Qualities of the AFC

[Rollo Tomassi]

I've been grinding my teeth here at the high concentration of blatantly AFC mind-sets I've been reading over the course of my vacation last week. Threads like "Found the perfect ONE" or "Spinning Plates and the ONE that might get away" are making me ill. I realize we have a new crop of regular posters to the Mature Men's board, but I'm seeing a lot of misinformation being bandied around and pitiful excuses for suck-up behaviors that are the direct result of abandoning the PRIZE mentality that is so necessary not only for personal success with women, but also their overall betterment in life.

This last week has allowed me to make some progress on the book I'm currently writing, and in response to this epidemic I'm going to post my outline of the qualities that define an AFC. 90% of the crap I'm reading here lately can be traced directly to these elements. Bear in mind that all of these are indicative behaviors and mental schemas that define a person as an AFC. Please feel free to debate and ad any that I've missed.



Qualities of an AFC

ONEitis – First and foremost.

Subscribes to feminine idealizations.

Supplication. She must increase, so he must decrease, regardless of how subtly this is realized.

The Savior Schema –reciprocation of intimacy for problems solved.

The Martyr Schema – the more you sacrifice the more it shows devotion.

The ‘Friends’ Debt – LJBF and the pseudo-friendship method.

Primarily relies on dating and social skills (or lack thereof) developed during puberty and early adulthood

A behavioral history that illustrates a mental attitude of ‘serial monogamy’ and the realated inscurities that accompany it.

A belief that women infallibly and consciously recognize what they want, and honestly convey this to them, irrespective of behaviors that contradict this. Uses deductive reasoning in determining intent and bases female motivations on statements rather than objectively observing behavior.

Believes in the Identification Myth. The more alike he is, or can make himself, with his idealized female the better able he will be to attract and secure her intimacy. Believes that shared common interests are the ONLY key to attraction and enduring intimacy.

Believes and practices the “not like other guys” doctrine, even under the condition of anonymity.

Considers LDRs a viable option for prolonged intimacy.

Maintain an internalized belief in the qualifications and characterizations of women that coincide with his ability (or inability) to attract them. Ergo, he self-confirms the “ she’s out of my league” and the “she’s a loose slut” mentalities on-the-fly to reinforce his position for his given conditions.

Harbors irrational (often socially reinforced) fears of long term solitude and alters his mind-set to accommodate or settle for a less than optimal short term relationship – often with life long consequences.

The AFC will confirm a belief in egalitarian equality between the genders without consideration for variance between the genders. Ergo, men make perfectly acceptable feminine models and women make perfectly acceptable masculine models. Due to societal pressures he unconsciously self-confirms androgyny as a goal state.

 

[Jester FPS]

Could you please explain what LJBF, LDR's and all that other lingo means?

 

[Vulpine]

How about the fact that AFC's will argue that they don't display any chumpish behaviors. They'll deny their AFCisms and cite "I get women" as if it would discount any AFC claim. Even after having all the info right in front of them in B&W, they'll not believe that they've been suckers/chumps. Therefore, they won't start the process of betterment and recovery - hopelessly destined to remain AFC's until they admit their problem and start learning from their mistakes.

Denial.

In fact, shame on us DJ's for celebrating ourselves over women - "women are god's gift to men".

Also, an AFC bases his happiness on women. An AFC is miserable when women aren't in his life. He feels that he is a failure if there isn't presently a woman attracted to him. A non-AFC would know women can only enhance one's happiness. Should these women start to detract from a non-AFC's happiness, the woman goes "buh-bye" whereas an AFC would fight to keep the woman in his life - unknowingly making the AFC even more miserable than he would've been without.

AFC: women = basis/measure of personal happiness

 

[Sinistar]

Please feel free to debate and ad any that I've missed.

Pedastal Placement:

I believe a core AFC misconception is that if they continue to tell a woman how [beautiful|hot|smart|...] she is that it will generate attraction, bump desire/IL, etc. When in reality, doing this places more pressure on them, tells them they are the prize and simply pushes them away.

Clearly this might be a large sub-category of PRIZE'ing however there are a lot of guys out who there who have been "programmed" to think these compliments actually work.

I understand this is almost always present with ONE-Itis, however it sure seems like a AFC false belief or in your terms "quality"

 

[Sinistar]

Please feel free to debate and ad any that I've missed.

