Women cheating

[Peaks&Valleys]

I've been having this discussion in another thread, but I'd like to expand on it and see other people's points of view.

First of all, is it safe to say that not all women cheat? Is that okay to say? Is it okay to say that some do and some don't? I'll agree with that. I'm not talking about a girl spinning plates while you're spinning plates. I'm talking about an agreed monogomous relationship.

But why do some cheat and some not cheat?

Here's my take on the whole thing:

From my experience I believe there's four main categories here, two that cheat and two that don't. Of course there's crossover and outside factors at play but for the sake of the argument, I'm separating them into four.

(I'm making up the names as I go along)

The Born Cheater: She goes into an LTR knowing full well that she is going to cheat. Why does she go into an LTR? Because she needs someone to always be there for her. Someone to do **** for her, and be her emotional tampon and all that. Someone to listen to her, agree with her, give her rides, and buy her ****. She needs someone to basically take care of her emotional needs, but for her physical needs she goes somewhere else.

The Addict: This girl goes into a relationship planning not to cheat. But for one reason or another she's not getting her physical needs at home so she gets them from somewhere else. Either that or her guy someway or another pushes her away. She doesn't want to break up with the guy or is planning to "eventually", which is one way she may explain to herself that it's okay.

The Intimate girl: This girl does not cheat on the guy, for the most part, because he's taking care of business. He's fulfilling her needs so she has no reason to go anywhere else. The times he's not fulfilling her needs are few and far between so she doesn't want to risk cheating with the chances that he would find out and leave her, thus her future needs not getting met.

The Principles chick: This chick has values and principles.. She may or may not be getting her physical needs met at home, but she has loyalty towards her man. If he's not taking care of business then, due to his other good qualities, she's willing to "work on" getting those needs met. If the cons of the relationship end up out weighing the pros, then she will simply break up with him before having sex with anyone else.


These are my thoughts, I could expand on them if needed, but for now, I'd like to hear any comments or views on this.

 

[Desdinova]

Disagree with all of it. I believe that ALL women have the potential to cheat. What drives them to cheat is the emotional stimulation they recieve that lures them into cheating. What varies is the amount of emotional stimulation they require to cheat. Some women need to have pretty much every emotional button pushed while others will require very few. Many things factor into how their emotional stimuation works, such as their morals, their current relationship status, their sexual experience, etc.

I don't believe for a moment that any woman will go into a relationship, knowing she's going to cheat. I also don't believe that women generally have an agenda to fill. Women follow what they feel. If it feels right or exciting, they pursue it.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Peaks and Valleys,
This cheating in Women thing is vastly exaggerated,not many Girls play up,but of those that do,not many do it just the once...No they may well be hypergamous,but in general we accuse them of promiscuity to conceal our own lecherous tendancies!

 

[Albatross953]

Desdinova is exactly right. Women usually won't cheat for physical reasons. Not proud of using these facts once or twice for personal gain.

 

[AAAgent]

I think all women are capable of cheating but i could be wrong. I've only had about 5-7 girls try to or cheat on their boyfriends with me. Only a few times were instigated by me.

I don't have much experience in LTR relationships with many chicks as i only date chicks that have principles but even those girls cheat. Depending on how you can work their emotions, that's how likely they are to cheat. In the end if you show that you accept them for who they are including cheating, they'll cheat on the guy their with you.

Most women just want to experience emotions and feel alive/be loved by someone that can make them feel those things and although they can love their boyfriend/husband, relationships and marriages and be boring and monotonous. So they are driven to take that risk to live that romantic drama life. Even a woman with principles can be driven to this.

 

[samspade]

Options + Immaturity. Women experience their greatest options in their younger adult and late teen years. This coincides with two things: 1. A general level of immaturity and carefree attitude; and 2. Encountering men their age who are desperate for girlfriends. I'd call them "betas," but a lot of young guys start out just wanting a woman who'll commit to them. They're willing to invest more, mainly because they haven't thought it through and don't realize their own value.

I'd guess that younger females take relationships less seriously than their male counterparts. We're always telling the 25 and under set to avoid serious LTRs and this is why. Younger women seem to have no compunction about cheating because they have options. I'd also guess that it's often only "cheating" in the young man's mind since he's desperate for ownership and commitment.

