If hair and baldness really didn't matter

[BeDJ]

Kids, it's better to believe in PUA's selling you a pack of lies while trying to get laid than to admit defeat and blame it on your shortcomings.

Stagger,

Maybe it's not your hair, or looks, or wallet, or job, or body shape, or if you saved 15% by switching to Geico. Maybe it's you giving of this negative aura and nervous self-consciousness. Stop being that guy with a cloud raining over your head on a sunny day.

To add:

My hair started graying when I was 13. It started from the back and slowly worked its way completely. All through high school and college, I shaved my head. After coming back to this site, I let it grow out - peppery. I haven't dyed my hair once. Can't wait to flash my Senior Discount with a Silvertop.

 

[Mike32ct]

I think all we can do is pick a look that attempts to optimize whatever we have and "own it." Whether it's shaved, buzz, cut short, or doughnut hole lol, it is what it is.

Right now, my hair is cut shorter, and the hair dye has been lightened a bit. It looks ok, so I'm going to leave it for now.

Honestly, the only thing that bugs me is having to "change" hairstyles every so often to compensate. I find a style I love, but it becomes no good in a few years with less hair. But that's the way it goes.

But defintely take care of your skin guys. Yes, hair is critical, and hair loss can cost you points, but your face is at least as important, sometimes more.

 

[corrector]

Kids, it's better to believe in PUA's selling you a pack of lies while trying to get laid than to admit defeat and blame it on your shortcomings.

Stagger,

Maybe it's not your hair, or looks, or wallet, or job, or body shape, or if you saved 15% by switching to Geico. Maybe it's you giving of this negative aura and nervous self-consciousness. Stop being that guy with a cloud raining over your head on a sunny day.

Well, you are 25 years old.

Stagar Lee,

On the negative, I disagree with Stagger because I don't have any positive experience in my past that I can contrast with and say things are worst now than before with my thinning hair or being balding. When you have a negative baseline than things get better not worst.

I had a head full of hair when I was 30 and yonger. I can tell you that did not help me get laid, or get a girlfriend. In fact, if you have a youthful looking face, I'd figure that thinning hair and balding would give you more credibility when dealing with business and would make you look more mature if you had a youthful face to start with. The older I got, the more quality experiences I've had with women with the peak so far being last year. The girl I was with liked long hair and preferred that I didn't shave off my head completely to hide my baldness but had some hair on my head even though I had a bald spot.

So, in my personal experience, I can't conclusively say that I was better with girls when I was yonger. I think it was a disaster when I was yonger since I kept getting friendzoned, or I just pursued crushes in a haphazard way that didn't lead to dating (i.e. either they had bfs anyway or weren't interested), as I didn't have a car.

 

[Stagger Lee]

Maybe it's not your hair, or looks, or wallet, or job, or body shape, or if you saved 15% by switching to Geico. Maybe it's you giving of this negative aura and nervous self-consciousness. Stop being that guy with a cloud raining over your head on a sunny day.

Or maybe not. That sounds like advice Ann Landers or Dear Abbey would give.
When I took a break from using rogaine and a break from gaming women for about a year, my hair thinned, but when I started back up with dating I felt stronger and more positive. Despite that I was shocked that my success had plummeted from before. I would meet up with women and the attraction wasn't there from the get go and I couldn't get compliance from the women. Before, with thicker hair I could basically even brood on the meet up and the girl still basically hung in there to be closed on.

I don't give a sh!t about hair loss. But people even stoop to not respecting men with hair loss and women are turned off by it. It's similar to guys below average height, similar to old guys in a young nightclub etc. Appearance matters.

My hair started graying when I was 13. It started from the back and slowly worked its way completely. All through high school and college, I shaved my head. After coming back to this site, I let it grow out - peppery. I haven't dyed my hair once. Can't wait to flash my Senior Discount with my Silvertop.

I didn't get any gray hairs until into my 30's and I thought I was premature graying. Dye your hair and see if it doesn't make a difference. You seem unwillingly to accept that appearance matters and experiment with it.

 

[MikeOck]

Maybe it's not your hair, or looks, or wallet, or job, or body shape, or if you saved 15% by switching to Geico. Maybe it's you giving of this negative aura and nervous self-consciousness. Stop being that guy with a cloud raining over your head on a sunny day.

