There is no amount of encouraging nor shaming by a woman that can make a man remove himself from being gynocentrically controlled by his mother

[christie]

My opinion: he's unable to leave his mother's influence and grip and will not fully mature until he 'cuts his umbilical cord' to his mother

 

[christie]

Further to this, these controlling mothers are outliving these controlled sons.

I can't think of a more important red pill to take than the one that helps a man leave his mother.

 

[christie]

they are 'mother-cels'

 

[christie]

What concerns me is how this was the common denominator in any ltr I've had.
Never obvious at first.
I grew up in a close nuclear family and often appreciated when the boyfriend was close to their family, including mother, as well.

I need to meditate at which point the truth was revealed; at what point in the relationship did I discover how tightly The Mother controlled them and also to meditate if I am attracting this on purpose.

What a terribly long road I have ahead of me in getting better satisfaction from an ltr if indeed I'm a domineering woman. Yikes.

 

[christie]

awww, that's what I've been thinking the last couple of years too.
Its just easier to be more feminine so why not be simp or trans.

What about that line by G. Greer that's quoted in some song.......

"The opposite of Patriarchy isn't Matriarchy, its fraternity and I think its women that are going to have to break the spiral of power and find the trick, to cooperation."

What do you think Pan? Is it do-able? Can some of the skills and character traits women have developed in f*ism in the last century, be useful enough to retain in some way for cooperation to create not a patriarchy but instead a fraternity?



Or just no?

 

[christie]

I think the results of Feminism speaks for itself. It hasn't resulted in fraternity, it has resulted in an almost complete alienation of the sexes.

I agree.

I was just attempting a fraternity negotiation instead of a return to patriarchy.

Did humankind ever have a fraternity?

or is that a slippery slope to com*ism economically and so not viable?

To the title of this thread I can tell you there were brief moments of a fraternal feeling with these boyfriends. Like, I could sympathise the predicaments they were in.
I feel the same with the knowledge and thoughts induced from reading on sosuave too.




I wouldn't attempt the question if I didn't think cooperation was possible.

Its just that I'm not sure of what I don't see yet.

We know patriarchy DID work.

Thanks for your time and effort in replying, appreciate it.

 

[christie]

Roosh V wrote a good article on this recently:

Men Treat Women As Gods – Roosh Valizadeh

In order to be with a woman, there is no sacrifice a modern man is not willing to make. He will pretend to be a feminist, travel around the world, and even feign allegiance to abortion or homosexual marriage. If a man wants a woman, and the woman professes to like something, the man will profess to

www.rooshv.com

To take the metaphor - The woman was made from a man's rib, a man wasn't made from a woman's rib. She was made to be beside him in a supporting role, not beneath him and not above him. A partnership.

That was interesting imagery of the man that 'pre-eats' the apple.
Good example to use, pretty good article, thanks.

I'll take the following, if that's the definition of Return to Patriarchy.

The part where you state:

She was made to be beside him in a supporting role, not beneath him and not above him. A partnership.

As long as one understands the role of support.

This can be trained into females who sense this is right but are unsure what the specific skills and behaviours are that are expected. Unfortunately, we know there are millions of women without this training.

And man, do we ever know that there are millions of men who don't know that they're supposed to train or even how to train.

So.

Get some Train the trainer programs started. I don't know how to market that.

"Partnership preparation classes"? *school

"Try on the roles of partners at a special retreat resort"? *recreation

"A travelling play that's performed by people willing to act out these prescripted 'partner' roles"? *hobbies

"A workplace that doubles as a community service like the Salvat ion Army model(I worked in the warehouse and then retail store before-genuine honest organisation, imo) but instead of that, its named 'Partnership Coalition' and to work there one new hire must agree to the terms of working in a partnership role assigned to you" *careers

That's all I have for ideas right now.

I like trying to solve this. Must be bold and have hope men and women can produce the will to learn.

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

My opinion: he's unable to leave his mother's influence and grip and will not fully mature until he 'cuts his umbilical cord' to his mother

There is a book on the complex. The most ****d up men are in single mom household. Highly unavailable.

 

[christie]

There is a book on the complex. The most ****d up men are in single mom household. Highly unavailable.

2parent households too...its tricky to spot right away.
My spotting/perceiving prowress is unusually low on a lot of dating facets.
Thanks for letting me learn here on sosuave. I'm trying to read everything obsessively what people recommend here or referenced influencers.
Its a bit dizzying but I'm making headway in perception changes and accountable personal attitude adjustments for the better.



