^^Yeah, but I'm asking you HOW am I supposed to go about it with someone who told me that they aren't ready for a kiss? And what was I supposed to do, then, huh? She wouldn't let me get in the position for me to kiss her.
"The Kiss of Death Mistake"
You replay the conversation at 2 a.m. She texted back fast yesterday. Today, nothing. Was that smile friendly or flirty? What did the shoulder touch mean?
Every hour you spend decoding her signals drains your confidence and hands her the controls. Women can sense that insecurity from across the room — and it repels them.
One of the "22 Rules" kills the obsession on the spot: assume she likes you, and act accordingly. Sounds too simple. Works anyway.
Her interest tends to rise to meet your expectations. Psychologists call it a self-fulfilling prophecy.
What do I do about her not being fully over her last boyfriend?
- Thread starter JCKey618
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“The 22 Psychological Triggers That Make Women Chase You… Starting Tonight”
Forget the cash, the cars, and the chiseled jawlines. Female desire operates on a completely different frequency. Primal. Subconscious. Triggers that bypass her logic and hit her on a gut level. Most guys are totally blind to them.
I know because I was one of them. The overthinking. The paralysis. The silent drive home kicking yourself for freezing up. Watching average guys walk away with the girl while you stood there stuck in your own head.
Then I decoded the psychology behind what actually makes women tick. 22 hard rules. Subtle behavioral shifts that rewired my entire reality. The anxiety evaporated. Women started leaning in. Investing. Chasing.
Giovanni Casanova
Master Don Juan
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You go for the kiss, period. If she doesn't want to kiss you, that's your answer. You don't beat around the bush acting like you maybe, kinda, sorta MIGHT kiss her at some point.
You either kiss her or you don't. There is no TRYING. If you go for the kiss, and your lips touch hers, you have kissed her. If you go for the kiss, but she pulls away or turns her head, or puts her hand in front of your mouth, or knees you in the crotch, that means you didn't kiss her.
In this case, you didn't kiss her. And she says that she "isn't ready" for you to kiss her. We're not talking about marriage or commitment or even sex... we're talking about a damned kiss and she "isn't ready" for you to kiss her? How ready do you think she needs to be?
Frankly, the fact that she says she "isn't ready" to kiss you has a lot more to do with YOU than it has to do with her ex-boyfriend.
Think of it like this: There are a lot of ways to ask a girl out. Let's observe:
- "Hey, clear your schedule for Thursday night. I'm going to take you to Applebee's and then kick your ass go-kart racing."
- "Hey, let's go get something to eat on Thursday and then go race go-karts."
- "Would you like to go out with me on Thursday night?"
- "I, uh -- this is going to sound stupid, but -- um, well, forgive me for asking you this, but, uh... are you busy on Thursday? Who am I kidding, I'm sure you're busy, right? And even if you weren't, why would you go out with someone like me? Um, I -- uhhh... well, um, if something falls through for you or something, um, maybe you'll consider possibly doing something on Thursday night? Please? I think you're beautiful. I've loved you since the fourth grade."
In the meantime, you go ahead and be her little teddy bear and take her places and listen to her hopes and dreams and puppy dogs and rainbows.
For the record, I've kissed her on the cheek already. But, I can see how I went about kissing her wrong in the past. But what about now? How do I know that if I try to kiss her now that she won't get mad cus she told me already that she definately will when she is ready to?
The question right now is, although she said what she said, should I go against her wishes? Some have told me if I do and wait for when she is 'ready' that it will show that I respect her.
And what do I do if I go in for the kiss and she does refuse? Like blatantly refuses? Just move on?
And, btw, the boyfriend excuse she told to my friend, not to me.
The thing is, in the past I've always did the 'I come 90% of the way, the girl meets me 10.' With this girl all I'm getting is a lot of hugged up. I mean, she's all hugged up on me in the movies and reaches for my hand to hold a lot when we walk and tells her friends she really likes me.
