Lessons from the old to the young!

[Heretolearn]

Obviously we can do whatever we want in our life but there are a lot of trends and support for the following ideals.

I would like you all to add your wisdom and thoughts on the subjects to help explain them to me and everyone else. I am very confused with what to do in life but hopefully we can all share our thoughts for the benefit of everyone!

* please provide the advantages and disadvantages of each if you can!

1) Buying a home as soon as possible

All I hear is that:
- 'rent is throwing your money away'
- Houses are always going up in value
- Houses are a good investment

Yet my investigations so far have revealed:

- I would pay 2.5 times the value of the house by using a 30 year mortgage,
o Obviously I would throw 1.5 times the value of the house away on interest
- I would increase my worries and financial pressures
- I would severely limit my ability to do other things such as travel and have spending money
- It is hard work and a lot of time in maintaining a house, even if you rent it out



2) A car is damn expensive

- registration
- insurance
- fuel
- maintenance
…………………..

3) Marriage and being with one person for life

a) Who sold us on this one?
b) Why do so many people believe in it?
c) Is it better to experience life with as many different quality relationships as possible as opposed to one? I.e to get enjoyment and know more people in life (not one night stands but getting to know others)


4) Go to school, get a job, marry, have kids, retire, die

a) Is this really the best life?
b) For you or society?
c) Why?

5) Go to University

I had fun but all these people that got jobs:

a) made more money
b) Did not get into student debt
c) Have life experience and EMPLOYMENT experience which is more valuable than a degree
d) These people can study later in life if necessary and especially part time whilst working

6) Take **** from people

I seriously was affected by idiots in my life, especially growing up. Eg. Sports coaches that would make you think a soccer game was the world and a bad or good game defined you as a person.

I wish someone told me to tell these people to get a life of their own!

7) Save your money

This is a good one for me so far. I blew all my cash on risky investments. I made a lot but lost it all and a little bit more in the end. I am now accepting that to increase wealth is a slow and gradual process

8) Patience and time is the key

Also good for me. Live your age and lifestyle. When you are young, act it. Be it. All those young guys, do not fixate on one woman or one life path. You have no idea what is out there!

Same for me too!

9) Love and respect your family first and good friends, get rid of the negative people in your life!

This one has helped me a lot. I never had a good relationship with my family when I was younger. I would hang out with my friends. Now, my family has REALLY been loyal and close, my friends have their own lives. Your family is part of your life! *not only blood family but the TRUE people in your life.

Also, get rid of the dead weight in your life such as people

10) Be clean, neat and organised!

This has really helped me. It just makes your life so much easier!

11) Be good to others

I agree. I do not believe in karma per se but seriously anyone who has something bad done to them should not do it to others. You really learn from the bad stuff

12) No matter what, life goes on

Well Said. You never know where your life will go, try to keep an open mind!

13) Travel

Yes! Opens your mind and your experiences. Unfortunately also your wallet 
Should be seen as a degree or college!



Please add your own and add your own thoughts to mine!

 

[Immaculate]

Most DEFINETLY buy a house ASAP

I bought my townhouse 3 years ago and it has almost doubled in value! I could sell now and walk off with 150 grand... I'm gonna wait another year or 2 and walk off with 400 grand then move to Florida and mack women till I die!

 

[WestCoaster]

On university ...

... wouldn't worry about the debt, you can pay it back at 3% rate and it's a better investment than a 30K SUV.

Here's why ... and I work at a university: I get about 2 people walking into my office a week who are managers or high up at big companies and have been told by their CEOs that they have hit the ceiling until they get a degree. These are people who could run the company, but we are in a degree world and they are getting leap-frogged by more degreed, though less-qualified people.

I was surprised and continue to be surprised at this happening. Trust me, you do not want to be 40 and going back to school, or even 30 for that matter ... though I went to grad school at a later date.

Also, people with bachelor's degrees make $1 million or more over a lifetime than those without; the money goes up with those with master's and advanced degrees.

I can tell you right now in our advancing technological world and with the high number of people getting degrees right now, you're be a 100 percent moron to put this off. If you do, you'll be working for someone else, not having people work for you.

