is this the end of my relationship? A mature response welcomed..

[jbbrain]

Men,

It's been a very long time since i've started a thread on this site. I've been browsing for the last few months, and really not posting that much.

In any case, here I am looking for a little insight as to what other ppl think about my relationship with my girlfriend, (there have been numerous posts about her before) to give input where it is needed and to really help take my head outta my ass in regards to the question we must all ask ourselves oneday:

"Is it really worth continuing my relationship with my girlfriend?"


I don't need to give u guys that much detail or background info about my past with this chick. We've had our differences over an array of subjects, but conceivably it's one theme that seems to keep on rearing its ugly head in the relationship. Its one thing that's manifesting itself over and over again and its the one thing that led me to break up with her bout 4 months ago. She begged me to come back, citing 'everything' would change, and I did...overall, the first 3 weeks were heaven, then it kinda felt nothing really changed (which I knew would happen...but i still wanted to provide that chance)...we've been going out for one year and five months now, something I thought I'd never achieve in this life time...

keep in mind my questions would probably be better answered pondering what i want out of my life in a dank quiet corner alone or something...but I felt it would also be kinda fun to post something again.

When we broke up, it was really because I couldn't stand the double standards she was imposing on our relationship. In a nutshell, she would get angry/upset over something I would do (or more in her case, the things I would not do...she complained relentlessly that I kept on disappointing her; which really meant she didnt like it when i didnt do something she wanted me to do) meanwhile exhibiting the EXACT behaviour she herself stated she hated to see in me. She wanted to have her cake and it eat it too and by the end I was sick and tired of her nagging and her chastising while I felt I was making genuine efforts for the wellbeing of 'us' while she herself was on the verge (IMO) of taking me for granted..arguments often ensued like this one:

"JB, I can't believe you're not hanging out with me tonight (tears welling up in the eyes) . You're diappointing me again..why do you make me cry?

"Babe, you nag and harrass me so much, but take a look at yourself...WHAT HAVE YOU DONE FOR ME LATELY? Only, I don't complain about it (probably because i tend to depend on myself for my entertainment)..why are u so selfish?"

Ahhh, see, communication apparently was not our strongest attribute. Crying would ALWAYS ensue after this classic argument and I would always be accused of making her feel like shyt, unloved, and even 'hated' (if u can believe that one) when all along i'm trying to explain to her, (sometimes in shouting matches) just trying to make her see..."HEY, DON'T YOU KNOW, YOU'RE BRINGING THIS ALL ON YOURSELF!?" Long story short, I got sick and tired of "disappointing her" while she sat back and did shyt all for the relationship (with slightly disrespectful actions sprinkled along the way), and I wanted out. The situation was so weird because we both thought of eachother as completely selfish and self interested..surely not many relationships exist where both parties think the exact same thing of the other...who was right?

I didn't try to answer that question, so i left. That was beg. november 2005.

1 week of begging and pleading later, I go back with her. Why? Because I cared..because she seemed so hellbent on being the woman I wanted her to be that I wanted to give her that chance. Shyt was good for awhile and for the first time in awhile we were both putting heaps of effort in this, knowing the other would do the same and be ultra grateful for it. Reciprocity is a wondeful thing.

Then, a new trend started forming. She would do certain things I would consider to be fvcking direspectful (blowing off new years plans with me because she got invited to a once in life time mtv new years eve party...ok ok...it wasnt a direct blowoff but the way she let me know of her change of plans was imo completely uncool) ..she once withheld sex from me for 3 weeks because she was on anti biotics and couldnt take the pill all the while knowing perfectly she had condoms in her bedside drawer...anyways..shyt like this and more of it. The way I handled it was very wrong and I would let myself get mad instead of remaing aloof and indifferent. Fights would again ensue and i would again be accused of making her feel like shyt (as in, "a good boyfriend would never make his girlfriend feel as shytty as you do sometimes jb" ...

