Primer on Women

[Maximus_Decimus]

I find women to be very fascinating creatures. These days, when I can see through a chick's actions and realize what she is really up to, I no longer get nervous or panic but remain calm and confident ... as if you see the Matrix exposed right in front of you and nothing confuses you anymore. I may even find her behavior amusing. For the woman is no longer a black box and I can focus on enjoying my time with her.

Hence, this primer. It is a partial collection of my experiences, observations, and thoughts regarding women. It also includes some ideas I have brought up in the past on the forum as well as other ideas from various sources in the community. If you find this information useful, you should also verify the ideas brought forth with real world experience of your own. None of these ideas will really sink in until you go out and experience this for yourself. Okay, let’s start then.

PRIMER ON WOMEN

The basic principle: As compared to men, women are very much social and emotional creatures.

Thus, with respect to women, there are two key aspects we are concerned with that influence the behavior of the majority of women’s daily lives:

1) Social Environment
2) Emotions/Feelings

Social Environment

Social Status

When a woman is in her social environment, she will constantly attempt to gain and maintain her social status. This issue has been covered in depth by Hitori's post on Social Status Explained and I encourage you to digest the information that Hitori has presented to us.

As Hitori mentioned, "Chicks act at all times to gain and maintain social status. This is more important to them than getting laid."

For instance, a chick may go out with you if it increases her social status. We can see this effect in a typical High School. Why do all the HBs (Hot Babes) hang out with the jocks?

Originally posted by Hitori
If a chick gets her hands on a very cool guy, HER coolness increases. HBs don't necessarily compete for the highest status so much as they just try to grab as much for themselves as they can, while it's on the table.

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=70707

Have you ever hit on a chick at a club only to be c*ck-blocked by one of her chick friends? Your target chick has a social rep to maintain and despite all the rapport you have built with her, if she gets pulled away by one of her friends, it becomes a difficult situation for her to stay. Realize that women are very conscious of their social status.

Originally posted by Deep Dish
Her friends pick her boyfriends. Her religion tells her to deny her very nature and for some like Orthodox Jews and Greeks, even playing role of her friends picking her mate. Dating never happens in a vacuum free from outside influences; you’re not dating her you’re dating everyone. In a certain light, men do not get women, women get society.

Source:http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=32713&highlight=book+AND+woman


Social Status and Men

Next time a chick flirts or kinos with you, just take it at face value and nothing more. Understand that it is natural for her to behave this way, and it increases the circle of men around her, and her social status (if she does it in a non-slutty way). She also receives validation with many men chasing her.

Originally posted by Deep Dish
Women derive their social value by how much male attention they get.

Source:http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=32713&highlight=book+AND+woman

Originally posted by Franco
Women take lot of advantage from this because by having the game all the time ON like us PUAs (Pick Up Artist) they can "remote control" lot of people, just like experienced PUAs do ... the circle of the man she has power on only increases without her having to even take panties off..

Source: http://fastseduction.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?action=retrieve&grp=3&mn=112245488323961

(Note: Franco uses the word “social power” but I would think “social status” is the more relevant term)

This is why chicks put so much emphasis on makeup and dressing up right – while it appears on the surface they are doing it for other women, beyond the surface, they are really competing with other women for male attention and validation:

Originally posted by Swinggcat
Why do you think women spend so much time - sometimes hours - primping and preening themselves to go out to nightclubs and bars? Because they want to be hit on.

There's a school of thought, though, that says: "Women don't dress up for men; they do it for other women."

I think there's a grain of truth here but what this means is that women dress up to compete with other women for male attention. For male validation. In other words, one of the reasons women put time into primping and preening themselves is to compete for who gets hit on the most by men.

Many a woman will never explicitly admit she enjoys men hitting on her. If she did, she'd risk other women perceiving her as being at the top of the Slut-O-Meter. Or, even worse, people thinking she's a power hungry rhymes-with-witch. Wanting to be hit on is one of women's dirty little secrets.

Source: http://www.alovelinksplus.com/advice/dating_secrets/index.htm


Many chicks don't go out with f*cking on their mind like men. When a chick flirts with us, many of us automatically think, "does she want to f*ck me?" But from her perspective, are you sure she is thinking the same thing?

Originally posted by Franco
The IOI (Indicator Of Interest) is a bait meant to control you. Women do this all the time but they are smarter than the average guy: they do IOIs but sex "just happens". They rarely go out "to have a great f*ck". This approach gives them the possibility of gaming a lot of guys at the same time.

Source: http://fastseduction.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?action=retrieve&grp=3&mn=112245488323961

Some women also talk about men that they are seeing. This is simply a mechanism they use to establish themselves as the prize and a method they use to social proof themselves. It is their way of telling you that they are desirable.

Social Conditioning

Women these days are socially conditioned and it has camouflaged their basic nature.
Thus, comes the jerk vs. nice guy debate. Inherently, most women are naturally attracted to men who know how to prize themselves. Ironically, jerks typically satisfy these attributes.

The confusion for most men is that when they watch the typical Hollywood movie or read a woman's personal ad, they mistakenly believe that a woman wants a nice guy. They have succumb to the fallacy of social conditioning.

We live in an increasingly feminist society - a society that is so feminized, it is no wonder why many men are lead astray and fall for the belief that women find nice guys attractive. Get this in your head - women are naturally submissive creatures. It is in their internal wiring to seek a dominant man. (There is a smart and social way to dominate but that is beyond the context of this thread).

Women are not attracted to weak men ... period!

