The key to "naturals"

[Darth]

Hi guys,

I've realized how to boil it down. The natural with women has exactly the same private life as they do public life. There is nothing secret that they don't want to display in public. No public persona and hidden persona. Because why do you keep things to yourself, anything? Fear and shame, bitterness and anger. When you get rid of those things, your private life and your public life exactly match. That means if you think a girl is attractive, you immediately tell her so because your private thought is automatically your public statement. There is no shame when everything matches up like that.

Liking a woman but trying to hide it is actually a sign of dishonesty. When your inner life and your outer life match up exactly, chicks can sense that and they REALLY DIG it.

If girls are not currently throwing themselves at you, your public life and your private life are not the same and as long as you have that shame, anger, etc. holding you back from publicizing everything about yourself, you will continue to try to "pick up" women rather than just walk around and be a magnet, which you will be if you adhere to this simple advice.

Btw this goes for people in general not just women.

I hope this helps; I am speaking from experience as someone who has been on both ends of the spectrum.

 

[corrector]

Or, they just happen to look better and as girls are attracted to looks then they throw themselves at them. So, a guy who has no job and is broke should advertise that to women, like LoneWolf did so he can attract an Asian woman who will treat him and take him all over the world and then dump him when its time to get married? Did Lonewolf teach you?

 

[Darth]

I have never heard of LoneWolf so no.

If you have no job you should say so. For instance, I got a haircut yesterday and the girl asked about my job and I said, "No, I don't really have a regular job right now. Haha! I should probably get one."

Then I told her about the speeding ticket I just got.

I told her about this band I used to play in that played geeky music and all the old people loved it.

Do you see? There are no rules.

Edit: I also went in reeking of cigarette smoke just to see if I could get away with it. It had no effect. At the end of the interaction, she mentioned having a boyfriend when I asked her a follow-up question. I said, "Ah!" in disappointment and she laughed. She wound up giving me her business card with her email and phone number on it anyway, plus a sh!tload of coupons. Also got a shampoo and massage that went on for WAY TOO LONG! Lol

All this to say, I don't think I'm full of sh!t.

 

[corrector]

I have never heard of LoneWolf so no.

He is the guy who picked up a sugar-mommy who took him travelling all around the world and then dumped him before it was time for marriage. He made a thread about it.

If you have no job you should say so. For instance, I got a haircut yesterday and the girl asked about my job and I said, "No, I don't really have a regular job right now. Haha! I should probably get one."

So you could tell her you haven't gotten over your ex and still have oneitis for her and if you can have a crush on her instead and if it's okay if you stalk her?

Then I told her about the speeding ticket I just got.

What about if you like suing people and have experience in appellate courts too? And also how you can also sue her if she rejects you and doesn't give you her phone number.

I told her about this band I used to play in that played geeky music and all the old people loved it.

Do you see? There are no rules.

Okay, but she still had a boyfriend and gave you the business cards as it was a business interest.

You see this girl was nice to you because she was a hired gun.

 

[JohnChops]

I have never heard of LoneWolf so no.

If you have no job you should say so. For instance, I got a haircut yesterday and the girl asked about my job and I said, "No, I don't really have a regular job right now. Haha! I should probably get one."

Then I told her about the speeding ticket I just got.

I told her about this band I used to play in that played geeky music and all the old people loved it.

Do you see? There are no rules.

Edit: I also went in reeking of cigarette smoke just to see if I could get away with it. It had no effect. At the end of the interaction, she mentioned having a boyfriend when I asked her a follow-up question. I said, "Ah!" in disappointment and she laughed. She wound up giving me her business card with her email and phone number on it anyway, plus a sh!tload of coupons. Also got a shampoo and massage that went on for WAY TOO LONG! Lol

All this to say, I don't think I'm full of sh!t.

So you just blurt out everything about your private life? This opposes the mystery argument .

 

[Darth]

So you could tell her you haven't gotten over your ex and still have oneitis for her and if you can have a crush on her instead and if it's okay if you stalk her?

If that is true, put it out there. Maybe you'll get another perspective on it. Keeping it to yourself indicates you are ashamed/humiliated about those thoughts. Not an attractive trait.

