slipstreamer83
Don Juan
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2003
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I think I´m not going to read any more posts on looks in this forum. It just gets me distracted from my target.
"You Can't Argue a Woman Into Liking You"
You made your case like a lawyer. Stable job. Good guy. Ready for something real. All true. All irrelevant.
She weighed your points, nodded along, felt nothing — then fell hard for some tattooed bartender with a motorcycle and a gambling problem.
Logic is where attraction goes to die. The "22 Rules" work a level deeper, on the subconscious switches that decide within minutes whether you register as a MAN or as part of the furniture.
Stop presenting evidence. Start flipping switches.
What can good-looks do that a personality can not?
- Thread starter tactic
- Start date
"The Coffee Shop Girl You Never Spoke To"
You've replayed it a hundred times. She stood three feet away, scrolling her phone. You had an opening. You composed the perfect line — after she was gone.
For all you know, she's married now. To some guy who said something. Anything.
Openers are cheap. Almost any sentence works when it's delivered within three seconds. The expensive part is the standing there, drafting and deleting, while the window quietly closes.
The "22 Rules" stripped out my hesitation. What to open with, how to keep it alive, and the one habit that costs guys more women than anything else: waiting for perfect.
ShortTimer
Banned
- Joined
- Aug 17, 2002
- Messages
- 917
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this link didn't work for me
FlyGuy
Master Don Juan
LOL @ this thread
I'm not even sure why there's room for debate here. As far as I'm concerned, it is a well known and indisputable fact that women are attracted to good looks; same as men are. The emprical and anecdotal evidence for this fact is overwhelming. Any honest woman will agree with this (witness MysteryWoman).
But why is it such a hot issue? Why does it matter whether women value looks more than personality? There's never going to be a straight answer to this question.
Unless you plan on getting some kind of radical make-over surgery, you can't do much about the way you look. So it becomes a moot point. I can understand that some people (myself included) just want to know what their odds are, where they stand, what their strengths/weaknesses are and how to capitalize on them, etc. etc.
But the great danger of focusing on looks is that if you aren't that great looking you can easily fall prey to low confidence which turns into a downward spiral of self fullfilling prophesy. We all know that ugly guys will have to work harder to get the really beautiful girls. Its a fact of life. But personality comes into play very heavily too, and unlike looks you can change your personality. So focus on the things you can change.
I'm not even sure why there's room for debate here. As far as I'm concerned, it is a well known and indisputable fact that women are attracted to good looks; same as men are. The emprical and anecdotal evidence for this fact is overwhelming. Any honest woman will agree with this (witness MysteryWoman).
But why is it such a hot issue? Why does it matter whether women value looks more than personality? There's never going to be a straight answer to this question.
Unless you plan on getting some kind of radical make-over surgery, you can't do much about the way you look. So it becomes a moot point. I can understand that some people (myself included) just want to know what their odds are, where they stand, what their strengths/weaknesses are and how to capitalize on them, etc. etc.
But the great danger of focusing on looks is that if you aren't that great looking you can easily fall prey to low confidence which turns into a downward spiral of self fullfilling prophesy. We all know that ugly guys will have to work harder to get the really beautiful girls. Its a fact of life. But personality comes into play very heavily too, and unlike looks you can change your personality. So focus on the things you can change.
Ok look, if you think looks matter alot, you are WRONG.
I know a guy who is not good-looking, nor decent (i'm saying not decent because i got this expression from a girl who was in love with him) and he got girls that most good-looking guys with good attitude couldn't get. The answer is attitude and alot of experience. Everything in life depends and if you do it right, you can suceed just like in business. Why should we men work so hard just for one person and risk alot of things? Why can't we just act normal and just hang out with guys who know women and become influenced dramatically by them?
I know a guy who is not good-looking, nor decent (i'm saying not decent because i got this expression from a girl who was in love with him) and he got girls that most good-looking guys with good attitude couldn't get. The answer is attitude and alot of experience. Everything in life depends and if you do it right, you can suceed just like in business. Why should we men work so hard just for one person and risk alot of things? Why can't we just act normal and just hang out with guys who know women and become influenced dramatically by them?