 

[jbbrain]

part 2 of story

I thought it was kinda funny that fights would never really start because something I did, but really only because shyt she did. The thing was, I started feeling kinda shytty myself because the relationship was marred with such fights (sometimes quite a few in a short span) and I started to genuinely feel like an uptight prick for always being up in her grill. The thing is, anyone who knows me knows i'm not an uptight priick. I'm not a control freak, and I don't enjoy beating my women up (mentally or emotionally) into a pulp of emotional and insecure mess. reagrdless, I'm not a doormat either, so I had to let her realize where, why and how she made me feel angry. I used to just bottle up inside and explode at a later date, but I've made great strides in being more real with her and myself and just tackling the problem head on. Still, this (maybe more now than aver) translated into confrontation, tears would flow and again I would be accused of being a prick. it got to the point where we obviously both thought we were the victims...thats not a place I like to be.

Perhaps the latest incident came on Valnetine's day, about 1 month ago. She was going to costa rica with her graduating friends for spring break and I was very excited for her so I got her a great gift i thought shed be sure to enjoy...a pair of roxy board shorts. This is a gift I did a fair share of research about and I talked to many of her friends in true secrecy so as to find a pair that would both fit her as well as match her bikini. I love to surf, and I love my shorts to death. Whether you're out on the beach or just walking around anywhere, they are so comfortable and stylish..., not to mention I think women who were them are extremely sexy. So i was really excited to give them to her and when i made that trek at 1 in the morning to her house so that i could be with her "Valentine's midnight" I get harrassed for coming too late while she laments about being so tired. Still, I insist on the gift and In that exciting moment of anticipation where shes undoing the wrapping paper, I have the biggest smile on my face. I can't wait for that look on her face...! you know?!?!?1 That LOOK! Instead...

"OMG, these are so not my style"

WHAT????Either she needs a serious degree in gift accepting 101 or..or...who the hell knows! 1 thing i do know is that I completely overrreacted to the situation. It was probably the biggest slap in the face I had gotten in my relationship with her . it was probably the rudest circumstance that I could have thought of at the time...but alas...hey, its only a pair of board shorts. Instead of being level headed, i got huffy, accused her of being an ungrateful princess and threatened to leave her house. it was kinda pathetic,but my ego was hurt! Through only adamant and incessant apologies, and a whole lot of (thats not what i meant! statements) was I able to sleep in her bed that night. Apparently, I misread her reaction and she did like them, its only that she didnt 'know how to surf'.

So I dropped it, until yesterday when we were sitting down reading. At a moments notice she enthusiastically reached into her bag.

"JB, I got you something!!!!!"

Hmmm, gold watch, keys to a new car I'm thinking...?hmmmmm? (Just kidding)

A cupcake! But not just any kind of cupcake. It was a member of the ones who've been stuffed into a tightfitting bag for too long a portion of the day. It was crushed, icing was dripping and sliding all along the plastic bag, and i just didnt feel like getting my hands dirty at the time.

"babe..thanks but I dont really feel like getting my hands dirty...I'll have one later at your place.."

I went back to reading my paper, thinking all was good and understood. Thinking..hey, its a crushed cupcake, whats the big deal right? After an unusually dark moment was seemingly brooding over our heads, I looked up to see my girlfriend almost in tears, completely red in the face, just about to explode (or implode lol)..apparently she didnt think the cupcake was much different than my v-day gift. She exclaims violently:

"What?!?! You're not goign to eat my cupcake? But I brought it for you! And YOU accuse me of being ungrateful ALL THE TIME, making me feel like shyt, and here you are so casually declining and disregarding something I brought especially for you!" WTF!

Me thinking: 'Holy shyt. this chcik could very well be insane. I better eat the cupcake.' Ha!

