since the manosphere always talks about the "good old days".

[zekko]

You could always just get as many women pregnant as you can via one night stands with distant strangers. Lie about your name, make up a story to tell her about how you grew up in the hills of Montana and your uncle still owns a ranch there.

That takes care of the nature, but not the nurture.
The kid won't be raised the way Tyte wants him raised.
Most likely he'll be raised as a feminist or at best, an emasculated pvssy.

 

[Tenacity]

double post

 

[Tenacity]

That takes care of the nature, but not the nurture.
The kid won't be raised the way Tyte wants him raised.
Most likely he'll be raised as a feminist or at best, an emasculated pvssy.

But this is where we are zekko, no matter if the Father is there or not. If the Father wants to put in discipline, teach their children the value of a dollar, teach them how to invest, how to budget, how to save, not just GIVE them gifts but they earn them, show them how to pick the right college major (and the right college)...........

......................they will be hauled off to jail for Child Abuse.

So your child gets D's and E's on their report card? And you as their Father cancel their Birthday Party? Expect NOT ONLY for the Mother to not cancel the party but to keep it going, but if you demand it remains cancelled then you will be hauled off as abusing the Child.

So your daughter at 16 wants to go hang out all night with God knows who, and you even have "word" she's been hanging out in some college dorm rooms. You decide that her going out days are BANNED....expect NOT ONLY for the Mother to cancel the Banning but if you demand the banning remains in place, you will be hauled off as abusing the Child.

The Red Pill and the Reality of the world we are living in has totally fvcked me up guys. I have all of the qualities and PASSION to be a Father but I'm not going to be able to do that in this new world. I would be lying to you if I told you that I was OK with this shyt. I'm working through accepting this new reality but sometimes I literally HATE women......no matter of fact I DO HATE WOMEN....I swear to God I literally HATE these people and the HATE is so strong I could just drop a fvcking BOMB on these bytches the likes Osama Bin Laden would have never seen.

I had to opt out of Marriage and creating Children, due to these stupid a.ss bytches. I honestly don't even know how the fvck I'm going to be able to live until "old age". A PART of me died when I came to the realization that I am NOT going to be a fvcking Father.....all on the account of these STUPID a.ss fvcking bytches.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Jaylan,
Flattered that you take me seriously....I grew up in Postwar Britain,a cheeseparing existence,queues of people 500 yards long to get one Banana each...everything rationed....life was puritanical,young folk generally lived with their parents,if working away from home,they had a Landlady who ruled with a rod of iron...Taking Women home was impossible...Oh sure their was furtive svex after dancing or heavy drinking at the pub,usually against a wall or lying on an old Army Great Coat...The sixties was great!the pill!...this liberated people and young Men now had cars,they didn't take their women home,but shagged them on the back seat...everything cruised along until HIV/Aids then there was a mass reversion to older moral values....gradually prosperity has improved,young folk leave home now in their early twenties and do what they want,how can you compare these times?...Were they better?...you have to be joking!

 

[dasein]

I had to opt out of Marriage and creating Children, due to these stupid a.ss bytches. I honestly don't even know how the fvck I'm going to be able to live until "old age". A PART of me died when I came to the realization that I am NOT going to be a fvcking Father.....all on the account of these STUPID a.ss fvcking bytches.

It gets better man. Just don't ruminate in the anger. Realize that it's your subconscious lizard/mammalian brain that is playing you into the natural selection role, so in one respect, your genes and subconscious are manipulating you far worse than any woman or gynoculture can or will. There are ways to address that via a process similar to self-hypnosis, replace the old evolutionary metaphors in your subconscious with new ones. It's easier said than done, but worth it IMO. In short, once freedom becomes your primary driving subconscious metaphor as opposed to the evolutionary stuff that's in there now, all the hatred and pain will be replaced with power and bliss. Not talking new age stuff, just science.

 

[Starwolf]

to Tenacity and TyTe`EyEz

If spreading your genes is important to you.. Would Surrogacy not be a viable option?

This would allow you to raise your children as YOU see fit with no female interference.

thoughts?

 

[Zarky]

OP's question is deceptively simple yet very thought-provoking, and I have yet to see a good response.

Basically, I'd say OP, that "alphas" are men who, in general, do what they want to do. Betas are men who do what they have to do.

So, to answer the question of whether providing for others is, ipso facto, beta, we'd have to answer just why exactly the specific man is doing the providing.

If it's because he (for some reason) wants to, then I see no reason why providing couldn't be an "alpha" activity. However, if he's providing because he feels that it's his duty, it's what society wants, or because that's what will get him a hot chick, then that's beta.

I am skeptical about "providers" being anything other than beta simply because I personally have never wanted to provide for a woman, children, or anyone else. I like to spend my resources on my own desires, thank you very much.

But, I'm not categorically opposed to the concept of a "provider alpha." He would have to be ruthlessly honest with himself about why, really, he's giving up his resources to creatures that are not him.

