"She Liked You in March. It's October Now."
Attraction runs on a clock.
She flirted for weeks. Touched your arm. Found reasons to be alone with you. And you were careful. Respectful. Waiting for the right moment.
The moment had a shelf life. It expired around month two, and by the time you asked her out, she'd quietly filed you under "little brother."
One of the hardest lessons inside the 22 Rules: women rarely wait. Interest either grows or it decays, and nothing decays it faster than a man who never moves.
Make the move while she's still inventing reasons to be near you.
reversing LJBF?
- Thread starter DjNLes
- Start date
"How I Made Sure No Woman Ever Friend-Zoned Me Again"
She calls you when her car breaks down. When she needs help moving. When some guy she's actually dating treats her badly.
You're the listener. The reliable one. The guy who would treat her so much better, if she'd just open her eyes.
She won't. You trained her to see you as the low-effort option — the friend who requires zero risk and zero investment. Every favor dug the hole deeper.
The "22 Rules" break the pattern. You'll stop auditioning for a role she already cast and become the man she chases instead. It starts with Rule 1.
Latinoman said:
By the way...very rarely things work "perfectly" when you START the sexual part with a woman. After all it is a "trial and error" thing in the sense that you apply what have worked for you when dealing with other women. However, here is the thing...no every woman is the same. Some love some things, while others hate the same things.
So, you have to COMMUNICATE with her and for the same token take the "explorer" approach (because you also want to introduce her to new things - wink). It is literaly like an explorer that before he conquers new lands, he must first UNDERSTAND it. You don't go into the Amazons without understanding what path you should take.
Most women know that. What they MIGHT not tolerate is a man that shows NO improvement.
So sex might not turn out to be "great" at the begining...however, if the potential of turning out SUPER great is there...the woman should know.
SoCalMike
Senior Don Juan
yes, that's a EXCELLENT technique. just make sure you do it right from the start, very soon after you meet and start to get to know each other. otherwise it won't work.Aaron B said:
monster squad
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DjNLes:
I'm not really sure I understand your question.
Basically, it's like this: when I do "make a move", she's usually not receptive. Occasionally she is, but it only seems to work when she gives a blatant go-ahead before hand, like exposing her neck or making the "kiss me" face. Nothing works unless she gives a blunt signal. Like the one time I did have sex with her, basically it was my roommate asking her what she was going to do about going home that night, as we had all been out drinking and we have a spare room. Not that anybody was trashed, mind you. She responded with something like "I'd have to sleep in (my) room, so he can protect me from the ghost.". Done and done. It was kinda awkward at first, but I just decided to take off my pants and started playing with her tits. The rest just flowed. The aftermath was not so simple.
But anyway, I went out with her last night. Despite her teasing message, the night was a bust, like I knew it would be. One of my more annoying friends (the Cartman of my social circle) was out, and he pretty much dominated any and all conversations. He's one of these people who watches television all day, absorbs all this History Channel/Learning Channel info, takes the most controversial stance on issues, then regurgitates all of this as his own opinion. I kinda get the feeling they're into each other, as she seems stupider than I originally gave her credit for. She also kept asking about another one of my friends, and he told her that she sounds obssessed with him. Whatever.
When we left I asked her if she was going home? "Yeah, I have to get up early. My car is due for it's inspection.". I pointed out that her stickers are good until the end of November, and walked away.
I'm not really sure I understand your question.
Basically, it's like this: when I do "make a move", she's usually not receptive. Occasionally she is, but it only seems to work when she gives a blatant go-ahead before hand, like exposing her neck or making the "kiss me" face. Nothing works unless she gives a blunt signal. Like the one time I did have sex with her, basically it was my roommate asking her what she was going to do about going home that night, as we had all been out drinking and we have a spare room. Not that anybody was trashed, mind you. She responded with something like "I'd have to sleep in (my) room, so he can protect me from the ghost.". Done and done. It was kinda awkward at first, but I just decided to take off my pants and started playing with her tits. The rest just flowed. The aftermath was not so simple.