All in all, as I want this to be my concluding paragraph (thanks so much for those who made it this far) I made the mistake right then and there of not confronting the situation; that is, an unstable gf whos freaking out at bullshyt. Instead, I bottled it up all inside and it came out at the worst time ( my mistake): Her graduation ball we were to go to that night. It wasnt my intention to bring it up since it was 'her' night afterall, but I just couldnt force myself to fake a good mood. My choice was to simply try not to interact with her specifically as much as possible throughtout the night. Just make it through the night and tackle the problem tomorrow I insisted to myself. In the end, I couldnt fool anyone and she whined and lamented about my distance and overall indifference to the night. I made a snyde joke about being "grateful" or something like that and then it all started. V DAY was brought up again (which was not my intention) and I learned a few things last night. the notable few: She apparently wasnt sorry in the end about the way she handled receiving my gift becaue last night all she could say was "I told you I didnt want to learn how to surf! You asked me 10 times and I kept on telling you the same thing!" She then accused me (she was kinda right) of sabotaging "her" night, but that ring didnt sound too good in my ears. I didnt want to deal with her at that moment (not too mention full blown fighting at her graduation formal!) so I went off mingling with other ppl and she followed me, nagging me and accussing me of ruining her night. I got angry at this and she started to cry. She wept in the corner and I got more: "You're ruining my night" as well as some "you're ruining my makeup" ..and a whole lot of "why do u hate me so much?"...at that point, I knew I wasnt dealing with a level headed person and I wanted out so I left the party. After picking up her what seemed like 10th call asking where I was, I told her I was on my way home and she basically told me in a roundabout way that it would be over if i didnt come back; That shes never been so insulted in her life and that she cant believe I did what i did. ITs funny how it didnt seem like she was crying anymore. I truly wanted to flirt with chance at that point but alas, a guilty conscience took control of me (afterall, it was her night) and I went back to find her and her friends. The ensuing rest of night was weird and awkward and manipulated by perhaps too much alcohol. All i know is that this is basically where it stands right now, as we didnt talk about it at all the rest of the night or this morning. I havent called her since this afternoon and all I can think about is how I want like a good 72 hours free from her so i can find out wtf I want to do...this is obviously a shytty situation, and as you can see, there is some serious communication lacking from this relationship....at the moment, I feel too much resentment to do anything (she probbaly feels the same way), so I just want to take a breather...

 

[Cesare Cardinali]

Wow bro, this girl sounds like a f*cking nightmare. My take on your situation is that you are ready to boot her and be done with it. She sounds moody, ungratefull, and just annoying as hell.

I am sure you can game her into temporarily treating you better and stuff, but overall this is not LTR material and she seems a little mentally unstable from what you wrote.

Move on.

Cesare Cardinali

 

[Wyldfire]

Just as I said on the other thread about this you started...

You both resent each other due to unmet expectation. The only chance for your relationship is to step out of the viscious circle and communicate. If you or she is unable to do that, it's not going to work.

 

[Donald Kaufman]

Not neccessarily over, but it might take more to find out

Ignore me if I'm wrong but I sense you are angry at each other for the faults you see in yourself. A classic.

You only give a few examples but I will believe they are emblematic as you have presented them to be.

I've used this example before but ...

In high school a big event comes up and the BF and GF go out to buy gifts for each other.

They guy goes out and tries to buy a slightly girlified version of what he would like to get. Something a little practical, some hint of sentimentality that does something or helps you do something. Something he knows something about, maybe an MP3 player.

She goes out and gets something less practical, more sentimental that is about creating or re-enforcing a feeling. Something she knows something about, maybe a sweater.

Both feel they have been thoughtful and given the person what they need. Both are disappointed. The first few times this kind of thing happens they will grin and bear it. The more it happens the less smiling they can manage.

He says, "I've got 10 sweaters, I like them all better then this one. She doesn't get my taste. Why doesn't she just buy me something I can use."

She says, "Anyone could buy me a player. It doesn't show he understands me. If he really knew me he would know what I like and surprise me with something that shows he knows me."

