"How I Made Sure No Woman Ever Friend-Zoned Me Again"

She calls you when her car breaks down. When she needs help moving. When some guy she's actually dating treats her badly.

You're the listener. The reliable one. The guy who would treat her so much better, if she'd just open her eyes.

She won't. You trained her to see you as the low-effort option — the friend who requires zero risk and zero investment. Every favor dug the hole deeper.

The "22 Rules" break the pattern. You'll stop auditioning for a role she already cast and become the man she chases instead. It starts with Rule 1.

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Most embarassing rejection you've gotten?

-E-

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Hey all,

Just thought it might be interesting to talk about rejections we've gotten that have embarrassed us (in public or otherwise). I got a real beauty last night at the gym --

I don't usually approach at the gym, but in effort to cut for the summer I started taking aerobics classes at mine (I love aerobics) and there's a girl, about a HB7, in the Wed. night class that I chat and joke around with. During class she looks at me from time to time and smiles whenever we make eye contact, so last night I decided to go for it.

After class she was talking to one of her female friends and I approached her and told her that we should chat sometime when we're not sweating it up here in class. At first she didn't hear me, so I repeated myself and halfway through me repeating myself she goes, "Awwwwwwwwwwww, that's so sweet! Are you trying to ask me out?" and she said it LOUD... like loud enough for everyone in our vicinity to hear. That response totally took me off-guard and I immediately knew that I was on a one-way train to the Friend Zone... but she seriously said it to me like she was talking to a little puppy or a 10 year old boy who had a crush on his teacher...

Being caught off guard I just kinda went "Ask you out? Well... I'd like to call you up and chat for a bit first..." (bad response but I was fumbling for words in my confused state). She basically replied "Well let me take a walk for a minute first..." And then she disappeared.

God that sucked. Girls and their damn mixed signals. And why couldn't she just say "No" instead of talking to me like a child or lost puppy in front of everyone, followed by leading me on and blowing me off?


Anyway that was damn embarrassing... what about you guys?
 

"She Made Her Decision Before You Finished Your Sentence"

Three seconds. That's how long it took. Your shoes. Your posture. The way you held your drink. Whether you looked at the floor or looked at her.

She already filed you away. Interesting. Boring. Safe. Bold. Before you even opened your mouth.

Everything you say after that is just her confirming what she already decided.

So stop rehearsing lines. Fix the first three seconds. Stand tall. Look up. Smile like you mean it. Walk like you belong wherever you're standing.

The words come later. The impression comes first.

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Warrior74

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I don't do the "haha I failed bad, how about you?" Threads. It's really not productive. I'd rather you just posted your failure and what you learned from it instead of dragging others into a negative mindstate by trying to get them to recounting past mistakes.
 

scorpio1138

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Good idea warrior.

Years ago when I was a full on AFC with a oneitus for one of my clients, I sent her flowers the day after we had lunch (not a business lunch) and thanked her for a good time.

She emailed me that I didn't have to do that and that the lunch was her way of gratitude for all the good work I've done for her as a vendor.

I felt completely destroyed and wanted to die that night. I immediately came to this forum and did a search on "flowers" and from that day learned that you never do stuff like that unless its been earned and you've already got some from her.
 

Naughty Ninja

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She basically replied "Well let me take a walk for a minute first..." And then she disappeared.



Dude next time you see her have a snickers bar with you (hopefully in front of the same group of people) tell her in the same loud tone of voice "that walk you took for a 'minute' the other day must've been your best "Forrest Gump" impression and give her the snickers bar while then saying "Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get" in a Forrest Gump voice and walk away from her a$$ laughing. That'll put her in place.