But those guys that won't leave their mommy though.

I suspect that deceased ex died of od. His mommy worked in a pharmacy. If correct, that's one of the biggest cases of passive-agressiveness I've ever known.
A woman can't tell the guy to leave his suffocating mother. It has to be a tribe of all men.

 

[corrector]

Further to this, these controlling mothers are outliving these controlled sons.

I can't think of a more important red pill to take than the one that helps a man leave his mother.

People stay at home longer because it is too expensive to move out. Nobody who can afford to leave usually stays.

 

[christie]

There is a discernible difference when witnessing a man that has 'cut the umbilical cord' or not.
Tells are found :

in frequency of communication on private matters to the mother.

in frequency of time spent alone with mother in the role of surrogate husband.

in frequency of being unable to make independent decisions without consulting the mother first.

Man, I could go on and on.

Ways to tell he HAS cut the umbilical cord, regardless if he's living under the same roof would be found in the opposite of the above tells.




My shock and grief at learning about the ex's premature death at 48 promoted this post, corrector, just so you know.
The ex actually lived apart from his mother but the invisible long umbilical cord was still attached all these years since dating him first in 1994. It was a huge factor in loss of attraction.

 

[corrector]

There is a discernible difference when witnessing a man that has 'cut the umbilical cord' or not.
Tells are found :

in frequency of communication on private matters to the mother.

in frequency of time spent alone with mother in the role of surrogate husband.

in frequency of being unable to make independent decisions without consulting the mother first.

Man, I could go on and on.

Ways to tell he HAS cut the umbilical cord, regardless if he's living under the same roof would be found in the opposite of the above tells.




My shock and grief at learning about the ex's premature death at 48 promoted this post, corrector, just so you know.
The ex actually lived apart from his mother but the invisible long umbilical cord was still attached all these years since dating him first in 1994. It was a huge factor in loss of attraction.

I may have missed something. The issue is your ex-premature death at 48. Why did he die? Why are you focusing on him being a momma's boy in regards to all of this? It's tragic that he died pre-maturely period, momma's boy or not.

 

[christie]

I may have missed something. The issue is your ex-premature death at 48. Why did he die? Why are you focusing on him being a momma's boy in regards to all of this? It's tragic that he died pre-maturely period, momma's boy or not.

thanks, the old anger and exasperation returned.
The disappointment he wouldn't come out here(from Grimsby)
The embarassment/guilt that my faults probably drove him to his mother.
Anger that I was never chosen as a priority in relevance to any of these ex's lives over their mother's grip.
The realisation I've never really learned of independent men(alphas) or what they're like when they refuse to be gynocentrically controlled even in some small way.

Frustration and impatience, mostly, corrector.

I promised my family yesterday I would stop googling ex's names

 

[redskinsfan92]

Hmm, never was a momma's boy. None of my friends are either as far as I have noticed. Knew a boy that was growing up. He was a mess.

 

[DEEZEDBRAH]

thanks, the old anger and exasperation returned.
The disappointment he wouldn't come out here(from Grimsby)
The embarassment/guilt that my faults probably drove him to his mother.
Anger that I was never chosen as a priority in relevance to any of these ex's lives over their mother's grip.
The realisation I've never really learned of independent men(alphas) or what they're like when they refuse to be gynocentrically controlled even in some small way.

Frustration and impatience, mostly, corrector.

I promised my family yesterday I would stop googling ex's names

Iys a ****ed up situation for couples. If i am seeing a girl and her fam is attempting to be involved, I cut contact. I have seen enough to know that it won't end well.

 

[christie]

Iys a ****ed up situation for couples. If i am seeing a girl and her fam is attempting to be involved, I cut contact. I have seen enough to know that it won't end well.

when I realised it would have took some lady b*lls because it would have meant getting up from the parents'kitchen table and walking immediately out. Historically, I never say why I'm walking out until later. Never been that brave/honest with other's family though.

They're not in my life now.
Next time I'll be myself.

 

[corrector]

Certain types of deviant and deranged women do like mommy's boys though.

What are you talking about?

 

[christie]

To the thread title: a woman must start encouraging him to build more male relationships. To release him to be able to do this.

As author Robert Glover writes in No more mister nice guy,
" developing male relationships helps undo a Nice Guy's monogamous bond with his mother. Little boys get pulled into unhealthy relationships with their mothers only when their fathers allow it. The solution to reversing this dynamic is creating healthy relationships with men "