GF going out to bars

[frivolousz21]

We come to this World from women. We have daughters (I do) and sisters (I do). Women are not worthless.

Do you know who I blame when a wife cheats on her husband? I ALWAYS blame the husband. Why? Because men are the ones that choose their wives (men ask women for marriage...not the other way around). If a man choose a woman that has the potential to be a slut...then it is HIS fault!

ANY woman is capable of cheating if put under the "correct" circunstances. Make no mistake about that. A woman that goes out twice a week WITHOUT her boyfriend and gets DRUNK EVERYTIME she goes out WITHOUT that boyfriend is a woman with greater chances of cheating than a woman that goes out once a week with her boyfriend and doesn't get drunk.


Respect. Let's say that respect is perhaps the most important thing a man can have. Women truly don't understand the concept of respect between men. And in today society (many times thanks to t.v. shows that make heroes out of wimps), many men don't understand the important of respect.

SHE is 21 yrs old.

and he is 19 yrs old.
yea 19.

we are not talking about 35 yr old woman!


21, 19
21, 19
21, 19.

at age 19 and 21..im sure the chances of them lasting are what 1 percent?


she should be allowed to have fun..if he being 19 doenst like it..say something or leave her

 

[mrRuckus]

How is grinding cheating? There's no exchange of fluids and what it comes down to is dancing. .

I was out the other night and had some girl who had a boyfriend that i personally know trying to be all up on me at the bar. All touching me and sh1t even after i told her to knock it off a few times. I consider that cheating if my gf did that stuff and pretty much called this girl a wh0re. Of course this set all her female friends off on me but whatever i'm not the one with a bf/gf and touching dudes.

I thought about it and told my gf about what happened and said it disgusted me and i hate girls like that and that i need to be able to trust her in any and all situations. She wrinkled her nose and said she doesn't even grind or dance all up on a guy even when she's single. Girls that do that crap just seem dirty to me. Tainted. And i was like you... it's cheating if you agree not to do certain things and someone does them anyway. So i let her know what i thought was out of line. I don't want to dance all over other girls and i don't want dudes touching her... so now we're in agreement and if these things ever happen someone's cheated (broken the agreed upon rules).

If she wants to touch a man she knows where i live.

 

[Jackman]

We come to this World from women. We have daughters (I do) and sisters (I do). Women are not worthless..

ANY woman is capable of cheating if put under the "correct" circunstances. Make no mistake about that. A woman that goes out twice a week WITHOUT her boyfriend and gets DRUNK EVERYTIME she goes out WITHOUT that boyfriend is a woman with greater chances of cheating than a woman that goes out once a week with her boyfriend and doesn't get drunk.


Respect. Let's say that respect is perhaps the most important thing a man can have. Women truly don't understand the concept of respect between men. And in today society (many times thanks to t.v. shows that make heroes out of wimps), many men don't understand the important of respect.

Do you know who I blame when a wife cheats on her husband? I ALWAYS blame the husband. Why? Because men are the ones that choose their wives (men ask women for marriage...not the other way around). If a man choose a woman that has the potential to be a slut...then it is HIS fault! .

I agree. To a point. But you can't incorporate all possible scenerios in the world and come up with something solid.

From what I've read, you've been in the dating scene for some time now. I have as well. We both know that a 19 year old guy who doesn't have a big problem getting girlfriends and has been dating a girl for only a few months is going to get over cheating much faster than a 40 year old guy who finds his wife of 20 years running around on him. And we both know 19 year old guys aren't usually out there trying to find a trophy wife, or at least they shouldn't be.

A teenage guy should not allow his time and emotions to be consumed by such things, if only because you and I know how raw and over blown emotions are at that age. Everything is a bigger deal than it really is, and if it is taken too personally, it will have its effects down the road.

I'm not discouraging any efforts here. I am simply saying that no approach is absolute. I would never advise a 40 year old guy in a 20 year marriage to simply "not worry" about cheating like I would with a teenager that goes through women like toilet paper, but many of my basic beliefs will still apply either way.

A woman that wants to cheat will find a way. Doesn't matter if she is 15 or 50. What changes is the man, his real needs and how he approaches these facts. In the end, what matters most is not the girl and what she is doing, it is in how important it is for a guy in any particular situation to realize what is at stake and what is worth his real time.

 

[WORKEROUTER]

Update On Gf Situation

As you may know, I have essentially "broken away" from my gf in that I'm not expecting too much from her anymore. I'm not delusional in terms of our relationship and where it could go. Whether right or not, I went after other girls, and went on a couple dates.

