Weird situation -- want master insight

[Bonhomme]

Cue the "Twilight Zone" theme ...

Submitted for your analysis and entertainment, a case from the far reaches of the Twilight Zone of weird female psychology...

There's this one gal I occasionally run into, and we have extremely intense chemistry -- she just about attacks me every time we meet -- but it's also just about impossible to get a date with her.

The one time we actually did go on a date, we had a great time, and I ended up staying the night, though she said some way-too-serious for a 1st date things that weirded me out a bit, though I kept a game face. It's not a big deal, because there are lots of others in the picture, even when I'm not hooked up with someone on a steady basis, but this is so puzzling I have a sort of scientist's curiosity about it.

Perhaps she's looking for a husband, and wants someone to really stick out his neck for her, but to me her game just comes across as disrespectful, so I bail. It's not really good for her, either (see last paragraph below).

Anyway, after months of no contact with her, I ran into her at a music festival, and she couldn't keep her hands off me. She complimented me, and I ran with it in a ****y/funny sort of manner, let my inner smartass take over, teased her a bit about her drunkenness, and we got pretty affectionate. I told her of another music fest going on in a venue near where she lives the next day that I was going to, and she begged me to go, giving me a kiss on the lips, while hugging with intense pressure in the crotch area. A real "do me" goodbye. If she wasn't with a (visibly annoyed) friend, I could have probably taken her home right then. OK.

Then the next day I called her in the early afternoon, and get her voice mail (note: I never do blocked calls or any of that crap -- gals are hip to it, and you just look like a wuss). I left a brief message telling her when the show is, and leaving my numbers. I didn't have anything genuinely witty to say, so just played it cool and kept it straight. Then I went about my activities, but didn't hear from her.

So I called again before the show, told her matter-of-factly I was going to take a little rest, then go to the show. In just a few minutes she called me back, sounding plenty enthusiastic, and said she was going to a barbecue for "just a little while," and would call my cell phone when she left there. I just said something to the effect of "OK, catch you later." This is the one thing I could improve upon if something like this comes up again: if this happens again, I'll essentially break the date, saying something to the effect of "enjoy your barbecue, we'll get together some other time." But I didn't think of that at the time, so just played it cool. I eventually went to the show, and had a good time, but never heard from her. I certainly wasn't about to call her, since she said she'd call me, even though that's what she may have wanted or expected (note that she returned my second call earlier).

I considered the possibility that she lost her phone, or it lost its charge (which happens a lot in both business and personal situations in these days of unreliable mobile communications), so just in case she lost her phone and my # with it, the next day I just left a message with my phone numbers, and said "what happened?" in a neutral tone of voice. No assumptions made. But I haven't heard from her, so now I'm sure that didn't happen.

The only thing I can think of is that she wants to hold all the cards in any relationship she's in, and expects guy to keep chasing after her until she's convinced she has him by the nuts. Of course, once he does that she'll lose all her attraction for him. If this is the case, no wonder she's single. Could she be one of those un-dateable women, where her left-brain demands for indulgence sabotage her right-brain emotions that attract her to strong men who are in control of situations?

Anyway, I won't play that game. I'd rather keep up the attractiveness level than hand over my nuts for some temporary booty. If I hook up with her sometime she loses her self-control, fine. But that's all I'll take it for, unless she gives me reason to believe otherwise. Meanwhile, I'll concentrate on the others and think of this one as weird female psychology lab exercise and have as much fun with it as I can.

I'm interested to see your thoughts on this one, especially those of you who are more advanced. I'm not looking for advice -- I've written her off, for all intents and purposes -- I'm looking for insight.

 

[xblitz44x]

Hey Bonhomme,

I'll give you my opinion and insight, although it probably isn't going to agree with yours and what most of these guys will say. Either way don't take offense to it.

Half of the problems in your post is her fault, the other half is YOUR fault. Just by reading your post, the entire source of the problem is revealed. You're under the impression that the more you talk to a girl, the more 'available' you are, the less she is going to like you; and the more 'in control' you are, the more 'confident' you are; the MORE she's going to like you. I don't agree with that at all; and I think that's WHY you're running into problems. Think about it, there are pleanty of guys who have no confidence, guys who have literally committed suicide - who get laid. And there are guys who have all the confidence in the world and wind up on sites like this one.

Also, you're trying way too hard to go the "I don't care" route. It's good that you're not concenered with the outcome but if you truely are, than it doesn't take effort and doesn't require you mentioning how you have other girls in the picture, and how you aren't going to 'hand over your nuts'.

