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Phyzzle Phield Reports

Phyzzle

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After being a back seat driver here forever, I figured I would spice things up with a report on some recent happenings since my move. I moved back to the U.S. two months ago, and, yet again, I find myself in a completely new region, without a single acquaintance outside of the male social recluses at my job.

One Friday, I went to a wine tasting, alone of course. Rather than picking the table with a hot chick, I sat with a few guys and introduced myself. The first priority is absolutely to meet people, any people. In this case, I lucked out. One of them was an owner of a night club (and also quite knowledgeable about wine). It’s always good to know a guy like that in a new town.

At the end of the tasting, he started buying rounds. He was quite generous, really.

“So what do you want next?”
“Well, I, uh, I really shouldn’t be having so many –“
“Come on! Here you go!”

I was finishing a beer (yes, he was buying us beer after wine) and getting ready to call it a night when a red head walked in, briefly made eye contact, adjusted her billowy orange scarf, sat down at the next table, and started looking around, and looking at her texts. I though, hmmm, attractive girl sitting in a pub without being engrossed in a conversation with five other people? How often does that happen? Never?

So I walked up and said, “that’s quite a scarf. It looks like something girls wear in France.” I suppose this was a bit of DHV, implying that I had been to France. (I have, and they do wear some pretty loudly colored scarves.) She laughed and spread it out on the table saying “I’m always wearing orange and black. I guess I like Halloween colors.”

“What are you? A Goth?”

“No, not really. I’m a band geek.”

“Yes, I had a very good band geek friend . . .” At this point, I told some funny story about hanging with this guy, we end up totaling his car, almost going to jail, etc..

I tried my best to stretch out the time before we get to the “where are you from where do you work what do you study blah blah blah” stuff. You have to get to that stuff eventually, sure. But I string it out a bit.

Eventually, we start to introduce ourselves. She was waiting for some very late friends. She works at an art gallery, and while I’m no art expert, I pride myself on being a bit knowledgeable about everything. At this point, I switch gears and talk briefly about my opinions of art, and I deepen the mood a little. Instead of keeping up a joking tone, I talk slowly, deeply, and seriously with plenty of eye contact. I talk about how good art is a reflection of the way our minds store visual memories . . . She eventually talks about how staring at a de Koonig painting in person can be like a spiritual experience. To really get rapport with someone, you can’t just keep up a joking, fun loving tone the whole time.

Finally, we were talking about tattoos, and I asked if she had one of those curly celtic ones on her lower back. “No I don’t have any tramp stamp!” I visibly sighed with relief. In hindsight, she was probably impressed by the simple act of qualifying her.

So, she volunteered her number, and a few days later, we arranged to meet for coffee. Nothing exciting, just some nice convo. She’s smart, sarcastic, and laid back. I could really get to like this one. The key part was venue changing. “Wanna go to this sketchy bar within walking distance?” The walk was a journey. I had forgotten that in America, a few feet of sidewalk is often replaced with half a mile of expansive parking lots and medians, which she walked through wearing heels.

It never fails – if she’s into you, she’ll walk closer and closer until you’re practically forced to put your arm around her.

After a drink, we parted ways, and she stood very close to me, as they sometimes do when expecting a kiss. I did my characteristic move of looking deeply into her eyes for a moment, then pointing to my cheek. (Sorry, it’s patented, the rest of you can’t do it.) This resulted in her getting pretty persistent, and some making out.

So she called me and asked me out a few days later. We meet a few more times, and I’m really starting to get used to her. She’s fun without being flaky, affectionate without being clingy, and she just acts, looks, and dresses like a woman should, without being shallow.

She ended up in my bed. With me in the living room. She yells, “sooo . . . feel free to join me. I mean, if you want.” And after that NCAA tournament game was over, I did.

Things were hot and heavy for a bit, then she started giving me some resistance. I wasn’t worried; just back off, try again later. But then she made a confession that has me wondering what to do. She’s a virgin. A hot, 25 year old virgin. And I don’t think she’s planning to change it until she’s engaged.