Anyway, I told her tonight my exact feelings on her going to bars and such.

It went like this:

I told her first of all that I feel that often going out to bars and clubs w/out her bf is disrespectful, and I told her that I was not going to be the guy who just sees her after 1:30-2:00 AM in the morning, after she had been drinking, to now hang out with her. I quite bluntly made it clear that I would do this with a f*ck buddy, but she should know I consider her more than that.

She has a roommate (who by the way has a bf and who's only 20) who went out with a couple of her guy "friends" to a 21+ club, got drunk, danced, and so forth, and wasn't back all night. I told her straight out that if I was this girl's boyfriend, I would have immediately dumped her for disrespecting me in this way. I told her that doing this kinda thing when one has a boyfriend is, in my eyes, clearly disrespectful, and I will not tolerate it.

She seemed a little irritated, or at least in opposition, to my views. I didn't try to appease her. I simply told her that these are the values and standards I hold. I told her that I respect myself enough to respect and follow these values because they're essentially my backbone, formed by personal beliefs and experiences, that will not be altered by another person.

So she tested by making the remark "so you would break up with me if I went to a club..," to which I remarked, "that's right, if you were to do what your roommate did, I would consider it disrespectful, and would have no choice."

At this point, she was quiet. She seemed neither happy nor mad, just in contemplation over what had been said to her. At this point, she was at a crossing point. She knew I liked her, but she also knew I have values and standards that if aren't met, will definitively end my feelings for her.

I was tempted to partly relinquish my own values and standards at this point in order to try to appease her own system of thought, but I refrained from doing so. I made no more comments about it.

I told her that I'm telling this to her so that she knows where I stand and how I feel. Her reaction is her choice.

At the end of the night, she started hugging and making out with me. I think she realized at this point she wasn't dealing with an ambivalent child who's beliefs were in constant vacillation (like so many guys out there), but rather, a man, a DJ, with a core set of standards and beliefs, who will not have them compromised for another.

 

[Blusher]

I was tempted to partly relinquish my own values and standards at this point in order to try to appease her own system of thought, but I refrained from doing so. I made no more comments about it.

Such words of wisdom coming from a 19 years old or from a "mature" man for that matters are quite impressive.

Way to go. :rockon:

 

[Last Man Standing]

Workrouter,

You decide the severity of her actions and how you handle – I personally, never before and would never in the future have a LTR with a woman who goes to clubs – especially on her own!!! At first you made it seem as if she went out twice a week and got drunk then you made it seem innocent by stating that she went out just out of curiosity because she and her friends turned 21.

Regardless, a woman should never go to a bar/club without the company of her man., if out of sheer respect alone!

You are young and you have grown up in a generation that have allowed and encouraged women to disrespect themselves and their man and thus you swallow it whole, as 99% of the young guys on this site do.

You have to set the parameters of the kind of girl you want and the level of respect you demand and have the dignity and fortitude to move on when you feel she is not meeting your standards as a feminine mate.

Most young men love pvssy moreso than they love themselves and thus these are the chumps that lay at their woman’s feet and lose their dignity by losing their masculinity – don’t be one of these men - lose the woman and keep your dignity or lose your dignity and keep the woman – it is up to you.

Do some reconnaissance on your girl and ask an older friend to spy on her at the club over a few weekends and see what he says and report back here!

Here is the longstanding 6,000 year rule:

A woman should never dance with another man unless her man gives the other man permission – the other man, out of respect for the man who she is with, must ask for this permission.

Do some reconnaissance!!

Jackman - you are wrong - I don't have LTR's with women who go to clubs - and never with a woman that gets drunk - I don't take them seriously and they are merely "playthings"!! These women don't respect themselves do you seriously think that they will respect their man? Emphatically "NO"!!

A man's dignity is worth much more than a hors' pvssy - you young naive bastards will find out one day!

Workrouter, it is good to hear (read) that you embraced your manhood and drew the line of respect vs. disrespect - women love it when a man doesn't take a woman's shyt!!!! They love a dignified man!!!

There is no such thing as a man being "insecure" (as some here have charged you with) for displaying his dominance over the female and laying the ground rules for the relationship, even if she is an older woman!.

Kudos to you Workrouter for setting her straight - next time do it right away and have a low tolerance for disrespect!!