Not making excuses for them - a lot of this is a Western cultural phenomenon: Extended adolescence/young adulthood + birth control + narcissism + lack of perceived incentive to marry, as advertised by feminists etc. We all know the script by now. When they hit the Wall, the incentives to commit and not cheat become clearer. In other cultures the incentives to commit and bear children by 25 are still in place.

However as others said most women need emotional prompts to cheat. Additionally it's not in their nature to spin more than 1.5 plates if that makes sense. Remember the same thing that necessitates Game also tempers the propensity to cheat. Her cycle matters, too.

 

[Bokanovsky]

First of all, is it safe to say that not all women cheat? Is that okay to say? Is it okay to say that some do and some don't?

Not, it's not okay to say that. If your "principled girl" finds herself alone with Channing Tatum on a desert island, you will find that her principles go out the window very quickly. Same thing with you. Put you on a desert island with [insert name of your dream girl] and you will probably cheat, especially if you thought that there was now way your GF/wife could find out.

These are extreme examples, but they are used to illustrate a point. And the point is that all people - men and women - are capable of cheating under the right circumstances. There are four factors that influence one's decision to cheat:

1) Physical attraction to the other person;
2) Proximity to that person (how much time you spend together);
3) Isolation from others (you spending time together without any one else around); and
4) Moral principles.

Keep in mind that these factors are interrelated. The higher the level of attraction, the more time you spend together, and the more time you spend alone with each other, the less weight will be given to moral principles.

 

[samspade]

Not, it's not okay to say that. If your "principled girl" finds herself alone with Channing Tatum on a desert island, you will find that her principles go out the window very quickly. Same thing with you. Put you on a desert island with [insert name of your dream girl] and you will probably cheat, especially if you thought that there was now way your GF/wife could find out.

True. Even Tom Hanks had that emotional affair with Wilson in Cast Away. Well I assume it was only emotional; they didn't show everything that happened.

 

[dasein]

More categories:

1. Disordered/branch swingers - fear of abandonment makes them seek the next branch at the very moment when the connection to the current branch is strongest and so in their minds most vulnerable to loss and pain, creates most fear>>> cheat to start cultivating that next branch(es). They say that 10% of women are cluster B, but then think how high the % with defined traits that don't rise to a clinical diagnosis could be, 20% or more? Whatever the number is, the bad air from them is exacerbated by the fact that they tend to cycle more in a given pool, the dirtiest penny goes through the most hands and in so doing causes the most damage.

2. Impulsives - Western/U.S. society does not curb impulsive behavior in women to near the degree it does in men. In women it's "cute" or "naughty," (or even lol... "empowerment") in men it's justification for a jail sentence or serious ass-kicking. Impulsive behavior snowballs into extremes such as cheating on otherwise fine relationships as prior behavior doesn't fill the hole any more, and like any drug, higher doses and more risky behavior sought. Just watch any soap opera. Women respond well to cheating motifs in entertainment and literature. They are capable of rationalizing cheating as "choosing between two men" when that is far far from what is really going on in black and white terms.

3. Victims - Women are hit from all angles with victimology messages. Crime shows, leftist politics, government PSAs, etc. create an environment where normal life situations are perverted into victimhood or even oppression. Couple that with the natural female powers of rationalization and their tendency towards "emotional fabrication" to fit in (can't count how many women I've dated over the years with claims of childhood abuse that were utterly false and made up) and is it any wonder that they do whatever they want whenever? A "victim" is capable of any behavior no matter how monstrous once they are persuaded of their oppression and oppressor class. See Nazis and Jews for clarification.

 

[Colossus]

I agree with Scara that the prevalence is overblown. The manosphere in general (including SS) is a big collection of biased sample fallacies and confirmation bias. In other words, it self-selects for guys who have had experience with cheating women.

