"When emotions are flaring"

[Vulpine]

Always good to have a few bros who really know their shyt to keep your head on straight when the emotions are flaring.

Thanks again

Slick

I think I could stand a little support from the network myself. It seems that I have sort of a "reverse" scenario from Slicksters. I'm the one in the doghouse, it seems.

Over the weekend my GF and I had some plans for a group outing. There was quite a bit of anticipation as we were both needing to have a good time and blow off steam.

Well, to be direct, I lost control. I made an ass of myself (a spectacle, to be sure), and in doing so, I managed to completely spoil the day for both of us. I disrespected her (and myself, really) in front of our peers, and overall the day was a big negative instead of the positive. I don't need to get long winded about the offense, it was just a bad day - happens to everyone.

So the day passes and I knew there was going to be some fallout. I also realized that I would have some "damage control" to attend to. I acknowledged my mistake and apologized to her the next day. Now, I didn't grovel or beg forgiveness, I just admitted I screwed up, and apologized. She was still irritated, but I managed to put out the fire and avoided bringing it up again. The next day she reports to me more "damage" that we were unaware of. This time, I offered:

V: *irritated* "Look, I apologized to you already. When I see people we were with, I'll apologize to them. So, until I do, let's just get on with life, shall we?"

That worked pretty well, until the next day, that is. This time, she didn't bring up the bad outing at all. Instead, she was freaking out about herself: her goals, her feelings, blah, blah, blah... some mush about feeling like she has lost her identity, etc. At one point she said, "you're not my father", "I feel like I'm following you around like a little puppy", and "this isn't me". She was doing about 90% of the talking... following me around while I was going about my business.

[Side note of comedy: I interjected at some point in her rant about goals because her tone was obviously a power struggle/frame problem... "You want a goal? Save up some cash and get the surgery to have a d¡ck sewn on. Is that what you want? To be a man?" It was sort of over-the-top, but thinking back it really changed the tone; she physically took a step back. Not only was it funny, but it was essentially a slap in the face that cut off her 'I'm so powerless!' whining.]

In my head, I was trying the best I could to decipher the chick-speak and look through to the core and see the problem.

So you know: I had been busting her chops about some things like weight loss, lifestyle (drinking, smoking), and diet (paying for a restaurant when there is healthy food rotting in the fridge). She mentioned these things that she wanted to change, so, I was working with her on them.

Anyway, in translating the chick-speak, I could tell that she felt that weight loss, quitting smoking, not drinking as much, and not blowing money on garbage food were MY goals FOR her.

:nono:

So, at a certain point, I just cut her off...

V: "Stop. You know what? Those are YOUR problems, not mine."

....*looks down for a pause, at which point I realized that cause must be getting static from the people we were out with on 'incident day' about me*

"Go ahead, tell your friends that I'm 'controlling'. Tell them I'm 'overbearing'. Hell, tell them 'manipulative', I don't give a ƒuck. The fact is, you mentioned that you wanted to [list of her goals]. I'm doing what I can to support you and encourage you to follow through. If you think I'm doing it purely for my own benefit, you are seriously jacked in the head. You don't think you'd be happier weighing less? Who'd be more happy, me or you?"

GF: *no response*

V: "Of course I'd be happy. But you are the one constantly obsessing about it: I'm trying to help you with this sh¡t, and by doing so, getting you to shut the ƒuck up about it."

At which point I pretty much dropped it.

SOooo, the next day she pulls some blatent test type crap. She blatently did some crap to: 1. "p¡ss me off" 2. exercise her "independence".

Ok, now this is a point where she is officially 'on my nerve'.

We haven't had sex for, uh... 5 days. So, I think the only course of action is to get home from work today, throw her on the bed, and give her a good anger-ƒucking without saying a word.

I mean, there is no sense in talking about specific crap. It's just negativity: nothing will be resolved, only relived, so it's pointless.

What do you guys think?

After reading Slick's post about his drama, I figured I could use a few suggestions regarding emotional turbulence myself. I bounced the scenario off my buddy, but he's only dabbled a bit in "DJ'ing". He busted me on dwelling on it, and trying to figure it out, so I'm off that trip. I'm sure her IL took a hit, but she's welcome to move out and let me move on with other chicks.

I guess what I'm seeking is some "fire marshalling" advice. Specifically, when you guys have blowouts, what do you do to smooth them out? Please, don't tell me 'ignore it until it goes away'. We all know it's not that simple.