Having said this, I believe a successful relationship requires the man to reciprocate respect to the woman. It is not hard to be a man that knows how to prize himself and reciprocate respect to the woman at the same time.

 

[Maximus_Decimus]

Social Proof and being desired by other Women

One of the most powerful mechanisms that influences a woman’s desire towards a man is knowing that other women want him.

Originally posted by Svengali
Nothing makes a woman see you as desirable, more then another woman finding interest in you.

Source:http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=67641.

Social proof, the term first coined by Dr. Robert Cialdini, defines a human behavior where our actions and opinions are influenced by the actions and opinions of those around us:

Originally posted by Robert Cialdini
We view a behavior as correct in a given situation to the degree that we see others performing it.

Source: “Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion”


For example, if you have never set foot in a specific restaurant but you witness a bunch of people lining up to get into that restaurant, you may assume that this restaurant could be of a certain quality. Similarly, according to social proof, if a woman sees a man who is desired by other women, she automatically assumes he must be of some type of value. In other words, she relies on other women to judge for her.

Originally posted by whoisthis19
Woman are lazy and won’t take the time to get interested in EVERY guy and get to know them. There just isn’t enough time. They'll let other woman do the work for them. If woman see a guy with woman falling all over him they tend to want to get to know him too. They know in at least someway the guy is attractive. They are at least curious. Lord knows how easy a curious woman can be.

Source: http://groups.google.ca/group/alt.seduction.fast/tree/browse_frm/
thread/530af5b5c75d53f3/c35a37ddea3ea9c2

Anti Slut Defense

Anti Slut Defense or ASD is simply the wall a woman puts up to prevent herself from looking like a slut - even if she really is a slut! Why do they do this? Because sluts are on the bottom of the social hierarchy:

Originally posted by Hitori
Women will avoid being labeled 'sluts' at all costs because they are at the BOTTOM of the social totem-pole, with the WBAFCs (Way Beyond AFC).

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=70707

Lets take this one step further. Women, in the absence of her friends and colleagues, will still put up ASD:

Originally posted by Hitori
Just as women will still display ASD (Anti-Slut Defense) when there's no-one to know they're having sex, women will still value peer-approval when there's no-one around to approve. It's like... an internalized groupmind.

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=70707

Ok, let's get onto the juicy stuff. The same thing goes when you want to f*ck close her for the first time. You don't say:

"Do you want to have sex?"
"Let's f*ck now."
"My car is just outside and my house is only a 5 minute drive from here."

Most women, aside from the pure sluts, will put up some type of ASD if you say anything remotely as lame as the above. Hence, this following explanation by MrSex4uNYC:

Originally posted by MrSex4uNYC
>maniac_high wrote:
>5)I meet a chick the first time. We drink, have supper, make out. Then we head back to her
>place on the train. At the train station, she tells me she lives with her parents so I probably cant
>come in. I tell her we will go to a hotel. She says no, she is "not that kind of girl, and doesn't go
>to hotels on the first night of meeting a guy". So I f*ck her right there in the train station behind
>some lockers instead. That was okay with her.

that's not so stupid really. it is a brilliant example of how to deal with chicks... action not words.

what happened was that you asked her to go to a hotel. you asked her to make a conscious decision to f*ck. NO NO NO she's not going to do that because that would make her a "slut". instead, you don't go anywhere, but apply the kino on her and make her FEEL like getting f*cked. THEN she wants it right there and then. hence the locker-f*ck. she was not in the right state to f*ck when you were discussing hotels. she was in the right state when you were near the lockers.

Source: http://groups.google.ca/group/alt.seduction.fast/msg/55c1b15f3fd32988?q=hotel+group:alt.seduction.fast+author:mrsex4unyc&hl=en&lr=&rnum=6

If you want to get her back to your place so you can f*ck her, then give her some sort of context/reason that is not sex related. Once you get her there, apply the right kino to make her feel horny ...

You see, many times, women act on their feelings first and then justify their actions after, also known as Backwards Justification which is discussed later.

Thus, the end result in her mind after you have sex should be "Oh, it just happened. I was really going over to his house to <insert chick excuse here> but things just happened so quickly after that."

You have just given her the excuse she needed to justify how she ended up f*cking you.

Originally posted by Hitori
It's important for her to maintain the illusion that she did not INTEND to f*ck you, in order to maintain her social value.

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=70707


Emotions/Feelings

Emotions/feelings are key, key, key to how many women behave! This is the other fundamental aspect of understanding women. While men often succumb to their emotions as well, emotions generally have a larger influence on a woman's everyday behavior as compared to a typical man.

If you ever look into Speed Seduction, the core of it is nothing more than a technique that uses NLP (Neuro Linguistic Programming) to push a woman's emotional state to the outcome you want. If you ever read Swingcat's e-book, Push-Pull is simply a method to swing a woman's emotion negatively to one direction, and finish up by swinging the emotion back to positive in the opposite direction for that so called "emotional rollercoaster" effect. Have you ever picked up a copy of Cosmo or any other chick magazine? All you see are a bunch of flashy, colorful pictures inside ... it is layed out in a way to maximize a woman's emotions. What about Soap Operas? Watch a Soap Opera and you will bounce from scene to scene in a matter of minutes, where each scene contains a different dramatic story line. Think of all the emotions a woman gets when they watch a Soap Opera as it shifts from one scene to another!

