"How I Made Sure No Woman Ever Friend-Zoned Me Again"

She calls you when her car breaks down. When she needs help moving. When some guy she's actually dating treats her badly.

You're the listener. The reliable one. The guy who would treat her so much better, if she'd just open her eyes.

She won't. You trained her to see you as the low-effort option — the friend who requires zero risk and zero investment. Every favor dug the hole deeper.

The "22 Rules" break the pattern. You'll stop auditioning for a role she already cast and become the man she chases instead. It starts with Rule 1.

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How to react after a possible flake? Is it possible to retrieve the situation?

Firefly

Don Juan
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Went out with a 9 last Friday. Things went very well, with lots of ****y and funny behaviour on my part and lots of interested behaviour on her part including her initiating Kino a few times. She asked me if I could meet up with her two days later, and I said I was busy but could contact her if I was available. So far so good.

Then I got a bit desperate, and called her the next morning. ( :cuss: at myself) I told her I was not free during the day on Sunday, but could meet up in the evening. She declined and sounded a little less interested.

I left it for five days, and then called to ask her out for tonight. She agreed. However, this morning she sent me a text to cancel, saying she was asked to work tonight. It is possible that this is true (the text came at the right time, and she is working as an au pair so I know they can often be called in at the last minute) and the tone of the text was friendly and jokey. However, she did not suggest an alternative date to meet.

So is this situation irretrievable? Does it sound like she has completely lost interest? Or should I wait a few days and contact her again?
 

"She Laughed All Night. Then She Ghosted You. Here's Why."

Dinner ran three hours. She laughed at everything. You walked her to her car thinking this one's locked in.

Then: nothing. Two texts. No reply. What happened?

You did what most men do on a great date. You filled every silence, answered every question, and left her with nothing to wonder about. No mystery. Nothing to sit with when she got home.

Rule 3 of the "22 Rules" changes the ending: tell her a little, hold back the rest, and let her imagination do the chasing. The ghosting stops too.

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Firefly

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Oh, and my response to her text cancelling was a simple "No problem. :)". Was that also an appropriate response?
 

Mr. Goods

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The "two strike" rule is in play here. If she flakes on you twice - in this case, without a counter-offer as well, then she's OUTTA HERE! It's so early into the dating with you two that nothing has cemented yet. It's not a LTR we're discussing here.

As for what you should do next, I'd let it go for now. No need to dwell on it. For whatever reason, she lost interest (it's happened to me and many others here too). Keep an eye out for other girls. If this girl is really interested in you, she'll be sure to let you know.
 

Kailex

Master Don Juan
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If this girl were a 6, would you know how to react to a possible flake? Would you be as interested in making this work as if it were a 9?

It just seems to me that the only reason why you want to "retrieve the situation" is because she's a 9. Just think of her as any other woman and deal with her accordingly.

Yes, she went from high interest to 0, and you'll learn from what you did "wrong". There's no need to get desperate because she wanted to see you on Sunday. You did well except for two things:

(1) Call her the next morning to see her "right away"
(2) The following:


Firefly said:
lots of interested behaviour on her part including her initiating Kino a few times.
Where's the part about YOUR kino? Where's the part about you being sexual with her or kissing her or anything like that?

You went from Mr. SoSuave to Mr. SoDesperate in less than 12 hours without even hinting to this forum that you made some moves.

I'd say that the first time you tried to rearrange dates, it wasn't a flake. You tried to move it up from a Sunday to a Saturday, so conceivably, she had plans which is why she said Sunday in the first place.

But 5 days later with a call and then a flake: I'd say, you aren't in her priority list right now. If she were really high interest, she'd counter-offer or call YOU in the next few days to arrange something. Other than that, this one is flatlining.
 

Firefly

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Well, turns out this girl is an even bigger flake then I suspected!

So last night, I get a text saying "Do you have plans for tomorrow? I am sorry because of (flaking) today". The following text conversation occurs:

Me: "that's ok; buy me a ****tail and I might forgive you. Meet at 6?"
Girl: "Ok - no problem. What's the plan? Should I take the last train or can you drive me back home or something?"
Me: "Well, we can play it by ear but I will make sure you get home safely"

Then as I am driving into the city at 5:20 (about 40 minutes before we are supposed to meet as agreed). I get the following text:

Girl: "Hey. My friends have already plans for tonight - so I am not sure if I can come. Where do you want to go to and who will be there? Maybe they can change their plans."

Then the following text conversation occurs:

Me: "If you already have plans with your friends, perhaps you should meet with them tonight and meet with me on a night you are sure you can come. This is the second time you have cancelled on me; now I know not all (people from the country girl comes from) are reliable ... :p"
Her: "No, I don't want to cancel - I just have to know what we do and I can bring my friends. Or is that a problem for you?"
Me: "Ha ha - you are such a vague girl. When you say "you are not sure you can come" here, it means you are cancelling. Well a friend invited me to a club with her on (area) tonight; if you want, you and your friends can come along - that is about 9".
Her: "Ok. Thanks a lot. And I just had to ask 3 times ..."
Me: "Well, it is difficult to work out what you are saying via text; maybe it is your (country) accent? So coming along, or do you need to ask your friends permission first? :)"
Her: "Do you just want to tell me the plan for tonight or what???"
Me: "Such a grumpy girl! Lol. Anyway, the plan is clubbing on (area). LMK if you are in and I will let my friend know."

Haven't heard from her since. So did I mess up or is this girl just a flaky bint? I have to admit I was p*ssed off that she suddenly "had to" meet up with her friends 40 minutes before the time of our meeting. However, I am now wondering whether agreeing to meet up with this girl on a day's notice was a mistake on my part - damn my weakness for 9's! :) Ah well, if worst comes to worst, I will accept the invitation from my female buddy to go clubbing - We are just friends, but because she is a Swedish 9.5, everytime we go out together in public, I seem to end up hooking up just because women are such competitive types ... :)
 

"She Made Her Decision Before You Finished Your Sentence"

Three seconds. That's how long it took. Your shoes. Your posture. The way you held your drink. Whether you looked at the floor or looked at her.

She already filed you away. Interesting. Boring. Safe. Bold. Before you even opened your mouth.

Everything you say after that is just her confirming what she already decided.

So stop rehearsing lines. Fix the first three seconds. Stand tall. Look up. Smile like you mean it. Walk like you belong wherever you're standing.

The words come later. The impression comes first.

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