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Internet Suppression - Your Thoughts?

Serenity

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Since there are a few scandinavians here (though AttackFormation seems to have disappeared) and you all, like the American's, have free speech I'm wondering whether that has significantly affected the response to covid there?
I think the quality of education is a larger contributor than the fact that we have free speech. There have been debates and such about it, but I'd say most people are educated enough to understand how covid is a problem for everyone and that some things need to be done.

It's no secret that many parts of America has atrocious education and it's nowhere near as prioritized as it should be. So what you get is a population who believes the sh!t they read on Facebook and other questionable "sources".

In Scandinavia, as we have seen that you have freedom of speech but also a tendency for these countries to be comparatively left leaning (certainly, like most countries, when compared to the US).
As if freedom of speech and certain left leaning policies are somehow mutually exclusive? We are democratic countries, the people voted to have the general politics we have. Some countries in Europe are more to the left and others more to the right compared to others. Most of it is a mix of both sides, which isn't such a bad idea if you ask me. This extremely dualistic view of politics prevalent in America isn't helping anyone over there, not everything is mutually exclusive.

Are the vaccination rates high in Scandanavia? I'm getting that impression. The word has obviously got out in the US about how
dangerous the vaccines are.
It's 70% fully vaccinated and 8% more if counting those who has gotten the first dose here in Norway. That's the vast majority of the adult population. I only personally know one person above the age of 18 who isn't vaccinated (by choice), the rest who are vaccinated experienced at worst fever and a sore arm for a day or two.

There was one vaccine that showed having potentially serious side effects in very rare cases, the government immediately stopped using it, just in case.

Given there is so much fear everywhere, I'm wondering whether anywhere has really escaped these irrational responses, largely driven by disinformation emanating from governments and the MSM everywhere.
It's as if nobody gives a fvck about the pandemic anymore in this country, it's mostly back to normal and restrictions are gone entirely in most municipalities. We just hit a new high on daily new infections, but I mean, the vast majority is vaccinated so it's not that big of a deal. The vaccine is working as far as I can tell, there's more infected than ever and less people who require hospitalization. Extremely few die.

Old news, the world goes on.
 

HaleyBaron

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It's no secret that many parts of America has atrocious education and it's nowhere near as prioritized as it should be. So what you get is a population who believes the sh!t they read on Facebook and other questionable "sources".
It's less to do with education and more to do with no common sense or ground-level education being taught. I would say education is actually the problem over here more than anything cause it is not teaching critical thinking skills to kids. By the time I was leaving school, the curriculum was changing from ground-based thinking to the more streamlined education of today. And it shows with how robotic a lot of kids and young adults think. Even those in my generation who are easily swayed by indoctrination methods or just anything they see on the news. This is correlated with lack of good parents, lots of student debt, and little progression from poor to middle class due to the stiffening of our economy.

Education is not that important, at least the kind that seems marketed in current culture.
 

Serenity

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It's less to do with education and more to do with no common sense or ground-level education being taught
Well, that would to my mind be what actual education is all about, common sense and critical thinking. I see it's so bad that you hesitate to call real education for what it is. The simple unstimulating indoctrination you're talking about isn't education, it's indoctrination. Let's not assist in warping the meaning of education to describe what's really just indoctrination.

So, as I said, atrocious education.

I can vividly remember my education to be very much centered around critical and independent thinking. Getting the answer itself somewhat right is just half the answer, showing the ability to think and reflect considering many different sources is the other half. It's still the way we educate.
 

