Hello Friend,

If this is your first visit to SoSuave, I would advise you to START HERE.

It will be the most efficient use of your time.

And you will learn everything you need to know to become a huge success with women.

Thank you for visiting and have a great day!

The Mythical War on Men

zekko

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Here's a recent CNN article criticizing the idea of a "war on men". I've been confused a few times on this forum recently by people saying that the Men's Rights Movement only wanted to protect white men. I couldn't figure out what race had to do with the legal bias toward females in today's society.

Reading this article, things become a little clearer. The feminists are PAINTING the battle this way. This is supposedly an article about gender wars, but I was shocked at how many times race was brought up. It talks about "white men" who lost jobs to "black women". And says that the only men who have complaints are those who were against President Obama and for Rush Limbaugh.

This is an age old tactic - divide the opposition. Instead of looking at the gender wars by gender, they muddy the water by trying to turn it into a race battle instead. Pretty sneaky, sis.

Here's a link to the article, although I don't really think it's worth reading.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/11/29/living/war-on-men/index.html?hpt=hp_bn11

I thought one of the comments was interesting. A guy was saying that it was strange that women received government intervention through affirmative action, even though women today are better educated than men - more women are getting college diplomas.
 

backbreaker

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1. I posted that same story here http://www.political-crossfire.com/v...php?f=5&t=1150

after reading that, i have come to the conclusion that thre red pill is one of attraction, not promotion. you can't promote the red pill as people are so ego invested in the blue pill they will fight it to the death. you aren't dealing with just a few articles or a few bad relationships you are dealing tih decades, an entire life time of social conditioning.

the only way i see the red pill being spread is by people saying look man i see how you are living, you get dates wtih cute women, you don't have any bat **** crazy ex's you don't have any baby momma's, you don't have all the **** most men have at your age how do you do it? then you show them.



2. black women have it rough. white men, unless your name is Olivia Pope lol, aren't attracted to black women. not only that, they are seen as the direct beneficiary of affirmative action by bitter white men, and articles like this don't help the issue. I did not word that correctly I am not calling all white men bitter, but when you talk AA the first thought that pops in most people's head is the black woman who got the job over teh qualified white man.


i agree wit your overall assessment.
 

samspade

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Good points, zekko. This is why a) it's a waste of time to argue/convince women, and b) it's key to persuade as many men as possible what's in their interest.

Men, even betas, can be persuaded and reasoned with. Women on the other hand will see what they want to see, with few exceptions. They will be too emotionally invested to understand why any change would ever need to be implemented.

I've ceased trying to argue with women or even have a spirited discussion with them on issues like this. It's a macro form of squabbling with your girlfriend, when action is more effective. As I've been saying, men need to act in their interests, not rally or write articles for the CNN-reading crowd.
 

backbreaker

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samspade said:
Good points, zekko. This is why a) it's a waste of time to argue/convince women, and b) it's key to persuade as many men as possible what's in their interest.

Men, even betas, can be persuaded and reasoned with. Women on the other hand will see what they want to see, with few exceptions. They will be too emotionally invested to understand why any change would ever need to be implemented.

I've ceased trying to argue with women or even have a spirited discussion with them on issues like this. It's a macro form of squabbling with your girlfriend, when action is more effective. As I've been saying, men need to act in their interests, not rally or write articles for the CNN-reading crowd.

even worse, i' going to break down exactly why it's a waste of time


Look at the dynamic of the CNN article.

men read it, wheels start spinning in head, a few guys make a few good points, and out of everywhere comes women from all places, telling them how this is much bull**** this is and how this will never make you happy, then re affirm what it is she wants the man to do. and the men will listen beucase in their mind, their sexual needs are at stake.

in other words, red pill guys for the most part are action oritned guys. bull pill guys, are more book/advice oritend guys, tha'ts how all of us got in the blue pill in the first place no one is born into the blue pill someone tells you to swollow it to get this. if a guy is reading a CNN article to figure otu what is wrong in the first place lol, he's a few HB 8's telling him that this is bull**** away to re swallow the blue pill.
 

Burroughs

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Social_Leper said:
So I ask again...What is to be done?
nothing for now

The wise must elevate the wise

red pill dudes share with other red pill dudes

Society is crumbling around us....once the state crumbles real men will be able to step up..women will be forced to capitulate to the rule of men or starve to death...no more welfare state to bolster their false ego...

