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Maryland universities support lowering drinking age to 18

Bible_Belt

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http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/local/bal-te.md.drink19aug19,0,7237773.story


Lower drinking age is backed
21 'is not working,' Md. college officials say

By Stephen Kiehl

Sun Reporter

August 19, 2008

Top university officials in Maryland - including the chancellor of the state university system and the president of the Johns Hopkins University - say the current drinking age of 21 "is not working" and has led to dangerous binges in which students have harmed themselves and others.

Six college presidents in Maryland are among more than 100 college and university presidents nationwide who have signed a statement calling for a public debate on rethinking the drinking age.

"Kids are going to drink whether it's legal or illegal," said Johns Hopkins President William R. Brody, who supports lowering the drinking age to 18. "We'd at least be able to have a more open dialogue with students about drinking as opposed to this sham where people don't want to talk about it because it's a violation of the law."

The presidents of the University of Maryland, College Park; Towson University; the College of Notre Dame of Maryland; Goucher College; Washington College and the University of Maryland Biotechnology Institute signed the statement, along with the presidents of Duke, Dartmouth and Ohio State University.

"How many times must we relearn the lessons of prohibition?" the statement says. "Adults under 21 are deemed capable of voting, signing contracts, serving on juries and enlisting in the military, but are told they are not mature enough to have a beer."

Each state has the authority to set its own drinking age, but in 1984 Congress passed the National Minimum Drinking Age Act, which says that states with a drinking age lower than 21 will lose 10 percent of their federal highway money. After that law passed, all 50 states raised their drinking age to 21.

The first step for the presidents is to work for repeal of that law as part of next year's transportation reauthorization bill. They recognize the challenge, given the passions ignited by the issue, but say they are desperate to confront the problem of drinking on and off college campuses.

"We have this law that in effect prevents any state from exploring new ways of addressing the issue," said William E. Kirwan, chancellor of the Maryland state university system. "We have a crisis on our hands. We need some new ideas and new thinking."

He said the debate should not be just about lowering the drinking age. It's more important, he said, to focus on better alcohol abuse education on campuses or in driver education courses. But now, he said, new ideas can't be tested because of the federal law.

Advocates of the 21-year-old drinking age say it has saved thousands of lives. They say lowering the age will pass the drinking problem down the line to high school students and that national surveys have found the public supports keeping the age at 21.

"Drunk driving used to be a part of American culture until someone stood up and said we need to make a change, and 25 years later 'designated driver' is a commonplace term in every household in America," said Caroline Cash, executive director of Mothers Against Drunk Driving for Maryland and Delaware.

She said was disappointed that the university presidents did not talk with MADD before signing the statement. She said she also questions their commitment to upholding the law.

"It gives me great pause to think of sending thousands of students onto a campus where the person who is most accountable doesn't seem to be devoted to ensuring their health and safety," Cash said.

But university presidents say that is at the center of their concerns. They are worried about the binge drinking that underage students engage in before they go out - the goal being to get drunk as quickly as possible before going to public places where they won't be served.

"If they drink too much in the beginning [of an evening], they can get alcohol poisoning," said Baird Tipson, president of Washington College in Chestertown. "They're really not aware of how their judgment is impaired. We hope they don't get into a car. Or, if they're a young woman, go to a fraternity party. It's just not healthy."

He said at least 90 percent of the disciplinary cases that have come before him - including physical and sexual assaults - involve alcohol. And because underage drinking is forbidden of college campuses, students do it off-campus. That means getting home can be a problem, the presidents said.

"A lot of young people feel that they are afraid of enforcement" on campus, said Sanford J. Ungar, president of Goucher College. "They tend to get in a car and go someplace else - and that's very, very dangerous. I worry about it every weekend."

Several students interviewed yesterday at Johns Hopkins said lowering the drinking age could reduce binge drinking. "I think alcohol is seen, a lot of times, as a forbidden thing, and people want it," said Jamie Hittman, 20, a junior from Columbia. "It's almost like contraband. Once you get it, you have to drink all of it."

Katie Buckheit, 19 and also a junior, said if people were exposed to drinking at a younger age, they would be more mature about it. "Maybe I'm being idealistic, but in Europe you can drink once you can see the bar," she said. "I think we should maybe take a lesson from what other countries are doing."

But Laura Kranish, an 18-year-old sophomore from Silver Spring, said students would drink as much they do no matter what the drinking age is.