 

[speed dawg]

I've been in lots of fights with my girlfriend. You sound like my d@mn spitting image. If you remember, I came in here about a year ago asking the same stuff. Ah well, I just stayed halfway independent (or acted it anyway), NEVER was controlling in the least little bit and it all worked itself out. I told myself I didn't care what she did, because if I found out she crossed the line, I'd drop her, and then I KNOW she'd be crawling back to me.

Alas, she passed my test, her IL never fell below the point of no return, nor did mine, although I did a pretty fukking good job convincing myself that I'd be happier if I was single.

Anyway, the crap's gonna go down sometime. All couples have a "trying time" before they decide if it's real or not. Just maintain your masculine frame. If you're in a bad mood (for whatever reasons), for the love of all of us don't go out with a big group.

And you also sound like my ignorant ass when you bust her about her weight and stuff. You can't do that. Only they can. My advice is do all that stuff yourself, and she'll follow suit. That's what happened in my case. I let my weight go, so did she. I got back in shape, all the sudden she wanted to. Covert, not overt, like Rollo says. If she feels at all threatened, she'll shape up.

Sounds like your chick has a good old case of "too comfortable". Easy fix, though.

 

[Vulpine]

And you also sound like my ignorant ass when you bust her about her weight and stuff. You can't do that. Only they can. My advice is do all that stuff yourself, and she'll follow suit. That's what happened in my case. I let my weight go, so did she. I got back in shape, all the sudden she wanted to. Covert, not overt, like Rollo says. If she feels at all threatened, she'll shape up.

Perhaps I phrased it poorly. I've been leading by example and pointing out how and where she fails when she does fail. I don't beat her up about it, I just point out her mistakes. You know, a jerk on the leash, so to speak.

At this point, you're right, I'm pretty much done with "helping" and going to throw up my hands - let her off the leash. If she wants to heel, she'll heel. If not, she can be someone else's problem.

Good call on the "too comfortable". I can see that.

 

[Sinistar]

Try humor dude - it disarms just about everyone and often it's delay is really the medicine you're after.

Nothing specific comes to mind on short notice however ... Maybe something like asking her if she actually saw horns and tail when you snapped If the mood is more laid back she'll bust on you in a more C&F stress relieving way (actually you're allowing her to bust on you but she won't know it. Let her run with it a bit until she cools off. She'll learn that you can laugh at yourself and not give a rip what others think. And she'll want to be just like you. And yes, you'll get laid before the day is over.

Related to the exercise topic. I've noticed that the wife really likes to emulate. If go bike riding, I'll do 20 miles but she'll come with and do about 10-15 and then do a walk afterwards while I finish. If I go swimming, she'll ask when and usually go walking/jogging at the same time. And if I get busy and miss them she's more likely to miss a workout too. The wife has always been extremely close to her ideal weight. Yet she still brings it up from time to time. I think she's friggin' hot. Being direct with them here doesn't seem to help. Drop indirect hints about how much less stress they have, how they will be able to focus on other sh!t, etc.

 

[jophil28]

Hey VP, trying to unravel women's moods and "understand" their thinking is essentially trying to 'make sense out of nonsense.'
The more understanding you act, the more knots and twists and turns they will concoct to hold your ATTENTION. She is doing attention seeking behavior right now - like a kid does..
Who cares what she is upset about. It will be forgotten in another 48 hours because her emotions will be swirling differently by then.
THis female shyte is like trying to grapple with an arm full of smoke.

Do not try to FIX it by f**king her. That teaches her that if she pulls emotional warfare she gets hot sex. WHo is in control from then on ? Huh !

Just go about your life and your daily stuff in a quiet and calm manner.Be distant and aloof, and stop arguing with a woman. I understand why you are trying get a grasp on what her thoughts and feelings are . WE men do that . Women just need to be heard. When she goes nutso just say," You sound pissed." and walk off ....Just say that.
You ever tried negotiating with a terrorist - a low chance of making any progress..

 

[Sinistar]

jophil28 your post rocked dude!

Sometimes I think Mother Nature played the funniest joke of all when it came to men and women. It's sort of like Mr.Spock meets Brittany Hilton Lohan. Mr Spock (MAN) would spend an entire lifetime mindfvcking himself trying to figure out the emotional swirlings of womankind. Meanwhile she grabs crewman # 6 and performs every known pleasure on him because he couldn'ty give a shyte less about what she thinks. He doesn't know why. He doesn't care either. He just knows that they can't get enough of him if he stops trying to figure them out, has options and doesn't try and fix their problems. Meanwhile Mr.Spock is sportin' a stiffy the size of a friggin' starship because he expects women to function logically (as he does).