Morpheus

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Hi Serenity,

Firstly, thank you for your thoughtful response.
I think the quality of education is a larger contributor than the fact that we have free speech. There have been debates and such about it, but I'd say most people are educated enough to understand how covid is a problem for everyone and that some things need to be done.
I agree that education is significant, though what I am more aware of is the pervasiveness of a single overriding 'narrative' dominating the public sphere which seems to be comparatively uniform across the western world. My problem with it is that it seems to be at odds with both the sciences involved (vaccinology, immunology, virology, general medical science) and with central principles of western medical ethics (eg. informed consent).
It's no secret that many parts of America has atrocious education and it's nowhere near as prioritized as it should be. So what you get is a population who believes the sh!t they read on Facebook and other questionable "sources".
I would probably disagree with this, though the range of education across the US is inherently very diverse, and I'm probably most familiar with post graduate end of it which is very sophisticated but, to say the least, not available to everyone. Ultimately, we run into the problem that the US is a very different type (and probably also scale) of society. You may very well be right about a lower priority being placed upon education in the US.
As if freedom of speech and certain left leaning policies are somehow mutually exclusive? We are democratic countries, the people voted to have the general politics we have. Some countries in Europe are more to the left and others more to the right compared to others. Most of it is a mix of both sides, which isn't such a bad idea if you ask me. This extremely dualistic view of politics prevalent in America isn't helping anyone over there, not everything is mutually exclusive.
Secondly, as it does seem to be a point of contention, I didn't really say that freedom and speech and left leaning policies are mutually
exclusive. Though, I guess I do see a tension. The left (certainly at present) in many countries is very inclined towards censorship, so this is, at the least, it seems, a complex issue. The Scandinavian countries do seem somewhat unusual, much as the US is.

Thirdly, education and left leaning policies is a different issue again. I would expect the quality of education to be high in both
Scandanavia and the US, although the education systems are, I dare say, worlds apart. Education in the US is far more of a private
business and so is more expensive for individuals, though the two cultures are, I guess, in general worlds apart.

I certainly don't want to equate Belgium with Scandinavia, but I did spent a year or two in the university system there, and it did have its down sides as well as its upsides, compared to the Australian university system (which seems to derive from the Scottish one). One down side which I found very striking there was, relative to Australia, that there was very little feedback on one's work. All that one would get back on an essay was a mark or grade, that was it. So, not much customer service you could say. By the same token, education was, however, very accessible there.
It's 70% fully vaccinated and 8% more if counting those who has gotten the first dose here in Norway. That's the vast majority of the adult population. I only personally know one person above the age of 18 who isn't vaccinated (by choice), the rest who are vaccinated experienced at worst fever and a sore arm for a day or two.

There was one vaccine that showed having potentially serious side effects in very rare cases, the government immediately stopped using it, just in case.
Thanks for this.

I wasn't really sure as to what the response to covid there (in Scandinavia) was like. I get the impression that the Swedish response
was rather unique even within Scandinavia and some have suggested that it was almost accidental that they responded as they did. Anyway, their response to the vaccination side of covid seems far less unique.

At present, I'm leaning towards seeing the differences in response as being cultural (though obviously more needs to be said than this).
It's as if nobody gives a fvck about the pandemic anymore in this country, it's mostly back to normal and restrictions are gone entirely in most municipalities. We just hit a new high on daily new infections, but I mean, the vast majority is vaccinated so it's not that big of a deal. The vaccine is working as far as I can tell, there's more infected than ever and less people who require hospitalization. Extremely few die.

Old news, the world goes on.
We will see I guess. I'm rather sceptical of the transition back to normality being as smooth as most people think. But that is probably better argued by Geert vanden Bossche than me.

It does seem like very few people have heard of him, which also isn't really that surprising. Like Malone and McCullough, he has been the target of much censorship but also comparatively little critical engagement with his views from those supporting the 'narrative'. I'll try to post some of his views, when I get a chance, because, I appreciate, I have tended to take his views for granted in my posts.
 

PowerQuest

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HaleyBaron

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Well here we go again and it makes med sort of sad :cry: because its my home country:
They are so power hungry that they cannot let go of the power they had. So now Mette Frederiksen and Co is adding back the darn covid passport and the restrictions. :mad:
I have peers who have been through many generations and they say that the one thing politicians will never do is admit they were wrong due to the way election careers work. And that when the government ever decides to invest money and time in an issue, they never let up until many years later.

