Why "Whatever You Want" Keeps You Single

She says the movie looks dumb; you suddenly agree. She tests you with a little attitude; you apologize for nothing.

You think you're being easy to get along with. She reads something else entirely: a man with no edges. Nothing to hold on to. No friction, no tension, no reason to wonder what he really thinks.

The "22 Rules" taught me to push back — playfully, calmly, without needing her approval. Strange things happened after that.

Read more...

Why do guys thinnks its a good idea to take a woman to a bar on the first date?

omkara

Senior Don Juan
Joined
Sep 1, 2008
Messages
330
Reaction score
16
Location
washington
I do it to filter out girls like Mocha 2010 and lordes.

There are plenty of girls out there, so it really makes no difference what you think. Having high expectations for a first date reeks of "high maintenance." And girls that are high maintenance don't just stop being high maintenance after the first date - it gets worse from there.

Therefore, I am not interested in dating any of these girls.
 

“The 22 Psychological Triggers That Make Women Chase You… Starting Tonight”

Forget the cash, the cars, and the chiseled jawlines. Female desire operates on a completely different frequency. Primal. Subconscious. Triggers that bypass her logic and hit her on a gut level. Most guys are totally blind to them.

I know because I was one of them. The overthinking. The paralysis. The silent drive home kicking yourself for freezing up. Watching average guys walk away with the girl while you stood there stuck in your own head.

Then I decoded the psychology behind what actually makes women tick. 22 hard rules.  Subtle behavioral shifts that rewired my entire reality. The anxiety evaporated. Women started leaning in. Investing. Chasing.

Read more...

zekko

Master Don Juan
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
16,800
Reaction score
10,036
mocha2010 said:
I remember I met this guy whom I thought the world of and would have done anything for but he was used to very very bad women and he treated me badly because he was hurt from the past
Careful, you're reinforcing the stereotype ("I thought the world of this guy who treated me badly").

As for that list of celebrities, the only one that seems at all classy is Natalie Portman. Even though her boobs aren't very big. Kim Kardashian, really?

Someone here (Falcon25?) always says "Alcohol=sex, Dinner=sleep".
Alcohol is definitely a liquid panty remover.

What offends me is this idea that women aren't responsible for themselves if they've had alcohol. If you have consenting sex with a woman who has been drinking, you can be arrested for rape! Why is it that women can't be responsible for stopping drinking before they're drunk? If they're not responsible why can they get a DUI? If a drunken man and a woman have sex, can the guy claim he was raped?
 

mocha2010

Don Juan
Joined
Jan 2, 2012
Messages
40
Reaction score
0
omkara said:
I do it to filter out girls like Mocha 2010 and lordes.

There are plenty of girls out there, so it really makes no difference what you think. Having high expectations for a first date reeks of "high maintenance." And girls that are high maintenance don't just stop being high maintenance after the first date - it gets worse from there.

Therefore, I am not interested in dating any of these girls.

LOL, above is one of the craziest thoughts Ive ever read, men and women are totally different in thinking. The first date is the first impression, its SHOULD BE the best impression not the opposite. The man should make it memorable if he really likes the girl.

I could never date you either. If you think taking a girl on a decent non bar date, in a great surrounding is high maintenance that's a big problem.

Many women from "good" homes, with "good" parents, who are used to "good" treatment probably would be what you consider high maintenance. Meaning they are used to "good " things and surroundings. That is not a bad thing. Do you want some disturbed psycho girl from a dysfunctional home?

No one is telling you to spend lots of money but the surroundings should be nice.


That is a bad thought IMO to reject a girl as high maintenance when many women these days have thier own careers.

SO YOU CAN COME TO YOUR OWN CONCLUSION ABOUT A WOMAN AS "HIGH MAINTENANCE" FROM THE FIRST DATE, BUT THE WOMAN CAN'T THINK OF YOU AS JERKY, SLEAZY AND LOW GRADE FOR TAKING HER TO A DIVE BAR ON THE FIRST DATE?
 

Iceberg

Master Don Juan
Joined
Apr 19, 2002
Messages
3,110
Reaction score
136
Age
45
Location
Manhattan, NY
mocha2010 said:
As a female I have to ask
Why do guys thinks its a good idea to take a woman to a bar on the first date? I can go to bars after the first or second date but this is a turn off to alot of women but many guys think this is okay.