Then keep in the future keep it light with her to not show ANY signs of embarrassment or rejection feelings. She's obviously an AW by having to try to shoot you down out loud and get off on it. I'm sure she's one of the Facebook Friend Princesses with 898 virtual friends.
 

vatoloco

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Naughty Ninja said:
Dude next time you see her have a snickers bar with you (hopefully in front of the same group of people) tell her in the same loud tone of voice "that walk you took for a 'minute' the other day must've been your best "Forrest Gump" impression and give her the snickers bar while then saying "Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get" in a Forrest Gump voice and walk away from her a$$ laughing. That'll put her in place.
I'm gonna have to disagree with Ninja. If you do this, you will let her know that she got to you. And you never let them know they got to you. Plus, you'll look like a douche to any other girls who overhear it, diminishing (and even killing) any chances you may have with any of them.

Always keep it classy. Karma's a b!tch and will take care of her eventually.


Then keep in the future keep it light with her to not show ANY signs of embarrassment or rejection feelings. She's obviously an AW by having to try to shoot you down out loud and get off on it. I'm sure she's one of the Facebook Friend Princesses with 898 virtual friends.
This I agree with. Just act like as if nothing happened.
 

"The Coffee Shop Girl You Never Spoke To"

You've replayed it a hundred times. She stood three feet away, scrolling her phone. You had an opening. You composed the perfect line — after she was gone.

For all you know, she's married now. To some guy who said something. Anything.

Openers are cheap. Almost any sentence works when it's delivered within three seconds. The expensive part is the standing there, drafting and deleting, while the window quietly closes.

The "22 Rules" stripped out my hesitation. What to open with, how to keep it alive, and the one habit that costs guys more women than anything else: waiting for perfect.

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Naughty Ninja

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Yeah Vato,

You're probably right. The time between the interaction would mean he dwelled on it. But I'm a wise ass and can't help being one. Women seem to love it.

E just scrap that idea and keep it in your mind if she tries to bring up you "asking her out" again to rub in your face.

I'm with Vato. I think she actually made an a$$ out of herself by acting like a child in front of people with you asking a simple question and blowing it up to make herself seem "kewl" in front of strangers. She did you a favor, and I'm sure there are people and other girls who heard it who think she's a moron but won't say it to her.
 

vatoloco

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Naughty Ninja said:
Yeah Vato,

You're probably right. The time between the interaction would mean he dwelled on it. But I'm a wise ass and can't help being one. Women seem to love it.
Oh no, don't me wrong. I love being a wise ass myself but, you have to "get back at them" in a funny, non-offensive way. Preferably, in a way that raises your value and diminishes hers. Plus it has to be done right then and there. You can't do it after the fact.

Since she initially said "Awwwwwwwwwwww, that's so sweet! Are you trying to ask me out?", I would have come back with "Sweetheart, I'm not trying! I AM asking you out. Let's go out for drinks this Tuesday at 8:00" If she's interested, she'll accept or counter. If she's not, then she'll pick one of millions of excuses as to why she can't OR be a b!tch about it, like she was in this case. Either way, you now know not to waste your time with her. Plus the people around would have seen that you had the balls to put her on the spot right then and there.

However, if at the time she had said "Awwwwwwwwwwww, that's so sweet! Are you trying to ask me out?", I had gotten the vibe that she was a b!tch to start with, something like "Well, I WAS gonna ask you out but now I changed my mind. Thanks for your time." and walk away. Letting her (and those around you) know that she didn't qualify up to your standards and that you don't put up with sh!t.

E, that's cool. Don't beat yourself up. Live and learn, man. Live and learn.
 

Naughty Ninja

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Vato,

I was just going with a possible future wise a$$ed reply. If on the spot and she said "awww that's so sweeet" I'd probably say "Toots, I'm so sweet I keep the dentist in business, and yes I AM asking you out. So DEAL with it woman!"


She's a silly lil AW who again, made an ass out of herself with her childish "look at me" nonsense.
 

Robert28

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let us know what happens the next time you see her. i'm curious to see if she's going to talk to you or keep giving you looks like she'd been doing in that calss now that you asked her out. if she ever does try to come talk to you, i couldn't help but be like "awwwww are you trying to talk to me?"lol
 

-E-

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Thanks for the responses guys.