But anyway, I went out with her last night. Despite her teasing message, the night was a bust, like I knew it would be. One of my more annoying friends (the Cartman of my social circle) was out, and he pretty much dominated any and all conversations. He's one of these people who watches television all day, absorbs all this History Channel/Learning Channel info, takes the most controversial stance on issues, then regurgitates all of this as his own opinion. I kinda get the feeling they're into each other, as she seems stupider than I originally gave her credit for. She also kept asking about another one of my friends, and he told her that she sounds obssessed with him. Whatever.
When we left I asked her if she was going home? "Yeah, I have to get up early. My car is due for it's inspection.". I pointed out that her stickers are good until the end of November, and walked away.
Hey guys,
I have been reading tips on this site for a while. I recently got with a girl after playing out a lot of the tips I have read here and elsewhere. She claimed that I was the first guy she had ever dated. Well some other circumstances arose which caused her to stop trusting me (I can elaborate on this if it's important) and she LJBF'ed me. I told her I understood where she was coming from and accepted the LJBF (I did - but I shouldn't have told her that) and walked away. We haven't communicated at all since. It is possible we will be seeing each other in groups (we share a similar group of friends); assuming I would eventually be wanting to get her back, how do I act towards her in the group setting? It is big enough that I can pretty much ignore her if needed. Do I start up some C&F or just ignore? Or just start hitting on another girl?
I have been reading tips on this site for a while. I recently got with a girl after playing out a lot of the tips I have read here and elsewhere. She claimed that I was the first guy she had ever dated. Well some other circumstances arose which caused her to stop trusting me (I can elaborate on this if it's important) and she LJBF'ed me. I told her I understood where she was coming from and accepted the LJBF (I did - but I shouldn't have told her that) and walked away. We haven't communicated at all since. It is possible we will be seeing each other in groups (we share a similar group of friends); assuming I would eventually be wanting to get her back, how do I act towards her in the group setting? It is big enough that I can pretty much ignore her if needed. Do I start up some C&F or just ignore? Or just start hitting on another girl?
"Stop Asking Your Friends What to Text Her"
Your buddy Dave has been single for three years and thinks "hey u up" is a valid strategy. Your other buddy Mike just got dumped and told you to "just be yourself."
You showed them her text. You asked them to decode the emoji. You drafted four responses and sent the screenshot to the group chat for a vote.
She's been waiting forty minutes.
Put the phone down. Stop crowdsourcing your love life. Type something that sounds like you. Hit send. Then go do literally anything else with your evening.
MonsterSquad: no group dates. Just take this chick out alone, without the blockers.
Yeah, she might not want to go out with just you (as friends and all). But, as you see, there's no point in going out with a group anyways.
Dinamu, her lack of trust isn't fatal. See monster squad's previous post? That's how a lot of women really act when her man cheats on her five times. It's not like her interest fizzled.
As for how you should act around her, what happend? You've gotta elaborate.
Yeah, she might not want to go out with just you (as friends and all). But, as you see, there's no point in going out with a group anyways.
Dinamu, her lack of trust isn't fatal. See monster squad's previous post? That's how a lot of women really act when her man cheats on her five times. It's not like her interest fizzled.
As for how you should act around her, what happend? You've gotta elaborate.
monster squad
Don Juan
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Phyzzle:
It was meant to be just the two of us. He just popped up. Every****ingtime we go out, somebody comes over and starts talking to me. Friends, people I barely know, people I don't know at all. And they never get the hint that I just want to be alone with her.
Last night was amusing. She called me up and invited me out to this beerfest thing. I met up with her, and a bunch of my "friends" were there. I overheard her mention one of my friends (the one she kept inquiring about the night before) a bunch of times. He wasn't there, but his brother was. At one point she even took him aside to get shots. I don't know if she's playing headgames, or if she's genuinly into the guy. I knew I had to do something stupid.