Is it possible that maybe her excuse is a valid one? She told my friend that in the past when she's kissed new boys she's always thought of her old boyfriend and that since she likes me so much she doesn't want it to be that way with me. And that she 'loved' her old boyfriend and is still getting over him.
What she told me (earlier), was: "trust me, when i'm ready, I'll kiss you. definately" She didn't say anything about her ex to me.
But if I should just go for it, I just want to know how to go about it so I won't offend her or come off as disrespectful for not going by her wishes.
Also, is it OK to go for the kiss during like a slow dance at prom or should the first kiss always be in private or something?
The question right now is, although she said what she said, should I go against her wishes? Some have told me if I do and wait for when she is 'ready' that it will show that I respect her.
And what do I do if I go in for the kiss and she does refuse? Like blatantly refuses? Just move on?
And, btw, the boyfriend excuse she told to my friend, not to me.
The thing is, in the past I've always did the 'I come 90% of the way, the girl meets me 10.' With this girl all I'm getting is a lot of hugged up. I mean, she's all hugged up on me in the movies and reaches for my hand to hold a lot when we walk and tells her friends she really likes me.
Is it possible that maybe her excuse is a valid one? She told my friend that in the past when she's kissed new boys she's always thought of her old boyfriend and that since she likes me so much she doesn't want it to be that way with me. And that she 'loved' her old boyfriend and is still getting over him.
What she told me (earlier), was: "trust me, when i'm ready, I'll kiss you. definately" She didn't say anything about her ex to me.
But if I should just go for it, I just want to know how to go about it so I won't offend her or come off as disrespectful for not going by her wishes.
Also, is it OK to go for the kiss during like a slow dance at prom or should the first kiss always be in private or something?
libre
Don Juan
Hello JcKey
I repeat. You are doing great up to now and you are achieving all your goals with your actual moves and your behavior. Do you want to ruin it?
It's ok for you to continue to put your desires forward and that young woman will continue to respond to you as she has done up to now. Why would you want to change or ruin a good campaign and winning strategy?
Give that young woman some credit. Up to now she has been straightforward with you and has responded favorably to every one of your moves. She only asks you to be a bit patient with your wish to kiss her and she has even taken the step to be clear with you about it. That is a rare, honest and clear behavior.
That young woman needs time to adjust to the desires that you are showing her. Give it to her. It will not cost you anything; she will not take this as a weakness on your part as you are also being straightforward with your moves to kiss her.
Kiss her when you think it's the right moment. Whenever is alright. Why don't you try when you are having a walk in the parc? She'll find this very romantic.
You are naturally doing all the right moves with her. Continue to do so because both of you are doing great. Don't worry about every move that you make. Some of them will be errors but you will live and learn.
Have fun.
I repeat. You are doing great up to now and you are achieving all your goals with your actual moves and your behavior. Do you want to ruin it?
It's ok for you to continue to put your desires forward and that young woman will continue to respond to you as she has done up to now. Why would you want to change or ruin a good campaign and winning strategy?
Give that young woman some credit. Up to now she has been straightforward with you and has responded favorably to every one of your moves. She only asks you to be a bit patient with your wish to kiss her and she has even taken the step to be clear with you about it. That is a rare, honest and clear behavior.
That young woman needs time to adjust to the desires that you are showing her. Give it to her. It will not cost you anything; she will not take this as a weakness on your part as you are also being straightforward with your moves to kiss her.
Kiss her when you think it's the right moment. Whenever is alright. Why don't you try when you are having a walk in the parc? She'll find this very romantic.
You are naturally doing all the right moves with her. Continue to do so because both of you are doing great. Don't worry about every move that you make. Some of them will be errors but you will live and learn.
Have fun.
Thanks, man. I really like your advice. I didn't mean to seem rude by seeming like I wasn't listening. It's just when different people tell me different things, it's hard to respond....
Anyway, I'm just gonna go with what I feel. If it's not meant to be, even if just for a little while, then it's not meant to be.