I was thinking I had lucked out, that I had landed a girl who was about as fine as a guy in my position could land. Now I’m a bit bothered by this. I’m trying to get other plates going, but it’s not easy to keep going out by yourself, even if you do sort of know the bartenders and owners. I’m working on it. Two other number closes, in fact, though I’m not optimistic about either. Plus, I don't think I can realistically find a new girl on this one's level any time soon. I do wish it could work with this one, but this whole dating a virgin thing is such an odd situation.
 

iqqi

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Phyzzle said:
... But then she made a confession that has me wondering what to do. She’s a virgin. A hot, 25 year old virgin. And I don’t think she’s planning to change it until she’s engaged.

Hahaha, that had to really suck. Everything else was going so perfectly, then she drops that one on you. It really sounds like you could have went all the way with her, though. The fact you didn't, is it because you don't want to do something that might be extremely meaningful to her, and not so much to you?
 

ThunderMaverick

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Mm. Also be careful with virgins and spinning plates. They have an extremely short fuse with that because they don't see sex the same way you do. I stayed a virgin until I was 23 and I'll tell you there were moments when a girl would talk about an "open relationship" and I dropped them immediately. I was very VERY picky who I even got physically close to.

My younger sister (who's 20 and a virgin) can smell a sex rat from a mile away. She's looking for someone with the same values as herself and it's a waste of time getting involved with someone who doesn't share those said values.

I made the mistake half a year ago trying to get involved with a virgin and totally forgot that they play by different rules.

Did she say WHY she wanted to keep her virginity?

25? I don't think she'll be changing her lifestyle for you anytime soon.
 

Phyzzle

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iqqi said:
It really sounds like you could have went all the way with her, though. The fact you didn't, is it because you don't want to do something that might be extremely meaningful to her, and not so much to you?
I wouldn't mind taking her virginity and raising her expectations, because this girl seems to be actually worth a long relationship.

I wonder if I could have gone all the way, but probably not. I gave up right away, because she said she her choice was a result of her Catholicism. Birth control is a sin.

In fact, I had said, "well, I don't have any condoms here, so I should go get some", which resulted in a long pause, followed by the announcement.

I have taken a girl's virginity before, but this is different. I'm not sure I can just wear down her anxieties with time nonverbally. Could I really strap on a condom without her immediately jumping up and asking WTF I'm thinking?

On the other hand, I could reason with her. She goes to mass once a year for chrissakes. By the letter of a hardline Catholic code, is she even allowed to date me? But REASONING with a woman to get sex? Yeah, I don't know about that either.
 

iqqi

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Phyzzle said:
I wouldn't mind taking her virginity and raising her expectations, because this girl seems to be actually worth a long relationship.

I wonder if I could have gone all the way, but probably not. I gave up right away, because she said she her choice was a result of her Catholicism. Birth control is a sin.

In fact, I had said, "well, I don't have any condoms here, so I should go get some", which resulted in a long pause, followed by the announcement.

I have taken a girl's virginity before, but this is different. I'm not sure I can just wear down her anxieties with time nonverbally. Could I really strap on a condom without her immediately asking WTF I'm thinking?

On the other hand, I could reason with her. She goes to mass once a year for chrissakes. By the letter of a hardline Catholic code, is she even allowed to date me? But REASONING with a woman to get sex? Yeah, I don't know about that either.
Well my advice would be to put more energy into getting to know her and not getting her in the sack, to see where her head really is at. Because you are right, if she is that hardcore religious, she shouldn't be making out with you like that. Or in your bed. She is old enough to know, or find out, that you can't just mess around with grown men like that. It is pretty immature of her.

You might find out that she is questioning her no sex thing, and at the point where she is ready to lose the V- card, as long as it isn't casual.

So I wouldn't reason to get sex, but I'd reason to get in her head, and see what she is thinking. Where her head is at, so to speak.
 

Phyzzle

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iqqi said:
Well my advice would be to put more energy into getting to know her and not getting her in the sack, to see where her head really is at. Because you are right, if she is that hardcore religious, she shouldn't be making out with you like that.
I guess I probably shouldn't ask, "under what circumstances would you be willing to have sex."

But you have a point; I think it's time to stop dodging the topic of religion. I've long been convinced that talking religion or political stuff doesn't raise a woman's interest, but in this one case, my hand has been forced. I have to ask just how catholic she is. Is she homophobic? I'm pretty dam sure she can't marry me. I'm not converting. So what is she doing?
 

iqqi

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Phyzzle said:
I guess I probably shouldn't ask, "under what circumstances would you be willing to have sex."