...at this time alpha men will be able to pick and choose for the long term...either a women serves you completely...or you toss her into the snow...women will once more be the subservient helpful creatures they are designed to be,
 

samspade

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Burroughs said:
nothing for now

The wise must elevate the wise

red pill dudes share with other red pill dudes

Society is crumbling around us....once the state crumbles real men will be able to step up..women will be forced to capitulate to the rule of men or starve to death...no more welfare state to bolster their false ego...

...at this time alpha men will be able to pick and choose for the long term...either a women serves you completely...or you toss her into the snow...women will once more be the subservient helpful creatures they are designed to be,
Amen.
 

samspade

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Here is what I do:

1. Smirk and ignore provocative female statements about men, gender, politics, equality, etc. Brush them off.

2. Do my best to help men who ask for it.

3. Disengage from that which bothers me. I don't like, for example, the AW/beta echo chamber that is Facebook. So I'm not on it. It works for me better that way. I don't jump into mindless pop culture conversations because I think they're mindless. Etc. And I definitely try to avoid articles that talk about gender wars, how men are "losing" and women are "winning," "Kidults," the phrase "man up," and anything that takes the same indignant stance on Roe v. Wade that we've heard a hundred million times and don't need to hear anymore.

4. Be happy with my choices and not worry about everyone else. My friends and family all know my wife is a little "old fashioned" in some regards. With some people, again mostly women, I can tell they find it wrong in some way that she does the majority of the housework, or took my last name. I don't give a flying F. I wear my happiness on my face in a huge, s**t-eating grin, same as I would if I were out wolfing around as a single guy.

5. Keep my mouth shut when it benefits me (at work, at parties, etc.). You won't change the world overnight. Pay lip service to whatever nonsense people support if necessary, but let your actions speak for you in the long run.
 

backbreaker

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Social_Leper said:
This seems hopelessly optimistic, or incredible pessimistic, depending on how you look at it.

Waiting for the complete breakdown of society makes sense in the long term (and i agree with you that it will happen eventually) but witnessing first hand the self-destructive logical conclusion of our current path could take generations.

it's the exact philophy that AA has taken on since 1932 and has grown from 2 members in 32' to 2.1 million members in 2012. AA doesn't promote, they only attract people who want to be clean. they don't waste time on people who aren't willing to do anything to get sober.


and there are a lot more than 2 pissed off men on earth.


when guys are sick of being sick and tired they will come find us.
 

backbreaker

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this is a debate i am not going to wate my time on danger. you have yoru ways and i have mine. but most addicts/alcoholics know about AA but don't go until they see someone living that they know used to get high or drunk and who is no longer doing so and then they ask why they did it.

and **** even the people who know who AA is, dno';t know how to get there; you have abetter chance of finding a CIA agent in disgause than finding most AA meetings.. generally you have to ask someone how to get there.

anyway that's how i feel. people ask me how i do it, i tell them. utnil then you are going against social conditioning.
 

backbreaker

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Social_Leper said:
That's the point Danger is trying to get at.

Most guys have no clue there's a problem and if they did they have no idea how to get help from game aware guys like us.
Most guys have no clue there's a problem and if they did they have no idea how to get help from game aware guys like us.
and that's what you aren't getting

a guy doesn't have to know that there is a problem to know that something isn't right and to want to fix it.

I'm just using my practical knowledge of something similar.

i mean if you want to beat your head up against the wall arguing wtih dudes who don't want to hear wht you are saying, be my guest. no skin off my back. but i've tried it for years in a different subject matter (drugs) and i know already the conclusion you are going to come to.

samspade and myself are virtually twins when it comes to this matter.

I'm happy today. I wake up happy. I have a good son, a hot wife who loves me very much, i'm not bitter, I get more femal attention from theo opposite sex today then i ever hve in my life, **** we just hired a football coach lol, i'm going to celebrate and then make sexy time with my wife tonight lol. if someone sees my joy and ants some of it i can give it and will freely. but i'm not going to lose my joy trying to drag people out of the crab bucket.

Law 10
Infection: Avoid the Unhappy and Unlucky
You can die from someone else’s misery – emotional states are as infectious as disease. You may feel you are helping the drowning man but you are only precipitating your own disaster. The unfortunate sometimes draw misfortune on themselves; they will also draw it on you. Associate with the happy and fortunate instead.
 

samspade

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Let's have some fun.

