What the Red Pill Isn't

[backbreaker]

AS most if not all of you know I'm a recovering drug addict. There was a time when I would go to NA/AA meetings 5-6 nights a week. I don't do that anymore. **** I drink lol. I don't go to NA/ AA but once in a blue moon now. maybe 1-2 times a month.

There are 2 reasons. First, I've found what works for me.

But secondly and most importantly, I don't agree with the message. Of course, no one would argue with me when I say that being a drug addict or an alcoholic is a bad thing, but that's not their message. Their message is that YOU are a bad person and that theo nly way you can become a good person is to do these things that we are doing, and by doing these things and doing these things alone your life will be better and great and super awesome. There is a passage in the AA book called the 12 promises that are read at the end of every AA meeting (at least the one I go to)

We are going to know a new freedom and a new happiness.

We will not regret the past nor wish to shut the door on it.

We will comprehend the word serenity.

We will know peace.

No matter how far down the scale we have gone, we will see how our experience can benefit others.

That feeling of uselessness and self-pity will disappear.

We will lose interest in selfish things and gain interest in our fellows.

Self-seeking will slip away.

Our whole attitude and outlook upon life will change.

Fear of people and of economic insecurity will leave us.

We will intuitively know how to handle situations which used to baffle us.

We will suddenly realize that God is doing for us what we could not do for ourselves.

you mean you're going to fix every problem in my life, problems that normal people that don't drink or drug deal with on a daily basis.. low self esteem, financial problems, health issues, etc.. just by not drinking and coming to these meetings and working the 12 steps. **** where do i sign up!


And that is the problem I have with NA/AA. It doesn't do any of those things. Because it's not supposed to do any of those things. I go to NA meetings or one reason and one reason only. To not smoke crack lol. By not smoking crack lol, I allow myself to be open to these things.. just like everyone else, and then I have to figure out how to deal with them.

You go to these meetings and in particular speaker meetings, they sit there and they tell you how great their lives are simply becuase they stopped drinking and went to meetings. they got money in the bank, friends, family is back, all of live's problems were solved for them just beucase they stopped drinking and drugging. Which I am not doubting that it's not true, what i'm saying is, it's not beucase you aren't drinking it's beucase you figured other **** out in life on how to have these things, but you had to not drink to first get there.

My point being and this is why a lot of new people in recovery relapse, they see these promiises, they put some work in and after 6 months or a year they don't see any of what everyone else is seeing or talking about and they relapse.


That's kinda how i feel about the red pill. You came here, becuase you had the AFC. Then people here, the manopshere, blogs, told you that this little pill would solve all your problems. it would make you great with women. it would make you successful. it iwll make you good looking. it will make you the life o every party. all you got to do is submit and follow this program, and swallow this pill.


Then when the pill is swallowed and the guy doesn't get any of that.. he begins to doubt, to blame more, to feel cheated and lied to. This is where the negative discourse in TRP is coming from. These people.


The red pill will not make you successful with women. It will help you better understand them, but it in itself will not make you successful with women. Only YOU can make you succesful with women.


The Red Pill is not a cure all to all of your life's problems.

 

[dasein]

Have not been through any of those programs myself, but several close friends have, and I've never seen anything like "you are a bad person," but rather "here's how to change your life to get what you want." So maybe you have been in different programs, I don't know, but I don't think it's accurate to tell people they will find lots of scolding and shaming from a 12 step program.

 

[backbreaker]

i've been going to 12 step meetings for 9 years. chairing them for 6. I've been to meetings in 3 states. I have a pretty accurate knowledge of the 12 step program.

even with that said, what YOU said is not what the progrlam is supposed to do. 12 steps will not make you have a better career, it will not make you better with women it will not make people like you. It will not make your spouse like you. . it will clear up a problem that prevents you from working on that.


you missed the entire point of my thread. you have people that go to meetings and that's all they do. they sit there 7 days a week and don't grow because they aren't doing any work.

people get clean, then the first time, someone breaks up with them, or they lose a job, or something really ****ty happens to them, they are right back out there, becuase they were sold a bill of goods on what life was going to be like , by "simply following our way of life"


red pill is supposed to awaken you. but it's not a magic pill, no more than the 12 steps / NA/ AA are.

