"She Liked You in March. It's October Now."
Attraction runs on a clock.
She flirted for weeks. Touched your arm. Found reasons to be alone with you. And you were careful. Respectful. Waiting for the right moment.
The moment had a shelf life. It expired around month two, and by the time you asked her out, she'd quietly filed you under "little brother."
One of the hardest lessons inside the 22 Rules: women rarely wait. Interest either grows or it decays, and nothing decays it faster than a man who never moves.
Make the move while she's still inventing reasons to be near you.
Has anyone ever met Tyler Durden?
- Thread starter eLMac
- Start date
"Nervous Around Beautiful Women? There's a Rule for That"
I could talk to any woman I wasn't attracted to. Charming, funny, relaxed. Then a gorgeous woman looked my way and I'd become a sweating, babbling mess.
The fix took me years to find and ten minutes to learn. Nervousness and excitement are the same physical state — pounding heart, adrenaline, flushed face. Your brain just picks the label. And you can pick a better one.
Rule 16 shows you how. You feel the nerves, relabel them as excitement, and let that energy pour out as enthusiasm. Women notice the guy radiating it. They always do.
I'm Joe Dirt
Master Don Juan
Quality not quantity is what I think matters most. Anyone - depending on their level of self conciousness and ability to feel shame - could approach hundreds of women a day.
I don't think the yardstick for success is how many you talk to how many you # close, etc. I think it is how many of them you were happy with I think. It's hard to quantify success since everyone has their own definition, but isnt the point of learning how to be a DJ so you can bag the girl of your dreams and have a happy relationship like the kind you always wanted as an AFC?
I think 99% of people who come here as total AFCs come here because they want to have a meaningful relationship with someone and are looking for advice, and then by the time this place is done with them they seem to treat women like objects and bragging about how many they can approach or get #s out of, but what happened to the relationship part?
Rather than helping guys achieve their goals that they've set out this place seems to change them or make them forget about their original goals. Kind of a bait and switch trick.
You are looking for a 'yes' or 'no' answer here so my answer is 'no.' If you've been reading the posts on this forum at all, and have at least skimmed through the DJ Bible, you'll recognize there is a definite split between the PUA and DJ communities. Durden, Mystery, and DeAngelo all fall into the PUA camp. The DJ Philosophy conversely, stresses personal improvement above all else and probably has a lot more in common with 'self-help' and even new age, existentialist, and buddhist philosophies (along with a good dose of evolutionary biology thrown in; whew, talk about a strange brew!) than with PUA skills which emphasizes memorizing scripts and focuses solely on maximizing the number of women you sleep with.
IMHO, fastseduction.com has a lot of valuable advice, but over-emphasizes 'outer game' to a ridiculous degree. They constantly preach scripts and maximizing the number of approaches and so on, without really addressing the underlying problem of confidence and the quest for finding meaning in one's short life.
By pointing to the total number of approaches as the lone criteria of admiration and respect, you are already getting caught in a numbers based (PUA) approach. Work on yourself first, not on becoming an approach warrior.
“The 22 Rules That Flip the Script With Women… And How You Can Use Them Tonight”
Most guys accidentally kill attraction before they even speak. They assume they need a bigger bank account, a better physique, or smoother lines. They miss the point.
Female desire operates on a specific set of psychological triggers. Break them, and you're invisible. Follow them, and you become magnetic.
I learned this the hard way. Years of freezing up. Getting friend-zoned. Watching other guys walk away with the girl I wanted. Then I discovered a set of 22 simple rules that rewired my entire approach.
Gangster Of Love
Master Don Juan
DeAngelo??? Nope, you got that wrong partner. I've followed his work and attended several of his programs, this guy is mostly about inner game and self improvement. He covers all that
" The DJ Philosophy conversely, stresses personal improvement above all else and probably has a lot more in common with 'self-help' and even new age, existentialist, and buddhist philosophies (along with a good dose of evolutionary biology thrown in; whew, talk about a strange brew!)"
that you are talking about. He lets some of his guests like Mystery, Tyler, etc. speak more on outer game, but even those guys have a very good understanding of the inner game component.
DeAngelo might sound that way on his newsletters, to attract more people, but once you study his programs, he really is giving you what is really needed, inner game and dealing with your issues.
Gangster Of Love
Master Don Juan
David D. is really not one of those guys like Tyler and Mystery, out there hitting the clubs every nite, etc.; and he will be the first one to tell you that those guys are the best at what they do.
David D. is more "geeky", and likes to explain not just how something works, but why it works, so most of the very smart, yet less socially skilled men can relate more to him than the pick up artists who dress up funky to go meet women at clubs. He sounds like a guy who is very happy with his level of skill and is more focused on running his business and not make women his ONLY goal.
I reckon a big thing is figuring your personal syle, me I'm a guitarist/performer and I like an audience when I sarge so I'm more likely to fall into the MM/RSD camp.
I'd rather do an approach in front of all my mates to show of than, approach on my own and be real! Thats the hardest game, and RJ is the master of that.
Nooby Doo
Don Juan
So how long have you and RJ been pals?
Haha..the internet is a funny place. People can take on any persona they please and you will buy it based on the strength of their words.
But back to the subject at hand....