 

[WORKEROUTER]

Workrouter, it is good to hear (read) that you embraced your manhood and drew the line of respect vs. disrespect - women love it when a man doesn't take a woman's shyt!!!! They love a dignified man!!!

There is no such thing as a man being "insecure" (as some here have charged you with) for displaying his dominance over the female and laying the ground rules for the relationship, even if she is an older woman!.

Kudos to you Workrouter for setting her straight - next time do it right away and have a low tolerance for disrespect!!

Damn right. Let's keep it straight.

 

[Jackman]

There is no such thing as a man being "insecure" (as some here have charged you with)

Let's get one thing straight here, sparky. It wasn't him I was accusing of being insecure. It was YOU.

I know all about your tough guy BS inside and out because I use to be that mother ****er. But let me tell you something I learned along the way since then:

Bravado serves well to only get them into your bed for a little while, but when a little time goes by, it becomes a fault women love to ****ing nit pick the moment she feels like she's getting the short end of the stick.

Workerouter, trust me brother, all that kissy, I'm so sorry BS is exactly that. It's temporary BS. I've had women sucking my **** appologizing to me when I drew the line like you just did. You're not putting them in thier place, they're just buying time.

I'm not going to explain it. You're just going to have to learn the hard way. Good luck.

 

[WORKEROUTER]

Jackman, this is the only thing I can do at this point though. What I told her IS a value that I hold, and that's it.

I told her, and now she knows. I did not tell her with any expectation of a reaction from her. I told her for MY sake.

If she's goig to disrespect me in the future, so be it. She knows the consequences. I won't be learning the "hard way" because I have ABSOLUTELY ZERO fear of losing her! In other words, I don't NEED her.

She knows I won't stand for mediocrityy.

 

[Last Man Standing]

Haha Jack - I don't even know how it feels to be insecure - I view "insecurity" as a feminine quality. Why did you take my quote out of context? Here is my statement in context..

“There is no such thing as a man being "insecure" (as some here have charged you with) for displaying his dominance over the female and laying the ground rules for the relationship, even if she is an older woman!”.

It has nothing to do with bravado or being tough - it has to do with masculinity!!! Men are dominant and women are submissive to this dominance!!!

If they don't comply with this natural order then they are not feminine and are acting out of their natural state!! Hors are not very feminine and they are in abundance today so you will encounter much resistance but you must adhere to your masculine nature and not allow a woman to dictate to you, if you want to maintain your dignity as a man!!!

Most men today are weak chumps and have no dignity thus the woman sets the rules and the agenda!! Men have taken the feminine role and women have taken the masculine role – this looks very strange indeed – they live in THE MATRIX – a delusional world based on a lie through mass media influence!!

Is she complying with his wishes temporarily to appease him? Of course, she is a hor!!! She will be gone soon – what workrouter told her is “this is what I expect and if you don’t want to comply then you will just be a hor for sex to me and not my ‘g/f’” A man must maintain his dignity and respect!!!!!!!!

The man dictates the agenda and sets the rules – only weak men allow a woman to lead and he follows!!

 

[Jackman]

Hey, don't get me wrong here. If this is something that makes you feel better, then by all means have at it. But look what happened here. You went from, "I took her virginity, She wouldn't cheat on me" to "**** it, I stood my ground. What happens happens".

Now, most guys will see that as an improvement. They're going to tell you you're finally being "the man" here. Problem is, she isn't going to see that change the same way. What you essentially just did was a somewhat sudden attitude change, which she is going to pin you for later when it comes down to the ugly. You're ****ing it up. You don't make these kinds of changes 4 months in, my man. You either do it right off the bat or just move on. You basically just gave her justifaction to b*tch about something. Drama.

Trust me, man. You're going the hard way.

 

[Jackman]

Haha Jack - I don't even know how it feels to be insecure -

Of course you dont, but it's not because you're confident and "masculine", it's because you're arrogant.

It has nothing to do with bravado or being tough - it has to do with masculinity!!! Men are dominant and women are submissive to this dominance!!!

This is ture, but it is not 100% all of the time ****ing true. It is situational, always, and you don't seem to have a clue when it's appropriate and when it becomes a liability that just complicates and ****s things up. What I am saying here is that sometimes, yes, you can put them in a place and turn them on with it, but other times it's just going to create resentment and drama you just don't need, and when you tell a guy in a four month relationship to just start acting like this, you're ****ing him all up.