The mythical 'war on men'
By Michael Kimmel, Special to CNN, aka the mythical unbiased news site selling detergents and soaps

(CNN) -- Some years ago, I appeared on a well-known television talk show opposite four "angry white men": four men who believed they had been discriminated against in the workplace by affirmative action programs initiated, they argued, by feminist women.

So you open with an anecdote about a talk show. Do you think they chose a provocative topic for ratings perhaps? And maybe coached the guests?

Each man told his story of how he was qualified for a job or qualified for a promotion that he did not get because of this putative reverse discrimination against white men. One ended his remarks with a line that served as the title for this show: "A black woman stole my job," he declared.

Asked to respond, I had but one question for these guys, a question about the title of the show. Actually, my question was about one word in the title of the show. I wanted to know about the word "my." Why did the men think it was their job? Why wasn't the title of the show "A black woman got a job" or "A black woman got the job"? The answer, I argued, was that these men felt entitled to the position, and that any effort to make the workplace more equal was perceived, by those men, as a loss.

Why don't you ask why their job should have been made available in the first place?

I thought of those men recently while reading Suzanne Venker's addled rant against feminist women as the source of the unhappiness that saturates male-female relationships. I thought of how painful it is when you are used to having everything to now have only 80%. What a loss! Poor us! Equality sucks when you've been on top -- and men have been on top for so long that we think it's a level playing field.

In her screed against women, she argues that women are their own worst enemy, and that the rise of women has caused the "end of men," that men are wilting into angry, resentful bachelorhood because women are demanding so much from men. They're emasculating men, confounding their DNA, which seeks only to provide and protect. Women aren't letting men be men.

More like happy, carefree bachelorhood. The ones who marry are usually the emasculated ones.

Women, Venker writes, have been seduced by feminists into pushing men off their pedestal to "take what they were taught to believe was rightfully theirs." As a result, Venker continues, women have come to believe the adage "women good/men bad" -- an equation that has "destroyed the relationship between the sexes." Men, she tells us, are "tired of being told that if women aren't happy, it's men's fault."

We're just tired of everything being our fault.

But she is actually arguing that if men aren't happy, it's women's fault -- for seeking the very same exhilarating sense of autonomy and selfhood that men claim as our natural entitled birthright. How dare they?

In this case, it IS men's fault - for allowing it to happen. Power abhors a vacuum.

OK, so what's wrong with this picture? This unhinged argument fuses dreadful history with empirically baseless contemporary analysis. The result cannot help but be bad politics.

This notion of good women/bad men has been the foundation not of feminism but of anti-feminism since the 19th century. Those innocent "angels in the house" were supposed to soothe the savage beast, as men were prone to bouts of rage, drunkenness and other depravities. If women didn't tame men, the anti-feminists argued, all hell would break loose.

Where in the holy h e l l are you coming up with these caricatures? This is your empirical analysis?

Pop psychologists joined the pundits to argue, as does Venker, that if women are unhappy, it's their own damned fault. How many advice columns about "the rules," admonitions about the man shortage or effusive media prostration before three or four upper-class white female Yale grads who "opted out" (only to rejoin the workforce when their children were 5 years old) must we endure? Countless. One needn't be original to be wrong.

You got that right.

In fact, feminism reversed the equation Venker offers. It encouraged women to be bad girls -- to seek their own pleasures, to go for it, autonomously, to leave unhappy marriages, and to control their own bodies. And it encouraged men to be good -- demanded it, in fact -- insisting that men can and should step up as equal parents, colleagues and coworkers, that we stop the rape and violence that so compromised women's equality.

Feminism did all that, eh? How noble! Oh, where were we before the Almighty 60s?!

And the empirical evidence suggests that men are quietly adapting to a very new landscape. Most of the 400 young men (aged 16-26) who I interviewed for my book "Guyland" assume, without resentment, that their wives will be as fully committed to their careers as they are. Why? Because they'll need the income. And they assume, with no resentment, that they will be involved fathers, spending far more time with their families than their parents or grandparents ever did. Why? Because they actually want to be involved dads.

Self-reporting from emasculated betas hardly counts as empirical evidence. Your social science is no match for the crushing reality of biology. Furthermore, wanting to be a good dad is hardly a phenomenon borne of the Feminist age. Do you think Abe Lincoln was a crappy father? How about biblical Joseph? These guys generated their own income for them and their families.