To me as a female it says "I want nothing else but to get you drunk and sleep with you"

I have read many dating sites and this seems to be a suggested thing for guys to do. Decent nice women would not like this for a first or second date, even if you meet them at a bar.

I read one post where a guy invited a woman to a bar and wondered why she did not show up. Bars scream sleazy.

If you want cheap date ideas, take her to a museum or art gallery. Opinions???

Bars scream sleazy? No...bars scream social.

As in, "I'm trying to evaluate you as a person and whether or not you're worthy of a more planned-out date."

I don't know what part of the Bible Belt you're living in, but out here people go to bars to talk, laugh, and share a drink. You make it sound like bars are for shooting heroin and getting hand jobs from crack wh0res.

Is a bar as "classy" as going to a museum? I guess not...at least in the cliche, Romantic Comedy sense. But the goal is to go to places where you can talk. Not where I can show you how artsy and classy I am. Besides...you can't talk at a museum. I mean, of course you can talk....but good conversations aren't happening when you're walking from spot to spot, looking at art.

If I can't do a bar, then I'll do a coffee shop. But I damn sure won't go some place where me and the girl are walking around staring at pictures, instead of talking to each other. The goal of the first few dates is to see "Is this girl cool...does she laugh. Does she make me laugh." It's not about showing how classy I am.

Seems silly to have this notion that a guy is supposed to plan out some elaborate, "classy" date for a girl he barely knows. Girlfriends will get museum dates, concerts, dinners, weekend trips, whatever. A girl on Date#1 is getting a few beers and a friendly chat. Because I don't know her, and we don't owe each other sh!t.
 

"She's Out of Your League"

You've said it a hundred times. Maybe a thousand. And every time you say it, you train your brain to freeze the next time she walks into the room.

Leagues are a myth invented by guys who are scared of women.

She's a person. She has bad breath in the morning. She picks songs she can't sing in the shower. She overthinks her own texts.

Walk over. Say something. The league dissolves the second you open your mouth.

Read more...

Iceberg

Master Don Juan
Joined
Apr 19, 2002
Messages
3,110
Reaction score
136
Age
45
Location
Manhattan, NY
mocha2010 said:
LOL, above is one of the craziest thoughts Ive ever read, men and women are totally different in thinking. The first date is the first impression, its SHOULD BE the best impression not the opposite. The man should make it memorable if he really likes the girl.
Hah. The man's job is to make it memorable...

..and the woman's job is to just show up, look nice, and judge the man? Must be nice to have absolutely no responsibility for the situations you end up in.

Tell you what - if you had a memorable personality, you could have a great date anywhere. If you're just a general bore, then yeah, you're going to need upscale surroundings to make up for your lack of personality.


SO YOU CAN COME TO YOUR OWN CONCLUSION ABOUT A WOMAN AS "HIGH MAINTENANCE" FROM THE FIRST DATE, BUT THE WOMAN CAN'T THINK OF YOU AS JERKY, SLEAZY AND LOW GRADE FOR TAKING HER TO A DIVE BAR ON THE FIRST DATE?
Dude, what kind of crack dens are these guys taking you to?

My definition of a dive bar is a nice, neighborhood place with wood paneling, a friendly bartender, and a decent selection of beer. Which is more than enough to entertain some female you just met.

You make it sound like there's knife fights in these places and rats in the bathroom.
 

mocha2010

Don Juan
Joined
Jan 2, 2012
Messages
40
Reaction score
0
Iceberg said:
Bars scream sleazy? No...bars scream social.

As in, "I'm trying to evaluate you as a person and whether or not you're worthy of a more planned-out date."

I don't know what part of the Bible Belt you're living in, but out here people go to bars to talk, laugh, and share a drink. You make it sound like bars are for shooting heroin and getting hand jobs from crack wh0res.

Is a bar as "classy" as going to a museum? I guess not...at least in the cliche, Romantic Comedy sense. But the goal is to go to places where you can talk. Not where I can show you how artsy and classy I am. Besides...you can't talk at a museum. I mean, of course you can talk....but good conversations aren't happening when you're walking from spot to spot, looking at art.


If I can't do a bar, then I'll do a coffee shop. But I damn sure won't go some place where me and the girl are walking around staring at pictures, instead of talking to each other. The goal of the first few dates is to see "Is this girl cool...does she laugh. Does she make me laugh." It's not about showing how classy I am.