 

[zekko]

Yeah, a good friend of mine struggled with drug addiction most of his life. After literally decades of abuse, he finally got himself clean. He was confounded by the fact that he continued to have problems - financial problems, relationship problems, etc.

He was always so focused on the drugs, he had always blamed all of his problems on the drugs, so he figured once he got clean there would be nothing to stand in his way. But he still had real life to contend with. He hadn't considered that people who weren't drug addicts had problems too.

 

[dasein]

i've been going to 12 step meetings for 9 years. chairing them for 6. I've been to meetings in 3 states. I have a pretty accurate knowledge of the 12 step program.

I don't care if you founded AA or NA, the statement that "their message is that you are a bad person" is either just a misstatement on your part or a purposeful error.

Also, what is called red pill thinking here does not entail acceptance that one is a bad person, but rather the opposite, that one is a great person with infinite potential not dependent on women or compliance with female desire, who may have developed some wrong or counterproductive habits and attitudes about women that need correcting. The biggest portion of blue pill to me is accepting that men are somehow guilty or less than because sex is a strong desire for us. Blue pill tells us to feel guilty about that, to feel shame, to supplicate to the female in penance. Red pill tells us we were OK already, to put down the guilt and shame, not to apologize for our healthy sexual desire for women, not to frame our desires in terms of female desires but as ends in themselves.

Nothing about any programs I'm aware of is conditioned on telling people they are a bad person, and the red pill awakening is certainly not either.

 

[zekko]

red pill thinking here does not entail acceptance that one is a bad person, but rather the opposite, that one is a great person with infinite potential not dependent on women or compliance with female desire, who may have developed some wrong or counterproductive habits and attitudes about women that need correcting. The biggest portion of blue pill to me is accepting that men are somehow guilty or less than because sex is a strong desire for us. Blue pill tells us to feel guilty about that

"Men are not dependent on women" and "Men should not apologize for their sexual desires" are common themes on the manosphere. But I've been thinking lately, isn't our strong sex drive a weakness (well, actually a strength and a weakness)? I mean, it's our strong sex drives and strong reaction to the female form that end up resulting in some men's dependence on women, pedestalizing, and all.

Whereas the term was once an apt analogy for a massive shift in perspective and lifestyle for men, it now has become convenient shorthand for everything from conservative ideology to traditional sex roles to simple pick up artistry to massive try-hard internet trolling

Lol, very true. It's a bloated term almost as meaningless as "alpha" because so many different ideas have been attributed to it. Guys use the "red pill" as a shaming device toward other men. All they have to do is wrap their ideas in the guise of the "red pill", and then if you disagree with them you're automatically designated a blue pill feminized woman-worshipping wimp. That's probably the use of the term that most irritates me.

 

[G_Govan]

What is it with some of the men on this board who like to argue semantics and only see things as all or nothing?

If someone says college provides a great opportunity to pursue a well paying job and I take the advice but don't end up succeeding in this endeavor, does it invalidate the statement?

Red pill is all about "awareness." What you do with this knowledge is up to you. Everyone has an opinion about what all of this entails. It doesn't mean you throw the baby out with the bath water because someone else's opinion or interpretation doesn't jive with your own.

To expand the college analogy: You don't simply obtain a degree and cross your fingers hoping to land a dream job. You have to do market research, network, internships etc., to maximize your chances of achieving your goals.

Red pill is no different, it requires a concerted effort to derive benefit.

"Men are not dependent on women" and "Men should not apologize for their sexual desires" are common themes on the manosphere. But I've been thinking lately, isn't our strong sex drive a weakness (well, actually a strength and a weakness)? I mean, it's our strong sex drives and strong reaction to the female form that end up resulting in some men's dependence on women, pedestalizing, and all.

It's a societal issue.

The drive has always been there, if it weren't we wouldn't be here. It's been harnessed as a weapon to subdue the average man and it's working beautifully, until things come crashing down that is (and it will at some point).