Yes, there are exceptions, but more often than not you're better off getting some kind of post-high school schooling. Also, high school education in this country isn't very good, I'd never hire someone with such a limited education and thought processes.

 

[Alicorn]

I don't know where you live, but rent around here is $900/mo for a place where you may not get robbed.

That's almost a mortgage, so you may as well own instead of rent.

 

[Immaculate]

I live in VA and my mortgage is under 1,000 a month. MUCH cheaper than renting. And I got a 5.25 interest rate.
I paid 180,000 for the house, and I could sell it now for 340,000!

 

[A-Unit]

Re:

The only time these things are a -problem[/]- is when you buy someone else's program or plan.

Most kids, teens, and college students do.

Buying a home is good as an inflation hedge, but unless you move around the country and downsize, the gains you experience aren't useful. The alternative is, if you're an astute investor, you could use the appreciation and home equity loan to buy properties elsewhere at depressed prices. So it's not an all or nothing.

However I get clients who sink loads of dough into their home, let it pop up in price, then think "oh well it's a good investment!"

Where will you live if you sold?
Would you downsize and buy less home?
If you pulled the gain out where would you put it?
Can you use that gain?

Lots of homeowners who saw huge gains...

-Aren't astute enough to invest that type of debt and earn more than it costs to borrow it.
-Won't downsize until 65+, so it's a useless gain; it's only on paper.
-Most homes cost the same across the country, unless you go to the midwest, or far north, or real ghetto areas.

Just some thoughts, getting a home now certainly enables you to stand pace with inflation, but if you're financial astute enough, using that gain isn't going to happen. Alot of HO's pulled out the gain to re-fi cars, credit cards, or buy new toys, NOT invest like most would believe.

-------------------

Marriage is a personal decision, and making it last is up to the individual. Right now alot of guys are idealists, and are great and motivated, but there's a strong sense of negativity and bitterness toward women, that is very characteristic of men in the 18-29 y.o bracket. They wouldn't be good partners b/c alot of them don't make good friends. Be a good friend, to both men and women, and then you can look toward a l/t relationship.

I know lots of couples making it last, and that love it. Sure, there's ups and downs, but all in all it's good for them because they have the right attitude. Nobody MISsold us on it, it just ONLY works for most people when it's a "traditional" marriage. No guy would realistically marry if he only had a Permanent Partner, i.e a woman who's a clone of himself (hard working, independent, barely around, driven etc). Maybe it's a turn, but you wouldn't have to marry for that.

-----------------------------

College works but few too many people OVER pay, UNDER perform, don't know what they're REALLY going for, and WASTE it. It's an education. The best sales line is that people get it to fall back on, or do it, but never use it. Why learn something you don't love, won't use, and don't see doing? Don't waste your time.

I think if you go for what you love, inevitably you'll use the degree SOMEHOW, and there can be value extracted, but consider what you invest for what you get.

If you drop $50,000, get a return on it. The return is normally the income you make or the EXTRA income you make, but there must be upside BEYOND what you'd get. If your degree only affords you 50k forever with inflation, then why? You could get a job / career for that, with more upside.

A-Unit

 

[WestCoaster]

Don't go to a private school

You can get out of college with paying only $20K for a college education -- at least here in the West in going to state school.

You'll pay that for a fast-depreciating car. In today's world you're sunk without a degree. Go ahead and do it ... I just talked to two CEOs last week, they're not hiring high school degree guys and never will ever again.

Don't sink your own boat.

 

[Immaculate]

Re: Re:

Originally posted by A-Unit
The only time these things are a -problem[/]- is when you buy someone else's program or plan.

Most kids, teens, and college students do.

Buying a home is good as an inflation hedge, but unless you move around the country and downsize, the gains you experience aren't useful. The alternative is, if you're an astute investor, you could use the appreciation and home equity loan to buy properties elsewhere at depressed prices. So it's not an all or nothing.

However I get clients who sink loads of dough into their home, let it pop up in price, then think "oh well it's a good investment!"

