WSJ - "My Fertility Crisis"

[wait_out]

Very, very interesting article.

The clinic's founder and medical director, William Schoolcraft, says that about 65% of the female infertility he sees now is due primarily to the age of the eggs, which usually (though not always) correlates with the age of the woman. Freezing eggs (successful just 10% of the time a few years ago, 80% of the time now) and egg donation have revolutionized the business of infertility. But they can't solve everything.

When we were young, we were taught again and again that we shouldn't get pregnant. Now we can't.

Many women are still listening to their bosses instead of their gynecologists and their guts. They still trust that their mid to late 30s is a fine time to start trying for children. True, they could get lucky. But the question should be asked: Would you prefer to have children earlier and naturally or later, by dosing yourself up with drugs, submitting to surgery and paying tens of thousands of dollars?

In the first scenario, you'll probably have as many children as you'd like, and they'll be healthy. In the second, you may be able to have only one or two kids—maybe none—with a higher risk of defects and disorders...

Nora Ephron has written how she regrets not having worn a bikini the entire time she was 26. "If anyone young is reading this," she writes, "go right this minute, put on a bikini, and don't take it off until you're 34."

The first thing I'd like to tell women ages 26 to 34 is: Start having babies. I know it's not polite or funny. But I don't want others to go through what I'm going through now.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111903461104576458134196248312.html

 

[LeftyLoosey]

Her honesty is refreshing.

 

[DarkShade]

Yes to bikinis

No to fatties in bikinis

Sorry ladies, not only do you lose the only leverage you had (your looks) but also the entire purpose you were put on this Earth (to procreate). +1 internets to American culture :\

 

[MatureDJ]

This woman is proof positive of Darwin's theory of evolution - she's far too narcissistic to be a fit mother.

When Doc S. told me I'd need IVF to have even a shot at motherhood, I had just begun seeing someone new—I'll call him X. The first year we were together, I froze eggs rather than going through with full-on fertilization and embryo transfer, to give us some unpressured time. But I knew enough to keep making plans. And I thought about that talk on the beach. If you buy sperm at $565 a vial, plus $170 shipping, doesn't that mean you can't get it—in my case, a husband and family—for free?

In January of last year, I planned to go ahead with fertilization for the first time and was telling X about the donor when he said, "I think I'd like to be involved." He seemed lit by some competition with the man in the vial. But perhaps he'd gotten serious? I started to consider him instead of my Ph.D. donor.

WTF? What kind of even an omega male would let his girlfriend tell him that she is getting a sperm donor? Oh My! :box:

The day before my flight to the fertility clinic in Colorado, I returned from an ultrasound to an empty house, no note. Later, X told me that he wanted four kids and thought I'd only be able to give him one or two. (To him, I was the bad bet.) I boarded the plane the next morning with swollen eyes.

YES! :yes: :yes:

And how about this winner (in the comments)

After 5 abortions (not with me) my ex wife became concerned that she would never have children due to using abortion as a bith control method. After a relaxing vacation where tension was reduced she found herself pregnant. 2 1/2 years later after needing psychoactive medication following an emotional incident she again found herself pregnant. In both cases it was the decline in emotional tension that resulted in pregnancy.

Sad to say later she turned to the bottle to battle with her emotional demons and I have the kids. The lesson is that emotional well being is highly important to achieving pregnancy as well as physical health. The hysteria of not getting pregnant can lead to infertility as well. Sometimes to succeed you need to quit trying so hard.

Dude, you married a chick that had 5 abortions?

 

[Burroughs]

Reality check for women....funny thing is women want men to suffer the same way they have to in terms of fertility...but men can have children into their 90s Why any women over 35 thinks she is ENTITLED to have a child is absurd.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Wait out,
an interesting read.....I thought DJ's take as usual,Worldly,wise and right on the money....Is it possible that we are hard wired with a levelling mechanism...look at Aids and the sexual revolution for instance...are we seeing played out here the self destruction of a significant part of our Western Civilisation?

 

[wait_out]

an interesting read.....I thought DJ's take as usual,Worldly,wise and right on the money....Is it possible that we are hard wired with a levelling mechanism...look at Aids and the sexual revolution for instance...are we seeing played out here the self destruction of a significant part of our Western Civilisation?

Our civilization is different, that's for sure -- I was in both Afghanistan and Indonesia for a significant portion of the last year and if these countries weren't both so disorganized, they would probably outpace the west in about 20 years. We have some major advantages (like functional governments, peace, and education) but our population is old and getting older. Coming back I noticed this immediately. There are no kids anywhere.

I can't really say what it means for us politically -- but socially, I think it makes western culture a bit of a more lonely, less vibrant place. If the woman in that article had lived in a different country, she'd be a mother with several children all of different promise and potential. As it stands she's currently another casualty of western social conformity, lamenting a life she doesn't have. Her story is a downer (though she doesn't advertise this in her social life). How can this be fun for anyone?