I met Tyler last year on a trip to London. It was sheer coincidence, but I was in Leicester Square one night and I could see a bunch of dudes huddling together and doing little missions. The scene had "workshop" written all over it, so I approached out of morbid curiosity. I never let on that I knew what they were up to, but I have enough skills approaching that I managed to get in with the crew and I even helped some of their students, since they were understaffed that night. Ultimately, we had a blast and I scored my first piece of English booty. Tyler is a good guy with a great sense of humor, and his skills are impressive. The man has balls of steel and doesn't understand the word "eject". He would get blown out of sets only to show up minuntes laterand win them over with his persistence. It was fun to watch.
Having said that, I didn't agree with all the advice he was giving his students. He would send these AFCs out with neghits/c&f lines which they were clearly not ready to deliver with any balls or conviction, so of course they got shot down repeatedly. Standing on the sidelines, I would hear the girls talk about how weird the guys were acting that night. It was sad to see some of them entertain a workshop AFC, make him think he got a number, and then laugh behind his back....obviously the number was fake. You could see the RSD boys in the background giving high-fives for his small victory, the poor bastard.
Apparently he is not the only one who did not get staisfactory results from RSD, since they are being sued by another attendee:
http://www.thundercatseductionlair.com/2005/06/rsd_lawsuit.html
It should also be noted the Tyler has social anxiety disorder, and his constant posting on all facets of social interaction borders on obsessive compulsive.
http://www.thundercatseductionlair.com/2005/02/tyler_durden_ca.html
Yup, TD has some skill and is a decent writer, the man lives for the game! But don't treat him like a PUA god....he's just a dude obsessed with pvssy like all the rest.
"The Coffee Shop Girl You Never Spoke To"
You've replayed it a hundred times. She stood three feet away, scrolling her phone. You had an opening. You composed the perfect line — after she was gone.
For all you know, she's married now. To some guy who said something. Anything.
Openers are cheap. Almost any sentence works when it's delivered within three seconds. The expensive part is the standing there, drafting and deleting, while the window quietly closes.
The "22 Rules" stripped out my hesitation. What to open with, how to keep it alive, and the one habit that costs guys more women than anything else: waiting for perfect.
Giovanni Casanova
Master Don Juan
- Joined
- Jan 5, 2002
- Messages
- 5,550
- Reaction score
- 18
- Age
- 47
- Location
- Hiding in Penkitten's Linen Closet
You mean THIS RJ? The one that recommends crying in order to get laid?
MacDiddy
Master Don Juan
"(w)hat you are talking about. He lets some of his guests like Mystery, Tyler, etc. speak more on outer game, but even those guys have a very good understanding of the inner game component."
---If you've been to the seminars, then obviously you have a much more in depth exposure to the ideas of these dating coaches. My exposure to their ideas comes primarily from reading/skimming through introductory materials on bristollair.com, from email newsletters, fastseduction.com as well as by running into a dating coach and his students by happenstance. The general picture I get from these various sources is that there is a tremendous emphasis on memorizing various scripts and openers on the one hand, and a constant reference, recitation of testimonials from guys who say they used to never get laid, then who say they get laid on a regular basis after taking one of the various seminars.
In other words, there's little or no emphasis on developing the inner confidence necessary for success in all areas of one's life, including family, work, as well as intimate relationships. There's a level of superficiality
(again this judgement is based on the limited amount of material I have access to as well as based on the attitudes of the students of these various seminars) which has deterred me from pursuing the various dating seminar options up until now (and I have not yet even mentioned the issue of cost).
I don't mean to hijack this thread; really what I'd like to see are reviews, amazon.com style, of the various dating coaches/seminars, based on the criteria of effectiveness, cost and the quality of interaction with/information from other seminar attendees.
Peace,
Allan
The Living Legend
Don Juan
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- Jul 22, 2005
- Messages
- 66
- Reaction score
- 0
"I just moved here from Florida."
That sentence contains at least five follow-up questions she WANTS you to ask. Where in Florida? What brought you here? How long have you been in the area? What do you miss? How does it compare to here?
She handed them to you on a silver platter. And you said, "Oh cool. I come here every week. I love this band. Ummm... pretty crowded tonight."
She smiled politely. Nodded. And never texted you back.
I was that guy for years. Talking too much. Listening too little. Panicking about my next sentence while she was literally feeding me the answers.
Then I found 22 rules that fixed the whole thing. Rule number one: shut up and listen. She'll tell you exactly what to say.
I'm Joe Dirt
Master Don Juan
undesputable
Master Don Juan
I'm Joe Dirt
Master Don Juan
That's the gambler's fallacy. Every approach is an independent event. There is no way to prove that he approached better girls or that he got more out of them than he did at the start.
One can argue with practice someone gets better but that's also not always the case because someone may not be learning from their mistakes. Also the quality may not improve if he tried to approach the same type of girls at the same locations.
There isn't enough info available to say conclusivley that because he approached 3,500 women it means he mustve gotten top notch at it and gotten quality women out of it. That's just not a logical conclusion that can be drawn based on the premises.
“The 22 Rules That Flip the Script With Women… And How You Can Use Them Tonight”
Most guys accidentally kill attraction before they even speak. They assume they need a bigger bank account, a better physique, or smoother lines. They miss the point.
Female desire operates on a specific set of psychological triggers. Break them, and you're invisible. Follow them, and you become magnetic.
I learned this the hard way. Years of freezing up. Getting friend-zoned. Watching other guys walk away with the girl I wanted. Then I discovered a set of 22 simple rules that rewired my entire approach.