Robert Caret, the president of Towson University, says he personally believes 18 is a more reasonable drinking age than 21, but he is not working toward that end. Rather, he said, he welcomes the discussion on the issue.

"Let's debate the age and look at the pros and cons," he said. Caret, like the other presidents, knows he is treading on delicate ground. But the officials say they have seen too much tragedy and too many lives ruined by alcohol to abide the current policies.

"I really think we've got to somehow be able to control it better because what we have done now is driven it underground, and we can't do anything about it," said Tipson, the Washington College president. "There are a lot of things we could do if it wasn't underground."
 

What happens, IN HER MIND, is that she comes to see you as WORTHLESS simply because she hasn't had to INVEST anything in you in order to get you or to keep you.

You were an interesting diversion while she had nothing else to do. But now that someone a little more valuable has come along, someone who expects her to treat him very well, she'll have no problem at all dropping you or demoting you to lowly "friendship" status.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

Smack

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Katie Buckheit, 19 and also a junior, said if people were exposed to drinking at a younger age, they would be more mature about it.
Exactly. Here in the UK, drinking isn't such a big thing. By the time kids go off to university they've more often than not experimented with alcohol for a while already and see it as no big deal.
 

The Bat

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This is just like the legalizing pot debate. Basic mantra is that we want what we cannot have. Therefore if you lower the drinking age to 18, there will be less hype and less demand from adults ranging 18-21 for alcohol. When this happens, less alcohol related assualts and accidents occur since getting wasted would not be the "cool" thing to do anymore because everybody can do it.

Same with legalizing pot. If you legalize pot, then less pot related crimes will occur and less addictions because it's not the "cool" thing to do anymore because everybody can do it (i.e. get high).

I didn't realize 10% of federal highway money is that big of a deal to ALL 50 states. Or maybe it's the hotties from MADD that have managed to keep the drinking age to 21?! :crackup:
 

ketostix

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I'll tell you what I think, these university just want drinking for 18 and up on campus to get a piece of the money action. Although, I do agree with their arguments that it should be lowered to 18 nationwide.

maybe it's the hotties from MADD that have managed to keep the drinking age to 21?!
What like the Milfs Againsts Drinking and Driving?
 

Just because a woman listens to you and acts interested in what you say doesn't mean she really is. She might just be acting polite, while silently wishing that the date would hurry up and end, or that you would go away... and never come back.

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Bible_Belt

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The original mother who founded MADD gave up control of the organization long ago. Now they are a powerful political lobby for harsher dui laws.

I agree that any change should be nationwide, or else it lends itself to a 'highway of death' scenario where teenagers drive to the place of lowered age, then drive home drunk.

Over a third of the drivers in the US have at least one DUI. That fraction grows every year, and is on pace to reach one-half. I think states actually want you to drive drunk. The revenue that DUIs raise is substantial. A lot of people make money at least indirectly when you get a dui - cop, lawyer, judge, county employees, Breathalyzer company. This is big business. If they really wanted to stop drunk driving, every car would have a bac-monitor like they install for people with multiple convictions, bars would not have parking lots, and there would actually be a usable public transportation system. Until then, most people will at least occasionally drive drunk.
 

shaunuk

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The drinking age in (most?) of the states being 21 sucks, full stop.

I'm British (live in England) like Smack and basically drinking is no big deal here...no one cares...people are drinking by time they're 15/16 here. Everyone going to uni (age 18) has already been wasted a million times...I take drinking for granted now. The US needs to sort this out, it's gone far enough.
 

immrtlwun

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I like the point how a person can be mature enough to vote, serve on jury, etc, but not drink. It is a pretty blatant double standard and needs to be looked into and fixed. Unfortunately for me, I'll be 21 by the time anything happens anyway, so it won't be a big deal anymore.
The other main issue they seem to have is drunk driving. I feel as though anyone who is stupid enough to drink and drive at 18 would still be stupid enough to 3 years later when they are 21.
 

TheHumanist

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During the Vietnam War, like voting and other stuff, drinking age was lower to 18. When that happened, car crash skyrocketed. MADD may had a role, but it was the jump in crashes (including deadly crashes), the national government push it back to 21.

To Keto -- What action does the university presidents get if they lower the drinking age? More income to colleges? I read it in the local papers which our school voiced the same thing, the funny thing I noticed that the colleges that support the lowering of the age at least in Massachusetts trend to be the liberal arts schools and borderline liberal arts (smaller national schools). Tufts is the largest national university in this state currently voicing the idea and even that school is on the smaller side as well and very well endowed (I don't know about Maryland).