I think a lot of men believe that if they create things that will last beyond their lives -- such as children or works of art or monuments or ideas or whatever -- that doing so will somehow confer some level of immortality upon them personally. In that case I could see how "providing" to achieve some sort of legacy would be beneficial for them.

However, I don't have that view of existence. I believe that, when I die, everything is over forever. That's just my metaphysical view. Therefore, for me, giving money to others would always necessarily come from a "have to" perspective and would therefore always be beta. Like a poster above me said, I think humans' drive toward creating "legacies" is part deep-seated, probably genetic terror of death and part social force. I consider myself enlightened to realize, like Tyler Durden said in Fight Club, "Know -- don't fear -- know, that some day you're going to die."

I do fear it, but I think I know it better than a lot of people

 

[zekko]

Basically, I'd say OP, that "alphas" are men who, in general, do what they want to do. Betas are men who do what they have to do.

Yeah, maybe. The more I think about it, though, the more I think that all these efforts to define the traits of an alpha is a big mistake. There are all kinds of different people in the world, different kinds of athletes, presidents, businessmen, letharios, whatever. I'm sure there are many different kinds of alphas as well, different paths to get there.

Regarding "providers", I will say this: The bigger your wealth and empire grows, the more you are going to find yourself providing for people in your life. Whether it be up close like in a wife and kids, or around the edges like people in your employ. I find it hard to believe all such successful men are "betas".

 

[Tenacity]

OP's question is deceptively simple yet very thought-provoking, and I have yet to see a good response.

Basically, I'd say OP, that "alphas" are men who, in general, do what they want to do. Betas are men who do what they have to do....

But in what context? So the "alpha guy" who works for a Corporation that's NOT a Manager, not a Senior Executive...gets to do what he wants to do on a daily basis? Really? And the guy who is coming from dire poverty and starts selling drugs to help pay for college tuition (I knew guys like this), is a "beta guy" because he's doing what he HAS to do for survival? Really?

That's a financial example, let's talk from a women/dating perspective. So the guy who takes care of a woman with 6 kids from 6 different ex-convicts, is an "alpha guy" because he's doing what he WANTS to do? And the guy that gets a chick pregnant that he didn't WANT to get pregnant, but the child is here and he believes in Fathering his child and plus he's in a position to where if he doesn't he will be put in jail...because he HAS to do these things that makes him a beta guy?

You don't see how absurd this sounds? There's no 100% Alpha or Beta guy, in some situations you are MORE Alpha than Beta (I define Alpha as Leader and Beta as Servicer), and in some cases you are MORE Beta than Alpha. In some cases, it's BETTER to be Beta than Alpha, as being the Beta reduces your Risk. Is it better to be the Loan Officer and get paid your percentage of the loan volume you closed with NO risk of losses on defaults, or is it better to be the Loan Company and take the financial loss when the loan defaults? It depends on the situation, but the Loan Officer is the Beta to the "Alpha" Loan Company, and in most situations like this it's better to be the Beta.

Just like in marriage, keep thinking you are ALPHA because you married a chick and you quote, unquote "call the shots in the marriage". LOL, keep thinking you are ALPHA. You are very much Beta in that situation as you are the Servicer that the Queen can destroy at any moment she wants through a sword called, "Divorce".

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

Alphas are leaders. Men follow them. Women follow them.

And it is ABSOLUTELY situation-dependent. An alpha in one group may not be an alpha in another group. The BIGGER the group, the HARDER it is to be alpha.

Generally speaking, the MORE alpha you can be in MORE situations, the better you'll do financially, emotionally and relationship-wise.

An alpha requires many betas. Betas require an alpha.

Guys that "go there own way" are neither alpha nor beta. Neither followers nor leaders.

They don't want to follow, but they can't lead, so they quit the game.

 

[user43770]

to Tenacity and TyTe`EyEz

If spreading your genes is important to you.. Would Surrogacy not be a viable option?

This would allow you to raise your children as YOU see fit with no female interference.

thoughts?

I appreciate the response, Starwolf. Would I consider a surrogate mother? Absolutely not. Who's going to raise the child when I'm at work? It's pretty much like sticking your child with public schooling: you know they're being taught some stupid sh1t.

I share all of Tenacity's concerns. I was full blown anti-offspring until recently. I'm not sure what changed (maybe hitting 30?), but I've been trying to figure out the point of life, and I think it has to be bigger than just my hobbies; it has to be bigger than working 55 hours a week, just so that I can afford a better lifestyle - just so that I can buy more stuff.

People talk about buying freedom, but I'm not sure that you can ever purchase freedom from the government.

 

[user43770]

I question men's pursuit of alphaness (is that a term?). I mean, going off of your definitions, any man trying to learn how to be alpha, is not alpha. Or is he? I can't even tell anymore.

How bad is a society when men get together anonymously and argue over ways they can change who they are? I'm not looking down. I do the same thing, and I think it's ridiculous.

I go back to Tenacity's other thread about just paying for it. It seems so much easier to me: short and long-term.

Makes me think of a Hemingway quote: Happiness in intelligent people is the rarest thing I know.