Protests in France

[user43770]

Correct. “Entitlement” is just a right wing pejorative for SS and Medicare.



This is actually a false statement that I let slide. “Great many” is not a quantifiable amount, and this the argument is just wrong. Everyone who’s ever been an employer or employee has contributed to this programs.



I let his little lie slide. He’s far less trollish than you.

Did I not point out the other trillion that goes to medicare, welfare, section 8, and government pensions?

 

[user43770]

This a great truth you have here. It is better for people to be equally poor than for them to be unequally better off.

They somehow think power only comes from someone having more money I imagine everyone had equal power back before money existed then, LOL!!!!!

Jealousy is my bet.

 

[Bible_Belt]

The first step is to remove insurance companies and Government from between the patient and the Doctor.

That is the system we have right now for animals. Basic care is cheaper, but for serious problems, euthanasia is the easy answer. Even if we killed the poor people with cancer and let the rich buy their own care, the volume of patients would be so low that science would never make any advancements toward curing the disease.

 

[user43770]

It doesn’t matter that the dollar lost value. Lol. You do realize that right?

It does at the grocery store or the pump, right?

 

[Bible_Belt]

Did I not point out the other trillion that goes to medicare, welfare, section 8, and government pensions?

Show me a section 8 landlord who is not a rich white man. Such a thing may exist, but I have never seen it. That's where section 8 money goes. It's the same with food stamp dollars that immediately get spent at the walmart supercenter, and go straight into the pockets of the Walton family heirs. What you see as welfare for the poor immediately makes rich people richer, which is the prime directive of our economic existence.

 

[Trump]

How many times did you dodge how poor people should pay for health care? You have no solution. Let’s recap: danger doesn’t believe health care is a right, yet wont offer a solution for sick poor people.

Bro just give him factual evidence that wealth gap causes corruption and be done with it.

I think wealth gap and power can lead to corruption, but it doesn’t ‘cause’ it. Correlation does not mean causation. It’s like eating McDoanlds every day for a year will cause your arteries to get clogged, but a wealth gap does not cause someone to be corrupt.

 

[user43770]

That is the system we have right now for animals. Basic care is cheaper, but for serious problems, euthanasia is the easy answer. Even if we killed the poor people with cancer and let the rich buy their own care, the volume of patients would be so low that science would never make any advancements toward curing the disease.

As if cancer patients were dying in the waiting room...get out of here.

And hospitals only make you pay 12$ a month on it, that is if you are "priveledged".

 

[user43770]

Show me a section 8 landlord who is not a rich white man. Such a thing may exist, but I have never seen it. That's where section 8 money goes. It's the same with food stamp dollars that immediately get spent at the walmart supercenter, and go straight into the pockets of the Walton family heirs. What you see as welfare for the poor immediately makes rich people richer, which is the prime directive of our economic existence.

Ok, bible. My tax dollars going to your fvcking ass, making the rich richer.

 

[Bible_Belt]

I was a section 8 landlord for a few years and I was poor as hell.

And so what if shareholders make a few pennies on $hit purchased by people on welfare?

So you used government welfare to make yourself rich, way to go. You should be the last person to be against such welfare, as well as be an example of why we really have these systems, which is insider profiteering.

And I have sold food to people on food stamps. The fees involved are tiny. I get to keep almost all the pennies. It is almost a full transfer of taxpayer money straight to me.

 

[Bible_Belt]

The money goes to shareholders and workers anyways, regardless of the origin of the dollar.

Bibles arguments are irrelevant since it seems to presume only welfare dollars do this.

Poor people spend their money. Rich people save it. Dollars to the poor get recycled into the ecomony immediately.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Oh geez, not the Trickle Down Kool Aid again. Giving rich people more money so they can stick it in the bank with their other money is the opposite of economic growth.

$1 in tax break to the Waltons and $1 in food stamps that get spent at Walmart both end up in just about the same place, the pockets of rich people.

 

[Magotrox]

I see people here are falling for one of the oldest cons of all time. Dating all the way back to Hammurabi

All rulers need some kind of consent from the ruled. So they make a bunch of laws that are supposed to "protect" the common folk.

That allegedly make it difficult to exploit people.

These laws are always a con, and are gamed by those who can.

This creates the wealth gap.

The more the common man complains about the wealth gap, the more the leaders create more "rules" to allegedly help the common man.

These new rules are also gamed by those who can, which EXACERBATES the wealth gap.

Not unlike regulatory capture, predicted by Noble winner Milton Friedman. Governments create laws, and those that can, GAME those laws to increase their wealth.

Poor people complain, they want MORE LAWS to reduce the "wealth gap" and politicians (especially those on the left whose marketing strategy is always geared toward lower income folk) are more than happy to comply.

This SAME PROCESS has happened in every society since the dawn of time.

The poor people who are getting screwed are usually the LOUDEST ONES clamoring for new laws that the wealthy will just game more.

This is EXACTLY why elites want massive immigration. Immigrants are the EASIEST voters to con. They are the most gullible for the promises of politicians who create laws that their rich friend can game to get even MORE WEALTH.

Same as it ever was.

True. Most guys here are running in circles because they are at upper levels (just the beginning) of the habbit hole. They don't realized yer the game: the exploitation (or profiteering) of men by men. Man is the wolf of man. This forum is very dangerous. I'll not be surprised when it suddenly shut down someday.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Poor people saving their money is as big of a fantasy as trickle down. It just doesn't happen. And there is hardly any middle class left. Many people who show up that way are working two minimum wage jobs, just overworked poor and not any higher in class, especially lifestyle. We are headed toward a wealth distribution unseen in modern times. None of that money given to billionaires tricked down at all. They've still got it.