Yeah after thinking about it I should have said something along the lines of "Asking you out? Sure, why not" or something else in the affirmative... but her reaction caught me off guard and tripped up my game... lol.

I'll see her again in aerobics class next week (unless she doesn't show for some reason) and I myself am curious to see how she reacts to my presence. I plan on being laid back and unconcerned though, and will just be sociable like always. If she doesn't bring it up I won't either because -

A. If she doesn't bring it up she's not interested.
B. I don't really care that much.

No sense in showing that the situation impacted me at all... Life goes on. ;)
 

"How I Made Sure No Woman Ever Friend-Zoned Me Again"

She calls you when her car breaks down. When she needs help moving. When some guy she's actually dating treats her badly.

You're the listener. The reliable one. The guy who would treat her so much better, if she'd just open her eyes.

She won't. You trained her to see you as the low-effort option — the friend who requires zero risk and zero investment. Every favor dug the hole deeper.

The "22 Rules" break the pattern. You'll stop auditioning for a role she already cast and become the man she chases instead. It starts with Rule 1.

Read more...

yuppaz

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Use this experience as a reference to harden you against rejection. All these posters agree that SHE was pretty f*cked up in the way she spoke to you, so it was her issue, she's the one with the problem, not you. Remember that. I've done tons of cold approaches at this point and have had some bad rejections, but now I'm so numb to it that when they AREN'T sensitive to the situation or want to act like *****es, I'm so unaffected by their stupid crap that it kind of turns them around. Those numbing experiences (IMO) are more valuable then the easy successes early on in learning some game. Some of the girls out there are just trash plain and simple, so when you find these human dumpsters and they spew their garbage all over you, just laugh and call them an idiot, or tell them they really aren't worth your time, there are much prettier girls out there, on the outside and the inside.

Here's another experience that happened to me post my being numb to it: St. Patricks Day, go to a line of porta potties to take a piss, I'm being a clown and asking everyone which is the piss line and which is the **** line. This soso girl looks at me and screams "YOUR ****" (wtf b*tch?), but instead of blowing up, I play it cool. I put my arm over her shoulder tenderly and start walking with her towards teh back of a building, telling her you know what I do need to take a sh*t, and you lucky lady are going to be my @sswiper......HAHAHAHAHA.....she didn't do it, but all her friends were really embarrassed, she started following me around for the night hoping to I guess wipe my @ss... It's WORTH it to be numb to the f*cked up ones out there.
 

-E-

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Well guys, it's Aerobics night again and I'll see how she reacts to my presence at class. I know some of you wanted me to report back with her reaction so I'll post up again tonight after class.

Oh and that semi-psycho cougar chick from POF started texting me again after a week and a half of no-contact -- first one yesterday asking if I could fix her computer, didn't reply, 2nd one a few minutes ago asking me to meet for drinks tonight. LOL.

No contact drives 'em nuts doesn't it.
 

vatoloco

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-E- said:
Well guys, it's Aerobics night again and I'll see how she reacts to my presence at class. I know some of you wanted me to report back with her reaction so I'll post up again tonight after class.
Just remember. Keep it classy. If she looks at you, just a polite "Hello" with a smile will suffice. Act as if nothing happened.


No contact drives 'em nuts doesn't it.
Yes. NC is an AW's kryptonite. :D
 

Dust 2 Dust

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This one happened to me a few years back.

While walking down the street to a friends house I see this hb in a white bikini top and shorts. She waves at me and says hello. I go to my friends house across the street and tell him about his neighbor that was waving at me. I then go across the street to approach her and she does a back turn and starts talking on her cell phone. A few minutes later her and her friend were laughing at me while I was in my friends garage.
 

horaholic

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She basically replied "Well let me take a walk for a minute first..." And then she disappeared./QUOTE]

Am I the only one that thinks that was pretty witty by her? The next time I saw her I would say "That walking away thing was pretty funny! Got any other good ones, or is that the only thing you got?"

From there you can either be a dyck and say "Well. I aint asking your bytch ass out anyway, so it really doesnt matter." or you can go for her more.
 