If they don't comply with this natural order then they are not feminine and are acting out of their natural state!! Hors are not very feminine and they are in abundance today so you will encounter much resistance but you must adhere to your masculine nature and not allow a woman to dictate to you, if you want to maintain your dignity as a man!!!

A dignified man avoids senseless BS, which you just steered him straight into. You want dignified? Tell him to call her right now and dump her.

Most men today are weak chumps and have no dignity thus the woman sets the rules and the agenda!! Men have taken the feminine role and women have taken the masculine role – this looks very strange indeed – they live in THE MATRIX – a delusional world based on a lie through mass media influence!!

Oh ****, here we go with the BS sci-fi/DJ movie references. LOSER.

Is she complying with his wishes temporarily to appease him? Of course, she is a hor!!!

No, the temporary appeasement occurs before she realizes he's now becomming a jealous, insecure prick (in her mind). Not always because she's a slut. What kind of A-hole are you? This guy asks for help and you're calling his girl a hor? I'd stick my boot in your ass even if she was.

he man dictates the agenda and sets the rules – only weak men allow a woman to lead and he follows!!

Yeah...too late for that. No one was talking about "following" here anyway. Get off your soap box.

 

[khash]

dont pay attention to what she does. seem relaxed and let her do what she wants. dude as 007 said, u have been here long enough to know she is cheating. even if she isnt, this relationship with girls being older never goes far, trust me.

you gotta worry about ur self right now, go out and meet other chicks and let her know by your actions that you are in demand and you " might " be fooling around with other girls. create some mystery, and she will ****ing stop going out with her friends, or at least she will go out less.

$$$$$$$

 

[S1NN3R]

He made his choice, saying now what he should have or could have done is merely academic and not helping anyone.

 

[Last Man Standing]

No Jack, I have NEVER felt insecure!!!! Hors are plentiful - are you saying I am insecure to lose a hor?? You never have a hor you are hers for only a short season - you are merely the next pimp in line!!

You act like this girl is worth keeping - NO!!!!!! I told Woekrouter to dump her but he is young and wishes to keep her for his sexual pleasure - once the sex stops he'll leave - guaranteed!!!! I believe she is cheating on him and I am trying to wake him up to this. I merely told him to not be disrespected and to value his dignity over pvssy!!

A man follows a woman if and when he is not leading!!!!

 

[Latinoman]

Jackman, this is the only thing I can do at this point though. What I told her IS a value that I hold, and that's it.

I told her, and now she knows. I did not tell her with any expectation of a reaction from her. I told her for MY sake.

If she's goig to disrespect me in the future, so be it. She knows the consequences. I won't be learning the "hard way" because I have ABSOLUTELY ZERO fear of losing her! In other words, I don't NEED her.

She knows I won't stand for mediocrityy.

And this is the most important post in this thread.

 

[Latinoman]

Hey, don't get me wrong here. If this is something that makes you feel better, then by all means have at it. But look what happened here. You went from, "I took her virginity, She wouldn't cheat on me" to "**** it, I stood my ground. What happens happens".

Now, most guys will see that as an improvement. They're going to tell you you're finally being "the man" here. Problem is, she isn't going to see that change the same way. What you essentially just did was a somewhat sudden attitude change, which she is going to pin you for later when it comes down to the ugly. You're ****ing it up. You don't make these kinds of changes 4 months in, my man. You either do it right off the bat or just move on. You basically just gave her justifaction to b*tch about something. Drama.

Trust me, man. You're going the hard way.

Good point. Do it right off the bat next time.

But...he is standing for his values and doing what is making him happy. No need to "just move on"...give her a chance to screw up and then move on.

 

[Jackman]

You act like this girl is worth keeping - NO!!!!!! I told Woekrouter to dump her but he is young and wishes to keep her for his sexual pleasure - once the sex stops he'll leave - guaranteed!!!! I believe she is cheating on him and I am trying to wake him up to this. I merely told him to not be disrespected and to value his dignity over pvssy!!

A man follows a woman if and when he is not leading!!!!

You have to put yourself in a situation, play it out, and then change roles to really understand the point I'm trying to make here.

Let's say you and I have been good friends for a few years now; I'd take a bullet for you, you'd take a bullet for me...whatever. We go out regularly on the weekends with a bunch of other guys to a local sports bar, maybe Hooters, to catch all the games and throw back a few beers.