Uniqueness Myth(s):
- Soulmates

These are clearly displayed when someone chimes in with ONE-Itis however I believe it was these very AFC mis-beliefs that lead them to their ONE-Itis in the first place. If a man was never allowed (or did not allow himself) to be programmed this way, he would be far less likely to fall into a situation of ONE-Itis. No true DJ believes there is only one person for them in their lifetime.

And this may lead to a more core "quality":

Rationalization & Justification

Perhaps these are the ******d symptoms of Denial?

When something ain't working a healthy person cuts it off, walks away or whatever it takes to get clear of it.

A guy who's going about things in a AFC manner will use rationalizations and justifications to make excuses to his logical self for why something illogical is not working. When we write in with "this isn't working but I think its because she..." its a rationalization. These key phrases (rationalizing, etc) when we are not biased by the problem lead us to deduce that the guy is acting AFC-like. A experienced person (man or woman) will not do this. They simply realize the core problem and move to solve it, not justify it.

And one more:

Believing Inter-Personal Relationships Function With Logic

AFC's believe they can use logic to solve relationship issues. Experienced guys learn this just wraps them farther around the axle.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Excessive politeness relates to the pedestal idea:

I'm sorry.
Excuse me.
Please forgive me.
Are you having a good time?
What do you want to do?
I'm so lucky to be with you....


But when you do the right things, it is the woman who finds herself acting like the AFC wuss.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

Pedestal Placement I would file under Supplication because I see this as symptomatic of a supplicating schema.

The Soulmate Myth I always apply with ONEitis in every post I comment on it. Soulmate Mythology is ONEitis.

Rationalization occurs in a lot of things that have nothing to do with being an AFC, so I can't say it's necessarily a prerequisite of it. I do agree however that it aids in perpetuating it.

One thing I should've added is a Scarcity Mentality. There are few women in the world who meet the requirements of an AFC’s idealization. Therefore when one does (or even comes close), he tenaciously clings to her as being the ONE for him and thus enters into other AFC behaviors.

 

[driver55]

Uniqueness Myth(s):
- Soulmates

These are clearly displayed when someone chimes in with ONE-Itis however I believe it was these very AFC mis-beliefs that lead them to their ONE-Itis in the first place. If a man was never allowed (or did not allow himself) to be programmed this way, he would be far less likely to fall into a situation of ONE-Itis. No true DJ believes there is only one person for them in their lifetime.

And this may lead to a more core "quality":

Rationalization & Justification

Perhaps these are the ******d symptoms of Denial?

When something ain't working a healthy person cuts it off, walks away or whatever it takes to get clear of it.

A guy who's going about things in a AFC manner will use rationalizations and justifications to make excuses to his logical self for why something illogical is not working. When we write in with "this isn't working but I think its because she..." its a rationalization. These key phrases (rationalizing, etc) when we are not biased by the problem lead us to deduce that the guy is acting AFC-like. A experienced person (man or woman) will not do this. They simply realize the core problem and move to solve it, not justify it.

To piggy-back off of the rationalization:

- Overanalyzing on why things aren't working, e.g. mulling over why a girl won't return a phone call/message for weeks at a time and debating whether to call back again, use a different number, talk to her friends, etc. instead of just moving on...

 

[Victory Unlimited]

Yo Troops, good posts--ALL.


Here's another "quality" of the AFC Mindset:


Emotional Immaturity

AFC behavior is often manifested as an inability or an unwillingness of a man to control his emotions. When caught in the grip of an infatuation or an unrequited love (One-itis), an AFC not only abandons logic---he dives head first into the sea of his emotions.

This is a form of behavior that completes the feminization process that AFCs go thru while caught in the web of tangled relationships with women. Theoretically, it can be argued that women thrive (see--feel more alive) in the realm of emotions. Good, bad, or ugly---It is THEIR realm. Yes, they thrive, but they are not IN CONTROL.

So therefore, when a man due to the overwhelming power of his One-itis, suddenly finds himself trapped in the emotional realm, he is literally OUT OF HIS LEAGUE---he DROWNS.

He is at a serious disadvantage. Even more sadly, he doesn't even receive the benefit of THRIVING while he's caught up in the emotional storms. He DOES NOT enjoy the ride at all. He is sometimes even more out of control than the women. It is said that men commit suicide MORE than women. Could lack of experience dealing with and controlling our emotions be the cause? Hmmmm.

It is a fact, that if his emotional upheaval lasts a second too long, he is lucky to even survive it. Why? Because a man who allows himself to be carried away (to his detriment) by his emotions has thrown away two of his greatest "qualities"---his logic and his resolve.