This times 1000.

Attitude is 90% of everything. You are what you believe you are, whether you accept it or not.

 

[corrector]

Why don't you just wear a wig?

So you are saying your whole success with women was wiped out because of your thinning hair? If you have it that bad and that's your only problem then buy a wig and glue it on.

If it's glued on properly every 2-3 weeks by a professional and competent hair studio and you have the right hairpiece that locks on propertly then it should work for you if its that bad.

 

[Stagger Lee]

Why don't you just wear a wig?

So you are saying your whole success with women was wiped out because of your thinning hair? If you have it that bad and that's your only problem then buy a wig and glue it on.

I consider myself not bad looking, but let's say you need to be a M6 to get any traction with females. I was probably around a 6 with good hair. With noticeable hair loss/bad hair a M6 can drop down to a 4-5 and below the minimum looks threshold. If you're a 7-9 to begin with, and with hair loss shaved or buzzed it, it would still lower success but you could still be a 6-7 and in the game.

I was similar to how you were when younger. Look young for my age, still fairly thick hair etc but not doing great with women. I was doing nothing and just about everything I did do was wrong and had little success. But up till my late 20's and in hindsight, many girls found me attractive and there were almost always girls I could have had for the taking.

It was after that and actually applying myself (lowering standards and numbers game) that I had peak success. I closed 4 new women in one week, and was closing about every other week, all younger women. Then the past few years coinciding with noticeable hair loss, things are much different now.

I will say after noticing a drop in success, I started to look at myself under a microscope. The skin on my face looks slightly more aged than I ever remember it being. I didn't think it was significant but I didn't think the hair thinning was either. It's possible it is a combination of hair thinning, some skin aging and just aging more over the past couple years.

If it's glued on properly every 2-3 weeks by a professional and competent hair studio and you have the right hairpiece that locks on propertly then it should work for you if its that bad.

I have heard of this, about many wealthy/business guys that go to these confidential and specialized salons that do this. They pay several hundreds a month or something. The idea of non-drug solution is appealing, but the whole idea of wearing a hairpiece weirds me out. And because of age, facial aesthetic, etc if good hair is only going to make me a 6, then it's not worth it.

 

[corrector]

I have heard of this, about many wealthy/business guys that go to these confidential and specialized salons that do this. They pay several hundreds a month or something. The idea of non-drug solution is appealing, but the whole idea of wearing a hairpiece weirds me out. And because of age, facial aesthetic, etc if good hair is only going to make me a 6, then it's not worth it.

If you look at your peak success that you just posted then it sounds worthwhile. Four women closed in one week yesterday vs nothing today.

 

[Trump]

Or maybe not. That sounds like advice Ann Landers or Dear Abbey would give.
When I took a break from using rogaine and a break from gaming women for about a year, my hair thinned, but when I started back up with dating I felt stronger and more positive. Despite that I was shocked that my success had plummeted from before. I would meet up with women and the attraction wasn't there from the get go and I couldn't get compliance from the women. Before, with thicker hair I could basically even brood on the meet up and the girl still basically hung in there to be closed on.

I don't give a sh!t about hair loss. But people even stoop to not respecting men with hair loss and women are turned off by it. It's similar to guys below average height, similar to old guys in a young nightclub etc. Appearance matters.

I didn't get any gray hairs until into my 30's and I thought I was premature graying. Dye your hair and see if it doesn't make a difference. You seem unwillingly to accept that appearance matters and experiment with it.

You have to work with what you have. What is said here is just giving you the right mindset. If girls don't like what they see and don't put their money down on it due to genetics, bad luck, bad decisions, not being lucky in life, change your selling tactics.

Yes appearance matters, looks matters, charisma matters, and sex sells, but you can't use it as an excuse. If you don't have appearance because of baldness, work on the other things.

 

[Stagger Lee]

If you look at your peak success that you just posted then it sounds worthwhile. Four women closed in one week yesterday vs nothing today.

That 4 closes within a week was a one time thing, kind of like when it rains it pours. It was more like one or two about every two weeks, and I was going out every night and probably doing about 40 approaches to one close.

Also, it seemed like my close ratio was about 50% when meeting up with a girl from online.