Of the gifts they bought he says, "She is always talking about other people's players. Keeps saying she's going out to buy one but brings back candles or incense instead. I really did listen to what she was saying. I gave her what she says she needs. I went to my electronic store and went into the gurly section and bought the one in her favorite color. I would never have bought that one for myself. I don't know what she's talking about."

She says, "He's always wearing these old sweatshirts with these logos for things that don't even exist anymore. He says he's going out to get a new one and comes back with one with some stupid team on it. Where can you go wearing sports paraphernalia. He needs something he can wear somewhere nice. I go to my mall, into the store where we bought those pants and bought one that just feels warm and says all the right things. You could wear it at a romantic restaurant or at a theatre. I don't know what he wants."

Excuse the stereo types but it's pretty easy to see what is going on. They both go out of their way to get the other what they themselves really want.

The more this goes on the shriller things get. She starts crying and he tries to explain how she shouldn't be feeling what she is feeling. He needs some quiet time to deal with the blow to his ego and she tries to draw him out so he can talk it out. (I'm starting to sound like that "mars/venus" loser. Somebody shoot me)

Over and over you both do what you want the other to do. You are incredibly similar. Maybe too similar. One of you has to step out of this and get some perspective and figure out if you can change this.

When you both tried to make an effort you put a fresh face on it and tried really hard. This time you get to the tired cycle faster because you recognize the frustration faster.

Trying makes things worse if you keep blindly trying to do the exact same things. You keep not getting the response you want, so you try harder. You are both trying to be the person you wish the other person was. For that to work you have to be opposites.

Take a step back and try to figure out what is the base of the behaviours you choose. Either work on those or work on finding some one who compliments your "style".

Good luck.

 

[Wyldfire]

lol...Donald, that was funny and SO true. With the exmples he gave us, yes, that is what happened exactly. I think there's a bit more to it than just the gifts, though. It sounds like there are some resentments built up from a lack of effective communication, too. At the same time, there is a VERY good chance that each of them are trying to get their needs in the relationship met by giving their partner what they need. He should pay close attention to the gestures she is making towards him and try mirroring them. If he sees it having a positive impact he should talk to her about it and ask her to try to make the kind of gestures to him that he used to make to her in an attempt to give her what he thought she needed.

Like I told him on another thread...it does sound like they at least WANT to please each other, otherwise they wouldn't have been so hurt over each other's reactions to the gifts. It looks more and more to me like the desire to make things work is there...and that they just are missing the mark because they are trying to give the other person what they, themselves want. Since women and men have different needs in a relationship, that approach just isn't going to cut the mustard. If the desire to make each other happy weren't so obviously there, I would tell him to just end it. But I really think they can patch this up with some good, open and effective communication.

 

[bp1974]

I'd like to point out to you that no-one makes another person feel anything. When you do something, she feels something about it. Someone else would feel something different. You are not responsible for how she feels, you can't amke her feel happy or sad. How she feels is her business and is based on the entire history of her life.

Same goes the other way round. You are responsible for your feelings. Regardless of her actions, she has not made you feel anything.

This is very important. Until you know that all of your feelings, pleasant and unpleasant, are your own, you will both continue to blame each other for the bad feelings you have and continue to rely on each other for the good ones too.

And I agree about the gifts. Gifts are gifts, nothing more, nothing less. As soon as they become invested with meanings above and beyond what they are, people get disappointed. Just because you bought her a gift she hates doesn't mean you don't know her or love her. You bought her something that was more about you than about you giving her a gift.

 

[NewMan]

I've got 2 words for you.

Passive Agressive.

Your both being passive agressive - and it's your's as much as her fault.

Bottom line is - it's not going to work out. Anyone can see that. All of your actions to her are negative and agressive - and her's to you.


Look, how hard would of it been for you to say "Thanks" - gave her a kiss for the cup cake?

You make excuses by saying it's been in her bag all day, you don't want to get your hands dirty etc. SO WHAT. Get a plate, get a fork and eat it. If only half of it. And tell her you like it.