As the old saying goes, restaurants will make a chicken sandwich to compete against Popeye's new sandwich within a week. If the government had a restaurant, it would take them two years to update their menu.
 

Morpheus

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Well here we go again and it makes me sort of sad :cry: because its my home country:
They are so power hungry that they cannot let go of the power they had. So now Mette Frederiksen and Co is adding back the darn covid passport and the restrictions. :mad:
Yes. That didn't take very long did it. I hope and suspect that this time around, the responses will be more divergent, much as we have seen increasing divergences between the different state responses in US. Hopefully people are paying attention, although, as usual, it's going to be difficult to judge what is really happening where. The contrast with Sweden is already being noted:


coronavirus-surge.png

Sweden vs EU.jpg

On internet censorship, this has presumably be been quite a boon for American websites, like zerohedge and others. I only know one website in Australia where one can openly discuss the response to covid. Also, the zerohedge commentors, and there were a lot of them for a story on Denmark, seem to have heard about vanden Bossche.
 
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Morpheus

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TLDR: Expect mass vaccination programs to drive vaccine resistant variants of SARS-Covid-2 into dominance, rendering the current vaccines useless
This is an attempt to outline Geert vanden Bossche's views, which I have tended to take for granted in my earlier posts. I think they are important because they provide the clearest indication as to how the SARS-Covid-2 virus is likely to evolve dynamically given the selection pressures placed upon it by the pervasive covid mass vaccination programs around the world.

In brief, he (along with Malone & McCullough) argues that vaccine resistant variants will develop and become the dominant ones. Indeed, there is already considerable evidence that the now dominant delta variant (in spite of pre-dating the vaccines) has already largely escaped the current vaccines. We are entering into an arms race with a virus that we simply cannot win.

The following is probably one of the better interviews concerning the population level and dynamic issues (which vanden Bossche has tended to emphasise and which stand behind many of their policy proposals), since it brings both Malone and vanden Bossche together. It is, needless to say, actually rather complicated, but hopefully, by listening to these people, you should at least become aware of just how simplistic and misinformed the pervasive public narrative about covid (which seems mainly intended to sell vaccines) is. The discussion exemplifies a conversation based upon reason and evidence as opposed fear and hate.

It is also quite long but note that many issues are not discussed here at all (vaccine injury, individual cost (risk) to benefit ratios, anti-viral therapeutics and early treatment - for these I would recommend Drs Malone and McCullough).


Some (rough) time stamps and the topics covered:

Background

The mRNA technology

Worked together before

12.00

Both celebrated by anti-vaxers?

17.00

Geert's initial warning in March 2021 about mass vaccination in the middle of a pandemic.

Where are we now relative to your predictions?

20.30

The data from Israel.

26.00

The vaccinated as superspreaders.

28.00

Geert: High vaccination rates mean waves around a high plateau of infection rates.

29.00

The non-vaccinated, as infection sinks, reduce the infectious pressure.

32.00

With increased vaccination, the waves decline and then we are left with a very high plateau, just waiting for the big wave.

33.00

Robert: Just to paraphrase that.

34.30

Geert: The problem is not with individuals being vaccinated but with mass vaccination driving escape mutant strains into dominance at the population level.

36.20

Fact checkers

42.00

Mass vaccination

The more one vaccinates, the more selection pressure, which means more infectious variants, which become dominant.

46.15

UK data

48.30

Robert paraphrases.

Vaccination provides a very narrow immune response (focused upon just the spike protein).

This will lead to convergent evolution.

52.30

Philip: The current vaccines target the original form of the virus, and so encourage variants which differ from it.

55.00

Geert: It is not increasing virulence but increasing infectiousness (driven by high rates of vaccination) that is the problem.

It is increasing infectious pressure that is driving the increasing vulnerability of younger populations.

1.00

Philip: We have stopped looking at the details.

1.01

Robert: This is a two phase disease:

pulmonary phase

inflammatory cytokine storm phase

ADE (antibody dependent enhancement)

1.05

ADE and the waning phase of immune response window.

