Tips needed - split shoulder routine?

[mintxx]

Hi guys,
I've been lifting for about 2 years, and have seen modest gains (a bit over 15kg). Until recently I concentrated on the big three power lifts, and while I'll continue to do so, I've been unsure of where to fit shoulders into my routine.

At the moment I'm on a three day split by muscle groups- squat, bench and dead, accompanied by associated moves that I swap on and off - leg press, incline and dips, flies, rows and chins.

I've added shoulders to leg day, by doing mil press, front/side raise, reverse flies etc,. totalling about 9 sets for the shoulders.

Now having spoken to a couple of guys who PT and throw a bit more weight around, I'm thinking I should be doing shoulders and chest on the same day, but since back and shoulders seem to go together with some stuff as well, I'm thinking of moving my shoulder stuff off of leg day and distributing it across the other two days.

My rationale is that I want to work the groups that go together on each day. So what if I do this:

On bench day, I add military press with variations/dumbbells (pushing, same muscle group)
and on deadlift day, I add raises and shrugs. I can then put abs/lower back on leg day, and have three fairly well grouped workouts that I can change around and vary a bit: lower body, pushes, pulls. This keeps to my big three routine while keeping to a three day split and not interrupting recovery by doing shoulder work on the third day. What do you guys think? Unless there's something important I'm missing or gains I'm wasting, I'll trial this for a month or two. Thanks for any replies, I'll delete if no action after a week. Cheers, mintxx

 

[mintxx]

Come on lads! I'll make it simple - where do you put shoulders in your workouts? Do you just add mil press to chest day and shrugs/raises to back day?

 

[stronglifts]

Come on lads! I'll make it simple - where do you put shoulders in your workouts? Do you just add mil press to chest day and shrugs/raises to back day?

Alternate between bench press & overhead press.

Example

Week1: mo BP/wed OP/FR BP
week2: mo OP/wed BP/FR OP
week3: same week1
week4: same week2
etc...

 

[shaunuk]

Hey mintxx,

it depends how your routine is setup, i.e. volume etc. Since shoulders are synnergists in most chest movements, i.e. all bench press variations, shoulders are traditionally done on chest day.

What does your whole routine look like?

-shaun

 

[mintxx]

day 1: legs and lower body
1. smith squat > free squat 2. leg press 3. weighted crunches 4. weighted back extensions
[2 x 7, 2 x 5 +~10kg for squats and leg press, 3 x 10 for abs/back]

day 2: chest and shoulders 'pushing' movements
1. bench, 2. incline/decline db press or dip, 3. mil press/o/h press 4. skullcrushers/tricep cable variations
[4 x ~5 for each compound, 3 x 8 for tricep]

day 3: back and shoulders 'pulling' movements
1. deadlift, 2. seated cable row/lat pulldown, 3. chins, 4. db shrugs 5. lat raises (front/side/rear) 6. barbell bicep curl
[4 x ~5 for compounds, curls and shrugs, 3 x 8 for raises. 90% recovery between each set, if i can do two or three extra reps i add more weight for that set]

sets can very, but i try to go to failure at least 3 times with full recovery. when i'm pushed for time, i drop bicep/triceps/shoulders and max out the big 3.

this is the basic idea. sometimes i swap in lunges on the same smith machine, cable flies on day 2, hammer and reverse e-z curls day 3. i take a week off every month or two, and alternate between going 1-2-3 and 1-off-2-off-3-off depending on what else i'm doing in food and cardio. Prior to this, I was doing o/h press, shrugs, raises on leg day instead of spreading them across chest and back. I think what I'm doing now is probably going to work well. I was on a 2 day split until a few months ago, and have increased the number of days I lift.

 

[shaunuk]

Looks good, but there's no need for those lateral raises, they might even be counterproductive. You don't need the direct trap work either (db shrugs) since your deadlifts will hit them hard.

You might also consider doing barbell rows + chins for back rather than pulldowns + chins, but your choice

A posterior core/hamstring movement would also be good on leg day, i.e. pullthroughs, goodmornings or gluteham-raises. Calf work if you can be arsed, haha.

-shaun

 

[mintxx]

OK I'll try cutting back day down to just barbells and bodyweight, alternate with cable some days, focus on deadlift increases for a few months.

And I'll round out leg day although I am lazy with the small stuff =).

Excellent, thanks for the tips, mintxx out