What about if you like suing people and have experience in appellate courts too? And also how you can also sue her if she rejects you and doesn't give you her phone number.

Why not? What are you afraid of?

Okay, but she still had a boyfriend and gave you the business cards as it was a business interest.

Maybe. But maybe not. This was a big place, this was a personal card with just her contact info on it. She was giving me the "look" most of the time she was doing it.

But you're right, maybe she was just faking being nice because it was a business interest. I just pulled this example from recent memory but there are others where I suspect that wasn't the case...

So you just blurt out everything about your private life? This opposes the mystery argument .

What private life? Keeping things secret is kind of lame unless there's some particular reason you don't want her to know something- otherwise you're just making excuses because you are ashamed of who you really are.

 

[corrector]

If that is true, put it out there. Maybe you'll get another perspective on it. Keeping it to yourself indicates you are ashamed/humiliated about those thoughts. Not an attractive trait.

Okay, I get it, you are serious about this "perspective". So, I should start crying to women (i.e. I can't get over my ex, I'm a 50 y/o virgin (but I look like I'm 20 years old because women make people look older), have no job, live at home and I will marry the first woman who is nice with, etc...) and all of a sudden I'm going to become a natural casanova and have women lining up and throwing themselves at me and wanting to marry me?

Why not? What are you afraid of?

I do not think this is realistic. But it sounds weird. I like weird advice. Maybe I'll attract a soul-mate.

So, next time I buy ice cream, at an ice cream shop and a woman says "hi, I think I've seen you here before.", then I'd reply by saying, "yes you have, let me tell you my life story, it goes like this..." (assuming there is no customers behind then start crying to her about the "ex" you can't get over until you have a crush on another girl, like her). Or, say hi to a random woman and say "would you have the time to hear my pathetic life story?" and I'm going to be good with women.

 

[Darth]

Okay, I get it, you are serious about this "perspective". So, I should start crying to women (i.e. I can't get over my ex, I'm a 50 y/o virgin (but I look like I'm 20 years old because women make people look older), have no job, live at home and I will marry the first woman who is nice with, etc...) and all of a sudden I'm going to become a natural casanova and have women lining up and throwing themselves at me and wanting to marry me?

If you gathered your courage and did just that, maybe you would be. Even George Costanza had the guts to do that: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6R03BVIyAdY

So, next time I buy ice cream, at an ice cream shop and a woman says "hi, I think I've seen you here before.", then I'd reply by saying, "yes you have, let me tell you my life story, it goes like this..." (assuming there is no customers behind then start crying to her about the "ex" you can't get over until you have a crush on another girl, like her). Or, say hi to a random woman and say "would you have the time to hear my pathetic life story?" and I'm going to be good with women

No no no. Just answer her questions. If she asks enough questions, you can throw one in too when there's a pause in the conversation so she knows you are interested in knowing her too. No "would you have the time."

Also, nobody's life story is "pathetic" and that includes yours. What is so pathetic about your previous life?

Edit: I do feel for you, man- but I would have to find out why you are so ashamed of your life story and what it was in your childhood or etc. that gave you such a low view of yourself that you would marry the first girl that was nice to you because you thought that was more than you deserved (no self-respect).

 

[JohnChops]

I'm not objecting your thread Darth but doesn't this ruis mystery with a girl? Isn't that what gives you more "attraction" to an extent? I'm pretty sure I do this already lol I shaw whatever I feel like with whoever I please.

 

[playa99]

The message here is be comfortable with yourself... Trying to create mystery by not answering straight up question and evading them ain't right! You should be confident in yourself and not hide things when asked or be uncomfortable, equally there's no point just blurting your life story out, I ain't a fan of strangers knowing my business, if I get asked a question ill answer honestly and confidently.

 

[corrector]

No no no. Just answer her questions. If she asks enough questions, you can throw one in too when there's a pause in the conversation so she knows you are interested in knowing her too. No "would you have the time."

Also, nobody's life story is "pathetic" and that includes yours. What is so pathetic about your previous life?