Seems silly to have this notion that a guy is supposed to plan out some elaborate, "classy" date for a girl he barely knows. Girlfriends will get museum dates, concerts, dinners, weekend trips, whatever. A girl on Date#1 is getting a few beers and a friendly chat. Because I don't know her, and we don't owe each other sh!t.
You can drink in an upscale lounge not a downtown nieghborhood bar hole. It cost the same price.

I totally disagree with you. I am a very popular mainstream social butterfly and YES for a first date a dive hole in the wall bar is SLEAZY.

I would be happy to go and socialize with you after I get to know you after a couple of dates . But unless you meet me in a bar. Do not take me there on the first date and plenty of my girlfriends feel this way.

Have you had long term relationships with any of the women you took to the dive bar? on the first date?
 

Iceberg

Master Don Juan
Joined
Apr 19, 2002
Messages
3,110
Reaction score
136
Age
45
Location
Manhattan, NY
mocha2010 said:
You can drink in an upscale lounge not a downtown nieghborhood bar hole. It cost the same price.

I totally disagree with you. I am a very popular mainstream social butterfly and YES for a first date a dive hole in the wall bar is SLEAZY.

I would be happy to go and socialize with you after I get to know you after a couple of dates . But unless you meet me in a bar. Do not take me there on the first date and plenty of my girlfriends feel this way.

Have you had long term relationships with any of the women you took to the dive bar? on the first date?
I don't know that any of the popular mainstream social butterflies I've ever met would describe themselves as "popular mainstream social butterflies".

Yeah. I'm just gonna treat you like a troll.

Maximummax said:
Please do not feed this troll, enough is enough!
You are absolutely correct. My apologies for keeping this conversation going.

/End thread
 

SamTheHobit

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Messages
1,514
Reaction score
95
Location
South Africa
I just wanted to add.... lol.
 

"The Coffee Shop Girl You Never Spoke To"

You've replayed it a hundred times. She stood three feet away, scrolling her phone. You had an opening. You composed the perfect line — after she was gone.

For all you know, she's married now. To some guy who said something. Anything.

Openers are cheap. Almost any sentence works when it's delivered within three seconds. The expensive part is the standing there, drafting and deleting, while the window quietly closes.

The "22 Rules" stripped out my hesitation. What to open with, how to keep it alive, and the one habit that costs guys more women than anything else: waiting for perfect.

Read more...

mocha2010

Don Juan
Joined
Jan 2, 2012
Messages
40
Reaction score
0
Maximummax said:
Please do not feed this troll, enough is enough!
:rolleyes:

I am actually not a "Troll" I think this is an important topic. I am a woman who gets alot of male attention and I do not like being taken to bars on the first date and neither do my friends. I am just putting out there what some women do not have the nerve to say because they do not want to hurt your feelings or go against "whats popular".
 

Maximummax

Senior Don Juan
Joined
Oct 1, 2011
Messages
485
Reaction score
25
Location
Florida
Don't know why you are here in this forum
Men act how ever they want to. If you don't want to go to a bar, tell a guy where you wanna go. if he likes it he will take you there, otherwise he won't.
 

mocha2010

Don Juan
Joined
Jan 2, 2012
Messages
40
Reaction score
0
Maximummax said:
Don't know why you are here in this forum
Men act how ever they want to. If you don't want to go to a bar, tell a guy where you wanna go. if he likes it he will take you there, otherwise he won't.
Alot of good restaurants now have upscale or nicer bar areas, I could do that on the first date like

1. Cheesecake Factory-has a great bar area for drinks, you are in a restaurant but you do not have to get dinner. But you dont have the dive bar feel.

2. Coastal Flats
3. Ruby Tuesdays

* I like to help people, call me the Angel, I think I have enough life experience to ad good insight to this site. And I have been around all types of people, cultures, etc. Plus I like to read about how men operate, it still baffles me
 

Maximummax

Senior Don Juan
Joined
Oct 1, 2011
Messages
485
Reaction score
25
Location
Florida
Alot of good restaurants now have upscale or nicer bar areas, I could do that on the first date like

1. Cheesecake Factory-has a great bar area for drinks, you are in a restaurant but you do not have to get dinner. But you dont have the dive bar feel.