Some of them weren't bad looking and were younger than me, but really none of them were really attractive in my book. Although my friend who witnessed the pull of one of the 4 in a week, kept going on about how she was an 8. I didn't see her above a 6, and I spent more time with her to know. I never had success with the young, hot girls I'm attracted to.

So apparently, I was only a M6 playing numbers game and lowered standards.

Now, my online meet up close ratio seems to be in the single digit percentile, and I haven't really pulled a girl from the bar more than once or twice in the past year or so.

But yeah if I could wear a wig and make up and went out a lot I could pull many sub-HB6s by my scale again lol :cheer: .

 

[OptimumIndividual]

Jeezus. You are oozing bad beta vibes, OP. If you're this weak on a message board, I can only imagine how lame you are in person. Real men don't moan and groan about "oh i don't have a full head of hair, women think i'm lame". No...your attitude is lame. Women up pick on subconscious cues without even knowing that they're doing it. I guarantee you're giving off insecurity and mediocrity and they see it clear as day.

 

[jay07]

A majority of guys start losing their hair at some point. This thread is stupid.

 

[Stagger Lee]

A majority of guys start losing their hair at some point. This thread is stupid.

That's funny, a majority of guys start to lose their ability to pick up women at some point too if they ever had it.

I really don't care if some guys disagree. Over 5 to 8 years years ago after a few years of heavy gaming I concluded that appearance/looks caused attraction. Guys that I knew personally who couldn't even pick up argued with me then when I was picking up girls. So I don't give any weight to guys disagreeing with the importance of appearance today either.

 

[Zarky]

And if hair doesn't matter

OMG dude your comments are so boring.

First the only thing that mattered was facial attractiveness.

Now the only thing that matters is whether or not you have hair on your head.

What will it be next? The only thing that matters is how close your eyebrows are together?

"Everyone here says it doesn't matter how close your eyebrows are together! But yesterday I saw 3 guys with widely spaced eyebrows pick up girls while the 2 guys with monobrows were left alone. Come on guys, tell me it doesn't matter!"

 

[Stagger Lee]

OMG dude your comments are so boring.

First the only thing that mattered was facial attractiveness.

Now the only thing that matters is whether or not you have hair on your head.

What will it be next? The only thing that matters is how close your eyebrows are together?

"Everyone here says it doesn't matter how close your eyebrows are together! But yesterday I saw 3 guys with widely spaced eyebrows pick up girls while the 2 guys with monobrows were left alone. Come on guys, tell me it doesn't matter!"

I think you are losing it or something, or maybe you just like making strawman. I've always said physical appearance matters the most by far for many years now. I never said only having one physical trait is the only thing that matters. Facial symmetry, proportions and balance is probably the most important and many studies support that, but hair, skin, teeth and your mannerism are all important in the equation.

What I don't believe is you can just think or talk your way into being attractive as the mainstream and even some in the manosphere believe.

I believe women are turned off by appearance issue that are minor and you may not even realize. So that's why you may be dating fatties and uglies or not dating at all, while you believe it's because of "confidence" or mystical thinking.

 

[jay07]

That's funny, a majority of guys start to lose their ability to pick up women at some point too if they ever had it.

I really don't care if some guys disagree. Over 5 to 8 years years ago after a few years of heavy gaming I concluded that appearance/looks caused attraction. Guys that I knew personally who couldn't even pick up argued with me then when I was picking up girls. So I don't give any weight to guys disagreeing with the importance of appearance today either.

Your comments are annoying. Good looks are a huge part.

If youve never seen a bald dude with a hot chick get out more. I see it all the time.

Your problem is you look like george costanza cause you refuse to get fit and shave your head.

 

[corrector]

I believe women are turned off by appearance issue that are minor and you may not even realize. So that's why you may be dating fatties and uglies or not dating at all, while you believe it's because of "confidence" or mystical thinking.

You also mentioned facial expression. "Confidence" and mystical thinking affect how that expression looks like. If you don't look sure of yourself, then that is going to show on your face. If you are socially well adjusted and happy in your own skin then that's showing also in your face as well.

Also what aura you give out is also noticed. Now, I can tell you I have a serious, lawyer-like aura that intimidates women. Like I'm probing right through them when I look at them. I can see a cashier be friendly with all sorts of people, but when I'm next they tend to stiffen up and be more closed. Vibes are also something that people notice as well.