So, just for this thread, try to drop the 'challenge, mystery = attraction' equation for one second and this all might make more sense.

"we have extremely intense chemistry -- she just about attacks me every time we meet -- but it's also just about impossible to get a date with her."

Maybe the 'chemistry' is your own perception of what is going on. How do you know that she feels the same way? Do you have any other hints besides the fact that she 'attacks' you? She may be simply flirtatious and outgoing by nature.

"Perhaps she's looking for a husband, and wants someone to really stick out his neck for her, but to me her game just comes across as disrespectful, so I bail."

What part of her 'game' is disrespectful? You wrote this before you wrote about the music festival thing and you left out the details on what exactly was 'disrespectful' about her game that made you not talk to her for months. Maybe those 'serious' things that she was saying was an indicator that she is looking for something more than just to fvck around (not neccesarily a husband). And maybe when you disappeared for months she assumed that you didn't want the same thing.

"I ran with it in a ****y/funny sort of manner, let my inner smartass take over, teased her a bit about her drunkenness, and we got pretty affectionate."

That's cool and there is nothing wrong with that in the music festival situation; but maybe you didn't take enough time to really connect with her. Which also might go back that she wanted something more than just a fling and you didn't appear to be down for that. It's hard to tell.

"The only thing I can think of is that she wants to hold all the cards in any relationship she's in, and expects guy to keep chasing after her until she's convinced she has him by the nuts. Of course, once he does that she'll lose all her attraction for him. If this is the case, no wonder she's single. Could she be one of those un-dateable women, where her left-brain demands for indulgence sabotage her right-brain emotions that attract her to strong men who are in control of situations?"

This entire paragraph is a disaster. This is the root of most of YOUR problem in this situation. I will admit that the girl takes the other half of the fault for leading you on, but your issues of feeling like a relationship is some sort of power struggle is evident by this paragraph. If you keep operating from this place, you're going to keep sabotaging relationships because you're too afraid of 'her having you by the nuts' or 'not being in control enough of the situation'. I am convinced that if you were just YOU, and didn't have your wires all tangled by misperceptions of what attracts women, you would have been fine.

"I've written her off, for all intents and purposes"

She wrote YOU off before you even realized it.

Again, I don't mean to be offensive but I think you need to take a step back for a second and clear your head.

-Blitz

 

[Bonhomme]

Filling in the blanks

Thanks for the thoughtful reply, xblitz. Good to hear from an experienced DJ who can look beyond the supposed "rules."

In the interest of brevity, I didn't fill in all the blanks in my post. It appears that some of it was unclear, judging from your response. And there are some good points you made, some of which reflect thoughts I've already had, but did not betray, to see if any independent voices would bring them up (how sneaky of me ).

Actually, I've been straightforward all along with this gal in terms of making plans, but she's been the one who has not followed through with what she says she would do. Before the time we did get together, we had made plans to get together, and when I called on the day we were to get together she cancelled. I did tell her cancelling without calling was unacceptable, but hung in there, though her reasons for not calling me to cancel were questionable, because she did apologize, and no harm was done beyond losing a chunk of my schedule.

Have you ever experienced how a woman will sometimes do something disrespectful to a man they really, really like to see if he has the backbone to call her on it without losing his cool and coming unhinged? I've had a couple women dump me for tolerating too much misbehavior from them. Few women like a guy who's a pushover. But one shouldn't be unreasonable, either, though it's better to err on the drill sergeant side (with a cool head), though it's not about just attracting women. It's a matter of being treated with respect. I was straddling that line the entire time, whether it was by accident or design from her end.

Actually, after the time we finally did get together, we had made plans to get together in a couple days, and she was just unreachable. I left a couple messages, and she didn't return my calls. So then I bailed. Should I put up with that, when we made plans? I say no. That's why I disappeared, and it was right to do so. She later claimed she got back together with her ex, but I don't necessarily believe it. I saw her out alone on a weekend night just a few weeks later, when I was out with someone else.

There's no question about the chemistry. I've hardly ever encountered anyone so straightforwardly aggressive with her affection, and I've not seen her be that way with anyone else. One can sense these things, and there's a stronger sexual vibe going than I've had with many gals I've been involved with. She's attracted to me, there's no doubt about it .... but it's true she may have doubts about me. But if she's trying to somehow test my commitment, she's going about it the wrong way. If she wants to see if I'm in it for the long haul, we should just make plans accordingly, and set up meetings well in advance in situations that are not likely to end up in the bedroom.