These are two valuable "qualities" that contribute to true masculinity. A man empowered by logic would be able to recognize when he is acting irrationally. And a man of resolve would be armed with the determination necessary to do what is in his OWN romantic best interest, no matter what his emotions are screaming to the contrary.

Listen up Troops!

Write this down, read it fifty times, and commit it to memory----

Women look at men who give away their emotions TOO EASILY the same way men look at women who give away their Pvssy TOO EASILY:

They look at them as SLVTS.



Peace...one day.

 

[RedPill]

One thing I should've added is a Scarcity Mentality. There are few women in the world who meet the requirements of an AFC’s idealization. Therefore when one does (or even comes close), he tenaciously clings to her as being the ONE for him and thus enters into other AFC behaviors.

You beat me to it! I think Scarcity Mentality is the root cause of oneitis.

 

[Sinistar]

This is a good thread in that the topic was "Qualities of an AFC". Yet many of the responses tend towards ONE-itis. So I have to bring this up. Isn't it quite possible (and perhaps quite common) for an AFC to happily go about his business w/o getting ONE-itis.

Consider an example. Typical AFC, no hobbies, not many buddies little or zero dating experience. One day at some event or work or wherever, sees a HB and tries to initiate by telling her she is beautiful. Maybe she lets him down easy, maybe she crucifies him. Either way, wrong approach we all know. So he moves on, just repeating the same mistake over and over again because its what he thinks will work (eg. I saw it in all the movies, etc).

Notice, not necessarily ONE-Itis. Just inexperience. They're the ones who don't come to this forum. They just keep repeating the same mistake over and over. Many will expereince ONE-itis, many may not.

Now I do agree with all the qualities listed. Yet it seems the long (or short) term failure to thwart one (or more) of these qualities are what lull a AFC towards ONE-itis.

So I will ask this question. If a guy did not "suffer" the other qualities that have been listed what would be the odds of him having a bout of ONE-itis? Especially if he simply did not allow himself to supplicate or subscribe to scarcity.

Or I guess my real question. Is ONE-Itis really a quality of a AFC or simply a derivate that tends to surface when one or more of the mentioned qualites rear up.

Perhaps another quality or subcategory:

Fear Of Rejection / Lack of Confidence

An experienced Alpha just goes for it. Confidence. A rejection is just a chink in his armor, part of the battle, might even make him smile. However this same rejection seems to be feared quite universally by the AFC. Sad and ironic. Sad that the AFC will watch opportunity after opportunity slip by due to fear of rejection. Yet ironic that other quality "scarcity" will then actually motivate him enough to act, only to blunder due to inexperience and other misbeliefs, etc. The rejection stings, unhealthy behavior learned....don't approach, it might hurt.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

SINISTAR hit upon my reasoning for outlining this in my book here. A while back I had a debate with DESDINOVA about what exactly constitutes ONEitis. His take is that ONEitis is acceptable in an LTR or that an LTR committment necessitates ONEitis, while I see ONEitis as more of a collected set of unhealthy mental schemas that are equally, if not more, damaging in an LTR. This then prompted me to list all of these schemas that made up ONEitis and in doing so I found I was describing the typical AFC mind sets and thus the list i offered in the start of this thread.

However the question remains; is ONEitis mutually exclusive from being an AFC?

 

[Nighthawk]

More words of wisdom from the Great Rollo (and everyone else). Hard to find anything to add, but another AFC trait is bitterness towards women. Repeated failure makes the chump project his self-loathing onto women and blame them for not following his often hypocritical value system.

For example, I remember on Average Joe Hawaii all the AFCs immediately and predictably fell in love with the hottie prize and when they got rejected (in favour of the imported hunks) out came the hostility and double-standards - 'She's superficial' - hello, you entered a contest to go out with a beauty queen regardless of her personality.

Of course women test for bitterness quickly so it becomes a self-perpetuating cycle. Likewise the natural DJ will have positive results with women and this will enhance his game.

I think a lot of men are comfortable being AFCs. Like some women prefer to fantasize about being saved by Prince Charming, these dreamers don't mind wasting their lives idealizing unavailable/mythical women. It has to give them some benefit, or why would they persist?

 

[WestCoaster]

This was written earlier:

**********************

Typical AFC, no hobbies, not many buddies little or zero dating experience.