Later on me, her, and one of her friends went to a bar. Everyone else went off to do their own thing. I pretty much turned into an ***hole for the rest of the night. She'd start singing along to whatever was on the jukebox, I'd tell her to shut the hell up. She started playfully punching me on the shoulder to the beat of the music, I'd tell her to knock it off. She mentioned that she thought the one bartender was "sexy" (the bartender being female). I told her that I find homosexual tendancies unnatural, then told the bartender, with her sitting right next to me, that she wanted to hook up with her. "What the **** was that!?!". Haha.
On that topic, before I said anything to the bartender, I said I preferred the other tender, a cute, little blond. "Oh. Yeah, she's cute, but such and such is way hotter.". Whatever. I proceeded to spent the rest of the night flirting with that blond. She got jealous. "Stop ogling!". At one point she got so pissed off, that she and her friend grabbed their purses and went to a table. "I'll be back in a minute.". I almost forgot she was gone.
At the end of the night I noticed out of the corner of my eye that she was coming back over, but when she was about 5 feet away, another girl ran over and gave me a hug and sat down next to me (just an acquaintance). I saw her stop, turn around, and walk back to the support of her friend. I saw them both keep looking at me, and she eventually came back over and sat down. I really didn't say anything until I noticed her friend making out with some dude. Then I grabbed a 6 pack for my roommate and we all left. I just gave her a hug, and went home smiling.
As for the topic of the girl who married the cheater, yeah. I remember one night being out with her and some friends. She got wasted, and called the guy up. I tried taking the phone from her, as did one of her friends, but she just ran into the bathroom. Then she came out crying, saying **** like, "What's wrong with me? Why did he cheat on me? Am I that ugly?", blah blah blah. Three weeks later I found out that she was going to marry the ****er. Actually, I had to decipher it with the little bit of Spanish that I've picked up, when she'd be talking with her friends. She wouldn't tell me until I confronted her about it. Kept telling me that she was moving with her family to Florida, which was 100% bull****.
Like I said, she had to prove herself, and now she's miserable, and alone with some cheating drug addict. Some people just can't be helped...
... kinda like me...
It was meant to be just the two of us. He just popped up. Every****ingtime we go out, somebody comes over and starts talking to me. Friends, people I barely know, people I don't know at all. And they never get the hint that I just want to be alone with her.
Last night was amusing. She called me up and invited me out to this beerfest thing. I met up with her, and a bunch of my "friends" were there. I overheard her mention one of my friends (the one she kept inquiring about the night before) a bunch of times. He wasn't there, but his brother was. At one point she even took him aside to get shots. I don't know if she's playing headgames, or if she's genuinly into the guy. I knew I had to do something stupid.
Later on me, her, and one of her friends went to a bar. Everyone else went off to do their own thing. I pretty much turned into an ***hole for the rest of the night. She'd start singing along to whatever was on the jukebox, I'd tell her to shut the hell up. She started playfully punching me on the shoulder to the beat of the music, I'd tell her to knock it off. She mentioned that she thought the one bartender was "sexy" (the bartender being female). I told her that I find homosexual tendancies unnatural, then told the bartender, with her sitting right next to me, that she wanted to hook up with her. "What the **** was that!?!". Haha.
On that topic, before I said anything to the bartender, I said I preferred the other tender, a cute, little blond. "Oh. Yeah, she's cute, but such and such is way hotter.". Whatever. I proceeded to spent the rest of the night flirting with that blond. She got jealous. "Stop ogling!". At one point she got so pissed off, that she and her friend grabbed their purses and went to a table. "I'll be back in a minute.". I almost forgot she was gone.