What people are saying is that your preoccupation with your hair may be effecting your aura, vibes, facial expression and the overall way you look physically which may have nothing at all to do with your hair. How do you know if someone's turned off by your hair, or they are turned off because you don't look sure of yourself in your eyes (i.e. because of your preoccupation with your hair)?

 

[Stagger Lee]

You also mentioned facial expression. "Confidence" and mystical thinking affect how that expression looks like. If you don't look sure of yourself, then that is going to show on your face. If you are socially well adjusted and happy in your own skin then that's showing also in your face as well.

Yes, but my point is non-verbal visual cues are still an appearance thing. Your non-verbals can be good or bad regardless of your inner thoughts. A person can be a basket case and low self esteem and can display very good non verbals, and a person can be fairly confident and happy and have poor non-verbals. But others can only believe and respond to the non-verbals they see.

Also what aura you give out is also noticed. Now, I can tell you I have a serious, lawyer-like aura that intimidates women. Like I'm probing right through them when I look at them. I can see a cashier be friendly with all sorts of people, but when I'm next they tend to stiffen up and be more closed. Vibes are also something that people notice as well.

What I object to here is the terms "aura" and "vibe" since that suggests other people are actually reading your thoughts and mentality. Let's put aside the halo effect of good looks. I believe others are only reading your mostly visual cues or your affect.

The thing you have to consider in your example is that let's say you smile and disarm the female cashier (or any female you encounter anywhere) and she responds positively, that's not sexual attraction. While it's not good for attraction to have cold, starring and poker face expressions, having a friendly inducing affect is not attraction. I known guys who lacked in looks but were very good at disarming and having friendly interactions with females but it was not attraction. It's better than "creeping" the girls out but it's still not attraction.

What people are saying is that your preoccupation with your hair may be effecting your aura, vibes, facial expression and the overall way you look physically which may have nothing at all to do with your hair. How do you know if someone's turned off by your hair, or they are turned off because you don't look sure of yourself in your eyes (i.e. because of your preoccupation with your hair)?

Because I never suspected there was a problem in the first place. I was more upbeat and confident feeling than ever. Then I noticed a trend of less success and then looked for what could be different. There was nothing I was doing differently than what I have been doing all these years before that was working. I wasn't getting attraction or compliance from the get go.

 

[corrector]

What I object to here is the terms "aura" and "vibe" since that suggests other people are actually reading your thoughts and mentality. Let's put aside the halo effect of good looks. I believe others are only reading your mostly visual cues or your affect.

But the visual cues or affect is influenced by your thoughts and mentality. If you are deeply thinkig about something then you are going to look distracted. If you are talking to a girl on the phone while you looking at something on the internet, the girl will know she doesn't have your full attention, even if you are talking with her.

The thing you have to consider in your example is that let's say you smile and disarm the female cashier (or any female you encounter anywhere) and she responds positively, that's not sexual attraction. While it's not good for attraction to have cold, starring and poker face expressions, having a friendly inducing affect is not attraction. I known guys who lacked in looks but were very good at disarming and having friendly interactions with females but it was not attraction. It's better than "creeping" the girls out but it's still not attraction.

What do you define as attraction? A girl is supposed to throw herself at you? She's suppose to give her number out?

I get jealous sometimes when I see a guy and woman lauging together or having a nice social connection since I'm too stiff for that to happen, and if it does happen I'm going to feel like "wow", did * that * just happen? Me opening up and having fun with a woman is like out of the ordinary, especially in a shopping environment.

So, I take it you are having very happy interactions with women, you are making them laugh, they are enjoying your company, and you are just getting friendzoned because you have thinning hair? Is that your story then?

Because I never suspected there was a problem in the first place. I was more upbeat and confident feeling than ever. Then I noticed a trend of less success and then looked for what could be different. There was nothing I was doing differently than what I have been doing all these years before that was working. I wasn't getting attraction or compliance from the get go.

So, you weren't getting numbers? You were not meeting people from the internet (i.e. what age did you post on your profile/what pics did you put up? would you lie about your age if you thought that would help?). Were you getting kiss closes? f-closes? Marriage proposal closes (MPCs)?