Notice I didn't include logic but rather emotions/feelings when discussing the behavior of women? I'm not saying women don't use logic at all ... they are just more prone to make decisions based on their emotions rather than logic:

Originally posted by MrSex4uNYC
chicks OVERRIDE any logic they MIGHT posess with their EMOTIONS.

(Source:http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.seduction.fast/browse_frm/thread/
9e2bb62bfa1ead40/d1d64e2c6aca45d9)

chicks actually believe they could f*ckup Mike Tyson if they are in the correct mood / mental state. I have heard girls less than 5 feet tall tell me how they had planned to attack a guy about a foot taller than them. they really thought they were going to attack the guy and get away with it. they really thought they were going to do damage to him. they really thought that if the guy hit them ONCE they wouldn't be REALLY HURT.

(Source:http://groups-beta.google.com/group/alt.seduction.fast/browse_frm/thread/8ef0719a3143e662/1b80ca7423e0fe7e?lnk=st&q=hit+logic+group:alt.seduction.fast+author:mrsex4unyc&rnum=1&hl=en#1b80ca7423e0fe7e)

And thus, even with fair entrance standards for both genders at Universities across North America, there is a trend where more men tend to major in disciplines such as engineering and computer science - disciplines that are highly dependant on logic, while women flock to other disciplines that lean more towards social skills.

 

[Maximus_Decimus]

Listen to conversations between women. Pay special attention to the words used. You will notice women use more adjectives and adverbs and a continual fluctuation of their tone of voice than when men converse ... women are simply conveying feelings from one to another!

Originally posted by Pook
The Secret to ******** is that it is a passage of feelings (where with REAL language it is a passage of thought). Women do not listen to each other, they FEEL one another. They cheer one another up. See those phone lines that are on fire due to women getting home from dates and calling each other? Female gossip is female therapy. As soon as they walk out of class, they must call someone on their cell phone immediately.

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=59124&highlight=feelings.

Exactly. Ever wonder why women talk for hours and hours on the phone? Has a chick ever dumped her life story onto you? Think of the emotions a woman experiences when they do this:

Originally posted by WORKEROUTER
One thing about my gf that can get irritating is that she loves to talk about herself (doesn't every girl)? Really, she loves to talk about past experiences or incidents in her life. For instance, I might make a short comment about something. Immediately that triggers a response in her memory of experiences/incidents that happened to her in the past. Then comes the story.

The problem is that she HAS A STORY FOR EVERYTHING. When she starts talking, I try to be a good listener, but after a while (and she takes a while giving every vivid background detail), I start to fade out, and it pretty much comes across that I DON'T CARE. I don't care about her experience as a lifeguard 3 years ago. I don't care what she did in elementary school in 3rd grade.

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?postid=658593#post658593

Yes, women like to verbalize their feelings, even when they are complaining:

Originally posted by AlphaHot1 wrote
:::::::The first rule is that chicks do not complain for reasons... they simply complain. Remember: chicks love to FEEL. Good or bad, it surprisingly makes little difference. They are designed to FEEL, above all else. They are feeling MACHINES. All the world's a soap opera and they love the melodrama of ecstasy or tragedy.

Source: http://groups.google.ca/group/alt.seduction.fast/msg/7bd334e39f547876?q=feel+complain+group:alt.seduction.fast&hl=en&lr=&rnum=5

And thus, many DJs suggest certain topics to avoid, especially on the first date such as politics, computers, etc. You want to get her emotions running! [BTW, I grudgingly used the word "date" ... I am coming to believe that I am only dating a woman if I am already f*cking her ].

That’s not to say you should talk like a chick and start conversations on nail polish and wedding dresses. Talking like a chick to a woman you like will eventually make you her platonic female friend. F*ck that! A woman already has a p*ssy ... she doesn't need another!

A woman's ability to orgasm is also linked to her emotional state. You can be doing everything physically right but if her emotional state is not right, her ability to orgasm will be reduced.

Originally posted by Franco
>schismatic wrote:
>
>When we first got together, lovemaking between us was amazing. I would give her multiple >orgasms by fingering her, then going down on her, and more through intercourse. She would >have between 5 - 12 orgasms every rendezvous. We were both very satisfied.
>
>Her frequency of orgasm has been gradually declining, and it's to the point that I'm getting >disturbed. She's slowly decreased the amount of activities she wants me to do to her. For >instance, she began to no longer want me to finger her, and within the last few weeks she won't >let me even touch her p*ssy with my hand and resists letting me go down on her. I haven't >specifically brought these issues up, but in the past she has said "I don't want or need to orgasm >that often. It's not that important to me." Clearly I don't believe her.

Almost probably you slowly forgot the role of EMOTIONALITY in women. There where men crave nice bodies, wonderful sex positions and physical activity women crave DRAMA AND EMOTIONS.

If you do not game her on her emotions no matter of great f*cker you are her interest in the sex will fade over time.

Also women are a real pain in the a*s when we come to BOREDOM and even if you are John Holmes in person or David Shade (LOL) you will always have to face the reality that what she craves is not SEXUAL ACTION but EMOTIONALITY AND DRAMA. With emotionality I mean BOTH GOOD AND BAD EMOTIONS, whatever emotions will make her horny.

…

You need to focus on HER EMOTIONS and not on her P*SSY.

Source: http://fastseduction.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?action=retrieve&grp=9&mn=1125481330241452

Unlike the average man, a woman's emotional state may change quickly. Such is the nature of women:

Originally posted by Svengali
Women are very UNstable creatures. Never assume that she will like, love, want or anything else ten minutes from now, as she does now. {Ride the moment, for in a few moments its all going to change.}

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=67641.