It's funny. When emotions flare up, as guys we want to solve it. Get it over with. Have it behind us. Reach a unanimous agreement where everone wins and we all go home happy. However, with women and lots of other other interpersonal sh!t the real answer is time. Time for nerves to settle. Time for the tiny importance of a single event in the grand scheme of life to be realized. Time to realize we're all gonna do better things and worse things and really they are all just part of living life.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

It would help if I knew what the original offense was, but my guess is it included alcohol?

Why are you with a fat chick? I hate to point out the obvious, but an overweight girl will always be insecure about herself.

 

[blueguy]

Brilliant post, Jophil. I'd like to add something to it. I don't know if this has already been pointed out. It's likely she started this increased level of attention-seeking as a direct result of seeing what level of attention you are capable of giving (blowing up) and is now seeking the same level of attention - directed at herself.

 

[Bonhomme]

The "too comfortable" comment makes sense.

Gals will often lose their sh1t over some relatively minor thing once they get comfortable in a relationship. A common stage of the process, one might say.

 

[joekerr31]

That worked pretty well, until the next day, that is. This time, she didn't bring up the bad outing at all. Instead, she was freaking out about herself: her goals, her feelings, blah, blah, blah... some mush about feeling like she has lost her identity, etc. At one point she said, "you're not my father", "I feel like I'm following you around like a little puppy", and "this isn't me". She was doing about 90% of the talking... following me around while I was going about my business.

right now she's looking for another vine (or will be shortly). maybe she'll find one, maybe she wont. (go read some of Rollo's posts on covert communications - this is prime example of it).

if she does you're getting dumped.

the thing i dont get about situations like yours, and im making an assumption based on your text, is why would anyone want to be in a relationship with this kind of tension.

if your constantly telling her things you dont like about her (weight, smoking, etc.) then WHY are you with her? and don't give me some chic answer like 'but i love her.'

come on dude. you made a fool of yourself (although we arent sure how) and then you rag on her when she rips in to you about 'her problems'. and you miss the whole point of what she was doing - that was her way of WARNING you that your relationship is on its last legs and shes going to start looking for another vine. and how do you respond? you start listing out her problems.

i mean, dude, if she has all these problems why are you with her? that's eventually what she is going to ask herself. and you know what the answer she will come up with? he's with me because he likes putting me down, or he's with me because its a routine, or hes with me for sex.

she WILL NOT conclude that you are with her because you feel she is a great person!

anyway, as for how to handle situations when a chic is yelling at you or going off the handles, i've got two things to say on that....

1) the extent of her flipping is determined less by how you react in the moment and much more by how you have reacted / behaved throughout the relationship. guys want a fix all strategy for reacting to fights, but hte problem is the best strategies require that you have exhibited, from the beginning of the relationship, certain personality traits.

2) never lose your temper. never show frustration. end the conversation if you have to. simply say 'i'm starting to get mad so we need to stop right now and pick this up again later because i don't want to get in to a yelling match that will get both of us nowhere.'

it's ok to raise your voice a little. its ok to be ALPHA, to show a little intensity. but your emotions should never be out of your control - and both anger and frustrations are emotions that fall in to the 'im no longer in control of my emotions' category.

i can tell you that i haven't lost my temper in over 10 years. not a single time. and i use to be the biggest hot head i knew! i was angry all the time and if someone wanted a fight - GREAT LETS GET IT ON. man, what a waste of time that attitude was. i'm so glad i got rid of my anger.

i've had some things happen in the past 10 years that would send some folks into a murderous rage. now, i just deal with it without getting angry, shake it off and move on with life.

and don't mistake that to mean im apathetic. im one of the most passionate guys you'll meet - i just realized a long time ago that anger serves absolutely no purpose other than to cause more chaos and destruction.

 

[jophil28]

Sinistar wrote .."Mr Spock meets Brittany Paris Lohan " - Priceless !!

 

[STR8UP]

it's ok to raise your voice a little. its ok to be ALPHA, to show a little intensity. but your emotions should never be out of your control - and both anger and frustrations are emotions that fall in to the 'im no longer in control of my emotions' category.