They all have friends of the opposite sex ("When Harry Met Sally's" dictum to the contrary), which bodes well for their ability to be more equal coworkers and colleagues with women they consider their peers.

The only thing this bodes well for is attention wh0ring females and the Alpha Males who can pick their locks.

Stop the madness. There's no war between the sexes. Men and women can, and should, be allies.

Agreed. If by "allies" you mean engaging in their respective roles within the family and in coitus.

And they are becoming more equal, and happier, every single day.

How much more equal can things get? Happier - have you actually paid attention when you interview these herbs and fems?

Men aren't nearly as unhappy or resentful as Venker suggests -- because she only talks to those who feel themselves so entitled that they lament, as did Rush Limbaugh, that the re-election of President Obama was the loss of "our country."

Beta males are frustrated but don't have the stones to admit it. Alphas are having a blast. A Rush Limbaugh quote is the last resort of the scoundrel.

Truth is, in her efforts to exalt men, she actually insults us. Who says we can't be happy with fully equal female colleagues and coworkers?

Who says we can't be even happier without them? Men invented work to get away from women. Why must women constantly bang down the "men only" door? You don't see any men trying to get into Curves, do you?

Who says we can't enjoy the joys of shared parenthood?

Shared = Man provides and disciplines, woman nurtures and feeds.

Who says that we are biologically programmed to be both rapacious testosterone-driven animals

Almighty Science.

and lazy remote-hogging couch potatoes unable to lift a finger in the kitchen?

Uninterested, not unable. And the remote belongs to the man. See again: Science.

Venker paints a most unyieldlingly awful portrait of men, one that is happily belied by actual, real, American men.

You are certainly not the arbiter of "real" masculinity.

And we won't stand for the sort of male-bashing Venker offers. We want it all also -- and the only way we can have it all is to halve it all.

[Throwing up into mouth.] Have fun at the rally. I hope your "This Is What A Feminist Looks Like" t shirt tightly accentuates your man boobs.
 

Who Dares Win

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This knowledge has to be spread not only to bring justice and fairness in this world by saving men from the programming which aims to screw them up.

This knowledge has to be spread because only when a significant number of men realize whats going on and goes on strike, the ground will be fertile enough for a change as much as politicians and media has to acknowledge it.

By strike I mean simply stopping to support this non-sense, wheter is accepting to be mistreated on their work place, paying unfair amount of taxes for women, MOST OF ALL REFUSE TO MARRY, and many more small steps as deleting a girls number once she play games or call a b1tch a b1tch when he sees one.

The problem with ignorant man is that they believe things are like they are because they are supposed to be like that and that there is not other alternative.

"Always respect women" - "we could never understand women"- "women know best when it comes of relationships" and so on....

They simply have to know that they didnt hit the jackpot when the "reformed girl" left the bad boys and went to him....he just had the last slice of the cake right before it expired.

Once reformed hos can no longer find a sucker because any sucker see whats going on and save his dignity,also other women will realize that with freedom come accountability, in relationships and society.

Just tell men whats going on, tell how they can be bad mouthed only to politely offer a lift to a girl under the rain at work or sued for harassment if they approach a girl which just blown an other guy in the back alley but doesnt find him attractive.

No amount of game or alpha bvllsh1t will help on a divorce court if the system is rigged.
 

Rollo Tomassi

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When I write I deliberately make my posts and my blog as politically and racially neutral as I can. Unless the topic is specifically about how the current gender landscape relates to a political climate, or expresses the individual experiences of a particular ethnicity or nationality, I intently keep my work as neutral as possible.

I do so because Game, unplugging and red pill awareness isn't about race or political affiliation, or even gender. I encourage anyone to participate in the discussion. I think all men (and more women now) regardless of culture or race can contribute to a better collective knowledge of Game and the awakening. I would be foolish to discount the related experiences of some guy in urban China or rural Africa. Everything help, every related experience strengthens the awakening.

This is what my opponents in the feminine imperative fear. That enough men will become aware. So they have to cast the manosphere as a collective of angry white conservatives. It's too terrible a notion to think that the manosphere is in fact a multi-cultural collective.
 