To expound on Bokanovsky's list I think that a woman's loyalty is directly related to several factors:

1. Your current value
2. Her past history with men
3. Her emotional satisfaction,
4. Her available options in comparison to you
5. Moral principles

If you read empirical literature on cheating, most women who have cheated report that they felt undervalued, ignored, or trapped with a boring man. The reasons are never purely or even primarily physical. There is always a perceived emotional "need" (want) that is going unmet for long enough that she will branch swing, feel "in love" all over again, and attempt to dissolve the marriage or relationship.

The whys of cheating aren't always easy to answer, and it's not as simple as the pat bio-hypergamy response from the manosphere. You have to look at multiple factors. There is one thing that is clear though, both in the literature and in men's experience: if she has a history of cheating, she is far more likely to do it again in the future.

 

[SecondHalf]

Not, it's not okay to say that. If your "principled girl" finds herself alone with Channing Tatum on a desert island, you will find that her principles go out the window very quickly. Same thing with you. Put you on a desert island with [insert name of your dream girl] and you will probably cheat, especially if you thought that there was now way your GF/wife could find out.

These are extreme examples, but they are used to illustrate a point. And the point is that all people - men and women - are capable of cheating under the right circumstances. There are four factors that influence one's decision to cheat:

1) Physical attraction to the other person;
2) Proximity to that person (how much time you spend together);
3) Isolation from others (you spending time together without any one else around); and
4) Moral principles.

Keep in mind that these factors are interrelated. The higher the level of attraction, the more time you spend together, and the more time you spend alone with each other, the less weight will be given to moral principles.

Agreed with the desert island analogy. I've been hit on by (happily) married women on business trips. I'm 95% certain a past GF did just that when she was on a business trip, even though she was supposed to be "so happy". If she can get away with it and it scratches an itch of some sort of itch she has, she likely will.

I cannot comment on the very young women, as it's been to long since I've been with one and I'm a little dated.
I will say that it's probably a little more likely that the older woman will slide. Women today are soooo gullible. If you can convince them that you're attracted to them and game them up, most will cave (business trip type opportunities). Especially the ones that still wear short skirts, show a lot of cleavage, you're typical aging wanna be "young hottie". They're an easy target, very easy.

The one category that I didn't see here is "The User".
This is the one that will hump for career advancement mostly, but I suppose there are numerous advantages they might seek without the intention of leaving their partner.

I don't know if every woman is capable of cheating, but I do believe this ... I will never be lucky enough to find one of the few who wouldn't even if she couldn't get caught!


SH

 

[Peaks&Valleys]

I tried to make a response earlier but I got timed out. Here goes attempt #2:

A good point has been brought up through these responses about an emotional connection. Yes, I agree that is one side of it, and with women, a way to tap into the physical is to stimulate emotional. I agree, BUT my point is, it's much more difficult to tap into the emotional to reach the physical if her physical needs are already being met at home.

I don't believe for a moment that any woman will go into a relationship, knowing she's going to cheat.

I disagree. Ever a heard of a woman having a guy on side through an engagement and well into a marriage?

Not, it's not okay to say that. If your "principled girl" finds herself alone with Channing Tatum on a desert island, you will find that her principles go out the window very quickly.

If someone offered you a billion dollars to sleep with your dream girl, even though you had the so called perfect wife at home. Would you? Of course. Yes, there are extreme cases for everything. I guess sometimes the stars just get aligned and there's nothing that can be done. But those are very rare instances....outliers, and you can't really include those in the sake of argument.

I've been hit on by (happily) married women on business trips.

This right here IMO would be an example of the addict. They're the ones that find themselves half way across the country away from their husband, wearing mini skirts and form fitting clothes showing off their cleavage and "things just seem to happen." It's like the guy in AA who still hangs around his old drinking buddies. He'll go to the bar with them and plan on just having a soda, but then decide on "just one beer". Then, next thing he knows, he's waking up in jail while is car is totaled.

The Addict - She would be the most dangerous one, she's the wild card, damaged goods, the "ho into a housewife". Hopefully you'll recognize red flags before getting involved with her. I still feel, even she can be drawn to monogomy, but it would take a serious connection and "rebirth" if you will.
The Born Cheater - She's looking for a beta provider, so as long as she recognizes early on that you're not going to put up with her fvcking around, she's not going to waste her time in an exclusive relationship with you.
The Intimate - She knows what she's getting into, and as long as you don't do a 180 with her, she will be content and happy with you.
The Principles - If you're not taking care of business at home, learn. If a woman can get herself off with just her finger then, any guy can learn to give a girl an orgasm.


