"The Coffee Shop Girl You Never Spoke To"

You've replayed it a hundred times. She stood three feet away, scrolling her phone. You had an opening. You composed the perfect line — after she was gone.

For all you know, she's married now. To some guy who said something. Anything.

Openers are cheap. Almost any sentence works when it's delivered within three seconds. The expensive part is the standing there, drafting and deleting, while the window quietly closes.

The "22 Rules" stripped out my hesitation. What to open with, how to keep it alive, and the one habit that costs guys more women than anything else: waiting for perfect.

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Having music as your main interest

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There is this thing about interests that I find interesting but also kind of frustrating.
A bunch of years ago I was dating a rather hot looking girl. We were both 18 and we got together frequenting the same bar. Now our interests were very similar which is music.

Here's the obstacle: one of my good friends mentioned that we talk about music all the time and that might kill the interaction/relationship. The relationship got killed. She broke up, I crashed and burned,... bla bla ....

Now I used to have a social circle where music brought us together. Now the main theme of our conversations was rarely ever about music. Thing is me, Im very passionate about analysing what makes music really beatiful. Now I like to talk about that but get into the boring mode rather easily. Now I do realize its all about the how and not the what.

The insecurity kindof boils down to a very silly sounding question I just start to realize.

Any people who are into music a lot get by in communicating being an interesting guy?

I keep hearing in interviews, conversations and what not, how much of a turnoff it is to talk about music and how uncool that is.

anyone can relate to that?
 

"How I Made Sure No Woman Ever Friend-Zoned Me Again"

She calls you when her car breaks down. When she needs help moving. When some guy she's actually dating treats her badly.

You're the listener. The reliable one. The guy who would treat her so much better, if she'd just open her eyes.

She won't. You trained her to see you as the low-effort option — the friend who requires zero risk and zero investment. Every favor dug the hole deeper.

The "22 Rules" break the pattern. You'll stop auditioning for a role she already cast and become the man she chases instead. It starts with Rule 1.

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Safari

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Key word: analyzing. Women don't analyze music, they feel it.

As a pro musician, I've studied music theory, music history, analyzed trends, practice fundamentals, write charts, etc, etc. All this gives me more tools to perform my best, outcompete lazier musicians, and enjoy music at more levels.

But to an audience, I must hide all of this. To them, it must seem like a natural gift and all they must see is the passion. This goes doubly true for women.

I communicate being an interesting guy by the mystery all this effort generates. As soon as I reveal the hidden science behind it, the mystery evaporates as does the IL.

This is a performer's perpective, but still for a woman if you turn something they experience spiritually into something logical, you become boring. For me, I enjoy reading technical articles, but I would never attempt to "passionately" communicate about these topics to a woman. The "how" wouldn't matter because women don't find logic attractive.

Perhaps you can use your knowledge to incorporate a woman's favorite topic (herself) with music?
 

whistler

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Interesting... my girlfriend is getting a PhD in auditory processing (hearing).

She likes talking about music when the conversation is technical, obviously... she ought to. (she's a nerd in private, but a HB in public)

But when she wants to feel warm and fuzzy -- when she wants to bond -- it's all about feeling.

I've never made her wet with talk about the inner ear.

The technical stuff is a turn-off at that point (even for her) because it's devoid of emotion.

So a girl that has no interest in the technical stuff will probably get nothing out of the conversation if her goal is feel you out or get close to you.


blah, blah, read safari's post again.
 

spukee

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Music is significant to me as well - to the point where I wont even consider a relationship with someone who doesn't have a musical taste I can respect. Talk about popular and underground music, the different subcultures spawned by the different genres, current music events, and concert stories tend to litter my conversations.

However... everything in moderation - if you can't come up with something else to talk about now and then, then yeah, you're going to lose her interest. Spice things up - I'm positive you have other interests. From music I can usually jump to any other aspect of pop culture - movies, TV, magazines, books, whatever... Entertainment is a powerful conversation topic, but you've got to keep it fresh.
 
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Originally posted by Safari

Perhaps you can use your knowledge to incorporate a woman's favorite topic (herself) with music?
sounds like an interesting idea. But then, hm incorporate herself in my knowledge about music.... wow....



erhm.. any ideas anyone?

By the way. Nice replies
 

"I just moved here from Florida."

That sentence contains at least five follow-up questions she WANTS you to ask. Where in Florida? What brought you here? How long have you been in the area? What do you miss? How does it compare to here?

She handed them to you on a silver platter. And you said, "Oh cool. I come here every week. I love this band. Ummm... pretty crowded tonight."

She smiled politely. Nodded. And never texted you back.

I was that guy for years. Talking too much. Listening too little. Panicking about my next sentence while she was literally feeding me the answers.

Then I found 22 rules that fixed the whole thing. Rule number one: shut up and listen. She'll tell you exactly what to say.

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Originally posted by Safari


As a pro musician, I've studied music theory, music history, analyzed trends, practice fundamentals, write charts, etc, etc. All this gives me more tools to perform my best, outcompete lazier musicians, and enjoy music at more levels.
By the way this is a KILLER mindset. Totally priceless.
 

Pain_free

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Originally posted by seize_the_pattern
We were both 18 and we got together frequenting the same bar. Now our interests were very similar which is music.
At least you've got music as a common ground to work on.

I'm doing DJing(trance/house/breaks/DnB) and that's even harder to relate to anyone else except to another fellow deejay..most girls I've encountered wouldn't know one genre to another(from my experience) to them it's all the same. But at the end of the day, it's bout the passion of being able to play the music.

Sidenote: From my friend doing actual club work, says it's not that easy to pickup in a club especially if you are a DJ...contary to popular belief:confused:

Originally posted by seize_the_pattern
Here's the obstacle: one of my good friends mentioned that we talk about music all the time and that might kill the interaction/relationship. The relationship got killed. She broke up, I crashed and burned,... bla bla ....
How'd that actually kill the relationship? Was it what actually happened or what your friend said that actually ate into your consciousness?
 
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Well yeah, it's all about the being focused vs. being interesting paradox. Your focussed and determined with no distractions which is very DJ. With no distractions its not easy to get into other stuff to make you more interesting which is DJ too.

I still have a hard time finding a balance between this.

The situation I illustrated this thread with is 5 years old basically but the issue is still the same.

Cheers
 
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