But you didn't - because that was a way (as silly as it sounds) you can get back at her (passive agressive) - same goes for her formal.

You talk about "Work" in a relationship. And true, relationship's are work and effort. But the work and effort should not be going into your basic relationship with each other. The work and effort - should go into keeping the relationship alive. Not into being able to get along with each other - which is where you two are at.

It's such a destructive relationship.

Your both having a go at each other consistantly.

Sure it may change for a couple of weeks - but you can not expect to be able to just wipe this slate clean and forget about the past.

Which is why you are fighting all of the time.

Sorry to say it - but this relationship is dead.

 

[Cesare Cardinali]

NewMan wrote:

relationship's are work and effort. But the work and effort should not be going into your basic relationship with each other. The work and effort - should go into keeping the relationship alive. Not into being able to get along with each other - which is where you two are at.

This is right on the money.

 

[Wyldfire]

Although I agree with all of the posts made on this thread so far...I am going to go out on a limb here and say that even though the observations about the relationship made by others is right, I do think there is a slight chance to turn things around...IF both of them REALLY want to do so. Again...I only say that because of how it seems that they both at least try to do things to please each other. They're both pretty young and probably don't have much experience with relationships. If he can step back from the viscious cycle they've fallen into and ACT instead of REACT, and if she responds well to that there might still be some hope for their relationship. And while many might tell him to just not bother and leave, I think at the very least it would be good practice if he tries to sort it out. He doesn't have anything to lose by testing out some of the suggestions I have given him (on the other thread he started), and at the very least he will improve his own communication skills. And who knows...it might workout for him and if it does, then he will have gained a better relationship out of it.

 

[FratAndDiddy]

dude, youre in deep
too deep for me.
i would run. life is too short for chickies playing with your head, both heads for that matter.

 

[Albion4]

Doomed, change your phone number, move to another country, whatever it takes to get out of it, do it. You're both just going to make each other miserable.

One thing everyone here fails to realize is that they're both young, he's 22 and she's what.. 18? Is that a highschool formal? Expecting an 18 year old to understand relationship with the opposite sex is like expecting a 3rd grader to understand multiplication and long division after the first lesson, it just doesn't happen. I believe at that age most people are still trying to come to grips with the idea that men and women think completely differently. Their expectations of the opposite sex are completely skewed toward the way they ack in the relationship.

What you need to do is learn from the mistakes both of you made and not bring them to the next relationship.

1) Learn ******** a bit better.
2) Learn your woman. If you have to write things down to remember, then write them down.
3) Remember dates. Again, if you need to write them in a calendar, then write them in a calendar.
4) It doesn't matter what a gift is or in what condition it's in. It's the thought that matters. You should have happily accepted the cupcake then tossed it into the toilet when she wasn't looking.

Anyway, I hope you have better luck the next time.

-Al

 

[jbbrain]

i want to get back to everybody eventually, but I can't now...ultra busy with things...thanks to those who took a particular interest in the subject (Wyldire you!)

but to clear any confusion, I'm 23 and she's 21. This was her College Ball.

 

[jbbrain]

UPDATE

Hey guys,

A little update because I know you guys think this is juicier than an issue of "US" weekly..

All this happened on Saturday, she came over Monday during the day to talk. I outlined that I thought that although I love her, I basically thought thought that this was a dysfunctional relationship and we talked about everything I felt was needed for this relationship to work...If you must know, it was everything that was written on this thread. I talked about our lack of comm., I talked about how I overreacted with the V day gift, I talked about how expectations have to be enacted only with full communication... I talked about how we're responsible for our own happiness etc.she agreed about everything. Then, I apologized for my part in what happened at the formal. Apparently this is what was bothering her most...the fact that "I brought up this fight" during what was apparently her most sacred night in her life...In truth, I never did want to brin it up..at the same time, I couldnt pretend everything was fine and amazing and i only brought it up after she insisted i was 'ruining her night' by being so distant.