My last LTR ended about 2 years ago, and that's when the "get pissed and YELL" side of me died.

When I caught her doing sh!t she wasn't supposed to be doing I screamed my head off. Pretty uncharacteristic for me, as anyone who knows me can attest.

But since I saw how that whole situation went down, I am now a changed man. From that point on I made a vow to never, and I mean NEVER let myself stoop to the level of a woman. I refuse to let my emotions run out of control. From now on, if a woman pisses me off, 9 times out of 10 I WALK AWAY. It's by far the most powerful tool in my arsenal.

 

[jophil28]

V,pine. do you notice how it is when YOU are the energy source driving improvements in a woman's life situation - she may be in a financial bind , perhaps a tad chunky or have issues with drugs booze or smokes. You formulate a plan of action and she appears to accept and endorse the proposal that you put forward. Your plan is well conceived and thoughtfully set out .YOu put the early stages into action. She seems happy and grateful and appreciative if somewhat unsure of the eventual outcome..
However, do you notice that when the shyte hits the proverbial in your personal relationship with her, your program of helping and support is turned into accusations of "controlling and domineering and being ssooo pushy ."

Go fig !

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the Unhappy and Unlucky
You can die from someone else's misery— emotional states are as infectious as diseases. You may feel you are helping the drowning man but you are only precipitating your own disaster. The unfortunate sometimes draw misfortune on themselves; they will also draw it on you. Associate with the happy and fortunate instead.

 

[Desdinova]

Instead, she was freaking out about herself: her goals, her feelings, blah, blah, blah... some mush about feeling like she has lost her identity, etc.

There's no point in helping a woman when she's so upset that she's barfing her feelings all over the place. She'll be barfing out a bunch of the 5hit you did in the past, how her ex made her feel, stuff her dad said about her, etc etc etc. Just let her barf it all out until she's done. Then work on what caused her to barf out all her emotions instead of the things she barfed up.

I've been leading by example and pointing out how and where she fails when she does fail.

The only thing you can do is lead by example. She may or may not choose to follow your lead. That's her choice, not yours. Just keep doing what you do and let her make her own choices. If she asks for some help, then offer it. If she doesn't ask for help, then she doesn't want it.

Do not try to FIX it by f**king her. That teaches her that if she pulls emotional warfare she gets hot sex. WHo is in control from then on ? Huh !

I have to agree with this. If she's behaving badly, punish her by NOT giving her sex.

Why are you with a fat chick? I hate to point out the obvious, but an overweight girl will always be insecure about herself.

I'd have to disagree with that, Rollo. A low self-esteem chick will be insecure about herself no matter what size she it. I've met overweight women who are not insecure about their appearance, and I've met skinny little b1tches who are pulling the "I'm so disgusting" card.

 

[speed dawg]

Geez, alot of you fellas talk like he's down and out with this chick. That's simply not the case, IF he returns to his DJ ways and doesn't keep acting all crazy.

I'd have to disagree with that, Rollo. A low self-esteem chick will be insecure about herself no matter what size she it. I've met overweight women who are not insecure about their appearance, and I've met skinny little b1tches who are pulling the "I'm so disgusting" card.

They may have low or high self esteem, but they ALWAYS know that can get d1ck whenever they want it. The self esteem part only determines if they'll do it or not.

 

[Vulpine]

Ok, a few misunderstandings.

When I first met her, she was in good shape. Then she had some issues and gained weight. I don't blame her, really, because her life was pretty heavy. I probably would have fell off the wagon myself, if I were a chick. Anyway, she's not "fat" now, and she never really got "bad"... just a little thick. But I've seen the before and after pictures, and she voiced her unhappiness about her present weight. I offered to help.

And the timeline goes:

I was helping her with a lifestyle change.
I made an ass of myself, or "us".
She uses my "help" as fodder against me.


I didn't get everyone's advice before last night. I turns out that I didn't anger-ƒuck her when I got home, or at all. I just didn't feel like it, and I was still, uh, uncomfortable. The "reward for bad behavior" aspect occured to me, so I'll wait.

Joekerr, I got the feeling she was going to look for another branch from her rant. But, in reality I don't think her IL dropped that low, I think it was a momentary occurance to her, which the thought of only FUELED her emotional tizzy. As in "Oh no, I couldn't possibly!"