*********************************

Yes, that's an AFC, but oneitis hits everyone. I've had it, you've had it, the biggest pick-up artists have had it. It's a sick disease put sub-consciously into our heads by years of stupid American culture.

It's possible to not be an AFC and still get oneitis. The belief that only AFCs get oneitis is a myth. One BECOMES an AFC for either a short or long period of time when they get oneitis.

I've seen the biggest womanizers in the world become married AFCs ... I'd say about 90 percent of them become AFCs whether they admit it or not, their womanizing is part of searching for the mythical "soul mate" and despite their womanizing, they never worked on their inner game away from women. Their lives were so absorbed by women that when they get married, they have little else.

Very possible to not be an AFC and still get oneitis ... sadly.

 

[WestCoaster]

Boy, ain't that the truth on speed dating. I saw a commerical on TV for it the other day and all the guys were terrible AFCs. "I don't have time to go date and I don't like the bar scene" whine, whine, whine. You have time, turn off Law & Order, get a gym membership and grow a pair.

There is absolutely no way you would know if you wanted to date someone after five minutes. Maybe get a cup of coffee, but not a true date.

Rollo is right: This is all set up for the women because they're not getting asked out. It's AFCness at its worst.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

WEST, you're up early this morning.

Is ONEitis a precursor for being an AFC or does ONEitis prompt AFCness? I also know plenty of otherwise in control men who are utter AFCs. I know millionaires who thought nothing of firing off a third of their workforce at Christmas time and bodybuilders who fight in the UFC who are the most pvssywhipped individuals you could imagine with their respective women.

 

[Sinistar]

A brief aside first to help illustrate a point regarding AFC and ONE-Itis. I tried something like this once to cure a case of ONE-itis. It helped me to see (visually & logically) that things were wrong (and how AFC I was too!)

Find 3 equal size jars. Fill one entirely full of pennies. The other two start out empty. The first (full) jar represents your reserves (the Bank). The second jar represents your returns on your emotional/mental investments (Returns) and the third jar represents your actual emotional/mental (Investments). The rules are fairly simple. When you make an investment it has to come from somewhere so the 1st rule is that you have to take from the Investments jar first. If that jar is empty then the pennies have to come from the Bank. The next rule is that returns on your investsments must be taken from Investments jar (if there is anything there). And to give it some meaning lets say there are 10 pennies worth of thought/investment per hour. Now consider a few examples:

1.) DJ/Alpha/Healthy/Confident Guy:

The primary focus of his investing is into himself, his career, family, friends, hobbies and interests. He is filling his investment jar primarily with investments that will most surely come back to him. Things such as paychecks, raises, promotions, purchasing things, hobbies, time with family, friends, vacations, good health, etc all comb back out of the Investments Jar and to replenish the Returns. Women are also a 'part' of his life. Here and there he will confidently & skillfully approach women, make an initial investment (say a few pennies/thoughts here and there). Sometims he will be rejected, no big deal because he never allowed the investment/thoughts get out of hand. And if/when the women responds and reciprocates he takes pennies from the Investment Jar and replenishes his Returns jar. That feels good! In due time there will be a healthy equilibrium where women compliment his life. And he won't often find himself going to his Bank. He has learned that a healthy life is a state of equilibrium, not a quest to fully invest himself only into a woman.

2.) AFC/Beta/LSE Guy:

Typically with little or no hobbies or friends, the primary focus of his investments will be his work and family. Not necessarily a bad thing. He's not harming anybody (except himself) and things are in a state of equilibrium for him. But something is missing and he knows it (ie pvssy). However he is so used to only making certain investments that his approach to women will be overly conservative. Here a few (and usually many) of Rollo's AFC "qualities" come into play. A typical AFC might try using friendship as a means to intimacy. Perfect approach in his mind. On the outside it seems like a very safe investment, at a minimum he will receive friendship back and there will be a new form of equilibrium. But things don't go as planned. He is a guy and mother nature is pushing him to bed his friendly HB. Yet HB is not reciprocating in the way he 'expects'. Actually she's svcking and fvcking other dudes and telling her new 'girlfriend' all about it. So he starts investing more mental/emotional energy. I would argue that he has crossed from the rather benign ZERO-itis to ONE-Itis about right here. If he had the three jars in front of him he would see his Investments dwindling and go empty. He would then start stealing from his reserves (Bank). And most importantly, the rate of investment (lets say 8+ pennies per hour) is telling us he is dwelling bordering on obessession He knows its way wrong. But his logical mind can't get a foot in to door to stop things. So he starts seeking help. That call for help comes in the form of excessive rants of rationalizations, justifications, excuses, fixation, wondering, planning, etc. Anything to keep himself from seeing that the Investments jar is filling, the Returns jar is empty and the reserves are dwindling.