This is when she began bawling again and started aggressively accusing me (once again) of ruining (singlehandedly) her formal out with her friends..She couldnt believe that I made her cry and that after what seemed like an eternity of her weeping, accusing me over and over again of fvcking u[p her night (in the end, I even tried to console her, but she wasnt ready), that I would actually leave the formal itself just so that I could clear my head. Like you all know, I did come back for her, becayuse i thought it was an ill advised decision to just leave it, mostly because I knew that without a doubt it would have been over if I never came back. I wanted to have that choice.

In the end, we very half assedly resolved the whole graduation formal thing, and that led me to come over to her place at 3am last night after I finished working at my bar.There were more tears, more accusation of ruining her night and asking me over and over again I could have done what I did knowing how much the night meant to her.

This was getting slightly ridiculous so I insisted with a retort that "No, I didnt 'ruin' your night..you let yourself ruin your night." in the end, yeah, I was an active participant in the "fight" but she perpetuated it just as much as I did, attacking me in ways that prompted a brief shouting match. Besides, i told her, 'ruining' someones night (especially one which she conveninetly labelled one of the most important in her life) is a very heavy burden to bare, and I didnt feel I was ready for it, or deserved it. This got her even more angry because she was thinking I was just being defensive and stubborn when all along i had been sincerely apologizing for what I did. She didnt think i was sincere and she made some comments that were intended to poke me in the ribs about how insincere she thought I was...

Bah. We feel asleep and she left in the morning.

It's funny how much I could have 'ruined' her night when I'm not even so sure she wanted me there in the 1st place. Maybe because she could fortell that something like this would happen? In the morning when I got up and got on her computer and saw a piece of paper right beside it in full view talking about how much she resented me and how i ruined this and even that, "ironically or sadly" she didnt even want me there in the 1st place. I probbaly should have put the paper away, but I continued to read the short paragraph. She wrote that she thought that the relationship was almost over and went on and on about why and how i could have hurt her the ways i did.

PHEWWW. To all those who helped me through this drama, I just want to thank you for your help and courteously accept mostly all of your suggestions that, indeed, this relationship is DEAD and over with. I know I can put the work to patch this up with good communication and other things, even though it appears that her resent towards me, although probbaly temporary, has hit a whole new plateau. The strange thing is, I don't have the will or the desire to patch things up and "work through yet another issue"...we've ben fighting quite a bit over the past couple months and it just drains me to no end. I'm sick and tired of being mad. I think I would be doing both of us a favour by ending it...(I think she may be too chicken shyt to do it herself) so I've basically decided that thats what I'll do...besides, this is her graduating year, finishing up in april, and she has given me no details whatsoever (even after i ask her) about what she decides to do fullwell knowing my plans to stick around in Montreal for the summer..

It's going to be hard..we had so many good times over a year and a half...but I'm still young, handsome and should realize when its time to cut my losses and move on...

This will be an experience all unto itself. Wish me luck!

 

[Nitemare]

Simple:
You already broke off the relationship in the past. Meaning- You were willing to give up everything with her and not look back.

Mistake--You came back to her. So now, the relationship will never be the same, and will never work...I stopped reading after you said you broke it off.
You leave- stay that way. You go back- you are wasting your time and hers...
enjoy!

 

[Wyldfire]

She's not able or willing to do her part to fix things. You can't do it alone...it would take cooperation.

Your relationship needs to be ended immediately because if you stay with her at this point it will only get worse.

 

[Cesare Cardinali]

Dude, it's very simple, unless the girl is exceptional to you or unless you are married and have kids (i.e. a large investment) you should eject when it is giving you more pain than pleasure. Sure, with high self esteem and good game, any situation can be turned around, but you've also got to know and trust your instincts when things are just not right between you two. Be the man and walk away. Refuse to even discuss why you fight or whatever...