As for "losing control"... I literally lost control. Not "lost control of my emotions", "raged out", or "yelled"; I don't yell, and I'm very calm in the face of a tempest. No instead, I blacked out for about an hour and a half. I mixed-and-matched, and it didn't turn out too well. (I suspect that I was "slipped a mickey" as an AMOG, but that's another story: a couple jealous dudes might have laced or spiked my business... there is evidence) I was on auto-pilot for a while, and the auto-pilot did some inappropriate stuff, stuff that I don't remember at all.

It happens. Ooops. Sorry. :nervous: Scary sh¡t.

Anyway, her and I are positve/upbeat/happy about "97%" of the time. It's not like she's dragging me down. I smoke, drink, have been working on my weight/muscle/fitness, saving cash, etc. It's not hard to bring a woman with when she asks 'can I do that stuff too?' She is trying to live the lifestyle I am, which is flattering. I can't help but to take that as "extremely high interest". Don't confuse me with Captain fix a ho, or save a ho. She's not broken or in danger, she just wants to improve beyond where she is: isn't that GOOD?

I didn't want everyone getting wrapped up in the details, because really, they aren't that important. The subject I wanted advice on or to discuss is, besides being stoic/unyielding/a rock when turmoil pops up, what were some other approaches that work. What are some "backup plans" in case indifference isn't working? Like, what can one add to their arsenal, like a "routine" or "pattern"?

Jophil and Sinistar suggest time and humor. Jokerr says stay calm. Those are great! Now that you mention them, I've used them many times. In fact, I'm waiting this out right now, so yeah, time definitely soothes the sores.

Her and I are going away for the weekend, just the two of us, to a more relaxing "mini-vaction" scene. She's much warmer now than all week. I've been trying to keep positive, and all the negative stressful events that had been coming up are behind us (gyno visits aren't very cheery I hear. But, yay! she's not pregnant and doesn't have VD! Pretty cheery for me!)

Anyway, the dust is settling.

Desdinova, your "let her barf it all out, then work on what made her barf out her emotions" reminds me of the scene from Fight Club where the bar owner comes down into the basement.

Tyler Durden is all "I didn't hear you."
*smack*
"I'm still not getting it."
*smack*
"I think I got it... nope, I lost it."
*smack*
"That's right big boy, let it all out."
*smack smack smack*
"Haahahahah! Yeah Lou!"
*smack smack smack*

Then when you think it's done, Tyler Durden "works on what made her barf out her emotions".

It really makes sense. Just take the beating, then, get back to business. Lou will feel better, and you'll get what you needed handled, handled. It's not logical, but I've seen it work with women.

Woman: "blah RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH"
V: "And?"
Woman: "AND RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH"
V: "Go on."
Woman: "SO RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH"
V: "Anything else?"
Woman: "No, just rah rah rah."
V: "Ok, then, blah. Yep, blah sucks. You'll have to take care of that."
Woman: "Yeah, I know..." *sigh* "You're right - you're so awsome!" *hug, kiss*

 

[Desdinova]

Woman: "blah RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH"
V: "And?"
Woman: "AND RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH"
V: "Go on."
Woman: "SO RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH RAH"
V: "Anything else?"
Woman: "No, just rah rah rah."
V: "Ok, then, blah. Yep, blah sucks. You'll have to take care of that."
Woman: "Yeah, I know..." *sigh* "You're right - you're so awsome!" *hug, kiss*

LOL! Yeah, that's pretty much it

 

[CF9]

Law 10: Infection: Avoid the Unhappy and Unlucky
You can die from someone else's misery— emotional states are as infectious as diseases. You may feel you are helping the drowning man but you are only precipitating your own disaster. The unfortunate sometimes draw misfortune on themselves; they will also draw it on you. Associate with the happy and fortunate instead.

QFMFT!!!

 

[grinder]

I guess what I'm seeking is some "fire marshalling" advice. Specifically, when you guys have blowouts, what do you do to smooth them out? Please, don't tell me 'ignore it until it goes away'. We all know it's not that simple.

I’m finding more and more that assuming (and behaving) like all is well goes a long way in smoothing out those peaks and valley’s of their emotional roller coasters. This is a corollary of assuming they like you as well.

I don’t insult them by pretending all is well while they are spewing the negativity, I wait for a lull, a break, even a couple hours or the next day, then I really do just tell myself that everything is fine and act that way.

I also ASSUME that what comes out of someone’s mouth when they are pissed is meaningless.