But you have a point; I think it's time to stop dodging the topic of religion. I've long been convinced that talking religion or political stuff doesn't raise a woman's interest, but in this one case, my hand has been forced. I have to ask just how catholic she is. Is she homophobic? I'm pretty dam sure she can't marry me. I'm not converting. So what is she doing?
Exactly.

And if she really is that interesting and intelligent, you may get a great conversation out of it, if nothing else.

Seeing as religion is a huge part of who she is, it is an unavoidable topic if you are going to get to know her. Especially as more than a friend. I have strict muslim friends, and although our conversations never get too deep in it, it is brought up enough because you can't understand a person without understanding their reasons and beliefs. I've picked up a lot from those conversations.
 

lookyoung

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If you like this girl than don't let her virginity impact any decisions you make. It is VERY RARE to find a 25 year old virgin that is hot, smart, and personable. One question are you positive she is a virgin? Maybe its a sh1t test. And if I were you I would hit it first than think about the next level.
 

ketostix

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lookyoung said:
If you like this girl than don't let her virginity impact any decisions you make. It is VERY RARE to find a 25 year old virgin that is hot, smart, and personable. One question are you positive she is a virgin? Maybe its a sh1t test. And if I were you I would hit it first than think about the next level.
I agree with lookyoung. Although I would probably keep working with this one while playing the field some. This was quite a FR and you seemed to played your game pretty well. Hmm, a virgin 25 years old AND hot. I think this is the first one I've ever heard of. Too bad LMS wasn't here, that should be right up his alley lol.
 

Phyzzle

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ThunderMaverick said:
I want to ask Phyz how long he's willing to wait for her to come around?
Well, I'm willing to have a committed, monogamous relationship, and then sex. I know this is not the conventional wisdom, and I agree with it, but this is a special case. So, 3 months I guess.
 

Señor Fingers

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I dealt with a similar situation once - 23-year old Muslim chick gave me the same speech verbatim. I popped that cherry within 1 week.

All you need to do is be super cool about this and tease the sh!t out of her. This means that YOU must be the one who pulls away and says things like "whoa.. hold on..we are going too fast" right when she is at her wettest.

Advance forward 3 paces, then pull back 2. Let her desire build until she cannot control it. Keep this rhythm up and she will not be able to take it anymore. She will BEG for sex!

Also, I dunno how many virgins you've had, but be prepared for some disappointment. They are nice in fantasy land, but in reality there is usually pain and blood involved. Remember to give her lots of affection afterwards.. she is going to need that emotional bond in order to deal with the guilt/

ketostix said:
Too bad LMS wasn't here, that should be right up his alley lol.
Seriously! It's times like this that I miss that crazy bastid.
 

Colossus

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Phyz, it sounds like your game has been strong. I dated a virgin recently, but it sorta fizzled out (no pun intended). I basically decided that it was not in my best interest to put forth the time and effort and end up with a serious ltr...in that case anyway.

When you take a girl's v-card, you are contractually agreeing to a serious relationship. Unless you are a complete a$$hole who wants to burn in hell.

Seriously though, id weigh it out. She sounds game enough, but you're aware of the implications.
 

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Phyz,

I also agree that your game sounds strong right now, thats why your willing to walk away from a great women. Which is the only reason I'd recommend moving forward. However there are several questions you need to answer.

I'm gonna take the high road on this one and say that if you do intend to pursue her, are you going to be in that city long enough to make it worth her while? Secondly are you willing to make a proper committment to her?

The only reason I mention these things is because its pretty slimebally to take a 25 year old women's virginity just for the sake of some pvssy. However I know your genuinely interested from your thoughts. That being said, it might be worthwhile to have a talk with her to see how deep her religious thoughts are, how she feels about you and to see if she would ever consider sex outside of marriage.

If she wouldn't tell her you know this great guy who's never been married and would be willing to make her that committment and give her my email.

Seriously though, trust your instincts, its probably not worth it. Too much headache's & hassles.
 