Anyway, I'm just gonna go with what I feel. If it's not meant to be, even if just for a little while, then it's not meant to be.
"She Wants a Man, Not a Boy"
You asked her if she wanted to grab coffee. Then you asked if the time worked. Then you asked if the place was okay. Then you asked if she'd prefer tea.
Four questions. Four chances for her to say no. Four signals that you're terrified of making a decision.
Plan it. Pick the place. Pick the time. Tell her where to meet you. She'll either show up or she won't.
Either way, you look like a man instead of a scared little boy.
Giovanni Casanova
Master Don Juan
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Exactly. If he continues to do what he's doing now, she will continue to respond to him as she has done up to now. Why is that a problem? Because this post wasn't, "Hey guys, I'm so ecstatic right now because this girl I like let me rub her face and kiss her on the cheek."
No, he senses that there is a problem, and he is correct. And if he doesn't change his approach, this girl is going to be perpetually "not ready" for him, but will be red-hot primed for the next guy.
Have you ever heard of a guy asking a girl out and her saying, "I am just getting over a bad relationship and I want to take things slow and careful"? But a week later she's knocking some guy's headboard into the wall so hard that plaster falls from the ceiling. Why does one guy succeed where the other fails? Do you honestly believe that she was "not ready" on the 14th but she WAS "ready" on the 21st? Of course not... her state of readiness did not change... the only major difference was the guys involved. One lit that spark and the other didn't.
Now you go ahead and keep telling this kid to continue to be himself, to take her on long walks and out to dinner and maybe he can rent "The Princess Diaries" and watch it with her and her girlfriends. He can continue to stroke her face and kiss her on the cheek. Maybe he can write a poem about how her eyes are as deep as oceans or something.
And then next week he can come back here, tears falling on his little keyboard keys, telling us all about how he stumbled upon her between classes, using her tongue to tickle some other guy's tonsils by the lockers.
And then you can explain to him again how he was making all the right moves.
The man said it. Look dude, we're trying to help sincerely, nobody's been agressive and we're trying to make you understand that you're doing some stuff wrong, which you already knew by the time you posted this. If you just wanna hear something to comfort and console you like "you're making all the right moves" then don't come here asking for help. Giovanni said it, if you wanna see changes, change yourself.
Do you really believe in this? Do you really believe that if something doesn't happen like you WANT IT to happen, then it wasn't meant to be? Look man, you need a serious attitude change. This is just my opinion, and i could be wrong. But please, just go read the Bible if you wanna do sth good for yourself.
libre
Don Juan
Mr. Casanova
I do concur with some of the precepts that are extolled on this site and that you put forward. However, I don't think that they should be applied without measure or considering the particular circumstances.
The precepts put forward here are not the end all to all the difficulties of relationship problems. If you follow them blindinglly (right spelling?), you will hit the wall in your relationships or let pass quite promising relationships. Life is more complex than that.
That young woman is not playing games with him. She is responding positively to every move that he proposes. He asked her out for the prom, her answer «Of course.» (straightforward answer), he asked her out for a movie and she agreed, I understand that they spent the day together probably after he proposed it. Now, she asks him time to be ready for her to answer his kiss after he made some moves, well, that is not a sign of pathological behavior.
She is responding favorably to his every move. She's a young woman growing up in her relationships with men. That's a healthy behavior on her part.
As for JcKey, he is not kowtowing to her. He is leading the game and she is following him. That is a winning strategy and attitude on his part. He has adopted with this attitude the right and winning frame of mind. He is a bit unsure of himself, well, I personnaly think that he is doing quite alright.
Good life to you.
I do concur with some of the precepts that are extolled on this site and that you put forward. However, I don't think that they should be applied without measure or considering the particular circumstances.
The precepts put forward here are not the end all to all the difficulties of relationship problems. If you follow them blindinglly (right spelling?), you will hit the wall in your relationships or let pass quite promising relationships. Life is more complex than that.