Those categories are, yes, generalities, and they could be broken down further with sub categories or even just more added. But I feel, as a man, if she cheats on you, for the most part there's something you are or are not doing.

If, like Desdinova said, all women go into a relationship planning on not cheating. Then why do they do it? Are women just that bad at discipline and controlling themselves? Are they all like that? If you are taking care of business at home and your relationship is a solid and healthy one, then why would they risk it all and still cheat? One chink in the armor, or struggle, then they're off to hop on the c0ck carousel? It just does not seem feasible that that's how it works.

I know women that don't sleep around period, whether they're in a serious relationship or not. I've seen plenty girls only sleep with a boyfriend, and during the in-between times stay abstinent. It makes no sense for them to start sleeping around once they do get into that serious relationship.

I just feel that as a whole, we only hear about the stories of women cheating. You're rarely going to hear a news story of a couple that was "monogomous for 6.5 years!" For the most part, those guys that are in a healthy relationship, and have never been cheated on, aren't here complaining about it.

 

[Desdinova]

I disagree. Ever a heard of a woman having a guy on side through an engagement and well into a marriage?

Yes, my mistress. Because she was fvcking me instead of her bf/fiancee, it doesn't mean she planned to cheat from the moment she started calling him her bf.

If, like Desdinova said, all women go into a relationship planning on not cheating. Then why do they do it? Are women just that bad at discipline and controlling themselves? Are they all like that?

Yes they are. Women will prefer to go along with how they feel at the moment as opposed to how they're going to feel afterward. The logic and organization of control and discipline does not factor into the equasion when emotions are running extremely high.

If you are taking care of business at home and your relationship is a solid and healthy one, then why would they risk it all and still cheat? One chink in the armor, or struggle, then they're off to hop on the c0ck carousel? It just does not seem feasible that that's how it works.

In our logical male minds, cheating makes no sense when there's a lot to lose. You need to understand that women's minds do not work like ours. No matter how much society wants men and women to be equal, it's impossible and unnatural. Men will think about the consequences of their actions, women will think about how enjoyable things are in their current situation.

Ever try to make arrangements to meet up with a chick after she's done hanging out with her friends? Either she's going to be done much later than she told you, or she's going to cancel on you at the last minute. She's enjoying the moment instead of worrying about how pissed off she's making you. THAT is how they work.

 

[samspade]

In our logical male minds, cheating makes no sense when there's a lot to lose. You need to understand that women's minds do not work like ours. No matter how much society wants men and women to be equal, it's impossible and unnatural. Men will think about the consequences of their actions, women will think about how enjoyable things are in their current situation.

Ever try to make arrangements to meet up with a chick after she's done hanging out with her friends? Either she's going to be done much later than she told you, or she's going to cancel on you at the last minute. She's enjoying the moment instead of worrying about how pissed off she's making you. THAT is how they work.

Des, I don't disagree with you, but wouldn't you say that the female mating strategy requires some attention to consequence? I.e. if she is invested in the right guy, heck let's use the ol' George Clooney archetype....she is not going to be so cavalier about risking her investment. The thought process may not be "logic" but female hind-brain. Or maybe you're saying that's what the "enjoyment" or lack thereof is.

 

[Peaks&Valleys]

Someone brought this acronym up in another thread: NAWALT

I guess I'm trying to support that.

Let's say I'm wrong though. All women are the same. Fine.

So all women will cheat. Okay.

Now, what else is being said is that the guy has no determiniation on whether the woman will cheat or not. There's virtually nothing he can do short of keeping her chained up the house, with booby traps set if she tries to escape.

This would mean that all women would treat all men equally. The beta and the alpha. She would cheat on them both, just the same.

So, this is what it boils down to: All women will cheat on every guy.

 

[Desdinova]

Des, I don't disagree with you, but wouldn't you say that the female mating strategy requires some attention to consequence? I.e. if she is invested in the right guy, heck let's use the ol' George Clooney archetype....she is not going to be so cavalier about risking her investment.