Scaramouche

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Dear Burroughs,
"Society is crumbling around us....once the state crumbles real men will be able to step up..women will be forced to capitulate to the rule of men or starve to death...no more welfare state to bolster their false ego..."
Oh my dear friend,you will go Old and Grey waiting for this.....Can't you see that from now on your Country will be going down the Welfare Path following the example of the various European Powers who over the last 1.000 years,successively passed the baton,from Nation to Nation and finally handed it to you people....Western Culture is at the end of its cycle and someone else is going to have a go...Probably they will end up sending their Body Bags to Afghanistan...John Maynard Keynes whose outdated Economics are still being followed by Western Nations,thought that by the 1980's People would be working only 15 hours a week leaving them free to indulge in Sports,Education and Cultural Pursuits....30 years ago this looked like the way it was going to go,we had Job Sharing,increased holidays,furlough,Superannuation,welfare Housing....Now it seems people lucky enough to have a job,work long arduous hours and have a poor quality of life,even if they have a lot of assett....Seeing our great Nations have abandoned Manufacturing in favour of Merchant Banking what are these people producing?Seems mostly senseless reports and statistics!....Perhaps the Welfare State is a better way of wasting Money than the alternative of sending your Young Men Overseas on Futile Quests...
"...at this time alpha men will be able to pick and choose for the long term...either a women serves you completely...or you toss her into the snow...women will once more be the subservient helpful creatures they are designed to be".....Oh Burroughs!Alpha Men,many on this site, are doing this right now,and you don't have to go to Thailand or the Philipines to indulge yourself!
 

Burroughs

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Scaramouche said:
Dear Burroughs,
"Society is crumbling around us....once the state crumbles real men will be able to step up..women will be forced to capitulate to the rule of men or starve to death...no more welfare state to bolster their false ego..."
Oh my dear friend,you will go Old and Grey waiting for this.....Can't you see that from now on your Country will be going down the Welfare Path following the example of the various European Powers who over the last 1.000 years,successively passed the baton,from Nation to Nation and finally handed it to you people....Western Culture is at the end of its cycle and someone else is going to have a go...Probably they will end up sending their Body Bags to Afghanistan...John Maynard Keynes whose outdated Economics are still being followed by Western Nations,thought that by the 1980's People would be working only 15 hours a week leaving them free to indulge in Sports,Education and Cultural Pursuits....30 years ago this looked like the way it was going to go,we had Job Sharing,increased holidays,furlough,Superannuation,welfare Housing....Now it seems people lucky enough to have a job,work long arduous hours and have a poor quality of life,even if they have a lot of assett....Seeing our great Nations have abandoned Manufacturing in favour of Merchant Banking what are

Much wisdom as always Captain Scara!

Yes I did consider the iron-clad grip the welfare state seems to have on the collective hearts and mind of the 90% or is it the 99.9%

And since we live in age of manufactured thin air currency there is no reason at all this cannot continue forever so long as people believe the lie...which they cling to ferociously..

..until one day it cannot....the elite decide to pull the plug http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgia_Guidestones

then it gets interesting :up:
 

Jitterbug

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While it's correct that most men have never heard of the MRM, the messages have reached way more than you think. I see them grow in my own very blue-pill social circle. I keep my mouth shut and say nothing except through humour, and I keep hearing guys bringing up topics related to the MRM and saying how they're sick & tired of feminist bullsh1t (e.g the 77c to a dollar one). Nobody is active in spreading the message IRL, but those guys are finding them all on their own, thanks to the Internet.

Besides, no guy wants to admit this IRL due to lack of anonymity. If you talk to me in my social habitat, you'd hear mostly blue pill crap, although if you pay attention, you'll recognise plenty of red pill knowledge sprinkled here & there. ;) There are so many feminists in my circles (a very SWPL city) that I have to protect myself. Laws of power baby.

Articles like this one are great for us. Even when they publish their denials of any war on men or issue affecting men, they are giving our issues publicity. Naturally men will read this and their minds will wonder if the issues truly exist or not. Getting them to think about men's issues (hopefully before they get bitten in the arse by those) is a great start.
 

d!ckmojo

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There's a b1tch Australian Journalist called Tory Shepherd whom I reeeeealy hate. I would like to see her suffer an excruciating torment for an extremely long time, I would spit on her if I ever met her.