That young woman is not playing games with him. She is responding positively to every move that he proposes. He asked her out for the prom, her answer «Of course.» (straightforward answer), he asked her out for a movie and she agreed, I understand that they spent the day together probably after he proposed it. Now, she asks him time to be ready for her to answer his kiss after he made some moves, well, that is not a sign of pathological behavior.
She is responding favorably to his every move. She's a young woman growing up in her relationships with men. That's a healthy behavior on her part.
As for JcKey, he is not kowtowing to her. He is leading the game and she is following him. That is a winning strategy and attitude on his part. He has adopted with this attitude the right and winning frame of mind. He is a bit unsure of himself, well, I personnaly think that he is doing quite alright.
Good life to you.
Giovanni Casanova
Master Don Juan
- Joined
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BOTTOM LINE: When people do what you're suggesting and are successful, it is in spite of their actions, instead of being because of their actions.
You're leading him down the path he wants to go down. That's the path where he gets to sit back and avoid effort and let her make the moves. Can that work? Sure... very, very short-term. But it forgets a major factor in attraction: girls like a guy who knows what he wants and works to get it -- not the guy who knows what he wants and then sits back and REALLY HOPES that it comes to him.
*UPDATE*
Justm got back in from prom night and me and my date (the girl) were alone in the limo for like 20 minutes. She was laying on me and then she sprung up and was like "I really want to kiss you. But I punked out." And she kept saying stuff like that kinda shyly so I put my hand on the back of her neck, thumb on face and went in for the kiss.
Very good kiss. Afterwards she said "Thank God you're a good kisser!" We had a nice kiss goodnight later. So, the door is open. I respected her wishes, which was easy because she came around at our very next meeting.
So, yeah, victory for me
Justm got back in from prom night and me and my date (the girl) were alone in the limo for like 20 minutes. She was laying on me and then she sprung up and was like "I really want to kiss you. But I punked out." And she kept saying stuff like that kinda shyly so I put my hand on the back of her neck, thumb on face and went in for the kiss.
Very good kiss. Afterwards she said "Thank God you're a good kisser!" We had a nice kiss goodnight later. So, the door is open. I respected her wishes, which was easy because she came around at our very next meeting.
So, yeah, victory for me
"Why Women Dump the Guys Who Try the Hardest"
You paid for dinner. You drove. You said "whatever you want is fine" every single time. All the effort, no expectations.
And she left anyway — probably for a guy who makes her pick up the pizza.
Painful. Also predictable. Her mind quietly concludes that anything requiring zero effort from her is worth exactly zero. You became a free sample, and free samples get taken for granted.
The 22 Rules flip the dynamic. Small shifts that get her investing effort, money, and time in you — until SHE'S the one afraid of losing YOU.
Hurray for peer pressure and the expectations of prom.
She told you to kiss her.
Let me tell you straight, this isn't going to last on it's current course. Shape up guy, you didn't kiss her. She didn't complement your kissing. She made you kiss her and then was relieved it wasn't half bad for all the effort SHE had to put into getting you to do it.
She told you to kiss her.
Let me tell you straight, this isn't going to last on it's current course. Shape up guy, you didn't kiss her. She didn't complement your kissing. She made you kiss her and then was relieved it wasn't half bad for all the effort SHE had to put into getting you to do it.
I'm gonna skip over all the kissing and need to be kissing stuff.
What you really need to do is get rid all this God damn third-party in your relationship crap. Instead of handling your relationship like a relationship, you've got friends that you talk to about your relationship and those same friends talk to her about the relationship. That is like the BIGGEST SETUP for miscommunication. If you're a man, handle talking to your own woman and that CRAP MUST STOP. I don't care what kinda security you feel about knowing something that she doesn't know you know. But if she did want to tell you, she would have, so quit being a snoop.