Have you ever called a chick before and she was very enthusiastic to hear from you and the conversation went well? And then, you call her up a few days later hoping to ask her out but all of a sudden, she's like this mean b*tch that just kicked the sh*t out of Scarecrow and the Tin Man. There was nothing that you did wrong ... it's just that her emotional state the first time she talked with you is different than her emotional state a few days later.

Here is a good example of emotional state change. MrSex4uNYC suggests doing the f*ck close on the premise while a chick is in a certain emotional state rather than changing venues which may lead to a change in her emotional state:

Originally posted by MrSex4uNYC
IMPORTANT... F*CK YOUR HOUSE! if you had taken her somewhere secluded, you could have f*cked her on the premises. she was rejecting GOING TO YOUR HOUSE... NOT you feeling her up. she was totally with it and you lost out because you tried to change the venue. I told you about that when we were discussing coffee shops -> lunch or dinner... how you can lose your vibe en route to the new location, so I don't like to change venues. you should have divided and conquered. f*ck her in the bathroom if you have to.

Source: http://groups.google.ca/group/alt.seduction.fast/browse_frm/thread/809b96a216b6f70c/1bbb5a3219e58806?lnk=st&q=change+venue+group:alt.seduction.fast+author:mrsex4unyc&rnum=2&hl=en#1bbb5a3219e58806

(Before attempting to f*ck close a chick in public – albeit, even in a secluded area- you will have to calibrate and determine how reserved the chick in question is and whether she would go through with it).

Eliciting Values

A woman will often say she wants an adventurous man, a tall man, etc. In the seduction community, this is called a means value. What she really wants though, is the ends value. If you ask her how she feels with an adventurous man, she may say she feels excitement. In this example, her end emotional state is feeling excited.

If you ask her how she feels with tall man, she may say she feels secure. In this second example, her end emotional state is feeling secure.

So, when a woman describes what she wants in a man, if she doesn't mention how she wants to feel when she is with a man, she is probably stating her means value. Here are a common set of positive end emotional states that women value:

Feeling horny
Feeling happy
Feeling excited
Feeling surprised
Feeling secure
Feeling curious

A few abnormal LSE (Low Self Esteem) types may also value the following:

Feeling sad
Feeling angry

If your chick gets a kick out of being angry and sad, you may have an LSE head case. Preferably, get an HSE chick if you want to spare yourself the emotional roller-coasters that come with LSE chicks.

Caveat about eliciting values: Since eliciting values was first introduced, there is disagreement within some in the community on whether one should elicit a woman's end value and feed it back to her. The reason is, it is contrary to the idea of prizing - that is, you are the prize. For the purpose of this thread, it's more important for you to understand what are means and ends values and that ends values relate to how she feels. Whether you should use the end values you have elicited is beyond the scope of this thread.

 

[Maximus_Decimus]

Emotions Follow Biology

Sometime ago at alt.seduction.fast, MrSex4uNYC along with Kate’s (Zipjack) help, came up with the idea: “Emotions follow biology.” From a woman’s perspective, the general idea is, a woman's emotions is often influenced through biological mechanisms:

For instance, when kino is done right, it starts to build an emotional bond between you and the woman being kinoed:

Originally posted by MrSex4uNYC
What I didn't know is that all that fun I am giving them and the hugging and the "platonic" kissing is fun and games for me, but they are actually building an emotional connection to me at the same time! it's no wonder it's so easy for me to move from friendship to f*cking friends... they have been considering it all along because when I massage them or kiss them, I am stimulating them biologically and I think they like it for the short term, but what I didn't consider until Kate mentioned it is that their emotions come into play also and I have been setting them up for the action without even knowing it.

Source: http://groups.google.ca/group/alt.seduction.fast/msg/101bfa2e358e5910?hl=en&lr=&rnum=1

Furthermore, there seems to be an immense power shift in the relationship towards the man after sexual penetration for the first time:

Originally posted by Maniac_High
for a woman (M types anyways) sex is probably the ultimate power game, to give her self up completely, and submit completely her mind, her body, to someone else.

Source: http://groups.google.ca/groups?hl=en&lr=&frame=right&th=9ea7b83b227e94a&seekm=95aemo%24h41%241%40nnrp1.deja.com#link1

And some DJs have probably experienced a situation where a FB (F*ck Buddy) eventually builds an emotional attachment to the DJ and will want more than a sexual relationship when enough emotional attachment has been built:

Originally posted by xblitz44x
After having sex, women feel that it has created this BOND to them. This makes it much easier for you to steer her towards an LTR if you'd choose. Women don't fvck everybody. Very few people are granted FULL ACCESS to her body. After you've experienced this level of intimacy (put your c0ck in her mouth, touched every part of her body, sweated all over each other, watched her swallow your cumm) she realizes that she has nothing to hide. You've already seen and experienced it all.

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=16824&highlight=fvck

The following is a perspective from a woman’s point of view on sex for the first time and the emotional bond that results:

Originally posted by mairsmlk
I've been in the situation several times where I won't have sex with a guy because I can tell I'd get emotional about it in that particular case, and I don't want to put the effort into having to fight off the automatic intensifying of attachment feelings. The emotions are unwanted and inconvenient for me in that particular instance. This can be true even if I want to have sex with him RIGHT NOW.

Source:http://fastseduction.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?action=retrieve&grp=9&mn=1114593852221789

Backwards Justification

Backwards justification is simply the process where women act on emotion/feelings first, and afterwards, they make up some logic to justify their initial actions. This is actually a partial contributor to what we call chick logic. Actually, you may even see some men do backwards justification as all human beings are influenced by their feelings/emotions; however, women are generally more controlled by their feelings/emotions than men.