It's possible she lacks confidence in her self-control, and is afraid of being abandoned after totally falling for me. I wouldn't do that, but how can she really know? If that's the case, I understand her dilemma. But ... if that means I'll have to lose my backbone and take all kinds of disrespect, it will be moot, because -- mark my words -- she will not be attracted to me anymore if my backbone turns to jelly -- not that I want to make such a Faustian bargain, anyway. That would not be true to myself.

The way I see it, there are two different dynamics: the "reptile brain" dynamic that determines the level of basic animal attraction; and the rational, "left brain" dynamic.

I think you're absolutely right, looking at things from the "left brain" side. But .. that has much less to do with the basic attraction people feel for each other than we're inclined to believe. I agree wholeheartedly with David D'Angelo that attraction is not a choice, and that attraction trumps everything else regarding people's choice of a mate.

OK, I've taken a long enough break ... back to work. Thanks again for your ideas and suggestions. I'll let your ideas stew around in my mind for a bit.

 

[The TallOne]

I would also be interested in a response to this.

I had a similar situation like this.

 

[Bonhomme]

It looks like even the masters are puzzled by this one.

At this time she is in limbo. I'd bet dollars to donuts if I run into her after leaving her alone for a while, she'll be all over me again.

I might experiment briefly with pursuing her a bit more, and see if it pulls her in or she pulls away. Nothing to lose.

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

Originally posted by Bonhomme
There's this one gal I occasionally run into, and we have extremely intense chemistry -- she just about attacks me every time we meet -- but it's also just about impossible to get a date with her.

Once I read the above quote I knew this is a situation that wouldn't make sense!

If you had intense chemistry then she would have obviously dated you more than one time and would want to meet you more than 'occasionally' and not let chance bring you two together!

This means either her 'excitement' is not sincere or you are misinterpreting her 'eagerness' to be with you. Could have her intoxicated state played a part?

I can't see where you went wrong so I take it she likes to turn men on so that she can get them to chase her end entertain herself in the process by making them jump through hoops and making them beg!

A woman who wants you doesn't act so casually and dismissive as this - so your so-called 'intense'chemistry is an illusion!

Or, she may have a boyfriend - maybe that is why her friend was annoyed when she saw her groping you.

 

[Bonhomme]

No question about the chemistry

There's absolutely no question about the chemistry. In fact, part of the problem might be that the chemistry's a bit too much for her, and she's afraid of losing control of her heart to a man who her mind is not sure about. The more I think of it, the more apparent that becomes.

I think xblitz is on the right track here: one of the things she said on the first date something to the effect that she was too old to be fooling around, and wanted something serious. The other little outbursts that weirded me out were consistent with that (in the context of having a bit too much to drink), too. But she wasn't acting weird the next morning when we woke up, and everything seemed cool.

I do like the gal, and think the quality of affection could well be worth a bit of compromising -- but not worth dealing with disrespect. Ahhhh, if life was a bit more straightforward.

Her friend at the music fest was annoyed because of envy, plain and simple. I didn't mention that her friend is rather heavyset, and not nearly as cute. Probably doesn't get very many dates. I was very friendly to her friend, but I'm sure that was little consolation.

It's quite possible there is another man in the picture. It may be a situation of sticking with a known quantity, rather than taking a chance with someone she's not so sure about. Still, I haven't seen her with any other man, and hardly ever in a group of people. She's usually either flying solo or with a female friend. Perhaps she's in an "on again/off again" relationship. During my overnight date I saw absolutely no evidence of any other man in her life, though.

There is one possibly huge thing I did not mention: she is an occasional smoker (not a heavy smoker -- I thought she was a non-smoker at first), and I'm am a very strict non-smoker, to the point I don't even allow it in my car or house at all. In fact, I'm chemically sensitive, and can only handle smoke on an infrequent basis.

The more I think of it, the more it appears she's attracted to me, but has very serious doubts about me as a long-term prospect. Possibly my aversion to cigarette smoke is a very big issue. I think the fact that I don't overindulge her cuts both ways: I think it attracts her in an animal sense, but puts her off in a logistical sense. It's certainly possible to work out a mutually acceptable compromise regarding the smoke issue. But the only way I could make that clear to her would be if we communicate.

I think confident persistence is what is called for here. The 'ol trick of showing strong interest while maintaining the aura of confidence and self-assurance, while not contacting her too often. "I know you're into me, why deny yourself the bliss, but you won't get the goodies if you're not good to me" is the underlying message to keep in mind.

Meanwhile, there are always others, so if she puts me off too long, she just may be SOL. Too bad for her.

 

[PuertoRican_Lover]

I think you answered your own question!! If she is 'older ' than , as you said, she is ready to 'settle'!!