I wouldn't say there is anything "pathetic" per say. I'm trying to spin it negative to see how far you would go with your theory?

You've answered by putting boundaries and saying "just answer her questions". I just want to see how crazy this was.

Edit: I do feel for you, man- but I would have to find out why you are so ashamed of your life story and what it was in your childhood or etc. that gave you such a low view of yourself that you would marry the first girl that was nice to you because you thought that was more than you deserved (no self-respect).

I'm not really ashamed of my life-story, however, it's fair to say that I haven't really had any real breaks as far as finding "unconditional love" with a woman that doesn't have baggage or is taking prescription drugs for a mental problem. "Unconditional love" is more than just being nice. Being nice could just be a facade.

 

[Atom Smasher]

So-called "naturals" like women, and women sense it.

 

[corrector]

So-called "naturals" like women, and women sense it.

Or they could really just have good looks that women like.

 

[Mike32ct]

A natural is a guy that women responded positively to early in life.

It could be because of his looks (often) or height or being big or being in the popular clique or being a sports player at school, or some combination thereof.

 

[Darth]

Hi guys,
I guess I don't really see the point of being mysterious for the sake of itself. Game-players attract game-players. Obviously there are different levels of closeness in a relationship so if she were to ask a question that was much too personal the first time I met her, I might laugh and say, "Ah I don't know." If she said, "No, come on, I really want to know," I would probably think that was funny and give her a look like, you really want to get to know me fast, don't you? LOL And then I may or may not answer depending on the particular question and the particular girl in question.

I will not deny that I am not an unattractive person. However- I was abused as a kid and was never in the popular clique in high school, nor was I good at sports. I was extraordinarily introverted and private. At 15 I found this site and it was helpful in some ways, but in another sense it was like trying to coat a turd with sugar (sorry for the crudeness). A couple years ago I decided to start regressing and go back to childhood and resolve everything that was holding me back and changing my personality for the worse.

It took a couple of years, but now look at what's happening- I am discovering that I am a natural. It is pretty cool stuff after you've been on the low end of the ladder for so long. I hope you guys might take something from this.

 

[zekko]

Because why do you keep things to yourself, anything? Fear and shame, bitterness and anger. When you get rid of those things, your private life and your public life exactly match. That means if you think a girl is attractive, you immediately tell her so because your private thought is automatically your public statement.

Interesting idea. What you're describing is kind of like being "out of your head". You're not "in your head" analyzing everything before you say it, it's like having no filter. Having no difference between your inner and outer thoughts also makes you very "congruent". So those are both ideas that are pushed by pickup gurus.

I think it's too simple to say naturals have no fear, shame, bitterness, or anger though. All human beings have thier own pain to deal with.

Of course most chodes think that hot girls are attractive, too. Does it do them any good to blurt it out? I'm not so sure. Most hot girls know they are attractive, they know most guys desire them sexually. Usually PUAs tell you not to give such general compliments such as "you're beautiful", because it's unimaginative and they hear it a lot.

So, I should start crying to women (i.e. I can't get over my ex, I'm a 50 y/o virgin (but I look like I'm 20 years old because women make people look older), have no job, live at home and I will marry the first woman who is nice with, etc...)

Oddly enough, I remember once after a painful breakup, I was complaining about my ex to everyone, how she dumped me like I was nothing, etc. I actually ended up dating some of the girls I was whining to. Even girls have their frustrations with dating, maybe they could relate.

So-called "naturals" like women, and women sense it.

It's clear they enjoy women, at least.

A natural is a guy that women responded positively to early in life.

Yeah, I think so too. They had early experiences that gave them confidence. Just like many other guys had early experiences that shook their confidence.

 

[Atom Smasher]

Yes, I think a lot of how we do with women is purely accidental, in a sense.

When a boy just happens to have a good experience with a girl, he will approach the next interaction positively, and it snowballs from there. Conversely, a boy could perceive a negative first interaction and the snowball works against him, each interaction reinforcing the previous ones.