Where will you live if you sold?
Would you downsize and buy less home?
If you pulled the gain out where would you put it?
Can you use that gain?

Lots of homeowners who saw huge gains...

-Aren't astute enough to invest that type of debt and earn more than it costs to borrow it.
-Won't downsize until 65+, so it's a useless gain; it's only on paper.
-Most homes cost the same across the country, unless you go to the midwest, or far north, or real ghetto areas.

Just some thoughts, getting a home now certainly enables you to stand pace with inflation, but if you're financial astute enough, using that gain isn't going to happen. Alot of HO's pulled out the gain to re-fi cars, credit cards, or buy new toys, NOT invest like most would believe.

-------------------

Marriage is a personal decision, and making it last is up to the individual. Right now alot of guys are idealists, and are great and motivated, but there's a strong sense of negativity and bitterness toward women, that is very characteristic of men in the 18-29 y.o bracket. They wouldn't be good partners b/c alot of them don't make good friends. Be a good friend, to both men and women, and then you can look toward a l/t relationship.

I know lots of couples making it last, and that love it. Sure, there's ups and downs, but all in all it's good for them because they have the right attitude. Nobody MISsold us on it, it just ONLY works for most people when it's a "traditional" marriage. No guy would realistically marry if he only had a Permanent Partner, i.e a woman who's a clone of himself (hard working, independent, barely around, driven etc). Maybe it's a turn, but you wouldn't have to marry for that.

-----------------------------

College works but few too many people OVER pay, UNDER perform, don't know what they're REALLY going for, and WASTE it. It's an education. The best sales line is that people get it to fall back on, or do it, but never use it. Why learn something you don't love, won't use, and don't see doing? Don't waste your time.

I think if you go for what you love, inevitably you'll use the degree SOMEHOW, and there can be value extracted, but consider what you invest for what you get.

If you drop $50,000, get a return on it. The return is normally the income you make or the EXTRA income you make, but there must be upside BEYOND what you'd get. If your degree only affords you 50k forever with inflation, then why? You could get a job / career for that, with more upside.

A-Unit

Dude, the gains to owning a house isn't useful??

I owe my mortgage co. about 155K right now. I paid 180,00 for the house. I could sell RIGHT now for MAX 340,000 , pay off the Mort co, and walk off with a pile of cash. Maybe it's just the area I live in. The population is growing so fast, everybody wants a home so my house value is skyrocketing! And it's a townhouse. There is no maintenance. The only maintenance I've had in 3 years is a broken water heater and clean my gutters. Boo - Hoo.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

This is going to come off as real bizzare but:

DO NOT GET A DOG until you are financially set.

I sh!t you not. Your girlfriend or wife might think the thing is a child substitue or so damn cute as a puppy but there is no greater money pit than an animal. Don't get me wrong, I love dogs, I own 2, but the dogs we loved before we had a child have now become the "damn dogs." I say this after paying almost $8K to have a fence installed around my backyard. I have had them eat a vinyl hot tub cover to the tune of $600, I have paid $750 for surgeries over the years, every home I've ever rented was $200+ more per month to accept animals, every home I've ever bought has been with the idea of containing the dogs (i.e. more expensive) I have paid for furniture being torn up, I have personally reinstalled door molding because the one dog chewed it off in an effort to escape our washroom one evening while we had a party, I have paid for and installed more chainlink kennels than I care to remember, and the list goes on and on.

Like I said, God bless 'em, I love dogs, but NEVER keep one until you have established yourself financially.

 

[A-Unit]

Re:

As stated, the gains are useful for the 'astute'.

So sell your house, you have $180,000, what do you do?

Peel it off into $90k x 2, invest 90k or more in apartments or commerical space, and plop the rest down into a new home. You'll carry a larger mortage, because if you MOVE, you still pay the same for what you have in your area, 340,000.

For what homes go for in MA @ 500,000, the same home is 100-200 in other parts of the country. The places you want to downsize to, mostly become HIGH priced, such as florida, which saw one of the greatest price appreciations, next to CA and New England throughout the country.