Other Aspects of Women

Women Communicate Indirectly

Often, women are not direct but communicate indirectly. Don't we all wish they would tell us directly what they want? Alas, it doesn't always work that way - get used to reading subtle cues and body language to determine what a woman wants.

Originally posted by Franco
We can define sub communication as a communication style where things are said in an INDIRECT way so that the other person is only given CLUES of what the communicator means.

…

In a word a woman will not stop sub communicating with you unless you are able to read her sub communication and some women will NEVER stop sub communicating with you EVEN if you are able to read their sub communication

(Source: http://groups.msn.com/FrancoSeduction/general.msnw?action=get_message&mview=0&ID_Message=7&LastModified=4675499077109779261)


Get used to the fact that women will always SUB-COMMUNICATE THINGS and not directly communicate like men do.

(Source: http://fastseduction.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?action=retrieve&grp=9&mn=1125481330241452 )


Most of the women will sub-communicate things. My experience is that they will sub-communicate the most important things and give the responsibility for them in a totally arbitrary way to the guy.

…

It seems to me that women sub-communicate because that is their way to keep
their GOOD EMOTIONS and have men SUPPLICATE TO THEM.

(Source: http://www.fastseduction.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?action=retrieve&grp=9&mn=1108548922208169 )

Originally posted by Deep Dish
Rather than ask you out, she flirts with you and asks what you’re doing later, or presses her breasts up against you.

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=32713&perpage=20&pagenumber=1

Unfortunately, it takes experience to accurately read what a woman is sub-communicating. While it is possible to read a woman’s sub-communication via what she says (you need to assess the context in which she says it as well), for those that are uncertain, it is more prudent to stick with the basic method of reading a woman by paying attention to her actions.

Many that are new to the field incorrectly read a woman's sub-communication and spend so much time thinking about it, that they develop one-itis for her. If you are not well versed with reading a woman’s sub-communication, just follow the basics: Don't listen to what she says, listen to her actions.

 

[Maximus_Decimus]

Indicators of Interest (IOI)

The previous section discussed how women tend to communicate indirectly. A woman may verbally or physically give off subtle signs that she is interested in you – otherwise known as Indicators of Interest or IOIs.

Originally posted by Canes
The woman ideally should act like a little girl around you. Easy to call her a
brat/little girl. She'll giggle when you do. She should be melting.

Here are some pretty reliable IOI, in generally descending significance (1 is
most significant, 5 is least significant).


1. Acts like a little girl around you.

-Makes a big stink about something insignificant
-Laughs at any joke you even so much as ATTEMPT
-Will get a big gasp/smile when you say something remotely offensive
-Degrades other women / gets jealous at any attention you give another girl
(this past week, out of nowhere, a chick I know started whispering to me some
bad things about another girl I had just hugged)
-Sits near you / follows you around
-Lights up when she sees you
-Play-fights with you


2. Is nervous or "not quite herself" around you.

-Apologizes profusely for stupid sh*t like a wussy AFC would (when I started
projecting alpha body language, this one surprised me. Out of nowhere, the
would apologize for stuff I didn't even care about)
-Apologizes...at all
-Makes excuses and explanations for anything you call her on
-Talks about you to other people in the following ways:

You are an as*hole and she can't stand you.
You are an as*hole and she loves you.
You are mysterious/ she tries to find out about you
She can't believe what you said the other day
Says anything except "I hate that loser"
Talks to other GUYS about you, pretty much in any way

-Will, at the drop of a hat, do whatever you say, hardly thinking about it
-Reacts VERY quickly to you, almost before you're done with your sentence
-Faces you with her hips/legs while sitting
-Opens up her body language to you while standing/faces you (at an amusement
park when I started projecting alpha body language, James Dean style, a girl
next to me in some food line caught my eye, and a few minutes later she
COMPLETELY turned to me as if to say "open me, please")
-Presents herself, stands up straight, arches her back when you look at her in
a qualifying way (look at her up and down, crinkle the brow)
-"Deer-in-the-headlights" look when she first sees you / meets you
-Actively whines/touches you/grabs you when you act like you're going to leave
her presence as punishment


3. Buys Into You

-Follows along with whatever C/F roleplaying you have going ("You love me,"
"Yeah, I love you," "You're stalking me," "Yeah, I'm following you," etc...)
-Actively engages YOU by doing some of these things:

****y/Funnies YOU first
Lights up when she sees you
Smiles when she sees you, beaming
Touches/ scratches you when greeting (this started happening to me only
after learning this stuff)
Calls you "dangerous," "trouble," or "bad boy" when greeting you
Says hi first
Her eyes open wide when she first sees you
Gets closer to you so that you can more easily approach her

-Goes "really?" when you say something ****y/funny about yourself, like "I work
at Taco Bell."
-Beyond that, wants to believe whatever you say
-Brings up dating first, or marriage first (had that happen last week for the
first time. I barely know the girl)

4. Tries to mold you

-A hot friend of mine strangely started to try and mold me after I started
communicating with her differently-- "no, you can't be like that"--just another
form of test
-Tells you what thrills her
-Tells you to do something that seems really dumb (I know a really intelligent
woman who loves me that tried to get me to steal some food, what the hell?
Well, she told me it thrills her)
-Makes a big stink about stupid sh*t just for attention/to see if you'll call
her on it
-Gets VERY needy when you DO call her on it
-Gets very needy when you don't talk to her
-Will act any way that you interpret as strange with OTHER guys/girls only when
you're around (overcompensates by trying to impress you)
-Talks about other guys out of nowhere
-Tests you to see if you get jealous
-Gets overly offended if you say something just to get her mad, tests you by
being self-righteous, and you have to BEAT it into the ground