I really don't know, Scaramouche.... I think we do a good job of raising our kids to be educated workers but we do a sh!t job of preparing to have families and good relationships. This article is about those consequences, which can be personally devastating. Yes the writer made bad choices but they are common choices. I will reference the personal example of my sister, who is an incredibly hard worker and social enough in groups, but who never really learned much empathy towards men in general which is going to make relationships difficult. Is this going to be the story of my generation? I wouldn't choose this and it makes me a little sad.

But as mDJ said you don't conjure character out of thin air. The moral of the story is, I predict good times for sperm banks and cat breeders

 

[typical]

In the western world you can no longer have "great" families and relationships with the ease you could in non western countries. Its just the way women behave or more to the point men in western cultures allow women to behave that screws us up.

Women these days between the ages of 18-30 have no sense of where they are going what they want out of life, its all about party hard and one day some desperate loser will marry me and I'll live a happy financially free life with no probs.

The reality is much harsher then what they think, the sad part is we aren't trying to educate them either and when we do try everyone hates on us and calls us misogynistic. So the cycle continues and we have what we have today. some men do teach their girls how to be a well rounded person but sadly that number is constantly on the decline.

I see it as survival of the fittest our western culture is not best suited to procreate and survive our downfall is the lack of social skills both men and women have do enable them to have a succesful relationship and bring up healthy well rounded children and teach them how to grow up into well rounded adults.

More and more I see the younger generation watch TV and play video games and have no real social skills or any social hobbies. What will happen to these kids in the future .... I know alot of mistakes and bad judgement calls. I'll stop now before I go into a full fledged 100 page theses.

 

[Burroughs]

Women these days between the ages of 18-30 have no sense of where they are going what they want out of life, its all about party hard and one day some desperate loser will marry me and I'll live a happy financially free life with no probs.

The reality is much harsher then what they think, the sad part is we aren't trying to educate them either and when we do try everyone hates on us and calls us misogynistic. So the cycle continues and we have what we have today. some men do teach their girls how to .

Very well said.

 

[Paintballguy]

The majority of women my age just want to party it up 24/7 and bang every hot guy that catches their eye. Who wants to start a family with some used up party chick? I sure as hell don't.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Waitout,
This is becoming enticingly provocative,thankyou....As a young Man,I was very much influenced by the English Historian Arnold Toynbee....He was in his Day very respected and had rather intriguing Ideas about Civilisations the Nub of which is,that they mirror in macrocosm our own pathetic little lives...So we have our conception,babyhood,infancy,adolescence....etc....Now the point he makes is that a culture never goes back to re-achieve greatness,it can pause for quite a long time,but inexorably it will collapse and die....So Afghanistan:Had its great Days 2500 years ago the largest mercantile Cities in the World were Karum Kush in Afghanistan (The confluence of the Ancient Silk Road from China,and the chain of routes coming over the Himalayas from India)the other great Metropolis was Alleppo in Syria at the end of the Silk Road....Today the latter remains a very busy City,One may still walk through the Bazaar in the footsteps of the Ancients,but it is no longer Internationally significant,it is in suspended animation....Karum Kush once at the hub of greatest Cultural and mercantile Roundabout the World had seen,is home to a few hundred Goatherds,and lately to the French Foreign Legion It completely collapsed....You also Mention Indonesia,well I also worked in Indonesia and travelled to Jogdjakarta several times.In its Day this must have been an amazing place,much like similar spots in Cambodia and Ceylon....Just a few places I have visited,you can doubtless think of lots more...Civilisations come and then go..as the Old Song says the Only thing that keeps flowing along is Old Father Thames....Interestingly China and India seem to be defying Toynbees Hypothesis,or do they?....As to the shortage of kids in the West...well amongst Caucasions this is evidence of some levelling effect....A very interesting book by a Guy Surnamed Lovelock called Gaia....Hypothesises an even greater macrocosm in which the Earth itself is a sentient being with self levelling reactions...crazy Huh?

 

[Burroughs]

Civilizations in decline are consistently characterised by a tendency towards standardization and uniformity.

-Arnold Toynbee

 

[mrRuckus]

This is white women. The non-white women of the USA don't seem to have much problem replenishing their people.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Burroughs,
"Civilizations in decline are consistently characterised by a tendency towards standardization and uniformity."....One of old Arnies best...look at China in 1427?(Circa) they abolished innovation a perfect example...They were in suspended innovation till 1956,I think 1972...Now they are off and running again and resuming their logical place as leaders on the World Scene.....Lets press the minimise button though Burroughs,how often does one see this Phenomenom in Clubs and Institutions?....and in Individuals?....Think On't.