She says there's no spark

[Abcd]

If you establish an emotional connection first and foremost and escalate her desire for the kiss to the point where she is actually dying for it, and then kiss her like it's something you've wanted to do forever, you create a spark. Rather then remembering the actual place you took her to for the date, she will remember the feeling of anticipating that kiss, and having it fullfilled. That's how you create a spark.
Hope that helps.

That's very good advice I think, and actually that's the one thing that I think I did RIGHT (though only by accident) in this case. The first kiss was long in coming, she obviously wanted it, and I finally took the initiative and kissed her when I didn't have to.

Having said that, after this painful experience I think I'm just going to try to escalate things as quickly as possible with the next girl. This was just too drawn out - five or six times seeing each other over weeks, and I never got her back to my apt. for some lovin.... that kills

 

[Abcd]

Oh yes...the dull dates definately played a big part in it...but I strongly suspect that this exchange was the straw that broke the camel's back. She was sticking it out to give you a chance to win her over up until that point...even with the dates being kinda lame.

Yeah I could see that.

"Too slow on the kino - learn for next time. Why did you insult her in your e-mail?"

You know, I didn't mean to make it sound like an insult, I was only trying to appear nonchalant. I think I had originally wrote "don't worry, I can't say that I was exactly head-over-heels" and for some reason changed it to straight up "I wasn't head-over-heels." It meant it to sound more "ah no worries" than "same to you"

Edit: btw, thanks for the replies everyone. I don't know, when I post a question I need answered on this board, I get nothing. But when I post "thoughts?" about a girl I no longer have chances with, I get 15 replies. Go figure...

 

[MindOverMatter]

You are missing the point. She longed for that kiss because you made her wait several dates (and because in her head she was wondering where this was going). She did not long for it because there was an escalating desire that made her want to jump you right there and then while at the same time holding herself back because she didn't want to lose self-control. Do you understand what I mean?

Having said that, after this painful experience I think I'm just going to try to escalate things as quickly as possible with the next girl. This was just too drawn out - five or six times seeing each other over weeks, and I never got her back to my apt. for some lovin.... that kills

Again, you are looking at it from the wrong way. You should not be counting the dates. Instead just relax, don't be strategic about it, and be natural. By looking at it logistically, you take away the spontaneous / passionate aspect of being with this girl and make it seem like a procedure. Once you learn the emotional aspect, it's easy to structure dates around it.

Be fun, avoid cliches, and establish an emotional connection before escalating a physical one. Avoid turning it into an interview, and most of all, make her have fun through being with you, rather then through the activity.

 

[Abcd]

I'm not sure I get you, "If you establish an emotional connection first and foremost and escalate her desire for the kiss to the point where she is actually dying for it, and then kiss her like it's something you've wanted to do forever, you create a spark."

Were you then talking about building up over a single date rather than multiple dates? I was saying that I built up that desire over a number of dates, she would hug me and such, but never had the opportunity to kiss me. Then I took her outside to kiss her only after she had been aching for it.

This type of girl has guys coming on to her left and right. To go out with her for the very first time get-to-know-you and *not* give her a kiss at the end was my plan - it worked, she facebook msgd me immediately saying what a good time she had. What I *didn't* plan was not being able to kiss her for the next two times we hung out as well - it just happened that way. During that time she sent me msgs unprovoked, etc. Then I went for the kiss at what I would say was the best time for it.

If you're talking about building up an emotional connection over any individual date, and then going for the kiss, I agree of course. Advice on how to do that building up is the hard part - enlighten me if you have any special tips!

 

[SamePendo]

We know how low the odds are on that type of thing actually working...

That's why I said it. You live you learn.

 

[john_1234]

great post!

A) what are the main things that abcd could have done to have had a successful outcome with the girl?

B) what are the main things he should have avoided which caused her to lose that spark?

abcd, how would you describe the level of kino between the two of you?

 

[Abcd]

great post!
abcd, how would you describe the level of kino between the two of you?

Not much outside of the few intimate moments... a hug here and there... this was definitely lacking, thanks for the headsup.

SamePendo, i am unable to decipher what the bejeezus you are talkin about.

 

[thederekeffect1]

Well, it looks like you got yourself a few tips and have taken the time to evaluate what went wrong. But what I think is more important is the way you handled yourself.

I don't think you insulted her at all. When you said that you weren't exactly head over heels for her either, it let her know that you guys are at a mutual agreement. Neither of you were feeling that spark. I say this because too many people are trying to evaluate the e-mail, thinking they could have came up with something better. No, no, no. You handled yourself very admirably. You kept it short and to the point, you didn't get offended, angry or upset. You responded calmly and rationally. You didn't go off and call her a *****, or start cursin' at her because she really made it seem like she liked you, or anything negative. You didn't call her a slut or ask her about other men. You weren't even immature about it. Man, you handled yourself well bro. And I'll be the first to congradulate you on a good job handling yourself that well.

