How does this reconcile with the social status/social proof thing?

[Mad Manic]

I have noticed that on average White men get higher quality black girls than the quality of white girls that black men get.. I already know why this is though, and so do you...LOL

Yep, socioeconomics is very important in male/female dynamics and with general human dynamics. Most people hook up and socialise/associate with people of the same race and class. Due to history and social conditioning there is still significant racial hierachy.

When a white girl is asked why she only dates white guys (if she does) she will often respond with saying that she was brought up in a white area, has a white culture and environment and thus that's what she is used to and fits in best with. Sounds like a reasonable argument. But then you see all these foreign girls and coloured girls hooking up with a mediocre white man at any slight opportunity and you then know all this familiarity drivel is just a fascade; it's about hierachy and whether one dates up or down in social class.

 

[Mad Manic]

White men are not more feminine. That makes no sense whatsoever.

The real reason is the media making it a sort of fashion statement. Women like to follow trends, get the latest 'in' thing.

They are seen as more feminine ... blacks have the well-endowed stereotype, atheltic body stereotype, gangster/crime stereotype etc. all pointing towards masculinity. As for your point, yes that's true, but it's a result of what I've mentioned. It's a lot lot harder to brainwash white girls into thinking chinese men are a viable option, for example.

MM

 

[slaog]

They are seen as more feminine ... blacks have the well-endowed stereotype, atheltic body stereotype, gangster/crime stereotype etc. all pointing towards masculinity. As for your point, yes that's true, but it's a result of what I've mentioned. It's a lot lot harder to brainwash white girls into thinking chinese men are a viable option, for example.

MM

Yes seen as. Blacks are better soccer players because they're more athletic but Whites are better rugby players (with the exception of the 2 wing positions where speed is valued most) where strength and endurance is needed.

 

[Mad Manic]

Yes seen as. Blacks are better soccer players because they're more athletic but Whites are better rugby players (with the exception of the 2 wing positions where speed is valued most) where strength and endurance is needed.

I think that's more to do with opportunity. Rugby is a middle class man's game tbh and that's why whites will do well at rugby, whereas football is more working class so that is more favourable to blacks than rugby is. Of the black people I know who were brought up in a middle class environment and thus played rugby from a young age, they are at/near the top amongst their peers, although this is only university level.

MM

 

[slaog]

I think that's more to do with opportunity. Rugby is a middle class man's game tbh and that's why whites will do well at rugby, whereas football is more working class so that is more favourable to blacks than rugby is. Of the black people I know who were brought up in a middle class environment and thus played rugby from a young age, they are at/near the top amongst their peers, although this is only university level.

MM

No its more to do with body shape. Blacks are faster because their bodys are designed for speed better than Whites. Look at scrummaging, Whites have bigger tigh muscles etc.

Compare MMA to boxing. Whites make better wrestlers but can't move around a boxing ring like Blacks.

I see your point but all the strongest men in the world are White. Thats all I'm saying, that Whites are not as feminine as made out.

 

[DonGorgon]

Yep, socioeconomics is very important in male/female dynamics and with general human dynamics. Most people hook up and socialise/associate with people of the same race and class. Due to history and social conditioning there is still significant racial hierachy.

When a white girl is asked why she only dates white guys (if she does) she will often respond with saying that she was brought up in a white area, has a white culture and environment and thus that's what she is used to and fits in best with. Sounds like a reasonable argument. But then you see all these foreign girls and coloured girls hooking up with a mediocre white man at any slight opportunity and you then know all this familiarity drivel is just a fascade; it's about hierachy and whether one dates up or down in social class.

Exaclly... exactly.!! i assume you read my thread then???
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=135152&highlight=socioeconomics

 

[DonGorgon]

I think that's more to do with opportunity. Rugby is a middle class man's game tbh and that's why whites will do well at rugby, whereas football is more working class so that is more favourable to blacks than rugby is. Of the black people I know who were brought up in a middle class environment and thus played rugby from a young age, they are at/near the top amongst their peers, although this is only university level.

MM

Ah yes Mad Manic, You think on a higher level!!! You understand the deeper side of things...

 

[DonGorgon]

I see your point but all the strongest men in the world are White. Thats all I'm saying, that Whites are not as feminine as made out.

So if that is true then why couldnt whites do the work that they stole and forced black slaves to do during colonialism????????????????????????????????????????

 

[slaog]

So if that is true then why couldnt whites do the work that they stole and forced black slaves to do during colonialism????????????????????????????????????????

Why do you think now? Why would somebody work when they could get people to do it for nothing?

 

[DonGorgon]

Why do you think now? Why would somebody work when they could get people to do it for nothing?

Actually early on may whites did try to do the work but could not survive the extremely harsh conditions .. Later on the success of the african workers is what lead to the massive slave trade later on...

 

[slaog]

Actually early on may whites did try to do the work but could not survive the extremely harsh conditions .. Later on the success of the african workers is what lead to the massive slave trade later on...

Harsh being hot I take it? It simply mean Whites are better suited to the cold.

Its besides the point anyway. I'm simply making the point that Whites are not naturally feminine.

 

[DonGorgon]

I'm simply making the point that Whites are not naturally feminine.

You are right... there are many very tough white dudes but the average black dude tries harder to portray himself as a tough guy than the average white guy, maybe cause the black guy has to try and compensate for is obviouse lack of financial power in comparison to white men in america... And the media is all too happy to help make the black man look thuggish and dangerous which is what he was viewed as since the end of slavery...

Both whites and blacks have the same propensity and capacity for success but historical events have lead to a culture where ones race has a direct effect on the number of hurdles placed in ones way on the journey to said success.