As for the kiss. Looks like you lucked out and got one of those moviestar moments. But with the way you're going, I figure someone is going to get bored pretty soon. You tell her EVERYTHING. Even about punking out when you want to kiss her. You also want to know EVERYTHING from her friends. Just chill and relax. You put too much into the relationship and I doubt she's jumping on forums posting about what to do.
What you really need to do is get rid all this God damn third-party in your relationship crap. Instead of handling your relationship like a relationship, you've got friends that you talk to about your relationship and those same friends talk to her about the relationship. That is like the BIGGEST SETUP for miscommunication. If you're a man, handle talking to your own woman and that CRAP MUST STOP. I don't care what kinda security you feel about knowing something that she doesn't know you know. But if she did want to tell you, she would have, so quit being a snoop.
As for the kiss. Looks like you lucked out and got one of those moviestar moments. But with the way you're going, I figure someone is going to get bored pretty soon. You tell her EVERYTHING. Even about punking out when you want to kiss her. You also want to know EVERYTHING from her friends. Just chill and relax. You put too much into the relationship and I doubt she's jumping on forums posting about what to do.
^^^You got it all wrong. I tell her nothing. I tell the third-party all this stuff and they don't tell her. I know this because most of them don't know her and the one that does wouldn't do me like that.
Read what I just posted again. SHE'S the one who said she punked out. Basically, she stuck with what she said about when she was ready, she would tell me. She was basically telling me she was ready and I took the chance.
Read what I just posted again. SHE'S the one who said she punked out. Basically, she stuck with what she said about when she was ready, she would tell me. She was basically telling me she was ready and I took the chance.
No no, you don't get it. Forget about the kissing stuff. You have a third party to gather secret intel for you. What she says goes to your friend which goes to you. What kind of a pansy are you? If she wants to tell you something, she'll say it to your face. Why do you need all this info that she doesn't tell you?
Most your friends that don't know her are gathering information for you? Does she tell EVERYONE about your relationship or something? How is it that people she doesn't even know get such information? I didn't say anything about telling her anything anyways. Your friend talks to her about her relationship and they talk to you, snitching everything she says.
WHY DOES IT EVEN MATTER?
What she says on her own time is her own business. You don't need a third-party in your relationship. Imagine having everyone who posted on this topic snitching to your girlfriend everything you said. Silly eh? Yeah.
Do you remember that game that we played back in elementary school? I think it was called "Telephone." It's the game where you can only whisper something once to the person next to you and it has to continue all through the class. What usually happens is it gets mixed up in the middle somewhere. There are SO many mixups getting information from friends. They'll add in their opinion and they'll measure tone of voice and all the stuff you couldn't get on your own unless you were there.
MAIN POINT: SCREW USING INFORMANTS, TALK TO YOUR OWN WOMAN. If you still think it's okay because they don't tell her all your crap, then you aren't ready for a relationship.
Yeah, I made a mistake about the kissing part, my bad. But it still doesn't escape the fact that you've been trying to know EVERYTHING about her. Imagine yourself on an uncharted island with her, my God, how would you ever know what she's thinking without all those friends of yours.
Most your friends that don't know her are gathering information for you? Does she tell EVERYONE about your relationship or something? How is it that people she doesn't even know get such information? I didn't say anything about telling her anything anyways. Your friend talks to her about her relationship and they talk to you, snitching everything she says.
WHY DOES IT EVEN MATTER?
What she says on her own time is her own business. You don't need a third-party in your relationship. Imagine having everyone who posted on this topic snitching to your girlfriend everything you said. Silly eh? Yeah.
Do you remember that game that we played back in elementary school? I think it was called "Telephone." It's the game where you can only whisper something once to the person next to you and it has to continue all through the class. What usually happens is it gets mixed up in the middle somewhere. There are SO many mixups getting information from friends. They'll add in their opinion and they'll measure tone of voice and all the stuff you couldn't get on your own unless you were there.
MAIN POINT: SCREW USING INFORMANTS, TALK TO YOUR OWN WOMAN. If you still think it's okay because they don't tell her all your crap, then you aren't ready for a relationship.
