The Problem with the "He Paid" Argument

[bigneil]

Imagine you were going on a date tonight with a fat 40 year old woman.

• If you could spend a penny and make her skinny, would you? Of course you would.
• If you could spend a dime and make her young and skinny, would you? Of course you would.
• If you had to spend a million dollars to make her one year younger, would you? Of course not.
• So we can see that it's not whether you paid her or not, it's how much you paid her and what you got in return.
• Another factor is how much you earn per hour at your job. If you were earning $2000 a day, would you spend $20 to upgrade your girl? Of course you would. If you were earning $10 a day, would you spend $20 to upgrade your girl? Of course not.

Summary: Many older men with good careers are willing to work an extra hour to upgrade their women from fat 40 year olds to hot 20 year olds. This is done by virtue of spending more on dates. Saying "it doesn't count because he paid" or "she's a working girl" misses those two key points about income and value.

 

[bigneil]

Here is another point many of you miss.

When you see that older guy out on a date with a model, remember: she could have gone out with a hotter, younger guy her own age instead, but he wouldn't have taken her to a nice restaurant. Who did she choose? Who is better off? Women vote with their feet.

One guy looks better by virtue of genetics. One guy IS better by virtue of strength, knowledge, talent and income. Which man is better off?

 

[devilkingx2]

she could have gone out with a hotter, younger guy her own age instead, but he wouldn't have taken her to a nice restaurant. Who did she choose? Who is better off? Women vote with their feet.

she sounds high maintenance

 

[bigneil]

she sounds high maintenance

No, HE does. The hotter younger guy is full of himself (mainly because the unemployed men here worship him), relatively boring (James Bond has more to say than a child actor star), unaccomplished, living with mommy, dependent, and more likely to cheat on her.

Men need to realize that a man providing looks is the same as providing resources.

 

[devilkingx2]

No, HE does. The hotter younger guy is full of himself (mainly because the unemployed men here worship him), relatively boring (James Bond has more to say than a child actor star), unaccomplished, living with mommy, dependent, and more likely to cheat on her.

Men need to realize that a man providing looks is the same as providing resources.

fair point, that guy probably is high maintenance, I feel like a girl choosing her men based off of wanting to go to expensive fancy restaurants is probably one of the classic definitions of high maintenance though.

 

[The Duke]

Neil, I agree with what you are saying and am always cognizant of this. Spending a couple hundred dollars on some chic is nothing for a guy making $150,000/yr. But when it comes to a serious relationship do you really want to be with those types?

Would the girl you are with now stick around if you weren't spending money on her?

Bret Michaels of Poison once said "you never know if these chics like you for your money and fame, or who you are as a person".

Its whatever floats your boat. I grew up in a family that had money and power. As a kid, I saw first hand people that would go out of their way to associate with my father because of who he was in the community. There were always people trying to be his "friend" so they could ride his coat tails. They would align themselves with him for social proof, financial gain, and to satisfy their own ego. Its no different than a woman being "attracted" to a guy because of his resources.

I want a woman to like me because she finds me physically attractive and mentally attractive. I don't want to "buy" someones affection. But If you want to be the next J. Howard Marshall/Anna Nicole Smith then feel free.

 

[bigneil]

Wait, you're quoting a rich rock star on what he says? Once you become rich and famous you NEVER know which girls like you for you. It's impossible. Guess what? I'd still like to be rich and famous.

Neil, I agree with what you are saying and am always cognizant of this. Spending a couple hundred dollars on some chic is nothing for a guy making $150,000/yr. But when it comes to a serious relationship do you really want to be with those types?

Do I want girls who like classy restaurants? Yes. I got my girlfriend to quit stripping by spoiling her and treating her like a lady. The next thing I knew her rich father took her back in the family.

Raising two children costs $1.5 Million dollars - some women are smart to find guys with money. You should be much more concerned dating a girl who hates her father and who resents being treated like a lady.

That said, the woman has to be attracted and highly interested. There are ways to test a woman's interest level. I don't want to be someone who is obviously compensating with money. I don't want other women to know my date doesn't love me.

That's why every few dates I make my girlfriend pay for the whole date. So yes, she would still like me if I wasn't spending money on her.

 

[Trump]

I want a woman to like me because she finds me physically attractive and mentally attractive. I don't want to "buy" someones affection.

So you work hard your whole life to get a good education and make good money. Good looking movie star actress who you are in love with wants to date you and sleep with you because of your money and riches and importance.

And you would REFUSE because she doesn't find you "physically and mentally attractive?"

Come on bro, laying it on a little thick here...

 

[The Duke]

So you work hard your whole life to get a good education and make good money. Good looking movie star actress who you are in love with wants to date you and sleep with you because of your money and riches and importance.

And you would REFUSE because she doesn't find you "physically and mentally attractive?"

Come on bro, laying it on a little thick here...

A good looking movie star actress will have her own money, she won't be looking for what she can gain financially which is why I prefer girls that make a decent living($65,000 and up) and have some assets. They view relationships very differently than a girl that makes $35K and has nothing. They aren't so quick to want to move in and combine resources.

Believe what you want Trump, I'm disgusted by anybody that wants to associate with me because of what I have to offer financially.

 

[zekko]

Believe what you want Trump, I'm disgusted by anybody that wants to associate with me because of what I have to offer financially.

No one wants a gold digger. But what if a girl were drawn to you and respected you because you were successful, would you be disgusted by that?