 

[samspade]

How profitable would you say insurance companies are?

How much money does it cost to run an insurance company?

What percentage of dollars paid to health insurance actually goes toward care for the patients?

If all of those costs were removed, how much cheaper would health care be?

I would guess very, since they run commercials with Aaron Rodgers and Peyton Manning every other minute. Their office complexes where I grew up are huge, bloated enterprises.

But I have no idea what percent goes toward care, or what should go toward care. On the one hand, you don't want unnecessary expenses, but on the other, you don't want patients being denied what they're paying for.

I'll tell you what would make private insurance cheaper: Choice. Right now, it's run like cartels, with a few big companies carving up the market. My last employer gave me a choice of 2-3 plans. They were good plans, but how is that competition? I could, of course, pay out of pocket for an alternative, but that would have drained my money.

Then they have the gall to make you pay $30-$40 per visit, plus deductibles for this and that. I thought insurance meant I pay the company, they pay for the care. That's how it is in other countries. How the American public got hoodwinked into co-pays, I'll never understand.

I also believe a baseline free public health system (not Obamacare) for the poor and unemployed would mitigate some of these private costs. I know that's anathema to a lot of people around here, but that's what bogs down the whole industry is bills that will never be paid. I would honestly rather chip in a few dollars than have the system in the US right now.

But if you talk to a doctor about it, he'll tell you that it's expensive because of 1) malpractice suits and insurance and 2) the health care in America is supposedly so fukking amazing that it's worth it. I'm not sure I buy that at all.

 

[user43770]

Poor people saving their money is as big of a fantasy as trickle down. It just doesn't happen. And there is hardly any middle class left. Many people who show up that way are working two minimum wage jobs, just overworked poor and not any higher in class, especially lifestyle. We are headed toward a wealth distribution unseen in modern times. None of that money given to billionaires tricked down at all. They've still got it.

So we finally get to the thick of it. Some people are dumb, and spend all of their money on stupid sh1t, rather than saving, and I'm supposed to feel bad for them why?

I worked on an ambulance for 2 years in a poor community. I took people to the hospital, mainly pregnant women who weren't even close to their due date. That was the majority of my calls.

My tax dollars at work. 40 years of tax paying my ass. And your ilk wants endless immigration?

 

[user43770]

My best friends wife works in health care and she said the exact same thing.

The "poor girl" who is pregnant would go to the emergency room complaining of stomach pains. The hospital is DISALLOWED BY LAW FROM TURNING THEM AWAY (Liberal myth one just got nuked).

Hospital staff: <performs work to ensure everything is ok, and gets a picture of the baby as a bonus> Everything seems fine. We can't find anything wrong.

Patient: Can you tell me da baby daddy?


She said she would get several of these a week and they could never pay. Glad to see confirmation from a totally different source.

On the ambulance we called it the gold card.

 

[EyeBRollin]

I never dodged, I gave the answer you didn't like. The first step is to remove insurance companies and Government from between the patient and the Doctor.

Let's recap your position. It always comes down to you having the right to seize other people's money (slavery).

Your answer isn’t a solution; it’s a slogan. Since you want to remove insurance and government, how do you propose a poor person afford surgery?

 

[EyeBRollin]

Of this, dude. .

Of what? Be specific.

The liberal's ultimate goal? To make everyone poor.

Bull**** statement #1. This is a strawman fallacy. Which liberal advocated making everyone poor?

Did I not point out the other trillion that goes to medicare, welfare, section 8, and government pensions?

No, you made a false statement when you said "great many" people are gaming the welfare system. This is an anecdotal fallacy.

Jealousy is my bet.

This is Bull**** statement #2. Here you imply that anyone who thinks America shouldn't socialize the rich feels that way out of jealousy.

 

[EyeBRollin]

1. And here comes the deflection attempt. I don't care whether you think it matters. It is a fact that printing a currency causes inflation. THIS is why you cannot account for the 98% of loss in the value of the dollqr over 100 years while gold did not lose this value (you can't print gold).

Printing currency does not cause inflation. You refused yet again to answer the question - what was the cause of inflation in the 1970s?

It's ironic you bring up gold when there's an obvious reason we abondoned it.

2. We always need to clarify with you, since you deflect and run away whenever you are shown to be wrong. Devaluation and printing both cause inflation. But you did not answer my either/or question. Are you talking about true inflation or about temporary market dislocations which can cause inflationary symptoms?

Devaluation is the effect, not the cause. What happened in the 1970s?

This a great truth you have here. It is better for people to be equally poor than for them to be unequally better off.

They somehow think power only comes from someone having more money I imagine everyone had equal power back before money existed then, LOL!!!!!

Ad hominems and the usual strawman.

It does at the grocery store or the pump, right?

Yes, and that's a good thing. Perhaps you can explain what caused onerous inflation in the 1970s?

 

[EyeBRollin]

Are the two mutually exclusive?

They are here.

Insurance is ok....it just cannot be mandated and it has to be able to cross state lines so that competition can take place.

Regurgitating the official Republican party position. They've held Congress and the majority of states for the last 2 years... why haven't they implemented this?

Lastly, doctors are more than willing to work with patients for payments, and they would be far far lower by removing all the Government mandated $hit.

This is correct. It still doesn't explain how a poor person will afford any kind of expensive medical procedure.

Lastly, did you know only a small number of Doctor's are allowed into school each year? We purposefully restrict supply, so if course it becomes much more expensive to pay for the scarcity of them.

More great Government created monopoly ideas <eyeroll>

Dr. supply isn't the reason the United States pays more than twice as much for health care as every other developed nation. I'll ask again... how do you propose poor people afford health care?