FlyGuy
Master Don Juan
"Ok look, if you think looks matter alot, you are WRONG."
Its really easy to make a statement, its a lot harder to back it up. Saying something like "I know a guy who is dog ugly and gets chicks left and right" doesn't prove your point. All it proves is that looks aren't the sole indicator of success - which is exactly what I just said!
I know a guy who is fat/ugly and who still does well with women. But guess what? He's got a LOT of other things going on in his life that provide value. If he were just an average joe I can guaruntee it would not be the same situation for him. Value is what I refer to in my previous post at the beginning of this thread. Its not a new concept. Looks provide value right from the beginning. Looks matter. Even if it isn't the only piece of the puzzle. To deny it is simply selectively viewing the evidence to support something that you already decided.
But I don't intend on being drawn into a useless debate. My point was simply that we as DJs shouldn't be hung up on this issue because REGARDLESS of who is right or wrong, it does no good to dwell on the issue no matter what you look like.
Its really easy to make a statement, its a lot harder to back it up. Saying something like "I know a guy who is dog ugly and gets chicks left and right" doesn't prove your point. All it proves is that looks aren't the sole indicator of success - which is exactly what I just said!
I know a guy who is fat/ugly and who still does well with women. But guess what? He's got a LOT of other things going on in his life that provide value. If he were just an average joe I can guaruntee it would not be the same situation for him. Value is what I refer to in my previous post at the beginning of this thread. Its not a new concept. Looks provide value right from the beginning. Looks matter. Even if it isn't the only piece of the puzzle. To deny it is simply selectively viewing the evidence to support something that you already decided.
But I don't intend on being drawn into a useless debate. My point was simply that we as DJs shouldn't be hung up on this issue because REGARDLESS of who is right or wrong, it does no good to dwell on the issue no matter what you look like.
"She Wants a Man, Not a Boy"
You asked her if she wanted to grab coffee. Then you asked if the time worked. Then you asked if the place was okay. Then you asked if she'd prefer tea.
Four questions. Four chances for her to say no. Four signals that you're terrified of making a decision.
Plan it. Pick the place. Pick the time. Tell her where to meet you. She'll either show up or she won't.
Either way, you look like a man instead of a scared little boy.
What this guy just said is very true. If you are Good Looking you will have instant Social proof, with Guys or Girls.
Im not sure where i am on the scale, but im sure im above average. Often I meet ppl from school or even my own friends think i have a great social life and have connections with lots of ppl. They ask me indirectly.
Eg: The gym manager im cool with normally but i dont talk to him that much nor know him too well. He was planning to buy a BMW, and asked if i had any connections w/anyonefrom BMW...he probably wanted a discount, i told him i didnt. Please man im 19, dont expect that much from me.
And i find acquaintances to always show the highest interest in me, like what i've been up to or anything new happening in my life.
#1 i dont have that great of a social life, just an average one
#2 I dont have much connections, maybe just a few.
#3 dont have much friends, only a few. Rest are acquaintances
- I also believe this is another reason why ppl take sudden interests in good looking ppl.
I highly believe that you should dress well or decent. As many of you have experienced in the past that you are better respected if you dress well.
Le Parisien
Master Don Juan
It looks like more and more that there's no need for any "debate" on this topic, people are always stuck with their ideas, what a surprise huh?
On a topic like this, it's not something like ethics or rocket science, no need to be WRONG or RIGHT, I would say "whatever works for you guys".
Again I don't want to flame anyone, but some people's reaction really reminds me of myself back in high school, when I was SO self conscious about my height, when I was always trying to "prove" that height does NOT matter, that anything equal elsewhere I was as "worthy" as the tall guys...
I grew out of it by acknowledging that it MATTERS somewhat but not a big deal. I am a happy and successful person now, hehe...
I still remember all those hours stupidly wasted on arguing with my parents and my friends about it...
On a topic like this, it's not something like ethics or rocket science, no need to be WRONG or RIGHT, I would say "whatever works for you guys".
FlyGuy put it perfectly.
Again I don't want to flame anyone, but some people's reaction really reminds me of myself back in high school, when I was SO self conscious about my height, when I was always trying to "prove" that height does NOT matter, that anything equal elsewhere I was as "worthy" as the tall guys...