"She Laughed All Night. Then She Ghosted You. Here's Why."

Dinner ran three hours. She laughed at everything. You walked her to her car thinking this one's locked in.

Then: nothing. Two texts. No reply. What happened?

You did what most men do on a great date. You filled every silence, answered every question, and left her with nothing to wonder about. No mystery. Nothing to sit with when she got home.

Rule 3 of the "22 Rules" changes the ending: tell her a little, hold back the rest, and let her imagination do the chasing. The ghosting stops too.

Read more...

-E-

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Just got back from the gym. As class was about to start she walked by me, smiled, waved, and said, "Yo what's up?" in a friendly voice. I happened to be talking to another girl at the time but I smiled, nodded, and said "Hey what's going on?" and that was that. We didn't make eye contact or talk for the rest of class, or after class. Although after class one of my not-so-suave AFC coworkers who also takes the class was egging me on to keep pursuing her... lol. But I guess that's that, especially since I don't give a crap about her to begin with.

Sorry that I don't have anything more dramatic or exciting to report though.


vatoloco said:
Yes. NC is an AW's kryptonite. :D

Dude she sent me ANOTHER text while I was in the gym! All it said was "Going to workout now..."


Oh lawd... :whistle:
 

Naughty Ninja

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-E- said:
Just got back from the gym. As class was about to start she walked by me, smiled, waved, and said, "Yo what's up?" in a friendly voice. I happened to be talking to another girl at the time but I smiled, nodded, and said "Hey what's going on?" and that was that. We didn't make eye contact or talk for the rest of class, or after class. Although after class one of my not-so-suave AFC coworkers who also takes the class was egging me on to keep pursuing her... lol. But I guess that's that, especially since I don't give a crap about her to begin with.

Sorry that I don't have anything more dramatic or exciting to report though.





Dude she sent me ANOTHER text while I was in the gym! All it said was "Going to workout now..."


Oh lawd... :whistle:
-E-,

She's an obvious AW. She's dangling a string in front of you to try and keep you "hooked" as an orbiter by saying "Hi" all polite and sending you texts. I'd ignore the texts and just act mature and polite in front of her. I'll bet she keeps it up to try to get a reaction or response out of you to boost her ego and talk to her friends about how YOU are "after" her but won't fill in all the details of HER trying to lead you on. This girl is a clown -E-. Forget her and just keep it short, sweet and courteous with her. She'll eventually get the hint you're too mature to play her game and will move on to some AFC she can get her kicks and ego boost out of.
 

DanelMadr

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-E- said:
Hey all,

Just thought it might be interesting to talk about rejections we've gotten that have embarrassed us (in public or otherwise). I got a real beauty last night at the gym --

I don't usually approach at the gym, but in effort to cut for the summer I started taking aerobics classes at mine (I love aerobics) and there's a girl, about a HB7, in the Wed. night class that I chat and joke around with. During class she looks at me from time to time and smiles whenever we make eye contact, so last night I decided to go for it.

After class she was talking to one of her female friends and I approached her and told her that we should chat sometime when we're not sweating it up here in class. At first she didn't hear me, so I repeated myself and halfway through me repeating myself she goes, "Awwwwwwwwwwww, that's so sweet! Are you trying to ask me out?" and she said it LOUD... like loud enough for everyone in our vicinity to hear. That response totally took me off-guard and I immediately knew that I was on a one-way train to the Friend Zone... but she seriously said it to me like she was talking to a little puppy or a 10 year old boy who had a crush on his teacher...

Being caught off guard I just kinda went "Ask you out? Well... I'd like to call you up and chat for a bit first..." (bad response but I was fumbling for words in my confused state). She basically replied "Well let me take a walk for a minute first..." And then she disappeared.

God that sucked. Girls and their damn mixed signals. And why couldn't she just say "No" instead of talking to me like a child or lost puppy in front of everyone, followed by leading me on and blowing me off?