5. Is friendly

-IMs, greets, e-mails, calls you first
-Generally polite and not in an annoyed way
-Seeks rapport / buys into YOUR sh*t when you HAVE rapport (the other day, a
girl whined, I made a "sad" lip, she did the exact same thing back to me)
-Mirrors YOUR body language
-Gently touches you as you walk with her (another recent development in my
life)
-Touches you at weird times (this happened before most of this for me, like
she'll "accidentally" touch you to test the waters)
-Barely tests you but will still do it subtly with a comment about how much she
hates something, or her qualifying something

Generally, this is changeable in your relationships. You escalate. But when
you START with 1, it's basically money in the bank if you don't just plainly
and simply suck, I think.

Source: http://www.fastseduction.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?action=retrieve&grp=3&mn=1107337988204771

Remember, IOIs are only the initial signs and nothing more. Notice how her “being friendly” with you is the weakest form of IOI and yet, so many guys develop one-itis based on a woman being friendly with him. Do not read too much into it or ponder about it too long, and definitely don’t develop one-itis from IOIs – take the IOIs at face value only. You will know where you stand with her depending on how far you can escalate: kinoing her without resistance is a better sign, while a kiss close is a stronger sign, while sucking her tits and having her doing a blowj*b for you is an even stronger sign, and a f*ck close tops them all.


Sh*t tests

Sometimes women consciously and/or unconsciously test us. A woman tests to screen for the strongest man who is the prize. A general rule of thumb that may detect some sh*t tests is asking yourself the question, “Would one of my buds ask this of me?” If the answer is no, you may be falling for a sh*t test.

Beyond sh*t tests, understand that you are constantly being judged by a woman. The moment you are in her presence, you are being judged.

Do not let this fact deter you from relaxing and enjoying your time with her. Sometimes, feel free to dish out tests of your own and make her jump through some of your hoops (credit Mystery’s hoop theory
). If you worry about how she judges you and you worry about when she is testing you, that is the `wrong frame of mind. Your frame of mind should be that you are the prize and she needs to meet your standards. You should be the one judging her. Read Swinggcat’s e-book for a more in depth look on prizing and reframing.


Respect

Have you noticed many men are dumped when a woman loses respect for him? Let’s delve deeper into the attraction process for women:

1) If a woman is attracted to a man, she probably looks up to him in some way.
2) Most women are not attracted to men that they don't respect (conversely, if they respect a man, that does not necessarily mean they will be attracted to him)

It is in the very nature of women to seek the Man of the House … a man that she respects.

Originally posted by Originally posted by Pook
Remember, if you cannot command respect, you cannot attract love. If you cannot be respected, women will ignore you and/or abuse you.

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=16903&highlight=command+AND+respect+AND+attract

Many women take advantage of men who constantly supplicate to her. A woman will not respect a man that consistently supplicates to her very whim. If she wants something from you when she has done nothing to deserve it, make sure you make her earn it first!

 

[Maximus_Decimus]

Monkey Branching

Many women are like monkeys swinging from branch to branch in a relationship: they can’t let go of their current BF until they have a secure hold on their next BF. Thus, they resemble monkeys that don’t let go of their current branch until they have a firm hold of their next branch. Some women will even remain in a boring relationship, where she is not getting her adequate dose of emotions from her BF, until she finds a better replacement.

Originally posted by CHALENGE GUY
I don’t have the guts to tell my current boyfriend that I want to end it before I get involved with you. I’m a little monkey with tits; I won't let go of one branch till I get a grip on the next. When it gets boring with you, I’m gonna do the exact same thing. But don’t listen to your bullsh!t detector! Everything is all right. Yeah, that’s right, look at my tits

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=16739&highlight=monkey+AND+branch

Remember, how she walks into a relationship is how she walks out of the relationship.


Power shift after first time sex

As mentioned previously, there tends to be a shift of power in the relationship towards the man after sex for the first time:

Originally posted by MrSex4uNYC
I find it fascinating how a chick will see you as a regular joe ONE day... and the day after you f*cked her, it's as if you swam over to Mt. Everest and climbed the whole mountain together... with NO GEAR!

Source: http://groups.google.ca/groups?hl=en&lr=&threadm=20010203183209.28072.00000613%40ng-fx1.aol.com&rnum=1&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Dmt.%2Beverest%2Bgroup:alt.seduction.fast%2Bauthor:mrsex4unyc%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26selm%3D20010203183209.28072.00000613%2540ng-fx1.aol.com%26rnum%3D1

Most women typically become more “clingy” following sex for the first time (although in the longer run, her attraction for you may wither away if you manage to successively turn her off):

Originally posted by xblitz44x
After having sex, women feel that it has created this BOND to them. This makes it much easier for you to steer her towards an LTR if you'd choose. Women don't fvck everybody. Very few people are granted FULL ACCESS to her body. After you've experienced this level of intimacy (put your c0ck in her mouth, touched every part of her body, sweated all over each other, watched her swallow your cumm) she realizes that she has nothing to hide. You've already seen and experienced it all.