However, I do agree that keeping the drinking age at 21 is not the best idea. If you want to get people to drink less, only a culture against drinking will do it, outlawing only does the opposite effect, and it did.
 

Levex

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I'm all for lowering the drinking age to 18.
I grew up in a country where drinking age limit was not really enforced anywhere and my parents gave me alcohol to try like on holidays or special occasions. I grew up thinking it wasnt a big deal and it still isnt.

Although i do support harsher dui laws.
i think legal bac should be raised to .10(as already is in some states), along with more severe punishments for dui, like mandatory jail time.

i live in a college town and personally had several close calls with drunk a$$holes on the road.
 

ketostix

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TheHumanist said:
To Keto -- What action does the university presidents get if they lower the drinking age? More income to colleges? I read it in the local papers which our school voiced the same thing
Selling beer and liquor is good business revenue. The big university are behind it too. Heck these University make quite a bit just selling coca cola. If the age was lowered to 18 they could sell a lot of beer on campus. Think of how many much beer they could sell at a big football game even.


Although I'm not so sure they'd want drinking on campus with a bunch of drunk young people running around. It's kind of like if you're in th US military the drinking age is 18 but no basis allow it. All I know is Universities like to make money and control students, so I can see them wanting to sell beer and have controlled parties on campus.
 

TheHumanist

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ketostix said:
Selling beer and liquor is good business revenue. The big university are behind it too. Heck these University make quite a bit just selling coca cola. If the age was lowered to 18 they could sell a lot of beer on campus. Think of how many much beer they could sell at a big football game even.


Although I'm not so sure they'd want drinking on campus with a bunch of drunk young people running around. It's kind of like if you're in th US military the drinking age is 18 but no basis allow it. All I know is Universities like to make money and control students, so I can see them wanting to sell beer and have controlled parties on campus.
I'm pretty sure public drinking won't fly at all, not in their best interests for parents of top students to see drunken students walking aorund. I think the University presidents who are voicing for the idea is more because that they are aware of the scale of drinking in most schools and trying to directly shut it down won't is only making it worse. I don't think University presidents is thinking about business revenue of alcohol during games, they been chasing active discouragement of drinking as they are aware doing the damage it can do to reputation and property. Selling beer during football games won't fly well, at least not for a long time even after a repeal. Not in their best interests for schools, to scare way the student's parents. Revenue from games does not compensate the loss of students because their parents saw too much drinking. From my knowledge, which is the schools in Massachusetts, only the smaller schools have voiced it to the papers and they won't make money from sports, liberal arts schools and tufts are not big time sports schools with very large venues.
 

ketostix

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TheHumanist said:
I'm pretty sure public drinking won't fly at all, not in their best interests for parents of top students to see drunken students walking aorund. I think the University presidents who are voicing for the idea is more because that they are aware of the scale of drinking in most schools and trying to directly shut it down won't is only making it worse. I don't think University presidents is thinking about business revenue of alcohol during games, they been chasing active discouragement of drinking as they are aware doing the damage it can do to reputation and property. Selling beer during football games won't fly well, at least not for a long time even after a repeal. Not in their best interests for schools, to scare way the student's parents. Revenue from games does not compensate the loss of students because their parents saw too much drinking. From my knowledge, which is the schools in Massachusetts, only the smaller schools have voiced it to the papers and they won't make money from sports, liberal arts schools and tufts are not big time sports schools with very large venues.

Well I say you're naive and wrong on almost all points. There's already drinking going on near campuses and underage on top of that. Parents know this. If the drinking age becomes 18 then there won't be any stigma against the drinking. Besides there's already a sh!tload of drinking at university football games, just that it's done "across the street" from the stadium and just that the beer wasn't sold by the university. It's total drunk chaos all around the University on game weekend. How could you not know this?

And you're wrong about only small schools voicing favor for lowering the age. Several big University presidents recently came out in favor of it. You can bet the idea was passed around betwen the big universities before it was presented to the news.
 