 

[ready123]

I THINK I understand the idea behind social status/social proof (actually all I understand is it's important as far as getting a woman. I really don't understand why its so important to women though).

Social proof is just an influence technique. It was first used in marketing and then the basic idea was applied to pick-up. Putting Michael Jordan on a box of Wheaties gives that box of cereal appeal even if you know nothing about the cereal. Being seen with a hot girl gives you value to other girls before they even know anything about YOU. Do you need social proof to be successful? No, it's just a superficial trick that gets blown up way too much on this board

But explain how this jives with the social status thing: how come for every white m/black f couple you see, there's maybe 50 white f/black m couples?

if you want to understand this you need to look at dating in terms of sociology and social norms. Asian Americans went through the same thing. Asian guys were emasculated while Asian women were exoticized. So there was this gender stratification that came up because of it. It all comes down to value, and when the majority places more social or sexual value on one gender within a specific ethnic group, you get wierd dating trends like this

But you can't tell me that it never raises any eyebrows among a white girl's friends when she first starts dating a black guy. Doesn't that mean it could hurt this guy's value as far as social status?

To keep it in perspective, most of the time when you start dating a girl, it'll raise an eyebrow among her friends. That has more to do with their friends being haters or not having met you than anything else.

My dad said he saw someone on tv say that the reason you see so many more white f/black m couples than white m/black f couples is because MEN are more concerned with what others think of their partner than women are! Which of course flies in the face of the social proof thing (I think). Anyone have an answer to this?

that's BS

 

[Mad Manic]

No its more to do with body shape. Blacks are faster because their bodys are designed for speed better than Whites. Look at scrummaging, Whites have bigger tigh muscles etc.

Compare MMA to boxing. Whites make better wrestlers but can't move around a boxing ring like Blacks.

I see your point but all the strongest men in the world are White. Thats all I'm saying, that Whites are not as feminine as made out.

Well you are looking at the very best of these sports, and when it comes down to the very best then things like funding, drugs, commitment, facilities, opportunity etc. are very important in creating that edge. I agree powerlifters and strongman tend to be white, but this is a tiny % of white males in general.

Although I will agree that a lot of the perception involved in blacks being tough guys is just nonsense perputrated from media and social conditioning, I don't agree that strongmen/powerlifters being white shows how whites are at least as tough as black guys. You could easily attribute that to something like; Greater opportunity + Finances + Facilities + Drugs + History of whites succeeding in the sport when blacks weren't even involved = Whites being more successful at it. But you can't really apply those arguments with sprinting, it's clearly a genetic propensity for blacks. Same with bodybuilding.

MM

 

[Mad Manic]

Social proof is just an influence technique. It was first used in marketing and then the basic idea was applied to pick-up. Putting Michael Jordan on a box of Wheaties gives that box of cereal appeal even if you know nothing about the cereal. Being seen with a hot girl gives you value to other girls before they even know anything about YOU. Do you need social proof to be successful? No, it's just a superficial trick that gets blown up way too much on this board

It may sound silly that people don't/can't think for themselves, but that is reality. Others' perception and one's reputation is very important and especially in college/school/enclosed environments it's even more important. Social proof is basically just a consequence of people needing group identities and a tendancy for humans to form packs. The better the pack you form and the greater the power you have within that pack, the more that you are admired simply because it's evolved as a trait that enables one to survive and reproduce. In the past it was being the strong man leading a pack of men to gather food, now it's the spikey haired white guy drinking alcohol and acting obnoxious at an 'exclusive' party.

MM

 

[L777]

Black men evolved from the slave days to chase white women and sex them as a way of revenge against their white male slave masters. Black women evolved to not have sex with white men because they raped them for 4 centuries. In addition black males are masculine, white females are feminine whereas black girls are quite masculine and white males more feminine than black men, all in general and relatively speaking. Those are basically the reasons.

MM

If you had even the faintest idea about the process of evolution, you'd realise that this is complete and utter bollocks.

Yes seen as. Blacks are better soccer players because they're more athletic but Whites are better rugby players (with the exception of the 2 wing positions where speed is valued most) where strength and endurance is needed.

And I hope that's a joke!! Black, world class (as in, top few in the world) soccer players: Ronaldinho, Eto, Drogba, Henry
White ones: C. Ronaldo, Old Ronaldo, Messi, Wayne Rooney, Steven Gerrard, Paul Scholes, Kaka, Zidane, Figo etc etc

Slightly off topic but come on....Americans know f.uck all about 'soccer' anyway.

 

[Mad Manic]

If you had even the faintest idea about the process of evolution, you'd realise that this is complete and utter bollocks.

Of course I do, the process of evolution within the human species takes thousands of years, a few centuries of slavery wouldn't be enough to enable these humans genetic programming to change per se. But I used the term 'evolved' in a more generic sense, meaning 'grew up being conditioned to' rather than something genetic or brainwired.

MM

 

[L777]

Of course I do, the process of evolution within the human species takes thousands of years, a few centuries of slavery wouldn't be enough to enable these humans genetic programming to change per se. But I used the term 'evolved' in a more generic sense, meaning 'grew up being conditioned to' rather than something genetic or brainwired.

MM

Just seems to me that you're obsessed with race and class, to your own detriment. I suggest you resolve these issues you have for your own sake!!

 

[Mad Manic]

Just seems to me that you're obsessed with race and class, to your own detriment. I suggest you resolve these issues you have for your own sake!!

I'm just sick of seeing social groups where everybody is the same race, white men taking all the women and foreign girls who can't speak english hooking up with a white guy despite having nothing in common, in a uni where less than 40% are white and the rest is very diverse. That's racial hierachy, and after 3 years of it I've had enough.

MM

 

[DonGorgon]

bump