I grew out of it by acknowledging that it MATTERS somewhat but not a big deal. I am a happy and successful person now, hehe...
I still remember all those hours stupidly wasted on arguing with my parents and my friends about it...
This may have been said before, I haven't read the entire thread, but good looks doesn't mean you have to look like Brad Pitt. Here is a little piece of info for all of you: If every man in the world worked out and kept himself physically in shape, the majority would be good looking! Good looking doesn't mean you have to be perfect!
If your a little worse looking than the guy next to you, who cares? If you put the time in at the gym and through dieting, you will be naturally good looking... With that being said, this arguement should be over.
Anyone who is saying they can't get women because they aren't good looking means they don't take care of themselves. If you do take care of yourself and you can't get women you need to evaluate your personality. Women want a 'total package'. Looks and personality are both valued... and women don't expect both to be perfect.
If your a little worse looking than the guy next to you, who cares? If you put the time in at the gym and through dieting, you will be naturally good looking... With that being said, this arguement should be over.
Anyone who is saying they can't get women because they aren't good looking means they don't take care of themselves. If you do take care of yourself and you can't get women you need to evaluate your personality. Women want a 'total package'. Looks and personality are both valued... and women don't expect both to be perfect.
FlyGuy
Master Don Juan
OK, you should have addressed your reply to him then
"She Laughed All Night. Then She Ghosted You. Here's Why."
Dinner ran three hours. She laughed at everything. You walked her to her car thinking this one's locked in.
Then: nothing. Two texts. No reply. What happened?
You did what most men do on a great date. You filled every silence, answered every question, and left her with nothing to wonder about. No mystery. Nothing to sit with when she got home.
Rule 3 of the "22 Rules" changes the ending: tell her a little, hold back the rest, and let her imagination do the chasing. The ghosting stops too.
DJUofS -
Your words speak truth. Many ppl out there may be overweight or fat, and their fat covers up their jawline or facial bone structure....If working out and losing weight i do believe Not only your face, but your entire body will be more defined and pleasing to the eye.
on another note - KC mentioned good looks are an asset, that's very true.
you can have good looks, but if ur posture is all off or you always keep looking down, or you dress like a slob...dont groom yourself....
BELIEVE ME, NO ONES GONNA GIVE YOU THE TIME OF THE DAY.
LOOKS ARE AN ASSET, BUT HOW YOU TAKE CARE OF YOUR BODY, YOUR CLOTHING, AND YOUR PERSONALITY IS MOST IMPORTANT.
end of story.
Your words speak truth. Many ppl out there may be overweight or fat, and their fat covers up their jawline or facial bone structure....If working out and losing weight i do believe Not only your face, but your entire body will be more defined and pleasing to the eye.
on another note - KC mentioned good looks are an asset, that's very true.
you can have good looks, but if ur posture is all off or you always keep looking down, or you dress like a slob...dont groom yourself....
BELIEVE ME, NO ONES GONNA GIVE YOU THE TIME OF THE DAY.
LOOKS ARE AN ASSET, BUT HOW YOU TAKE CARE OF YOUR BODY, YOUR CLOTHING, AND YOUR PERSONALITY IS MOST IMPORTANT.
end of story.
JT47319
Master Don Juan
Bullshyt. I've seen scruffy fyckas get tail based purely on looks. So long as he's not smelly (not even then) then he's gonna get his bones jumped. I've come in from the beach after a long session of beach Volleyball and we're all scruffy, dirty, looking like total slobs & scrubs and yes, even smelly, and see some of my Natural friends pull.
Wing with Naturals. They can do the stupidest, AFC shyt and still bag T&A based purely on looks.
It's also a lot more fun to wing with Naturals too.
If i'm looking for a one night stand and I have to choose between a HB9 and a HB7, I will take the 9. Same goes for women... If they are willing to get laid then and there and a very nice looking guy comes up to them, they will get the tail no problem.
This site, however, isn't based on one night stands. It's based on getting better with women. That includes personality. If I have to choose to date a HB9 or a HB7 based on looks and personality and the 7 has a much better personality, I am choosing her. I am sure the same goes for women.