For the most part, women aren't going to be wandering around fvcking every guy who happens to not be the mate she chose. Women can and will stick with the same man for a lengthy amount of time, especially if they're not being exposed to other men on a regular basis. Also remember that 80% of the world is made up of generally unattractive AFCs, so most are not going to even spark her emotionally. This also means that the odds of her marrying an AFC are in her favor. Most other men are going to be on the same level or lower than her husband if she chose someone who has at least SOME masculine qualities.

She could be with her mate for years before someone else comes along and presses her emotional triggers in the matter of a couple of hours. It's much easier for women to be logical with their existing investment if it's not being overshadowed by strong emotions.

There's also the fact that women are empowered by the law. If she screws around and gets caught, she'll get her revenge on her husband calling out her cheating by taking him to the cleaners in the divorce settlement. She pays the consequences for her actions when she's an unwanted single mother of two or more kids. Sure she got her revenge and it felt good at the time of the divorce, but she's didn't think of her life after divorce. All she focused on was how great it felt to get back at that bastard for finding out.

So all women will cheat. Okay.

No, all women have the potential to cheat. If they never have the opportunity presented to them, they won't cheat.

There's virtually nothing he can do short of keeping her chained up the house, with booby traps set if she tries to escape.

The best thing a man can do is BE A MAN. Her mate is the one who SHOULD be pushing all her emotional triggers. When a woman's mate is keeping her emotionally stimulated, other men are going to pale in comparison. You need to be part of the 20% who are NOT AFC. You also need to aim at being just as good if not BETTER than that 20%. In other words, the game doesn't end when you enter a LTR.

 

[nismo-4]

Your princess will be in another castle if your value is lower than her other options. Men value love, and women love value. And it's not just the value of the current man she's with, it's the attraction factor too.

All women can cheat. All women have options. Your job is to be that top option. Do that, and all her other options will get flaked on, and kept as friends (beta orbiters).

I still refuse to get married. F**k that. And the law favors women more, especially in divorce and custody? Judge nismo ain't having that sh*t.

Case closed.

 

[GotED?]

A real man knows when a relationship is over and should NEVER let it drag on like an AFC without hope and pride.

AFC men beg and plead the woman to be with him until she is so unattracted to his feminimity that she either leaves, or branch swings to another castle.

A REAL man has leadership skills - this mean, telling your ho to get a hoe and take a hike to the farm at the first sign that she ain't gonna ever respect you, or you totally have lost your frame.

Why is it so hard of a concept to grasp - ALWAYS BE ABLE TO WALK AWAY AT ANYTIME.

Exodus

 

[May_Day]

All women have the potential to cheat. Yes, surprisingly enough, even some of the ugliest attached women have men wanting to sleep with them. What matters is in this case, is her desire to cheat. Will she act on it or not? Will she ruin a relationship or marriage if she acts on her desires? It really comes down to if she will act on it or not. I've heard women in my social circle say "I would be on him in a minute if I wasn't with so and so." Women always have desires to be with a certain type of guy. Whether they act on it is what matters. Some women do and some don't. It comes down to the woman and what is beneficial to her.

 

[dasein]

I agree with Scara that the prevalence is overblown. The manosphere in general (including SS) is a big collection of biased sample fallacies and confirmation bias. In other words, it self-selects for guys who have had experience with cheating women.

There may be some truth to this but it's for good reason. The message that "men are dogs, pigs, irredeemable cheaters" has been played loud and long for decades. Then we get some experience under the belt and realize that women cheat as much as men if not moreso, and do so without much reason or provocation capriciously. Everyone is quick to make excuses, rationalize and blameshift for the cheating woman, it's going on right in this thread as if this place were "The View" FFS. No one makes excuses for the man no matter what kind of cheeto-encrusted lard bucket with a cape buffalo's temperament he is dealing with at home. Have seen this play out more times than I can mentally count.

So why shouldn't we backlash, even to the point of mild exaggeration? There's certainly enough exaggeration running the other way. Do all women cheat? No. Will all women cheat? No. Is there a helluva disconnect between reality and cultural perception as pertains to how cheating plays out between the genders? Absolutely.