"You Can't Argue a Woman Into Liking You"

You made your case like a lawyer. Stable job. Good guy. Ready for something real. All true. All irrelevant.

She weighed your points, nodded along, felt nothing — then fell hard for some tattooed bartender with a motorcycle and a gambling problem.

Logic is where attraction goes to die. The "22 Rules" work a level deeper, on the subconscious switches that decide within minutes whether you register as a MAN or as part of the furniture.

Stop presenting evidence. Start flipping switches.

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Sick of screwing up...help

coachD

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I went out late Friday to try and meet some girls. Ended up at Bdubs for a late dinner and instead of sitting alone at the end of the bar like I did as AFC I sat in the empty chair between two different groups. Anyway, the girl on my left doesn't say much to me but twice rubs her ass on me getting into her chair. First time I was like...OK then the second I was seriously thinking she's coming on to me. Mind you, I'm AFC for almost 40 years now. Lost weight and dressing preppy seems to have opened my eyes to the fact that I CAN be attractive to the girls.

So after butt rub number two she opens me up in a couple of minutes. Before long she's giving me her number, demanding I guess her age, letting me play with the ring on her finger then holding her hand. Near closing time she says, "Follow me home so you will know where I live when you pick me up like a gentleman for our date". All of this is unsolicited, but I'm interested and trying to use what I've read on these forums. So I follow her home and get out of the car thinking sex is imminent. She was still talking about "our date" that I never agreed to and giving me body language like, this is it...say goodnight and call me. So I think okay she's not inviting me in tonight I'll get there soon enough. Said goodbye and headed home.

I called her Sunday and left the following message on voicemail, "Hey, it's coachd calling to talk to Nina". As of today I haven't heard from her and I'm starting to think she's not going to call.

Two questions:

What would you have done to get past the perceived non-invite inside?

Do I call or text a second time?

As I type this it's painfully clear that she wanted sex that night and all the talk of the date and being a gentleman was probably a **** test.

Any help would be appreciated.
 

"Nervous Around Beautiful Women? There's a Rule for That"

I could talk to any woman I wasn't attracted to. Charming, funny, relaxed. Then a gorgeous woman looked my way and I'd become a sweating, babbling mess.

The fix took me years to find and ten minutes to learn. Nervousness and excitement are the same physical state — pounding heart, adrenaline, flushed face. Your brain just picks the label. And you can pick a better one.

Rule 16 shows you how. You feel the nerves, relabel them as excitement, and let that energy pour out as enthusiasm. Women notice the guy radiating it. They always do.

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Black Widow Void

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I'll take a stab at this. My guess is when you followed her home, this sent a specific message.

First I'll back up and explain a situation where I messed up. About fifteen years ago, I was trying to rekindle an old relationship. From the coffee shop, we walked to grab a slice of pizza. The walk was about a half a mile. Half way during the walk, and while we were talking, she decided to cross the street ( there was no vibe that she was wanting to get a way from me or anything). Anyway, I crossed the street with her. The evening went well, but not as well as I would have liked.

Some readers here may already see what I'm about to explain. When I look back, it's all quite clear. When she crossed the road, this was a subtle test When I followed her lead, and crossed the road with her, I failed. I'm sure through out that evening, I probably did other things that I initially didn't pick up on.

As to your situation, it can be sometimes not as easy to think on your feet. If something similar happens again, you might say, "I've got a GPS and it would be easier if you'd text your address, but if you'd like to hangout at your place for a while, I'm cool with that."

We're always going to screw up from time to time. The fact that you are here and attempting to reduce it, is a sign that you will.

Good Luck!
 

coachD

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I appreciate it. I have had such a dry spell that now I'm getting close but can't close.

Coffee is for closers.
 

Black Widow Void

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Speaking of being able to "close" it really is like a game of selling. If we have a door slammed in our face, we have two choices.
1. Get angry and let this shine on our sleeve as we knock on the next door
or
2. Let it roll off our backs and ask ourselves... "what can we do differently when knocking on the next door to provide a better end-result."
 