The Bat

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TheHumanist said:
I'm pretty sure public drinking won't fly at all, not in their best interests for parents of top students to see drunken students walking aorund. I think the University presidents who are voicing for the idea is more because that they are aware of the scale of drinking in most schools and trying to directly shut it down won't is only making it worse. I don't think University presidents is thinking about business revenue of alcohol during games, they been chasing active discouragement of drinking as they are aware doing the damage it can do to reputation and property. Selling beer during football games won't fly well, at least not for a long time even after a repeal. Not in their best interests for schools, to scare way the student's parents. Revenue from games does not compensate the loss of students because their parents saw too much drinking. From my knowledge, which is the schools in Massachusetts, only the smaller schools have voiced it to the papers and they won't make money from sports, liberal arts schools and tufts are not big time sports schools with very large venues.
Haha oh man, you're so naive.

There is already drinking going on campuses, big or small. Even when a school declares itself as a "dry campus", they are heavily doing a disservice to the parents by making them believe that their kids are getting their education on. While the reality is that all you have to do is look at the number of sororities and fraternities on that campus, and there will be no doubt that at least 1 out of 5 people are drinking.

There is a thing called tailgating at football games. Everybody camps out with their pick up truck/RV, grill, coolers, and lawn chairs in a parking lot across from the stadium. Wait, what's in those coolers? That's right, you will not find a sober soul at these tailgating parties (except for the security guards but they are just having a blast watching drunk kids do stupid things and have to arrest them for it).

I think lowering the drinking age won't have much problem, in fact, it will reduce the problem since "getting drunk" and "having a party with alcohol" won't be a cool thing anymore. Why? Because everybody can do it. It'd just turn into a kick back and chill out kind of thing where alcoholics can continue getting drunk while normal kids (which is like 90% of them) can get drunk every once in awhile and enjoy the nightlife.

Just go to a bar near campus and see how the crowd is. Most of them aren't getting hammered and jumping off balconies and throwing chairs at each other. There is a certain element of "maturity" attached with turning 21 and drinking legally.

Think what will happen if we lower the drinking age to 18.
 

TheHumanist

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The Bat said:
Haha oh man, you're so naive.

There is already drinking going on campuses, big or small. Even when a school declares itself as a "dry campus", they are heavily doing a disservice to the parents by making them believe that their kids are getting their education on. While the reality is that all you have to do is look at the number of sororities and fraternities on that campus, and there will be no doubt that at least 1 out of 5 people are drinking.

There is a thing called tailgating at football games. Everybody camps out with their pick up truck/RV, grill, coolers, and lawn chairs in a parking lot across from the stadium. Wait, what's in those coolers? That's right, you will not find a sober soul at these tailgating parties (except for the security guards but they are just having a blast watching drunk kids do stupid things and have to arrest them for it).

I think lowering the drinking age won't have much problem, in fact, it will reduce the problem since "getting drunk" and "having a party with alcohol" won't be a cool thing anymore. Why? Because everybody can do it. It'd just turn into a kick back and chill out kind of thing where alcoholics can continue getting drunk while normal kids (which is like 90% of them) can get drunk every once in awhile and enjoy the nightlife.

Just go to a bar near campus and see how the crowd is. Most of them aren't getting hammered and jumping off balconies and throwing chairs at each other. There is a certain element of "maturity" attached with turning 21 and drinking legally.

Think what will happen if we lower the drinking age to 18.
That's ironic that you call me naive since I'm a college student and drink too (though not as heavy as many though). Perhaps you are misunderstanding. Of course, drinking is rampant on campus and I'm fully aware of that. My argument is to address Keto that I doubt the University President's interest in getting the law repealed is to sell beer inside the stadium, especially since the presidents who are part of the Amethyst Initiative in Massachusetts are mostly liberal arts colleges, not schools with a large athletic presence that can reap money from selling it during games as the games attract too little to be really worth it while, unless Division III football really attract that many people. I suspect also that repealing it and starting to sell on campus openly during games may hurt the school reputation, which is also not in the interest of the school as well. Drinking is rampant on large or small schools, but I doubt the school plan to reap money by selling it.

As much as drinking is (sort-of) under the seams, putting in the open to sell during games may not in the school's best interests. Especially those who are part of the initiative are not presidents of schools that would likely make the most money.

Also, btw, as I said before, I agree in the assessment that it should be brought back to 18. 21 is simply not working and just encouraging excessive drinking.
 

Maxtro

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I'm confused, what is it they hope to accomplish by lowering the drinking age?

I guarantee that if the drinking age was lowered to 18, the rate of alcohol related incidents would skyrocket.
 
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