Yeah, I made a mistake about the kissing part, my bad. But it still doesn't escape the fact that you've been trying to know EVERYTHING about her. Imagine yourself on an uncharted island with her, my God, how would you ever know what she's thinking without all those friends of yours.
libre
Don Juan
Hello JcKey
Great for you. You are having fun and having success with this young woman, which is more than what we read a lot about on this forum. You are having more success' than men 10 years older than you on this site.
You've got a good thing going. And so has this young lady.
Your confidence will grow with every good experience that you have in life, and you are having some with her. Don't worry about the naysayers on this site or on any WEB site; they are a dime a dozen. Remember, they are possibly projecting their own limits in their personalities and defeats in their relationships in their answers.
What I can suggest you which I find the most important, if you are looking for a good and simple guideline, is always command (I don't know if this is the correct word in english) respect in your relationships. I you don't get that respect from the relation, well take your steps away from that situation.
So, with this young woman or any other woman expect respect from her and don't ever kowtow to her. No woman will respect a man who kowtows to her, and if you fail and do, you won't even respect yourself.
However, don't follow this blindingly (correct english?). Every relationship requires give and take with the parties involved. You must expect this if you want to have success'.
You are building a relationship with her. That will be good and gratifying for both of you. Make your moves like the man that you are. She is drinking avidly in this fountain of pleasure and welcomes your moves. Don't worry you've got a good thing going.
Well, like I wrote before, have fun.
Keep us posted (not on the high school forum); it's fun to read about your success' (by the way, is that the proper method of putting success in plural in english?).
Great for you. You are having fun and having success with this young woman, which is more than what we read a lot about on this forum. You are having more success' than men 10 years older than you on this site.
You've got a good thing going. And so has this young lady.
Your confidence will grow with every good experience that you have in life, and you are having some with her. Don't worry about the naysayers on this site or on any WEB site; they are a dime a dozen. Remember, they are possibly projecting their own limits in their personalities and defeats in their relationships in their answers.
What I can suggest you which I find the most important, if you are looking for a good and simple guideline, is always command (I don't know if this is the correct word in english) respect in your relationships. I you don't get that respect from the relation, well take your steps away from that situation.
So, with this young woman or any other woman expect respect from her and don't ever kowtow to her. No woman will respect a man who kowtows to her, and if you fail and do, you won't even respect yourself.
However, don't follow this blindingly (correct english?). Every relationship requires give and take with the parties involved. You must expect this if you want to have success'.
You are building a relationship with her. That will be good and gratifying for both of you. Make your moves like the man that you are. She is drinking avidly in this fountain of pleasure and welcomes your moves. Don't worry you've got a good thing going.
Well, like I wrote before, have fun.
Keep us posted (not on the high school forum); it's fun to read about your success' (by the way, is that the proper method of putting success in plural in english?).
"She Made Her Decision Before You Finished Your Sentence"
Three seconds. That's how long it took. Your shoes. Your posture. The way you held your drink. Whether you looked at the floor or looked at her.
She already filed you away. Interesting. Boring. Safe. Bold. Before you even opened your mouth.
Everything you say after that is just her confirming what she already decided.
So stop rehearsing lines. Fix the first three seconds. Stand tall. Look up. Smile like you mean it. Walk like you belong wherever you're standing.
The words come later. The impression comes first.
It's not as bad as you think. I have friends that I tell all my insecurities too so I can get it out and so that it won't show around my female interests. I'm working on eliminating all the insecurities, but until then I need people to talk to.
And the stuff I get from friends is just light info. Like her saying that she likes me and she talks about me. And you asked how does someone know about it but doesn't even talk to her: a good friend of hers is morgan's friend. Yeah, I know, the whole 'telephone' thing but all she told me was that Morgan said she really liked me.
The only 'snooping' info I got was from Courtney that one time when he told me what she said about not being ready to kiss.