A key element that is missing with many of us is the lack of a role model growing up. My dad taught me nothing about women, unfortunately, and I grew up in a household of females (I was the only boy). I desperately needed instruction on being a man and I had very little, since my dad rarely had time for me. I think this is a critical factor in a boy's ability to relate to women in a healthy way.

 

[Mike32ct]

Spot on.

Yes, I think a lot of how we do with women is purely accidental, in a sense.

When a boy just happens to have a good experience with a girl, he will approach the next interaction positively, and it snowballs from there. Conversely, a boy could perceive a negative first interaction and the snowball works against him, each interaction reinforcing the previous ones.

A key element that is missing with many of us is the lack of a role model growing up. My dad taught me nothing about women, unfortunately, and I grew up in a household of females (I was the only boy). I desperately needed instruction on being a man and I had very little, since my dad rarely had time for me. I think this is a critical factor in a boy's ability to relate to women in a healthy way.

 

[corrector]

Oddly enough, I remember once after a painful breakup, I was complaining about my ex to everyone, how she dumped me like I was nothing, etc. I actually ended up dating some of the girls I was whining to. Even girls have their frustrations with dating, maybe they could relate.

But what if you dumped the girl?

 

[Darth]

Here's the thing: Imagine your personality is like a piece of cake, and then through rough experiences in your early life a turd grows around it (bitterness). Now, you have a choice. You can either face the turd and come to grips with why that turd is there (which means going back to childhood and addressing the root causes), or you can try to be a "pick up artist" or some similar thing and try to coat the turd with sugar. No matter how much sugar you keep heaping on top of it, though, you've still got a major turd underneath and that will seep out in various ways no matter how much you are trying to hide it.

That's why I would argue that it is better for a "chode" to tell the girl he thinks he is hot than to keep it to himself and be either "nice guy" or pretend to be aloof. It's all about honesty.

The chode or chump or AFC who honestly tells the girl that he thinks she's the most beautiful girl ever, he thinks about her all the time, etc. is actually FURTHER ALONG in my estimation to being a natural with women than many of the PUAs. Why? Because while the piece of cake is still triumphing in the AFC and driving his behavior, the PUAs have chosen to heap sugar on the turd, creating an entirely false personality (which all of the good women will sense before long) and their true personality, the piece of cake, is completely shut off and hidden. Why? Because they didn't have the guts to face up to the reality that they see themselves as a turd. They live in fantasy land.


Here was my progression:

-Piece of cake (young child)
-Abuse and parental neglect-Major turd surrounding the piece of cake.
-Showing interest in girls openly, "chodelike"=failure. Bitterness grows, turd becomes thicker (some hard-headed geeks stay in "chode" mode permanently, hitting on women and keeping getting rejected/laughed at by women. Women seem to have contempt for them, but probably have more respect for them than the later stages since at least they are honest about what they want).
-I watch girls and secretly want them (quintessential AFC). In one case, I didn't have the guts to tell her in person, but I told her, "I feel so stupid" and then sent her love letters via email. The turd is thick, but the cake is still driving the personality- in other words, I want the girl, I know I want the girl, and I am attempting to take action in the outside world to communicate that to her.
-I decided I would rise above everything and become great with women. I read articles all the time, read forum posts, etc. I coated the turd with sugar and startd to make fantasies about myself thinking that I was better at women than other people with women because I wasn't brainwashed anymore, I had all this theory, etc. I coated the turd with sugar. I was cool and aloof with women, I felt like I didn't want them because there were millions more when that came from and I was a prize, I was a catch. This was comforting but THIS WAS A MAJOR MISTAKE. It was DENIAL of the real story. It was making up a fantasy about myself because the truth was too much to bear.
-Finally, I plowed backwards, first through the false ego I made for myself, then addressing the turd directly and plowing through that. It took 2 years because the turd was so thick. But now, the piece of cake is uncovered!

Do you see what I am saying? Many AFCs are actually CLOSER to true recovery than many so-called DJs because the AFCs have not so thoroughly deluded themselves. Should the AFC decide to face the turd and deal with his childhood, it will take less time than the DJ, who would have to do everything the AFC does, but in addition, cast aside the false pride and the false image he has made for himself.

Capiche?