Now this girl I've been with for only a few months comes out of the blue asking me to stop hanging with you like that because she doesn't like it. What would you think of me if I actually did it? How would you look at our friendship if I just started turning down your offers to go hang like we always have? How would you feel if I came back three months later out of the blue after I broke up with her and said, "Hey man, wanna hang at Hooters with me?"

Most people would say good friends don't do **** like that. Most people would stick with thier friends. Most guys here would advise me in that situation to tell this girl how it's going to be.

Now when you do this to a woman, and she actually listens and complies with your wishes, she is essentially being the blow off friend like I was to you in the earlier example. Ironically, you're getting the exact opposite of what you think you're getting, because a person who starts blowing off long time friends more than likely isn't going to be loyal in a relationship either.

Remember that story I told earlier about my fiance? She listened to me. She blew off her friends when I told her I didn't like what she was doing. She was a cheater, just like the rest of them that always listened to me. The ones that got pissed off and dumped me, those were the normal ones. Those were the ones who were insulted that I felt that way. Those were the ones that chose her friends over me. I didn't always have to make clear cut ultimatums either. Sometimes just implying was good enough.

The bottom line here is that I don't disagree with your basic ideas. I disagree with how to go about implimenting them. You can still be the man, you can still get respect, you can still make your intentions very clear. You just don't do it in that way.

 

[S1NN3R]

Without sounding judgemental towards anyone's opinions, to me it boils down to this. Boys need to control the woman in their life. Grown men know that if she's truly their's to begin with, she doesn't need controlling.

If it just come down to a respect or control thing, then there's really no helpful advice, that's all your moral choice. But to me, some people here saying that they know she's cheating simply because she's going out and having fun without her BF is retarded, short bus style. A) you can't know what she's doing based on one action. You know what your insecure ass would suspect your girlfriend of doing in the same situation. B) If she actually was cheating at the clubs, then she's going to cheat anyway, whenever and where ever she wants to. Unless she's locked in the basement, a cheating girl will do it. And no matter what is going on around her, a non-cheating girl won't.

 

[Last Man Standing]

You have to put yourself in a situation, play it out, and then change roles to really understand the point I'm trying to make here.

Let's say you and I have been good friends for a few years now; I'd take a bullet for you, you'd take a bullet for me...whatever. We go out regularly on the weekends with a bunch of other guys to a local sports bar, maybe Hooters, to catch all the games and throw back a few beers.

Now this girl I've been with for only a few months comes out of the blue asking me to stop hanging with you like that because she doesn't like it. What would you think of me if I actually did it? How would you look at our friendship if I just started turning down your offers to go hang like we always have? How would you feel if I came back three months later out of the blue after I broke up with her and said, "Hey man, wanna hang at Hooters with me?"

Most people would say good friends don't do **** like that. Most people would stick with thier friends. Most guys here would advise me in that situation to tell this girl how it's going to be.

Now when you do this to a woman, and she actually listens and complies with your wishes, she is essentially being the blow off friend like I was to you in the earlier example. Ironically, you're getting the exact opposite of what you think you're getting, because a person who starts blowing off long time friends more than likely isn't going to be loyal in a relationship either.

Remember that story I told earlier about my fiance? She listened to me. She blew off her friends when I told her I didn't like what she was doing. She was a cheater, just like the rest of them that always listened to me. The ones that got pissed off and dumped me, those were the normal ones. Those were the ones who were insulted that I felt that way. Those were the ones that chose her friends over me. I didn't always have to make clear cut ultimatums either. Sometimes just implying was good enough.

The bottom line here is that I don't disagree with your basic ideas. I disagree with how to go about implimenting them. You can still be the man, you can still get respect, you can still make your intentions very clear. You just don't do it in that way.

I agree Jack - good analogy!

Work dude said she started going out to clubs on her birthday so this was not in the beginning of their relationship so although he told her a bit late he had to set the record straight out of his conscious and dignity as a man.

I expect she will still go out and hide it from him but this is the kind of women we have to choose from nowadays - I personally wouldn't tell my girl not to go to clubs she should know this already from day one - I don't pursue women with the club mindset for a LTR!

It is OK to go to bars as a man but not for a woman - we have a different standard because we are the ones who do the pursuing!! If my buddy wants me to accompany him to a bar/club then I would go regard;ess of my girl's discontent. Girls that go to bars KNOW that men are going to approach them - this is not a secret!! Whereas if a man goes out he is the one to decide if he will approach the woman - thus a different standard applies.

Workrouter, you explained yourself well!!!