Greasy Pig

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Did you even try to invite yourself in?
You could've said something like: "I'm a bit worried I'll perish on the way home. How about we have a drink inside before I head off? After all, that would be the ladylike thing to do for a gentleman."
Once you get in the house, then you cosy up on the couch or my favourite is to lean back on the kitchen bench, look at her, hold out my hand and pull her in for a kiss.
 

"How I Made Sure No Woman Ever Friend-Zoned Me Again"

She calls you when her car breaks down. When she needs help moving. When some guy she's actually dating treats her badly.

You're the listener. The reliable one. The guy who would treat her so much better, if she'd just open her eyes.

She won't. You trained her to see you as the low-effort option — the friend who requires zero risk and zero investment. Every favor dug the hole deeper.

The "22 Rules" break the pattern. You'll stop auditioning for a role she already cast and become the man she chases instead. It starts with Rule 1.

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coachD

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Greasy I didn't try to get in. I went AFC there. At least I'm learning, like Black Widow says.
 

Bushmaster

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coachD said:
She was still talking about "our date" that I never agreed to--Challenge/ Push" Well, Maybe we can, if you are good tonight"

and giving me body language like, this is it...say goodnight and call me. So I think okay she's not inviting me in tonight I'll get there soon enough. Said goodbye and headed home. - I see this alot in this forum - assume she wants you and be a sexual man and push the sex envelope. She may say no but she will respect you for it, and it frames you as a potential lover.
Just my thoughts.

Be patient with yourself, you are learning, not screwing up.
 

coachD

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Thanks Bushmaster. I'm having some success by just going out and chilling. I've had two or three girls approach me when I'm solo at bars. Should I just keep learning on the fly or go to the boot camp approach? I'm in the middle of my coaching season, so I don't have much time to devote to either at this point.
 

pdx1138

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To get in her house. Thats an easy one.

Tell her you need to use the restroom.
as a bonus, while in the restroom, check the cabinet for prescription meds so you know what you're dealing with.
Do it after you turn the faucet on when you wash your hands.
This is the first thing I do whenever I get an invite over.

Then when you come out, find an object of interest and comment on it.
Get a convo going, look into her eyes... thats all ye need!
 

“The 22 Rules That Turned Me From Invisible to Irresistible With Women… Starting Tonight”

You can skip the expensive cars, the fancy clothes, and the endless gym selfies. Completely unnecessary.

I used to freeze the second a beautiful woman looked my way. Frustrated. Awkward. Watching other guys walk away with the girl while I stood there tongue-tied.

Then I discovered 22 simple rules that rewired my entire dating life. The anxiety vanished. Conversations flowed effortlessly. Women started chasing me for a change.

These rules trigger a woman's subconscious attraction switches. And you can start using them tonight.

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Bushmaster

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coachD said:
Thanks Bushmaster. I'm having some success by just going out and chilling. I've had two or three girls approach me when I'm solo at bars. Should I just keep learning on the fly or go to the boot camp approach? I'm in the middle of my coaching season, so I don't have much time to devote to either at this point.
NP, I see it as even my most awkward self is still equal or better than a woman who doesn't do **** to earn affection.

Good on being approached, you have a vibe working.

On your other question I can't say, just learn from each interaction, and make it positive.

Also, read up on texting protocols, often better than leaving a voice message.
 

Colossus

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coachD said:
Any thread about texting best?
Do a search, there are tons of them. I also recommend not leaving messages with girls. Those are for business and friends.


Some general texting guidelines:

-Adhere to the < 50:50 rule. Never send more texts than you are receiving from her.
-Keep it funny and short.
-Avoid excessive emoticons and text-speak (lol, lmao, etc)
-Be unpredictable in your response time. Don't fire back immediately every time.
-Don't engage in full-blown text convos with new girls.
 

Atom Smasher

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pdx1138 said:
To get in her house. Thats an easy one.