2. Coastal Flats
3. Ruby Tuesdays

mocha2010 said:
I like to help people, call me the Angel,
I think I have enough life experience to ad good insight to this site. And I have been around all types of people, cultures, etc. Plus I like to read about how men operate, it still baffles me


Guys don't like to spend money on women who they don't even know
Insecure guys will try hard to impress for sure.
So if you want luxuries on date 1, find a needy guy.
 

Michele l'Arcangelo

Master Don Juan
Joined
Aug 5, 2005
Messages
1,460
Reaction score
22
I skimmed. But I agree with this girl. She makes some valid points, while I hear most of you guys regurgitating old info you've read here, that isn't working, or is making you bitter, unhappy people.

I used to be cynical like you all, (but I took an arrow in the knee) but I found out women are more attracted to genuinely happy and warm guys who enjoy their time and selves. Happy, warm, and confident men can and will make ANYTHING fun for a woman. Why use alcohol to ease the nerves? Or her nerves? Play it off and bust on her for being nervous and lighten the mood.

I'd say take her for a stroll downtown, or if there are any of those hippyish, or olde town cities around ("the place to go"), take her there so she can see how you "NATURALLY" are around other folks, how you react, how you treat them. Plus you can see her side, too. In a confined building, sitting at tables, you're forced to talk, only because you'd think that she'd think that silence is bad. I think in a natural outside of a building setting would be more enjoyable, as you can highlight your awesomeness and charisma by greeting and smiling to people in general, it'd show how much fun you are.

IF she's a dirty girl, she'd be wondering how you are in bed on her own, you don't need alcohol.
 

"She's Out of Your League"

You've said it a hundred times. Maybe a thousand. And every time you say it, you train your brain to freeze the next time she walks into the room.

Leagues are a myth invented by guys who are scared of women.

She's a person. She has bad breath in the morning. She picks songs she can't sing in the shower. She overthinks her own texts.

Walk over. Say something. The league dissolves the second you open your mouth.

Read more...

Iceberg

Master Don Juan
Joined
Apr 19, 2002
Messages
3,110
Reaction score
136
Age
45
Location
Manhattan, NY
Michele said:
I skimmed. But I agree with this girl. She makes some valid points, while I hear most of you guys regurgitating old info you've read here, that isn't working, or is making you bitter, unhappy people.

I used to be cynical like you all, (but I took an arrow in the knee) but I found out women are more attracted to genuinely happy and warm guys who enjoy their time and selves. Happy, warm, and confident men can and will make ANYTHING fun for a woman. Why use alcohol to ease the nerves? Or her nerves? Play it off and bust on her for being nervous and lighten the mood.

I'd say take her for a stroll downtown, or if there are any of those hippyish, or olde town cities around ("the place to go"), take her there so she can see how you "NATURALLY" are around other folks, how you react, how you treat them. Plus you can see her side, too. In a confined building, sitting at tables, you're forced to talk, only because you'd think that she'd think that silence is bad. I think in a natural outside of a building setting would be more enjoyable, as you can highlight your awesomeness and charisma by greeting and smiling to people in general, it'd show how much fun you are.

IF she's a dirty girl, she'd be wondering how you are in bed on her own, you don't need alcohol.
There's nothing wrong with taking a girl on a stroll downtown. If that's your thing.

But on the flip side, there's nothing wrong with taking a girl to a bar for a drink. For generations, people have been sitting down at bars talking over beers. It's not like it's suddenly destroying the concept of socializing or getting to know someone.

My issue with the troll is that it was demanding that men cannot take women to bars for dates. And I'm thinking to myself, "What do you mean I can't take girls to bars? I've been doing it for a decade with great results."

I'm a bar type of guy. It's where I'm comfortable. It's where my charisma is best displayed. If you're a museum type of guy, then take your girl to a museum. And if you're a stroll type of guy, then take your chicks on a stroll.
 

SamTheHobit

Master Don Juan
Joined
Jan 10, 2011
Messages
1,514
Reaction score
95
Location
South Africa
Michele said:
I skimmed. But I agree with this girl. She makes some valid points, while I hear most of you guys regurgitating old info you've read here, that isn't working, or is making you bitter, unhappy people.

I used to be cynical like you all, (but I took an arrow in the knee) but I found out women are more attracted to genuinely happy and warm guys who enjoy their time and selves. Happy, warm, and confident men can and will make ANYTHING fun for a woman. Why use alcohol to ease the nerves? Or her nerves? Play it off and bust on her for being nervous and lighten the mood.