Obviously, I'm not congradulating you on the relationship itself. Obviously something went wrong, but hey... We can't win them all. Better luck next time.

 

[( . )( . )]

I wasn't exactly head-over-heels either.

Weak and childish

As much as they act like it often chicks are not total retards, 5 lame dates and you pull this rubbish? She knows full well you wanted to pin it.

Lets hope when you were acting as her (albeit unexciting) entertainment coordinater you didnt pay for her dinner.

Realistically you probably got off lightly, if I was her I would have strung you along for alot longer than 5 (yes she knew the first 5 minutes of meeting you whether she'd spread em or not) dates, at least 3 or 4 free meals easy.

 

[thederekeffect1]

Weak and childish

As much as they act like it often chicks are not total retards, 5 lame dates and you pull this rubbish? She knows full well you wanted to pin it.

Lets hope when you were acting as her (albeit unexciting) entertainment coordinater you didnt pay for her dinner.

Realistically you probably got off lightly, if I was her I would have strung you along for alot longer than 5 (yes she knew the first 5 minutes of meeting you whether she'd spread em or not) dates, at least 3 or 4 free meals easy.

(shakes head)

No. It's not weak and childish. In fact, this might given her an explanation of why he never made the move into the bedroom and didn't give her much physical contact. If what you said were true, then it would be true for her. She also went on those 5 dates and then she decided that she didn't feel a connection? He went on those 5 dates, barely touched her... But of course he HAD TO have felt a connection since he went on 5 dates with her. Right?

 

[Abcd]

...That's called reactionary dissonance, and it's always interpreted for the BS that it is.

Hahaha well said. Maybe it's always interpreted that way by people who know the definitions of terms like "reactionary dissonance." I'm assuming you're in psychology? Frankly, I was *not* head-over-heels in love with this girl. I like her, and she's very cool, but she's actually a bit lacking in intelligence and full of her own tripe. Its not like I said "yeah I don't feel the chemistry either," of course that would be BS. This was just an attempt to save some face with a reasonable - and true - description of my non-attraction. She knows I want her, she knows every guy wants her... probably one of the top 10 most attractive people I've talked to at my uni of 40,000 people.

"No hard feelings. I can understand how fickle thoughts of attraction can be. I hope that things work out for you. Take care."

That to me sounds almost like a taunt, but I like something along those lines. Maybe "No hard feelings. I've got some experience with fickle thoughts of attraction myself. I hope you have a great time over the next year, give me a call."

 

[( . )( . )]

(shakes head)

No. It's not weak and childish. In fact, this might given her an explanation of why he never made the move into the bedroom and didn't give her much physical contact.

LOL and shes supposed to buy that? cmon dude what do you take her for?

Hate to burst your bubble mate but chicks know we dont go out 5 times for nothing.

 

[Abcd]

Weak and childish ...
Realistically you probably got off lightly, if I was her I would have strung you along for alot longer than 5 (yes she knew the first 5 minutes of meeting you whether she'd spread em or not) dates, at least 3 or 4 free meals easy.

Yeah thanks for your input. FYI the only time I ever paid a cent for anything of hers was the last time we went out, when I finally decided I was over the hump and could buy her dinner without looking like a chump, on a night I didn't expect to get any action.

 

[Pimp-sicle]

(shakes head)

No. It's not weak and childish. In fact, this might given her an explanation of why he never made the move into the bedroom and didn't give her much physical contact. If what you said were true, then it would be true for her. She also went on those 5 dates and then she decided that she didn't feel a connection? He went on those 5 dates, barely touched her... But of course he HAD TO have felt a connection since he went on 5 dates with her. Right?

YES IT IS VERY WEAK AND CHILDISH!!! Girls usually make up their mind within 5-10 minutes of meeting a guy whether they would sleep with him. Of course there are exceptions to this jus like any other case, but it was a weak attempt by ABC to save face, all it did was make him look like more of a retard. I'd be shocked if the girl actually calls him again like she said she would after reading his response.

However with that said, I don't think it would have mattered in the end. Obviously this girl met someone else over spring break that she was more into and that sealed his fate.


ABC: You shouldn't have replied to her e-mail in that way. It did show courage and character for her to be upfront with you, because most girls would just indirectly blow you off until you got the hint (flaking, not answering the phone) but she was honest. I don't think you did anything really wrong while you went on those dates. Never take rejection personal, just move on.




PIMP

 

[Abcd]

Derek, thanks for the props.