MysteryWoman
Master Don Juan
Try typing it in the address bar, you will be quite shocked to find out how much a woman is prepared to have sex with a hot guy. Even I'm quite shocked!
"Nervous Around Beautiful Women? There's a Rule for That"
I could talk to any woman I wasn't attracted to. Charming, funny, relaxed. Then a gorgeous woman looked my way and I'd become a sweating, babbling mess.
The fix took me years to find and ten minutes to learn. Nervousness and excitement are the same physical state — pounding heart, adrenaline, flushed face. Your brain just picks the label. And you can pick a better one.
Rule 16 shows you how. You feel the nerves, relabel them as excitement, and let that energy pour out as enthusiasm. Women notice the guy radiating it. They always do.
Definitely YES!!
As long as a girl finds you SOMEWHAT GOOD LOOKING, you still have a shot at getting her. If you're just an average Joe, it will take you longer, but it can be accomplished.
If a girl DOESN'T FIND YOU AT ALL GOOD LOOKING, then you have no chance of getting her. None, Nada, Zilch....!!!!
It is human nature that people look at things that are pleasing to their eyes, and stay away from repulsive things.
If you don't believe me, try to picture a 400 pound fatty trying to hook up with you. She can throw every trick in the book at you, but there's no way in hell that you're going to hook up with her. Of course we all have different taste, but the majority of humans would find a 400 pound fatty repulsive.
Men and women actually go about the selection process in the same manner. It all depends on what one is looking for at a particular time.
If a woman goes to a bar just to get laid, she'll start off by giving signals to the guy she finds the best looking. If the guy shows no interest or misses the signals, she'll move on to the next guy that she finds the next best looking. She'll go through this process until someone shows interest or picks up on her signals. Eventually she'll work her way down to the average Joe. As long as she finds him somewhat good looking, he's still alive in the game.
The same thing goes if a woman is looking for a relationship with a guy. She'll start off with the best looking guy and work her way down the looks ladder until she finds the right guy that has the qualities she's looking for.
So in conclusion...
LOOKS are more important than personality. Your personality will get you nowhere if the woman finds your looks repulsive.
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Surfboard-
lets clarify first that -
Good looking does not always mean attractive
A chick can find her bf to be very attractive, yet in girls' eyes, he's average looking
You're placing good looking & attractive in the same category, which it isnt completely similar in concept.
Yes the chick at the bar might be sending signals to a handsome guy to get laid. But she'd equally do the same for a guy that appears to present social proof, who is average looking
lets clarify first that -
Good looking does not always mean attractive
A chick can find her bf to be very attractive, yet in girls' eyes, he's average looking
You're placing good looking & attractive in the same category, which it isnt completely similar in concept.
Yes the chick at the bar might be sending signals to a handsome guy to get laid. But she'd equally do the same for a guy that appears to present social proof, who is average looking
surfboard, np.
i reread your post, seems to maek more sense with the changes, btw u seem to be onto something...
ranging from 5 - 8, i think that's what the average is on looks on the population. It would be hard to find someone repulsive or THAT UGLY..would have to be a practical genetic deformation.
but yea you'd have to look really repulsive to get nowhere.
but nowadays ppl seem to be taking good care of themselves, compared to the medieval times (no make up, no mirrors, no fashion, there ya got it repulsive lookin ogres.
i reread your post, seems to maek more sense with the changes, btw u seem to be onto something...
ranging from 5 - 8, i think that's what the average is on looks on the population. It would be hard to find someone repulsive or THAT UGLY..would have to be a practical genetic deformation.
but yea you'd have to look really repulsive to get nowhere.
but nowadays ppl seem to be taking good care of themselves, compared to the medieval times (no make up, no mirrors, no fashion, there ya got it repulsive lookin ogres.
"She's Out of Your League"
You've said it a hundred times. Maybe a thousand. And every time you say it, you train your brain to freeze the next time she walks into the room.
Leagues are a myth invented by guys who are scared of women.
She's a person. She has bad breath in the morning. She picks songs she can't sing in the shower. She overthinks her own texts.
Walk over. Say something. The league dissolves the second you open your mouth.