At the end of the night I noticed out of the corner of my eye that she was coming back over, but when she was about 5 feet away, another girl ran over and gave me a hug and sat down next to me (just an acquaintance). I saw her stop, turn around, and walk back to the support of her friend. I saw them both keep looking at me, and she eventually came back over and sat down. I really didn't say anything until I noticed her friend making out with some dude. Then I grabbed a 6 pack for my roommate and we all left. I just gave her a hug, and went home smiling.
As for the topic of the girl who married the cheater, yeah. I remember one night being out with her and some friends. She got wasted, and called the guy up. I tried taking the phone from her, as did one of her friends, but she just ran into the bathroom. Then she came out crying, saying **** like, "What's wrong with me? Why did he cheat on me? Am I that ugly?", blah blah blah. Three weeks later I found out that she was going to marry the ****er. Actually, I had to decipher it with the little bit of Spanish that I've picked up, when she'd be talking with her friends. She wouldn't tell me until I confronted her about it. Kept telling me that she was moving with her family to Florida, which was 100% bull****.
Like I said, she had to prove herself, and now she's miserable, and alone with some cheating drug addict. Some people just can't be helped...
... kinda like me...
Thanks for the encouragement. Basically, she told me some stuff about one of her previous boyfriends and specifically mentioned that she wanted to keep this information secret. I very stupidly and regrettably talked to one of my buds (who has a huge mouth) and then he repeated it in front of her (even though I specifically told him not to).Phyzzle said:
So how do I talk to her in groups/alone? I don't want to accept the LJBF. She seems to be the type that craves attention - in groups she will try to get attention from any guy who will give it - and then when they do she will leave them alone. That's why some wondered how the hell I got her originally.
zerocelcius
Master Don Juan
DjNLes said:Thanks for the great insights guys.
"So all that means a bl0wjob is out of the question, then?"
"mangina"
"I've got a better deal, Let's Not Be Enemies" Those just cracks me up.
Here's the situation. We haven't been in contact for weeks now other than that one text msg I received last week. I got a wedding to go to next month and she's supposed to be my date. I'm not sure if that thrilled about it now. Regardless, if she does show up and we do go. At the end of the night, I'm just gonna kiss her. Any comments or suggestions..thanks!
Why are you going to the wedding with her?
Dinamu, she didn't break it off out of jeleousy because you were flirting with other chicks; this is a bad thing.
In this case, I don't think she LJBF'ed you. I think she just flat-out does't like you anymore. This is a different situation from MonsterSquad's.
This chick isn't calling you to hang out and then acting all inconsistent and dragging her friends in. This chick simply dumped you, said some token "LJBF" mantra, and that was it. I don't think it matters how you act now.
In this case, I don't think she LJBF'ed you. I think she just flat-out does't like you anymore. This is a different situation from MonsterSquad's.
This chick isn't calling you to hang out and then acting all inconsistent and dragging her friends in. This chick simply dumped you, said some token "LJBF" mantra, and that was it. I don't think it matters how you act now.
"Nervous Around Beautiful Women? There's a Rule for That"
I could talk to any woman I wasn't attracted to. Charming, funny, relaxed. Then a gorgeous woman looked my way and I'd become a sweating, babbling mess.
The fix took me years to find and ten minutes to learn. Nervousness and excitement are the same physical state — pounding heart, adrenaline, flushed face. Your brain just picks the label. And you can pick a better one.
Rule 16 shows you how. You feel the nerves, relabel them as excitement, and let that energy pour out as enthusiasm. Women notice the guy radiating it. They always do.
Hey zerocelcius,
Actually a while back she had asked that if I ever get invited to a wedding to bring her along. That's why I asked her to come with me. She's going to have to take of work to come. I'm not sure if all this is such a great idea.
Actually a while back she had asked that if I ever get invited to a wedding to bring her along. That's why I asked her to come with me. She's going to have to take of work to come. I'm not sure if all this is such a great idea.
Can you elaborate on why you think this please? Specifically the first sentence.Phyzzle said:
Up until the incidence occurred that made her lose trust in me, she had fallen harder for me than any girl I have ever noticed. Almost attached.