ThunderMaverick

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Colossus said:
When you take a girl's v-card, you are contractually agreeing to a serious relationship. Unless you are a complete a$$hole who wants to burn in hell.

Yup. It's something she's going to take 100 times more seriously than you. If you push too hard she'll sense it. If you take it and move on, she'll be broken.

Three months? Trust me, you don't want to be sleeping with any other girls during that period. Keep yourself in check. Knowing virgins she simply will not put up with it. Hmm. Do you sense that maybe besides her religious beliefs that no one has turned her on strongly enough?
 

Phyzzle

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MacAvoy said:
I'm gonna take the high road on this one.
:eek: It's quite a juxtaposition between that name and that quote.

ThunderMaverick said:
Three months? Trust me, you don't want to be sleeping with any other girls during that period. Keep yourself in check.
Interesting take. I habitually put forward the quiet implication that I might be seeing other women, but you're saying the opposite is in order.

I think I'll hold off on the religion talk for just one more meeting. Instead of dealing with her verbally, I'll deal with her orally, if you catch my drift, huh huh huhuhuhuhuhuhh. Perhaps one more meeting before I get into the heavy stuff.
 

Phyzzle

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More stuff

I think it was the day after I met HBRed, I had an amusing experience in an upscale bar.

I had gone alone (of course), but the good thing about American or European bars is that it's expected for people to just walk up and have a few and maybe chat at random; cafe culture and all that.

There was a couple there, and the man kept looking around and throwing up his hands, as if in expectation. I jumped up and said, "are you expecting some major event to happen?" He said, "no, I'm throwing up my hands in exasperation every time she says something."

I end up talking to this couple for a bit, when the guy says, "I wonder if those two blondes there are sisters? They look eerily alike." Having a few drinks in me, I say, "let's find out."

When one girl was in the bathroom, I walk up to the other, and ask if the two are sisters. "No, but we have the same taste in clothes and hair style. Dude, if you ask her, I guarantee she'll tell you that we're sisters."

So I go back to the couple (years ago, I would have sat down and clung to any girl that was friendly.) After a while, I notice both blondes are sitting there, and I walk up and ask the second one, "are you guys sisters?"

"Yeah! Yeah we totally are!" The first girl starts laughing, and at some point I realize that I am doing a pickup right out of The Game by Niel Strauss (copyright #$%#%@%).

I say "So you two are friends? Wanna try the best friends test? Okay, what kind of shampoo do you use?"

Now for those who don't know, this is a canned routine, where you ask this question, they immediately look at eachother in confusion, and you say, "HA! You have to look at each other before answering a simple question! That was the test."

Instead, without a flinch, they both look straight at me and answer simultaneously - and it's the same brand of shampoo. After staring blankly for a moment, I say, "well, uh, I guess you pass then." They give each other high fives.

Only one of the girls live in town, and so I said, here, write your number on my hand. So she does just that, using a glossy blue permanent laundry marker. Fvck.

When I called later she seemed friendly enough, but I got the flake vibe, so I haven't tried to pin down plans. No surprise. These were severely tanned, sweat-pants wearing sorority girls. We're not really on the same page, but it was neat to try an actual canned PUA routine.
 

MacAvoy

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Phyzzle said:
:eek: It's quite a juxtaposition between that name and that quote.
I'm glad my reputation preceeds me. As morally bankrupt as I am, I do have some morals, I'm not saying I wouldn't pursue her, I probably would, and I would probably justify it by telling myself I have honourable intentions.

Regardless your smart enough to know how to handle the situation.
 

thedeparted

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I'm impressed. This seems like a real DJ FR.
 

iqqi

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thedeparted said:
I'm impressed. This seems like a real DJ FR.
Thank god, too!!!!!!!! (+ a million)

OK, to Phyzzle:

I thought this was the funniest part:
Instead, without a flinch, they both look straight at me and answer simultaneously - and it's the same brand of shampoo. After staring blankly for a moment, I say, "well, uh, I guess you pass then." They give each other high fives.​

And in regards to Red, aka your future wife, (JK!!!), I don't think you should do this:

Interesting take. I habitually put forward the quiet implication that I might be seeing other women, but you're saying the opposite is in order.

I think you should keep doing what your doing. I mean, why do you do it in the first place with a non virgin? Answer that.
 
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