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=16824&highlight=fvck

(Some claim that certain biological influences, such as Oxytocin which is released during orgasm, may influence a woman’s attachment to a man. Although this is beyond the scope of this article, you can read more about Oxytocin at: http://www.oxytocin.org/oxytoc/love-science.html)

In addition, she may backwards justify why she had sex with you. After sleeping with you for the first time, she will likely justify her actions and why she slept with you:

Originally posted by xblitz44x
Early in the relationship, women tend to hold (or THINK they hold) the power. They decide if they want to decline or accept your offers and advances. However, once you've had sex with her, SHE has to convince YOU and herself that she did it because of your amazing relationship with one another. She shared something that probably views "special" with you, and she has to now validate her actions in your, and HER mind. You now hold the power while she tries to prove the relationship to YOU.

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=16824&perpage=20&highlight=fvck&pagenumber=1

Originally posted by SexPDX
Before she has sex with you she may be very much attracted and you want to take advantage of that before her rational mind catches up with her emotion and comes up with some culturally conditioned bullsh1t she has bouncing around her head to convince herself why she shouldn't let you hurry up and fvck her brains out. Once you already have fvcked her, her unconscious mind is conditioned to use the rational mind to attract reasons to support why she gave it up in the first place.

Source: http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?threadid=16824&perpage=20&highlight=fvck&pagenumber=1


Women and their manipulation

As you observe your own relationship with your GF, wife, or the relationships of your other friends, you may notice a trend whereby there is a tendency for the woman to manipulate (betaise) her BF/Husband. Women inherently possess this control mechanism to manipulate their man. Ironically, if she successfully manipulates her man in all areas, she will lose respect for him and ultimately, lose attraction for him: thus, women have a paradox embedded into their very behavior.

Originally posted by Franco
Why a woman would try to make weaker EXACTLY that Prince she wanted so much as companion? Well there are several reasons:
- Female competition: in the deep of their hearts women know that the most Alpha of all the male is the one who never is exclusive to one woman. … In a way, in the deeper of their psyche, they ”sense” that if a man agrees totally to be only with them he is in a way agreeing to be a little bit ”betaised”. Anyway they have the deep need to make him weaker which would keep him from spreading his genes to other women.
- When she will be pregnant and for a longer period after the birth of the child she will need protection. So if she does not have any psychological influence on him there is the risk that he will start to mess around exactly when she has the biggest need for his protection.

…

So what is the PROCESS of BETAISING? It is a process starting soon after the woman has shoot down weaker males and her relationship with an Alpha male started.
Well guys the truth is that this process lasts FOREVER because women have in their deeper instincts:
- The need to test from times to times is their own man STILL Alpha.
- At the same time the need to change him into beta, to make sure he will be the only one to them.

…

This is for most women largely UNCONSCIOUS as said, they are not really LYING, they are only acting under the influence of very strong instincts, which contain the contradiction:
”I have to make weaker exactly the man I like so much so I can be sure that he will become a PROVIDER to me and will not spread his genes elsewhere”

…

…if the man, in a way, agrees to be betaised by her she will loose any attraction for him. So the paradox is: what a woman really wants in the process of betaising is EXACTLY the contrary of what she is really doing to him.

Source: http://groups.msn.com/FrancoSeduction/general.msnw?action=get_message&mview=1&ID_Message=16

 

[Maximus_Decimus]

A Woman’s Self Esteem

In general, women will range from LSE (Low Self Esteem) to HSE (High Self Esteem). The following is an excellent interpretation by David Shade on LSE and HSE women:

Originally posted by David Shade
There is no black and white, and there are various degrees, but at the extremes, I have found the following to be true of HSE women and LSE women:

LSE women are insecure and seek validation from men.
HSE women are secure in themselves and have nothing to prove.

LSE women have a bottomless pit of emotional need that can never be filled.
HSE women are self fulfilled.

LSE women will manipulate a man to make him meet her needs.
HSE women know exactly what they want in a man, and when they find one enjoy who he is.

LSE women are quick to obtain their man's tokens of devotion, such as expensive gifts or immediately requiring a monogamous relationship.
HSE women are suspicious of expensive gifts early on, and do not decide that they want a relationship with the man until she gets to know him well.

LSE women would steal a man if it would give her affirmation.
HSE women are not at all interested in another woman's man.

LSE women trade sex for attention and for verification that they are attractive and worthy.
For HSE women, sex is about sharing and celebrating sexuality.

LSE women respond to being treated poorly in an attempt to prove their worthiness.
HSE women expect to be treated well and respond only to that.

For a LSE woman, it's not about the man, it's about her own needs.
For a HSE woman, it's about what her and her man enjoy together.

LSE women blame their problems on other people. They have the victim mentality.
HSE women assume personal responsibility for their own lot in life.

LSE women are motivated by moving away from bad.
HSE women are motivated by moving towards good.

LSE women must control others by manipulation.
HSE women see that as unhealthy.

LSE women are drama queens.
HSE women seek harmony.

LSE women have a warped sense of deservedness.
HSE women have a healthy sense of deservedness.

Source: http://www.fastseduction.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?action=retrieve&grp=3&mn=1089190325163015

Perhaps one of the most influential contributors to the development of a woman’s self-esteem comes from how she was raised by her parents:

Originally posted by David Shade
Self-esteem is formed early in life and takes years to develop. A woman's biggest influence in her developing years are her parents, and it is her father that has the most important influence. It is through him that she acquires the ability, or lack of ability, to have an emotionally healthy relationship with men.