Anyway that was damn embarrassing... what about you guys?
That really sucks, man. She played you and publicly stroked her ego.At least you didn't end up with self centered insensitive b!tch ;-)

I really do hate it when you talk to a girl and her expression turns to I-know-you-are-interested. Funny thing is it happens most of the times with girls I don't really dig. So I have no problem eject after that look.

And why do I lose the rest of Interest Level in her after that? She is quite stupid when she things she is so smart that she figured me out. In other words....even if one can read the other person, it is not smart to let him know about it. That's just rude. She basically pushes herself on pedastal with all force despite the fact, that by doing so is patronizing me, therefore she lacks good manners - is insensitive and arrogant. No thanks. When a girl is ****y she loses her feminine play. That's why ****y (and funny) was "invented " to assert Confidence-manly trait.

Before you flame me, that you like confident women. Well, I never ever met any (despite some lesbians). And their "confident" acting is just an act. Brainwashed to them through feminist propaganda. Yeah, there is nothing wrong when a girl is asertive, confident whatever, but she can't use it when situation dictates to be feminine. And not to pizz off guys by being arogant man in bra or b!tch on pedestal.
 

lorekeeper

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know this girl, I really like her (just as someone to bug) cause she is so bugable. she thinks she's completly hot****, too good for almost anyone, but i consistantly put her in her place the absolute harshest i can, and we3're both good with it (case in point, how we got introduced, first time making contact: she was sitting at a table listening to me and a friend talk about how we shoulda just stayed home an play video games

hb7: not my kind of guy.
LK: thats ok sweety, youre not exactly my kind of girl.
hb7: (going bat****) oh yeah?!? what are you some kind of toughguy? you dont even know who i am, you dont know what im capable of!"
lk: (completly mockingly): oh! im so scared! what are you going to to? throw your 95 pound frame against my and try to hit me with your little fists of fury?"
hb7 mouth agape: "you dont even know my name!"
lk: of course i do!
hb7: oh yeah? what is it?
lk: stands up, looks down at her and in a complete stonic voice: "unimportant."

I swear i though she was gonna hit me, but then all of a sudden she gets this HUGE grin on her face and blurts out "omg! you think i'm 95 pounds! your so sweet, your my new best friend!!")


I constantly blurt out oneliners against her, and i dont know how i do it. it took me 4 moths to accidentily find out her name, i just called her drunky (drunky: lorekeeper, I'll drink you under the table! LK: considering you spend most of the night UNDER the table I dont find that so hard to belive"

ANNNNYWAYS....
Im palying pool, and we're going to play doubles. i walk over her table and tell her "come play, and bring one of your friends" she comes over with hb8, I make some jokes with drunky, mock beat her up, then turn to her friend and say "nice to meet you, I'm LK" and she replies:

"i dont care"

she was a complete. and. utter. *****.

she did not give me her name, she did not shake my hand, she stared me down, and i ACTUALLY GOT NERVOUS.

she said "i do not care3 about people that disrespect my friends"

I told her "ohhhhhh, youre gonna HATE me!"

she actually completly freaked/creeped me out. i saw her 3 times after that and each time i got the cold shoulder. (i call her angry girl)

however, her friend claims i give the best hugs in the world. angry girl is sitting on the pooltable and her friend tells me to give her a hug, I comply and give her a good one, then back off and with a smile tell her "this doesn't mean i like you"

next time i saw her 3 weeks later she was all over me.

(playfighting, "stepping up" slapping my ass, when i was grabbing hers etc. JUST shy of making out)
 

"You'll Never Feel READY to Walk Over"

Next Monday you'll feel more confident. After the gym you'll feel more confident. After one more drink you'll feel more confident. After you get a better haircut, a better jacket, a better job.

You've been "getting ready" for two years.

She's standing ten feet away right now. She'll be gone in four minutes. No amount of preparation will manufacture the courage that only comes from moving your feet.

Walk over. Stumble through the first sentence. Let it be clumsy. Let it be imperfect. You will feel more alive in those ten seconds than you have all month.

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