I'm all for HOME OWNERSHIP, but, understand they do suck up money and will, and you ALWAYS needs a place to live, so as an asset, it's only useful IF YOU USE IT as one. This isn't RDPD speaking, it's pure economics, and financial, facts.

It becomes the largest asset for most people, but they do a reverse mortgage later in life, turning your home into an income stream.

So for the guys here, buy 1 and learn to use mortgages and home equity to create wealth. But keep in mind, YOU ALWAYS need a place to live, and thinking you can just sell out, get 180 and sit and rent or lease is WASTING that gain.

For the uninitiated, and not-so-astute, how do they use the gain? Move? Most HO's with a sizeable don't know about the tax deferral on R/E, can't use HE right, and think "well gee I have this gain!" No, so does every other HO, so ALL properties are pricey. Either you get a smaller home and bank the gain, OR, you move to an area that's cheaper. In Massachusetts, you could get homes in the boonies @ 200, for what they got @ for 500 near Boston. Or take your 250k in Boston, and go to Maine for TWICE the home.

Guys here looking to buy or rent, in esp. cheap areas should buy, learn to use HE. For those that don't, it's a paper gain, but the ones who will benefit are your beneficiaries.



A-Unit

 

[al77]

Re: Re: Re:

Originally posted by Immaculate
Dude, the gains to owning a house isn't useful??

I owe my mortgage co. about 155K right now. I paid 180,00 for the house. I could sell RIGHT now for MAX 340,000 , pay off the Mort co, and walk off with a pile of cash. Maybe it's just the area I live in.

I agree with A-Unit he provided an excellent explanation of why it is not very useful if you are not doing business with it.

ok, you got 340k and where are you going to live? Note if you going to buy another similar house you will have to pay..340k again (or more).
Even if you move to another state, you think houses there didn't get appreciated from 180 to 340?

 

[WestCoaster]

Hey Rollo, I've had a few dogs -- they're called ex-girlfriends! (Rim shot in the background .. "Thank you, I'll be here all week.")

More sage advice from Rollo. I don't have a dog, but had some animals while growing up. Lots of time and work. I love animals, but when you're single, no freaking way. My single friends have made it a freaking major project just to find apartments which allow pets, and then there are pet-sitters to get. When you're single, you want TOTAL freedom, not partial freedom. You want to be able to get in the car and go ... not scramble for a pet-sitter.

Good advice Rollo.

 

[A-Unit]

Re:

Some things I would add.

Per "The Richest Man in Babylon" Book

Save a mandatory 10%.

And that's not just in or for retirement, that's in general, like a cash/mm account or mutual fund. The retirement account is just basics, since we in the US must provide for our own future. The other 10% allows you to grow moderate wealth so that you can aspire to a "comfy" life. Plus, what good is all that crap, when after 4 years it's old, broken, and outdated?

I don't have to go into buying specifics, but most people who have to have tons of new stuff, can find that crap, as crap in their closet, gathering dust, or just so old. That includes upgrading video game systems to the newest system of the day, buying overpriced computer systems, high priced tv's (they used to last 10 years, now most have them last 4), buying too many dvd's when BlockBuster has them cheap, buying too many cd's when you burn them or download songs, etc.

A buddy of mine bought tons of stuff for 5 years. Big tv, BMW, Burberry, Von Dutch, Dvd's, and sure he looked flossed, but even he admitted he'd like the money RIGHT now, because for the dollars he spent, and lost compound interest, plus the ability to have a larger bank balance ready for investment opportunities, it's a HUGE cost. Sad.

You want to end up somewhere different, start out going in a different, direction.

Stay on your health.

That means, if you're not gaining the muscle or losing the fat, don't give up. These 3 month programs require FULL out intensity, but if you committ a lifetime to lifting or exercise, you'll be better off, have a wonderful sex life, attract lots of women, have tons of energy for future sports and life engagements, have lower insurance costs, fit into clothes longer and better, and have a stronger self-confidence going forward.

STICK TO IT! It's the fluctuations that throw you off. Prior to college, I worked out alot and ate well. During it, I ate crappy. After college, I drank alot, fawking up workouts like crazy. Now, I just engage the occasional cognac, scotch, cigar, or beer. Binging kills me. Even mixed drinks irk me.