A woman who had a close relationship with her father when she was a little girl is what I call a 'Daddy's Girl.' Her father was loving and caring. He believed in her and supported her. He taught her to be self reliant, independent, and to believe in herself. He may have even taught her how to throw a baseball or throw a punch. She thus grew up with a high self-esteem, a healthy relationship with men, and a good sense of deservedness. She is thus emotionally healthy and believes that she deserves to be treated well by men. Interestingly, she is also very skilled at influencing men and making a man feel emotionally close to her.

Her relationship with her father goes through stages. As a little girl, she loves him dearly and looks up to him. When the taboo instinct sets in at about age 14, she becomes independent from him and sees him as the biggest dork in the world. By the time she matures into the age of legal adult, she again adores him and cares about him dearly. But at any age, she always wants him to see her as innocent and pure, and she wants him to continue to be proud of her.

This is in contrast to another woman who had a condescending or absent father. Such a woman is incapable of forming a deep emotional bond with a man. She has a bottomless pit of emotional need that can never be filled. She believes that
she deserves to be treated poorly by men, though she expects being showered with attention and material gifts. She is often spotted in the company of men that view women as objects.

Her relationship with her mother is also important. I have known daddy's girls who had mothers that were total emotional basket cases and made very bad decisions for themselves. In those cases, the young women tend to make bad decisions for themselves. To a large extent, women tend to repeat the same successes or failures of their mothers. Such daddy's girls display some of the typical traits of a daddy's girl, but they make mistakes such as having no direction in life. The very best women are those who had two good parents in a good relationship.

A Daddy's Girl has a good sense of deservedness. Deservedness is what a woman believes she deserves for herself. She believes that she deserves to experience wonderful pleasure, and she believes that she deserves you. She will be your best ally. She will be routing for you.

The opposite is a bad sense of deservedness. (Note: everybody has A sense of deservedness.) An example of a bad sense of deservedness is a woman who stays with a controlling or abusive man. Therefore, one of the quickest ways to obtain much information about a woman is to note the men she associates with. If the woman does not have a good sense of deservedness, you will be forever frustrated, your energy will be constantly drained, and the relationship is doomed. She cannot appreciate a good man when she's got one. She will
sabotage the relationship and eventually leave for some scum that she believes she deserves. If you aren't a psychiatrist or a therapist, there's not much you can do about it. And even then, it's usually futile.

Source: http://www.fastseduction.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi?action=retrieve&grp=3&mn=1089190325163015

Final Words
Finally, you need to work on yourself, your confidence, your inner game, and prizing yourself. Beyond that, I find it helpful to truly understand and appreciate women for what they are. While I don’t see women as the enemy, I find the following quote from the Art of War to be inspirational in succeeding with them:

If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle - Sun Tzu

Further Reading

Free Resources

1)Social Status Explained - Hitori

2)The Book of Woman- Deep Dish

3) Process of Betaising the Alpha Male – Franco

4) Woman’s sub communication - Franco

5)Svengali’s Ten Rules

6)Secret to ********!. – Pook

7)MrSex4uNYC’s archive

8)David Shade’s comments on a woman’s self esteem



Commercial Resources

9)Real World Seduction - Swinggcat

10)Manual of Seduction - Franco

 

[Maximus_Decimus]

.

 

[romangod]

Bravo!!!....... Excellent read and very enlightening. Great job!

 

[sol2k]

Wonderful job !
Great analysis and a wealth of info !

To the Bible with this one !

sol2k

 

[manuva]

Out. Standing.

 

[FishInaJar]

Nicez post! So, if I want to bed a chick, should I structure it so she has an excuse afterwardz?

 

[Rith]

She'll want the excuse before, too, if she's gonna need it. That way in her mind she is not a slut for, gasp, intentionally having casual sex. So she was just at your house to see your *****in' rock collection or something, and somehow for some reason you ended up having sex, even though it was sort of implied from the beginning. How they can accept such flimsy excuses within their own minds is a mystery to me. She may use the same excuse afterwards to her friends or whatever, again to not look like a slut. And then she will come up with reasons for herself why it was a good move to have sex with you.

That's my understanding, at least. It's getting pretty late.

But yes, very good post indeed, I'll have to re-read it later.

 

[Maximus_Decimus]

Originally posted by Rith
She'll want the excuse before, too, if she's gonna need it. That way in her mind she is not a slut for, gasp, intentionally having casual sex. So she was just at your house to see your *****in' rock collection or something, and somehow for some reason you ended up having sex, even though it was sort of implied from the beginning. How they can accept such flimsy excuses within their own minds is a mystery to me. She may use the same excuse afterwards to her friends or whatever, again to not look like a slut. And then she will come up with reasons for herself why it was a good move to have sex with you.

That's my understanding, at least. It's getting pretty late.

But yes, very good post indeed, I'll have to re-read it later.

Yes, a good response by Rith. In one timeline, if you ask a woman to check out the new stereo system back at your place, and then you successfully manage to kino, escalate, and f*ck close her, she will call you her "prince". In another timeline, if you ask the same woman to go back to your place to f*ck, she will slap you on the face.

Maximus_Decimus

 

[josh1]

Brilliant.
Thank you.

 

[graffiti8nation]

Fabulous post Max. What do you think of Robert Cialdini? Cheers.

 

[sux2bu]

well gosh darn.. :woo:

 

[Carnegie]

This thread explains it all!! Bible this!

 

[Mind_Body_Soul]

All I can say is WOW. I'm amazed. Great job.

 

[greenpeace937]

Nice post Max!

Green Peace