Tell her you need to use the restroom.
as a bonus, while in the restroom, check the cabinet for prescription meds so you know what you're dealing with.
Do it after you turn the faucet on when you wash your hands.
This is the first thing I do whenever I get an invite over.
You'd better hope she doesn't do what I did once. I filled the medicine cabinet with enough marbles that they would spill out all over the floor if the cabinet were opened. Sure enough, I heard the clatter of marbles in there.

That was one short relationship...
 

muscleman

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You could have gotten the lay, but that's ok. Next time (and probably with a different girl).

Here's the thing:

SHE opened YOU. She rubbed her ass on you twice, you didn't respond, and she STILL initiated conversation. Huge interest level. That would be a guaranteed lay for me right there.

From what you described, you actually played it well at the bar, all nonchalant. Problem is, you should have capitalized on the bits she threw at you. Call it the 'sex test' if you will. For example, when she said this:

coachD said:
"Follow me home so you will know where I live when you pick me up like a gentleman for our date"
You should have come back with 'only if you make a me a drink'. Boom. She says yes, you're in. She says no, don't follow her home (or you have some work to do still before she's ready).

I always ALWAYS do the 'sex test' when I'm with a girl to see if there's a possibility of getting laid that night. If it's a good chance, I'll proceed. If not, I'll exit and find something better to do with my time.

You'll get better, don't worry.

PS. Since you did follow her home, that was your time to be aggressive. The advice of 'hey can I use your restroom' is solid.
 

"I just moved here from Florida."

That sentence contains at least five follow-up questions she WANTS you to ask. Where in Florida? What brought you here? How long have you been in the area? What do you miss? How does it compare to here?

She handed them to you on a silver platter. And you said, "Oh cool. I come here every week. I love this band. Ummm... pretty crowded tonight."

She smiled politely. Nodded. And never texted you back.

I was that guy for years. Talking too much. Listening too little. Panicking about my next sentence while she was literally feeding me the answers.

Then I found 22 rules that fixed the whole thing. Rule number one: shut up and listen. She'll tell you exactly what to say.

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JulieWatson31

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My guess is that she was DTF but did not just come out with it and instead talked about a 'date'.

Why not just call her, not text and set up something.
 

Desdinova

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Atom Smasher said:
You'd better hope she doesn't do what I did once. I filled the medicine cabinet with enough marbles that they would spill out all over the floor if the cabinet were opened. Sure enough, I heard the clatter of marbles in there.

That was one short relationship...
BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! :crackup:

If I could rep you again, I would :up:
 

coachD

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muscleman said:
You should have come back with 'only if you make a me a drink'. Boom. She says yes, you're in. She says no, don't follow her home (or you have some work to do still before she's ready).

I always ALWAYS do the 'sex test' when I'm with a girl to see if there's a possibility of getting laid that night. If it's a good chance, I'll proceed. If not, I'll exit and find something better to do with my time.

You'll get better, don't worry.

PS. Since you did follow her home, that was your time to be aggressive. The advice of 'hey can I use your restroom' is solid.
Great advice from all of you. This sex test is so great. I'm pissed I didn't think of something like that.

I'm at a point now where I got spoiled by having a few girls open me. I need to get off my ass and go initiate. I'm thinking of doing the GLL approach methods and play the numbers game. I don't know if I could handle a bunch of rejection ("screens").
 

coachD

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JulieWatson31 said:
My guess is that she was DTF but did not just come out with it and instead talked about a 'date'.

Why not just call her, not text and set up something.
Julie, I called her two days later and it went straight to VM. I left a brief message and she never returned the call.
 

“The 22 Rules That Flip the Script With Women… And How You Can Use Them Tonight”

Most guys accidentally kill attraction before they even speak. They assume they need a bigger bank account, a better physique, or smoother lines. They miss the point.

Female desire operates on a specific set of psychological triggers.  Break them, and you're invisible. Follow them, and you become magnetic.

I learned this the hard way. Years of freezing up. Getting friend-zoned. Watching other guys walk away with the girl I wanted. Then I discovered a set of 22 simple rules that rewired my entire approach.

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