1.11

Philip: What will the regulators be thinking now and what would you being saying?

1.12

Geert: The regulators are used to vaccines tested in well defined clinical trials.

But this thing is evolving which is something which these guys have no experience with.

1.15.30

Robert: I can speak to the US.

The FDA operates on the basis of checklists. There is not a whole lot of thinking. Policy thinking does not occur at the FDA.

They have admitted that they cannot evaluate the safety very well.

Fauci (the executive) is setting policy.

1.20.00

The director of the FDA adds another group (to the high risk group). The CDC advisory group rejects that addition. The director of the the CDC overruled the advisory group (this is Fauci again).

1.22.00

The CDC: They are policy advisory. They are largely funded to promote vaccines. They also have the (underfunded) function of ensuring vaccine safety.

1.24.00

Malone and Navarro's US policy recommendations (a four point strategy)

There was no response.

1.30

Geert: We have to stop the mass vaccination.

We have to stop vaccinating the younger age groups.

They are our only hope for herd immunity. What is the aim now? There isn't one.

1.35.30

What about tomorrow? We will ultimately end up with is resistance. Anti-virals will be all we have left once we have vaccinated everyone.

Nature will win.

1.39.00

Compare the ratio of disease in the vaccinated to the unvaccinated.

Try to find these numbers.

1.41.00

Robert: The UK data is paradoxical. In the vaccinated, more death but less severe disease.

1.42

Auto immune risks

Original antigetic sin (new strains will be poorly matched with existing antibody responses)

1.44.00

The assumption that 'more is better' (vaccination after natural infection, boosters) is not true.

1.46.00

Geert: Discrimination is scientific nonsense.

1.48

Variation in shedding.

1.52.00

End
Dr Philip McMillan (Vejon Health) was the first to interview Geert and you can find lots of other related (long) interviews on his channel. Geert has also been interviewed by lots of other people (eg. Bret Weinstein, Chris Martenson, Matt Wong etc.)
 

PowerQuest

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It seems that people are finally starting to wake up and protest against the oppression against tyranny and the loss of our freedom rights? :up:
This gives me hope that we will have future still as free men and we will not be oppressed by politicians and governments.
Our forefathers has died for our freedom in past world wars, its our duty to protect our liberty.
 
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zekko

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This gives me hope that we will have future still as free men and we will not be oppressed by politicians and governments.
I am encouraged that there are still people who want to have freedom. Too many want to trade their freedom for safety, and to put themselves under the care of the government for the rest of their lives.
 

PowerQuest

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I am encouraged that there are still people who want to have freedom. Too many want to trade their freedom for safety, and to put themselves under the care of the government for the rest of their lives.
I'm glad to hear that mate.
Our freedom is a precious "gift" from our ancestors which must be valued dearly. Millions of men before us has fought for it over hundreds of years going 800 years back to Magna Carta, (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magna_Carta). We must care for it.
 

HaleyBaron

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By now, you should all have the following opinions based on the actions of everyone who showed their hands:
  • The news lies.
  • Social media lies and is the equivalent of tabloids.
  • The medical industry is corrupt and has control of the government and a large sum of governments across the world.
  • The broadcasting power of this coalition is insanely big. Bigger than I ever realized.
  • Majority of people are sheep and will comply to avoid disrupting the safety of their lives. They are easily controlled through fear.
  • Most of the medicine science is flawed due to said corruption. Drinking alcohol is not healthier than sunlight.
  • Public schooling is unnecessary.
  • Everyone should have a gun and increase their independence to be less affected by changes of laws and mandates.
  • City life is communism in action. Race to bottom.
  • Morality is at an all time low.
  • Identity politics is the current hot religion, and will likely lead to Mao-like conditions in the future. History rhymes.
There's a lot more, but this is the basis.
 

zekko

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Oligarchy.
 

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PowerQuest

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Meanwhile the governments keep pushing for their retarded covid passports which is very concerning and creepy:

Watch the video too...
 
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