YES IT IS VERY WEAK AND CHILDISH!!! Girls usually make up their mind within 5-10 minutes of meeting a guy whether they would sleep with him. Of course there are exceptions to this jus like any other case, but it was a weak attempt by ABC to save face, all it did was make him look like more of a retard. I'd be shocked if the girl actually calls him again like she said she would after reading his response.

However with that said, I don't think it would have mattered in the end. Obviously this girl met someone else over spring break that she was more into and that sealed his fate.
PIMP

I don't know what the big deal is, all I was trying to say was yeah, don't worry about it, that hurts but I'll get over it like a normal person. Maybe I should have worded it differently, but I don't know why you'd say it makes me look retarded. I don't really care whether she calls me or not, all I was trying to do was smooth things over for the future with her and any other friends of ours. And as for your "of course" assesment, I don't know why you'd think "of course" anything, but I guess you're a "pimp." We went out twice after break and she seemed the same to me up until this email.

Now, after finishing my homework at 3AM, I realized I am still thinking about this and posting about this, and I realized that means I'm thinking about it way too much. Especially because, though I didn't think of this before, her email cannot be read as anything more than "i'm not interested for unspecified reason(s)." If you think about it, when you get sick of a girl, or when you meet another girl, or when you decide you're gonna join the seminary, whatever the reason, that has no bearing on how you dismiss the girl. You get rid of her in the easiest way possible, in the way that will make her feel the least bad and cause you the least trouble. So really anything could have happened here, regardless of what she says, and so perhaps all of this analysis is silly. Or perhaps not, who the heck knows.

 

[thederekeffect1]

YES IT IS VERY WEAK AND CHILDISH!!! Girls usually make up their mind within 5-10 minutes of meeting a guy whether they would sleep with him. Of course there are exceptions to this jus like any other case, but it was a weak attempt by ABC to save face, all it did was make him look like more of a retard. I'd be shocked if the girl actually calls him again like she said she would after reading his response.

(sigh) Some people get it. Some people will never ever get it. I'll bet you 20 dollars that she feels relieved that he said that.

 

[Wyldfire]

Derek, thanks for the props.



I don't know what the big deal is, all I was trying to say was yeah, don't worry about it, that hurts but I'll get over it like a normal person. Maybe I should have worded it differently, but I don't know why you'd say it makes me look retarded. I don't really care whether she calls me or not, all I was trying to do was smooth things over for the future with her and any other friends of ours. And as for your "of course" assesment, I don't know why you'd think "of course" anything, but I guess you're a "pimp." We went out twice after break and she seemed the same to me up until this email.

Now, after finishing my homework at 3AM, I realized I am still thinking about this and posting about this, and I realized that means I'm thinking about it way too much. Especially because, though I didn't think of this before, her email cannot be read as anything more than "i'm not interested for unspecified reason(s)." If you think about it, when you get sick of a girl, or when you meet another girl, or when you decide you're gonna join the seminary, whatever the reason, that has no bearing on how you dismiss the girl. You get rid of her in the easiest way possible, in the way that will make her feel the least bad and cause you the least trouble. So really anything could have happened here, regardless of what she says, and so perhaps all of this analysis is silly. Or perhaps not, who the heck knows.

I think the point everyone is trying to make is that in your attempt to be polite and cordial you came off a bit dorky and too formal. The formal thing is going to hurt you if you are trying to get a woman to relax around you. Formal is good for business matters...but it sucks ass for personal relations. It makes you sound fake and contrived...and you've got to try to tone that down a bit in your dealings with women. Being polite is always good...manners are important...it's the formal thing that isn't going to work well with women. It can make you come off as being pretty stuffy...and you really don't want that.

 

[Wyldfire]

(sigh) Some people get it. Some people will never ever get it. I'll bet you 20 dollars that she feels relieved that he said that.

Nope...the other guys are right. She knows he only said that to attempt to save face after she rejected him. It doesn't really matter at this point, though, because things were finished before he wrote that. That being said...he could have responded far worse than that, too...so it's no biggie either way. He does have to make a concerted effort to be less formal and proper with women, though. He wants them to relax with him and be comfortable or else they won't be able to look at him romantically...so he definately needs to work on that.

 

[Tomatoes]

No Spark = No action date + no kino or she found a guy during the weekend. I think its more of the first thow....those dates were abit lame. Girls like to take it slower than blokes but i hear enough stories about girls braking up with guys because they didnt get them into bed quick enough and didnt want to wait around...


Lesson for the day. To get a spark. Pin her against a wall and bang her like a beast.

 

[speedo_meme]

1) you didn't put the moves on her soon enough
2) you did alot of nice guy stuff
3) you did boring things
4) you PROBABLY, judging by your posts, got sort of needy on her

Dude, you may not have turned her off, but you definitely didn't turn her on either. The first couple of dates should be exciting. Wyldfire's posts are good advice. You calling her stupid for her opinions didn't exactly help your situation.