What schools teach regarding active shooters doesn't work.....

[speed dawg]

We obviously have many other problems too as far as school shootings, but I want to address this one -

Teaching kids to line up against the wall and under desks is suicide. Shooters just go from room to room. We've been teaching this crap for decades and it's been disastrous.

ALICE training is the new wave. Alert, Lockdown, Inform, Counter, Evacuate. Counter is the most important now. If the shooter enters the room, you either have to move and create commotion, or swarm him. Can't just let him pull the trigger over and over and over. Lockdown is different too, you have to barricade the door, or at least give the shooter some obstacles. With obstacles, comes more time to create a swarm.

 

[Bible_Belt]

US Army Field Manual 7-8 instructs soldiers to rush a near-ambush.

 

[wifehunter]

Our schools are dumb...

if I had kids... I'd school them myself.

 

[zekko]

ALICE training is the new wave. Alert, Lockdown, Inform, Counter, Evacuate. Counter is the most important now. If the shooter enters the room, you either have to move and create commotion, or swarm him. Can't just let him pull the trigger over and over and over. Lockdown is different too, you have to barricade the door, or at least give the shooter some obstacles. With obstacles, comes more time to create a swarm.

Swarming sounds good, but the problem is that if they teach that then they are using the kids as cannon fodder. That doesn't mean it's a bad idea, but in today's PC environment and the parents with their special snowflakes, you can imagine why the schools don't do this.

Let me also just say, as an older fellow, when I was growing up people shooting up schools was unheard of. Now it seems to happen every other week. WTF is wrong with people these days? Something has gone very wrong.

 

[speed dawg]

Our schools are dumb...

if I had kids... I'd school them myself.

I'm doing that at the moment. It's working out great.....so far.

 

[speed dawg]

Swarming sounds good, but the problem is that if they teach that then they are using the kids as cannon fodder. That doesn't mean it's a bad idea, but in today's PC environment and the parents with their special snowflakes, you can imagine why the schools don't do this.

They are essentially target practice if huddled under a table or lined against a wall. And let me clarify - kids don't swarm (at least young kids don't, high school kids definitely SHOULD). ALICE teaches to just run around, make commotion and throw toys, etc. at the shooter. Anything to distract him and give SOMEONE a chance to take him down, run out of bullets, something, anything. Never stand still. There's a small chance to survive, vs. essentially zero chance of survival.

Let me also just say, as an older fellow, when I was growing up people shooting up schools was unheard of. Now it seems to happen every other week. WTF is wrong with people these days? Something has gone very wrong.

I personally think it's the effect of many bad behaviors we discuss on this site daily.

 

[samspade]

What they teach us at work is Run, Hide, Fight. Run meaning if you can get out, do so immediately, fastest means of egress possible. Failing that, hide. If found, fight. But that probably doesn't give you much chance (after run anyway), and swarming or running interference makes more sense. Only problem is it presupposed people are in a large group, which is the case in schoolrooms but not in all work environments.

 

[Magotrox]

Jeremy spoke in class today...

When asked about the song, Vedder explained:

It came from a small paragraph in a paper which means you kill yourself and you make a big old sacrifice and try to get your revenge. That all you're gonna end up with is a paragraph in a newspaper. Sixty-four degrees and cloudy in a suburban neighborhood. That's the beginning of the video and that's the same thing in the end; it does nothing … nothing changes. The world goes on and you're gone. The best revenge is to live on and prove yourself. Be stronger than those people. And then you can come back.[9]

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

WTF is wrong with people these days? Something has gone very wrong.

Because back in your day, fighting was allowed. Nowadays with all that anti-bullying crap, it isn’t. Kids still bully, it’s just that anti-bullying made it to where you can’t defend yourself against it anymore. In my brother’s school, if you fight, you get a 2 week suspension and the school calls the police. Now you got the cops to deal with. Because kids can’t fight, because GUYS can’t fight (why else are all the shooters men?), it’s just left to sit and boil. Fighting needs to be allowed. Sometimes you gotta just duke it out.

Also, a lot of older guys say that the younger generation is so much into their phones and technology and crap and don’t actually do anything anymore. Well that’s because most of the stuff that my parents were able to do as kids is illegal nowadays.

 

[zekko]

Because back in your day, fighting was allowed. Nowadays with all that anti-bullying crap, it isn’t. Kids still bully, it’s just that anti-bullying made it to where you can’t defend yourself against it anymore.

That's an interesting thought, you might be on to something there. If we were bullied, we usually had to handle it ourselves. That doesn't mean we had to go beat up the bully necessarily (although that option was there), but we had to toughen up and build some coping mechanisms. Now days everyone is a special snowflake, competition is discourage, and they don't know how to cope. So it reaches a boiling point.

Your other point, about everyone being on their phones, is good also. It kind of makes me laugh because it reminds me of older people when I was growing up: "In my day, we were outside playing". We had television and records, now they have phones and video games.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Given that bombs and explosives are a much more effective way to kill large numbers of random people, why don't we ever see school bombers instead of school shooters? I don't know the answer to that one. Maybe it is more satisfying to shoot someone than blow them up, maybe it has to do with the video game culture of the Xbox generation, or maybe today's teens are simply too lazy or uneducated to build a bomb.

 

[Von]

Given that bombs and explosives are a much more effective way to kill large numbers of random people, why don't we ever see school bombers instead of school shooters? I don't know the answer to that one. Maybe it is more satisfying to shoot someone than blow them up, maybe it has to do with the video game culture of the Xbox generation, or maybe today's teens are simply too lazy or uneducated to build a bomb.

Maybe the guy afraid the grenade will blow them, or in their face.

If you throw a grenade... you basically giving the power away for a reaction. You have your "weapon", now you threw it away hoping to explode.

I guess you feel more powerful and secure with something you can keep holding aka the gun.

Anyway... schools seems to be messy... back in the days the teachers were beating you up if you didn't behave... now the kids and the parents are on the teachers case.

Alot of people expect school to raise their kids.
Alot of parents don't care about the kids or think the " kid " is perfect.
You have USA crazie too... with their God's and creationist who say on Sunday something that will be contradicted Monday.

Followed by anyone can buy a gun and all seeking some attention.

There is a reason in Europe they shut down the names of the "aggressors"

Anyway, if you have to teach your guys how to run from a crazy gunman something is wrong. What kind of world you live

 

[Macaframalama]

Everyone, not just kids are too comfortable these days. They have very few outlets to express their masculinity today and what few there are left, are often discouraged. Mothers hawking over baby boy and chewing his @ss out for searching for snakes and spiders, normal chit young boys do. Phys Ed classes removed from alot of schools. Corporal punishment taken out of schools. Contact sports are discouraged by alot of parents. Up until about 16 and my parents divorce and could no longer be told what to do, I had farming and gardening responsibilities. Milking cows, hauling hay, feeding chickens, etc. Kids these days don't have chit to do and are just too damn comfortable. It's the same reason with all the anxiety issues ppl have today. After school, football practice and coming home and doing chores, ain't no damn time for anxiety, because you're too fvcking tired for it, not to mention the pride found in hard work and accomplishment. There just simply isn't room for it. The only anxieties I remembered at that age were the normal, asking a girl to dance or going for the kiss or fist fight come last bell at the bus stop. It starts at home. Ppl are literally coddling their kids to death.