So just stick to a LONG_term plan and you'll be whatever you want to be.

Manage your life like a business.

Every business has 2 sides, the business/reality side, and the creative/marketing side. Life has those sides, too. In order to enjoy the fruits of Life, we have to manage it properly. It's all well and good to be "out there" and lax, but you can be MORE lax if you just take a few minutes each day managing it.

For instance...

-keep accurate records of important documents, such as insurance, tickets (speeding), transactions, taxes, tax write-offs, etc.
-keep a basic budget, either on a spreadsheet, notebook, or computer program. KNOW your basic bills, i.e. rent, utilities, insurance, car, debt payments, monthly bills etc.
-keep a log or black book of the people you know, in MS OUTLOOK, a palm pilot, etc, so you have a DATABASE of friends and contacts FOR life. Who knows who gets famous or could tap you into some wonderful opportunity?
-Regularly clean yourself up. Throw away old clothes, donate them. Get rid of old bills by shreading them. Stop cluttering life. The physical crap you keep weighs you down emotionally and psychologically.
-Take care of your clothes, esp. your more expensive ones. Get your suits dry cleaned, own at least 1 suit and 1 tux for any occasion so you're not caught in a pinch.
-Take care of your car, by cleaning it, keeping it running well, and detailing. This maintains a higher value and makes it cheaper overtime to maintain.
-Always be aware of your job/career status. Know your upgrade options and potential promotions. See your next move, so you can make one. If you don't have 1, you might be in the wrong field wasting time and potential higher earnings.
-Be a student of life. Don't stop reading. If it gets boring, switch to fiction books then go back. Take classes and seminars. Buy or borrow them from libraries.

If you're a man, give it a chance to live on your own.

A MUST. Learn to fend for yourself, so if and when it comes time to shack up with a woman, you can survive. If you can't survive on your own, and it's your first time and it's done with a woman, you'll exhibit your weaknesses and contribute to any FREAK OUTS she has. A woman is more likely to trust a man and have faith in him, IF he has exhibited he can get by on his own, because most women won't ever live ALONE.

Plus, it's fun!

Don't get so consumed by friends.

Have good friends, BUT KNOW their boundaries. As someone "older", I learned early friends, esp. young ones don't know themselves, so they won't be around forever. Some will, some won't. So just be protective of that. If their only past-time is drinking, be wary. You're not really friends b/c there's no other connections; I had friends like that.

Young guys get taken away by their friends, forsaking their dreams and goals for awhile. In the end, they had lots of fun, but feel like they haven't progressed any. I say with a 21 y.o guy today who felt the same way. And I congratulated him on recognizing that. But as I told him..."You know where I am and how I can help, if you're serious about what you want, meet me here."




A-Unit

 

[Desdinova]

1) Buying a home as soon as possible
Advantages: Excellent investment. You'll be way ahead of the other peers in your age group, and you'll be able to use that to buy a better house a few years down the road.

Disadvantages: It's easy to get into it when you're not financially ready. It also costs money to maintain it.

2) A car is damn expensive
Depends on the type of car you get. The car itself may not be expensive, but maintenance can be. If you're gonna buy a car, get something that's useful, like a truck. You can haul 5hit around in it, and you won't have to pay movers, nor will you have to rely on your friends. A truck is also very convenient.

3) Marriage and being with one person for life

Depends on who you marry. If you marry a woman who has the same enthusiasm about life that you do and shares similar goals, she'll become an important part of you life and will help you escalate your life into higher gear.

However, if you marry the wrong woman, you'll waste your time, money, and she'll prevent you from moving ahead with life.

4) Go to school, get a job, marry, have kids, retire, die

This is a general layout. It's the things you put into the gaps that are going to make your life worthwhile.

5) Go to University
Depends. If you have a lot of money, go ahead. If you don't, don't bother (unless your job pays for it).