It's always interested me that guys are so ready to accept girls finding them physically attractive, when guys can't really control their looks (it's a genetic gift). But if a guy works hard to get ahead and be a success, that shouldn't count.

 

[Trump]

A good looking movie star actress will have her own money, she won't be looking for what she can gain financially which is why I prefer girls that make a decent living($65,000 and up) and have some assets. They view relationships very differently than a girl that makes $35K and has nothing. They aren't so quick to want to move in and combine resources.

.

Fair enough. My point was if the girl was hot enough (movie star looks, not asset rich) alot of men would give in rather than be alone by themselves Friday and Saturday night. But if you are "disgusted" by the fact that a girl doesn't love you for you, more power to you to find the special one and only girl.

In my experience, any girl in 2017 that would love a guy for him is only found in movies. Or the guy is living in lala land.

 

[bigneil]

A good looking movie star actress will have her own money...

My 21 year old model girlfriend grew up in a third generation mansion. Her best friend has a penthouse apartment. Her 77 year old Sugar Daddy has millions in the bank. Her dad has a $2M yacht. She has her own money too. Still think I bought her? No, I just lived up to her standards. You sexy frat guys should try that sometime.

 

[zekko]

Aren't frat guys usually from well off families?

 

[The Duke]

I'm ok with a girl being attracted to these 3 things:
My looks, my personality, my accomplishments.

But if I sense any hint of her liking me because of my wealth then I'm turned off. I try to keep that stuff under wraps. I'm pretty tight with my money.

I had to line out this girl I've been dating. She has dated some wealthy guys in her past. One of them is a well known hockey player. So she has been spoiled with expensive trips, purses, and jewelry that these guys provided to her. She's been to all of the fancy restaurants. She started complaining that I never take her anywhere nice meaning some fancy restaurant. This was a red flag for me. If she doesn't like what I'm offering, she can hit the road. I'm not buying her schitt, regardless of what I'm worth. She has since understood the message.

I could afford to live like I was rich, but its not me and I'm definitely not looking to be a provider. Everybody needs to be self made.

Did you ever hear about the story of the old college librarian who lived a simple life and died with a couple million in the bank? No one had a clue he had that much money. I admire a guy like that. Just like I admire my buddy who plays NFL football, makes a couple million/year and lives in an average house and drives a Dodge dually with a flat bed on it.

 

[The Duke]

My 21 year old model girlfriend grew up in a third generation mansion. Her best friend has a penthouse apartment. Her 77 year old Sugar Daddy has millions in the bank. Her dad has a $2M yacht. She has her own money too. Still think I bought her? No, I just lived up to her standards. You sexy frat guys should try that sometime.

Wait a minute.....let me piece this together and hopefully I get it right, if not correct me.
She comes from money, yet got sideways with her daddy so he cut off the cash. At some point she turned to $tripping to support her taste for expensive things. That wasn't enough so she gets a sugar daddy. You say she has her own money??? How?? Why did she feel the need to $trip and have a sugar daddy. And why are you footing the bills for her? You know girls don't $trip because its fun. They also don't have 77yo sugar daddies because they love the elderly so much.

 

[ubercat]

And this is the romance of the century. Keep one foot out the door at all times Neil. Rule 1 protect your heart.

 

[darksprezzatura]

I don't give a thought to whether a girl likes the 'inner me' or my 'emotional side' or accepts my 'dark secrets'.

She'll never know.

The only thing I'd want in my woman is for her to love a permanently seeded idea of me, an illusion that I create from the first moment she locks eyes with me.

Do you believe when you first meet a woman she knows how much money you have in the bank, the car you drive or the connections you have?

It's just a combination of physical attractiveness and vibe/personality.

Money, power, fame or success is what I want for myself, not to please a woman.

A moderate balance amongst all of them and an emotionally detached mindset is all you need to qualify with most women.

It's not that easy for me so far, and I'm reaching mid 20s.

 

[skinnyguy]

Two things:

1) if the girl is only interested in your funds that's a red flag. A true DJ will respect himself enough to realize that lots of women want him for his personality and charisma and not just his money.

2) I have found it pays off to not be cheap on dates. If the girl sees you're not interested in being stingy when it comes to going out she will probably have more fun and you'll be more likely to see her again. Don't penny pinch on dates. You work your a$$ off so just have fun once in a while without worrying about money.

Guys like Neil have to rely on money more cause they look older and aren't in college. If you're in your 20's you can rely on social circle and looks.

 

[zekko]

Guys like Neil have to rely on money more cause they look older and aren't in college. If you're in your 20's you can rely on social circle and looks.

Years ago, PUAs used to say "Looks don't matter". Now you seem to be saying not only do looks matter, that is the main thing young guys have to offer.

That's overlooking, however, that women don't view attraction like men do. For us, youth = looks. But women often find older men ruggedly handsome or distinguished looking. Not to mention men age more gracefully than women do.

Another things PUAs used to say is "Game trumps all". Generally speaking, I would think a man's game should be better in his 30s than his 20s, just because he has more life experience.

There is also a saying "Women want to be loved, men want to be admired". Men usually want to be looked up to and respected for their skills and accomplishments. They don't usually say "I want a woman to want me because I'm so pretty".

 

[bigneil]

Guys like Neil have to rely on money more cause they look older and aren't in college. If you're in your 20's you can rely on social circle and looks.

Not an argument.

Want to bet $100 I'm more physically attractive than you?