Seeing that 3rd jar fill with nothing coming back, especially after a week or month - ouch! After several months of even years - sad.

Coming back to the thread topic now.

I think a DJ (Case # 1) can get ONE-itis too (just as West stated and has shared). However his experience, confidence and solid beliefs will help him identify when the imbalance is excessive. And he will fall back on his skills, experience and beliefs and take actions. One other thought here. A DJ might focus on a woman, big deal if it is temporary and he doesn't supplicate, start obsessing or stop investing in himself (ie work, friends, family, etc). The key here is that he knows what the ONE-Itis is and how to cure it (ie taking a break, spinning more plates, etc). I believe a true DJ experiencing ONE-itis still refuses beliefs in scarcity, friends for intimacy, rescuing, saving, etc.

Case # 2 is where most of us come from. We feared rejection, specifically what our buddies and families might think if we fail (stupid). We feared being seeing with anything less than a HB9 thus leading us to the scarcity mindset (unhealthy self-esteem and image perception issues). We lacked confidence due to failed attempts (this lead us to stop trying). Our belief system is shot. No actually, it is simply programmed wrong from the start. And beliefs drive expectations (often unhealthy). And AFC has ridiculous expectations such as Case # 2 where he expects intimacy via the friendship investment because of some ridiculous programming earlier in life. Put all this together and I think it is just far, far more likely that the AFC will fall into ONE-itis over and over again. To many of his key AFC "qualities" are fully in place giving him the (albiet) false basis for his later rationalization.

My apologies if this was too long or drifted off topic. However, again and again it would appear that "being afraid", "fear" and "no confidence" (or some general group combining them all) are a key ingredient to remaining AFC and prop the door wide open for ONE-itis to rear up.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

There are people who think that the game should be changed to accomodate them and there are people who persistently practice to better succeed at playing it.

 

[WestCoaster]

I always have different scenarios that keep me thinking about this oneitis/soul mate B.S.

The last two days I've helped train some student advisors at my university. Only one male in the group, lots of women, as in lots of cute women. I was thinking, "If I was an undergrad, I'd hit on a lot of these gals."

But when I was their age, I had -- as Rollo T. puts it -- the shotgun approach, not the AK-47 approach. I fired one shot, if I didn't hit anything, I missed my target, slowly re-loaded, instead of spraying bullets at a variety of women.

All these women got me thinking: The only way we meet a gf, fiance, or wife is if we're in the right place at the right time. Some of these women will meet and marry guys from the university because they're here in location and proximity. There is no fate, no soul mate b.s., no holiness deemed from above. It's proximity and location ... and all you dudes on this site would not have been born had your dad met mom in a certain town. If he had been re-located by job or military, he would've met a different woman and had different kids.

Just the way it is, no fate involved.

I noticed a lot of cute women today -- one yesterday caught me looking at her beautiful breasts and smiled. Luckily no sex harrassment as she walked out with me after the session. Today another gal was flirting with me, touching me frequently, smiling and laughing, definitely peaking my interest. After the session is over, I'll inquire as I won't supervise her again.

Just a helluva lot of women out there folks, this was just from a very small session. No reason to get oneitis, there are plenty to bounce back from. You can literally fall in love with millions of women on this planet ... yes, millions. It's all about timing and location.

Forget that soulmate/oneitis sh-t ... you had fun with one woman and broke up. If you didn't have fun with her, you'd have fun with another.

... Wish I knew this 20 years ago.

 

[Sir_Chalupalot]

What is your opinion on alcohol, marijuana and partying in general for the AFC and DJ with meeting women? The bible had mixed opinions on drinking while out sarging,

My opinion is some is OK but too much as very bad. I've been in a slump and end up in AFC-land just drinking at the bar with my friends and not expanding myself to meet women. Lately, I've been approaching women (at bars) after EC, or just if they look approacable, introduce myself, chatting it up, but not getting any kind of closes. Its an improvement, but not anywhere near DJ-ness that I'm trying to work on. Alcohol seems to relax me and reduce inhibitions to go up and talk to women, but also I get to the point where I don't really remember what we talked about. So I personally think I need to reduce it, but don't know if I can or want to eliminate it. What say everyone else?