Now that she has LJBF'ed me, I have ignored her....and all she has been doing has been putting up emo away messages on AIM, and in groups I notice her looking at me (assuming to see if I am looking) and then she'll go up "get close" with another random guy (it doesn't even matter who it is) in (what I think is an) attempt to make me jealous. I just smile and ignore. I still haven't spoken to her.
Are these behaviors of someone not interested?
On that 1st sentence, I mean when a guy dumps one girl for another, this doubles the interest level of the ex.
I see it happen a lot. Ever seen a girl who still has feelings for her ex? Then promptly dumps her new guy when her ex comes "back into the picture"? That's what happens when the male dumps the female. You see posts on this board of guys who got burned like that.
In fact, I've been thinking of "pre-emptive dumping" as a way to make a woman more attracted to me.
But anyway, that's not what happened to you. You did something annoying, the SHE broke it off with YOU, and now she's not your friend, either.
So you can keep ignoring her, or walk up and try to chat her up, but I don't see it making any difference.
I see it happen a lot. Ever seen a girl who still has feelings for her ex? Then promptly dumps her new guy when her ex comes "back into the picture"? That's what happens when the male dumps the female. You see posts on this board of guys who got burned like that.
In fact, I've been thinking of "pre-emptive dumping" as a way to make a woman more attracted to me.
But anyway, that's not what happened to you. You did something annoying, the SHE broke it off with YOU, and now she's not your friend, either.
Yes, I think they are. Her EGO was hurt by the fact that you aren't begging to have her back. But really wanting your attention is not the same as wanting you. The key difference is, an interested chick would have brooded a few days, accepted your apology, and called you. She's never tried to patch things up, right? That's what interested chicks do after a breakup from an argument.
So you can keep ignoring her, or walk up and try to chat her up, but I don't see it making any difference.
zerocelcius
Master Don Juan
Last time I went to a Wedding with a chick, that was all she would talk about on the drive home (6 hours).DjNLes said:
Is there anybody else you can take? Since you haven't even talked why take her? I don't get why you would consider taking her now that you are in this kinda relationship. IS this a desperate grasp?
I Humble Opinion is Keep her off the Radar and find another Date!
"She Laughed All Night. Then She Ghosted You. Here's Why."
Dinner ran three hours. She laughed at everything. You walked her to her car thinking this one's locked in.
Then: nothing. Two texts. No reply. What happened?
You did what most men do on a great date. You filled every silence, answered every question, and left her with nothing to wonder about. No mystery. Nothing to sit with when she got home.
Rule 3 of the "22 Rules" changes the ending: tell her a little, hold back the rest, and let her imagination do the chasing. The ghosting stops too.
Hey zerocelcius,
Was that girl you took to the wedding someone who ljbf'd you?
I do understand your point. Part of me wants to take her so I can make my move and part of me thinks this is absurd cause she would've shown interest the two times she came to visit me and that im just wasting my time.
As far as deparation is concerned it's definitely not the case because I've been to weddings alone. Perhaps it's me hoping something good might happen?
Was that girl you took to the wedding someone who ljbf'd you?
I do understand your point. Part of me wants to take her so I can make my move and part of me thinks this is absurd cause she would've shown interest the two times she came to visit me and that im just wasting my time.
As far as deparation is concerned it's definitely not the case because I've been to weddings alone. Perhaps it's me hoping something good might happen?
BobFuest
Senior Don Juan
my girl didnt try to ljbf me but tried the "i dont know how i feel" recently. I said "are you sure?" she said she didnt know. Since then i have had no contact with her and she calls me everyday sometimes 5 times a day to see how i am doing and tell me things. She even states over and over she has to tell me something but I havent responded. Its a tough road but always stick to your guns and forget about the woman. I dont think she ever thought i had the stones to just disappear but she is quickly finding out i do. although at some point i do have to pick up my stuff from her house.. damn.. haha