Anyway, among other things that p1ss me off, she's the most smarmy opponent of Mens' Rights you could imagine. She rights these articles on a popular Australian news website about how all Mens' Rights Advocates are "extremists", and how everything they say is nonsense: http://www.thepunch.com.au/tags/mens-rights-extremists/

Well, I tried to post on that website yesterday a comment along the lines of: "You say that Mens' Rights advocates are "extremists", but if you look at the way these feminists are carrying on~ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iARHCxAMAO0

And then if you view the lecture they were trying to stop people from listening to~ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6w1S8yrFz4

Ask yourself, who are the real extremists?"


Needless to say, the comment didn't get published on that Mainstream News site.
 

AW1983

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Again I will have to fall into the BB/samspade camp on this one. Awareness/Game trumps all, including organized political movements.

Are the courts biased? Sure, so don't get married. Or have an iron-clad prenup if you must. If the average guy out there had more Awareness/Game, he'd know all about women and their wiley ways, he'd know how to spot red flags from a mile off, etc, etc. So the chances of him getting married to a succubus saboteur who will rape him in divorce court are much lower. Perhaps he wouldn't even feel the need to get married at all, since he has an abundance mentality now.

And here's where someone or other will jump in with the "false rape" argument. Ok...idk about you guys but I've never even known or personally heard of anyone in my life who had a FR accusation brought against them. And I'm sure most of the many hundreds/thousands of guys I've known in my life did not have the Game resources we have. Again: if you have Awareness/Game, you'll be able to spot red flags and substantially lower the already very small chance this will happen to you. Could it still happen? Sure...but you could also get hit by lightning the second you walk out your front door. Anything's possible, but f*ck it - you only have one life to live.

EDIT: In my younger years, I wondered if it was my duty to mankind to perhaps dedicate my life to a political movement/uprising/revolution based on the principles I adhered to and found just. After much thought and pondering I realized this would be a futile waste of my time. Not because the cause isn't worthy...but because the vast majority of people are INDIFFERENT, apathetic, lazy, and stuck in perpetual inertia. Why waste my valuable time on this planet trying to help people who don't care to help themselves? Remember, Neo was searching for the answer to the question, every night, before the revelation came. The seekers will find what this site and others offer, and everyone else will stay where they are...on their couches watching some new BS reality tv show.
 

st_99

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i skimmed through the article, wow, it gets annoying.

i mean, how the hell do you go from the subject of 'war on men' and turn it into a racial rant?

Man, you just want to smack the stupid out of these people. I'd be willing to bet the guy who wrote that article has no black friends and lives in an all white hood. LOL.

Anyway, I always say any kind of war on men is mainly a man on man war. Imo, females basically have no power, zero, zippo, notta other than the power of persuasion. And that persuasion pits one type of man against another. That is how the female power dynamic works.

How did a female get the right to vote, how did she get into the board room, how did she get free birth control pills haha. Its because a man decided it was the right thing to do.. i'm not saying what is right or wrong but make no mistake, women had nothing to do with it.

Take a look at our govt to see how much power women have...
In the House, 362 men and 76 women. In the Senate, 17 women and 83 men.
 

backbreaker

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st_99 said:
i skimmed through the article, wow, it gets annoying.

i mean, how the hell do you go from the subject of 'war on men' and turn it into a racial rant?

Man, you just want to smack the stupid out of these people. I'd be willing to bet the guy who wrote that article has no black friends and lives in an all white hood. LOL.

Anyway, I always say any kind of war on men is mainly a man on man war. Imo, females basically have no power, zero, zippo, notta other than the power of persuasion. And that persuasion pits one type of man against another. That is how the female power dynamic works.

How did a female get the right to vote, how did she get into the board room, how did she get free birth control pills haha. Its because a man decided it was the right thing to do.. i'm not saying what is right or wrong but make no mistake, women had nothing to do with it.

really this is a good point.

we aren't waring wtih women.. we are @ war against men who allow women to act this way. if women couldn't act the way they do, they wouldn't. but they can.

if every man on earth got their **** together and said look babe.. this or bye. women would shape up.

that's why arguing with women is pointless, that's not the target.

and of course, his entire dogma is tied up into his beliefs, he believes this is the tried and true, or atl esat, he has his money riding on this being the tried and truth method of getting female companionship.. submit to women, be their friend, promote them and they will shower you with love and attention and if you keep flaking out it's beucase you haven't met the right one, not beucase the dogma is wrong...
 
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