6) Take **** from people
I paid that price most of my life. I kept getting walked on, but I was taught to be like Jesus and turn the other cheek and freely forgive. Because I followed this, I kept getting screwed around. The Jesus theory went out the window and I replaced it with my own: Everyone gets one chance. If they screw it up, they're out of my life.

7) Save your money
There's no point in saving money if you don't spend it. Save money for a purpose.

8) Patience and time is the key
Patience can be very good, but it can also be abused. Being patient and waiting on a hope is pointless. Making it happen will get you much further.

9) Love and respect your family first and good friends, get rid of the negative people in your life!
Agreed to a point. Family and friends can become negative people. Love yourself foremost, love others who respect you next.

10) Be clean, neat and organised!
All good stuff. However, being 100% devoted to perfection can hurt you.

11) Be good to others
Be good to others who are deserving of it.

12) No matter what, life goes on
Exactly.

13) Travel
Travel only if it interests you. If it doesn't, you're wasting your money.

 

[A-Unit]

Good One.

6) Take **** from people

Right on the money.

See...just because you should TREAT people well, doesn't mean you should ACCEPT shytty people into your life and then TREAT them as well as the people who do treat you well.

Life isn't charity.

Yeah, be nice to the bank teller, grocery bagger, clients, the cable guy, but call people to the carpet. That isn't NOT being like Jesus, because he would pull your reality card, too. He just didn't STRESS it. He wasn't looking to save people in the sense of running to everybody and say " DO THIS". He made them CHOOSE, but showed them HE WAS THE BEST OPTION!

I used to have that mentality, but after 1 guy friend tried to take 2 different chicks, I got fed up and realize I do NOT have to spend time with anyone, AND THAT'S ok!

Good point, Des.



A-Unit

 

[WestCoaster]

I'd say don't shack up unless you're married. After 1 year or less you know if you want to marry a woman or not. You don't need to test-drive that long. Unless you're going to live together forever without the legal agreement -- which is OK-- no reason to live together.

It's a money drainer, waste of time, you have to put up with B.S., and there's no commitment. All of my friends who shacked up and then married the gal and regretting it enormously now. They wish they would've stayed single, played the field more. Instead they were tied down in their freaking 20's without any real commitment from the woman (or the man for that matter).

I can't believe this isn't looked at more carefully in the U.S. It's only looked at from a morality angle, and frankly I could care less about that, if people want to screw, they're going to screw.

I look at it from a waste of time/money angle, and a lack of commitment angle. It's a colassal waste of time unless you're going to live together the rest of your life.

 

[Desdinova]

I'd say don't shack up unless you're married. After 1 year or less you know if you want to marry a woman or not.

I agree 100% and I made that mistake once.

 

[GirlCrazy]

I say this after paying almost $8K to have a fence installed around my backyard. I have had them eat a vinyl hot tub cover to the tune of $600

Wow, twilight zone music playing, I spent almost those exact amounts for those two exact items because of the 80 pound black lab puppy. And when the fence guys were just finishing up the new fence (including the new chain link around the hot tub area), the puppy knocked down the front gate - another $500.

It all needed replacing anyway, but without the puppy I could've taken my time on it. So yeah, dogs can be expensive, and don't be so quick to get one unless you have the $$$, unless it's a chihuahua.

 

[Bourne]

This is good thread with useful input.

A-Unit your stuff I really like. Share more with us.

 

[wheelin&dealin]

Buying a house isn't that AMAZING like most people make it out to be. You could be throwing your money away if you have to repair and fix it up all the time. It could be the worst decision of your life. You aren't instantly set for life if you have a house. Say you live in the place for 3 years and make $10,000... that's chump change and nobody ever talks about how much you could lose on it. If you rent you don't have to pay for electical/plumbing or any other problems and if you don't like the place you can just leave.

If you buy a house you'll probably buy in a sh*tty area because you're too poor to afford a house in a rich neighbourhood. You'll commute to work for about 2 hours a day. And all you have to say for it is "I own my own place". That's stupid in my opinion. Why not live the life while you're young and rent a condo in a nice area?

As long as you live withing your means you will be fine. Who cares about saving up for the future... You live your life in the present.