I'd say take her for a stroll downtown, or if there are any of those hippyish, or olde town cities around ("the place to go"), take her there so she can see how you "NATURALLY" are around other folks, how you react, how you treat them. Plus you can see her side, too. In a confined building, sitting at tables, you're forced to talk, only because you'd think that she'd think that silence is bad. I think in a natural outside of a building setting would be more enjoyable, as you can highlight your awesomeness and charisma by greeting and smiling to people in general, it'd show how much fun you are.

IF she's a dirty girl, she'd be wondering how you are in bed on her own, you don't need alcohol.
Nice post.
 

5string

Master Don Juan
Joined
Feb 18, 2010
Messages
2,348
Reaction score
116
Location
Standing At The Crossroads
What I am getting from the OP in this thread is that she thinks she is entitled to be impressed by the venue of the first date like it's the mans duty or obligation. This mindset simply screams "I need my attention and deserve to be treated like the princess that I am"! If you don't want to go to a particular place, stand up for yourself and suggest an alternate.

I met my wife on our first date at a lower end bar. Neither one of us had a problem. We just got to know one another. Pretty simple. And please don't read into this. I have taken her to Broadway plays, some of the finest resorts in the country and dined in some of the finest restaurants.

I cannot agree that by taking a woman out to a bar and having some drinks, suggests the guy simply wishes to sleep with her.

Think I'll call Mrs.5string and see if she wants to get some drinks at a local pub near the house after work. Maybe I'll get lucky.
 

mocha2010

Don Juan
Joined
Jan 2, 2012
Messages
40
Reaction score
0
Michele said:
I skimmed. But I agree with this girl. She makes some valid points, while I hear most of you guys regurgitating old info you've read here, that isn't working, or is making you bitter, unhappy people.

I used to be cynical like you all, (but I took an arrow in the knee) but I found out women are more attracted to genuinely happy and warm guys who enjoy their time and selves. Happy, warm, and confident men can and will make ANYTHING fun for a woman. Why use alcohol to ease the nerves? Or her nerves? Play it off and bust on her for being nervous and lighten the mood.

I'd say take her for a stroll downtown, or if there are any of those hippyish, or olde town cities around ("the place to go"), take her there so she can see how you "NATURALLY" are around other folks, how you react, how you treat them. Plus you can see her side, too. In a confined building, sitting at tables, you're forced to talk, only because you'd think that she'd think that silence is bad. I think in a natural outside of a building setting would be more enjoyable, as you can highlight your awesomeness and charisma by greeting and smiling to people in general, it'd show how much fun you are.

IF she's a dirty girl, she'd be wondering how you are in bed on her own, you don't need alcohol.
Great post! One of the best Ive heard yet. I would date you :)
 

Packers2010

Master Don Juan
Joined
Oct 21, 2010
Messages
1,165
Reaction score
31
Age
36
Location
The Wild Wigga From the West
you know.. i haven't really thought about this. i read threw this thread and have come up with one option on this.

why do girls always think it's the guys job to do EVERYTHING!. go to an online dating site look at the girls who are 21 and see what there likes are. 9 times out of 10 it's either pubbing or clubbing.

so where do you think i am going to go? sure it's nice to do something different. but i am going to go with what the people want. i also think that is the date doesn't go well you won't be suck in a place you don't like. if your in a nice bar ( have NO idea where you got sh!tty dive from) then it's not so bad if she or you leave.

if i was going to take a girl anywhere it would be a pool hall. cos that's where i hang out. then coffee after. i used to do this will all my girls back home. they didn't seam to mind.

your not there to worry about where you are. your there too see if you like the guy. i would feel guilty if a girl too me to an expensive place, paid for it all and i didn't like her. i would feel like i would HAVE TO go on a second date.

but that's just me..
 

“The 22 Rules That Flip the Script With Women… And How You Can Use Them Tonight”

Most guys accidentally kill attraction before they even speak. They assume they need a bigger bank account, a better physique, or smoother lines. They miss the point.

Female desire operates on a specific set of psychological triggers.  Break them, and you're invisible. Follow them, and you become magnetic.

I learned this the hard way. Years of freezing up. Getting friend-zoned. Watching other guys walk away with the girl I wanted. Then I discovered a set of 22 simple rules that rewired my entire approach.

Read more...

Top