Getting over fear of approaching older women and in front of crowds?

[Deicide]

Hey, I'm slowly getting back into cold approach pick up and about everytime I go out in the field, whether it's to approach or do other things, I find I have problems. These 2 have been with me for a while and I haven't gotten over them, but here goes.
I was picking up pizza at a local place and I noticed an attractive dark skinned older woman in her 40s-50s sitting with a younger girl(Couldn't see because of distance) and I was afraid she was married and might've had a husband that may want to kill me, or that the people around me would've thought I was weird for liking older women. That and approaching in front of crowds makes me think they will judge me and spread the word about me doing this stuff. This pizza place in a town of 2K people. I didn't approach though I was upset at myself for not approaching when I got home.
Now, I really want to get over this and have complete social freedom to do what I want. I even tell myself everyday "I don't give a f*ck about reputation or what people think, I do what I want". Problem is that I can't match that mindset even though I really want to. So inner game is a huge problem for me, and I don't know how to get over my problems. When I get out in the field everything changes into worser things. I can do the things in my head, but doing in reality is much tougher. But, I'm willing to step outside my comfort zones to do this and have comeplete social freedom, though it will be tough.
So what can I do to get over my fear of approaching older women/potential threats from husbands and in front of people?

 

[YouKnowI'mRight]

So inner game is a huge problem for me, and I don't know how to get over my problems. When I get out in the field everything changes into worser things. I can do the things in my head, but doing in reality is much tougher. But, I'm willing to step outside my comfort zones to do this and have comeplete social freedom, though it will be tough.
So what can I do to get over my fear of approaching older women/potential threats from husbands and in front of people?

Here's a way:

What you really NEED to do is to get very comfortable with touching women and you can touch them in lots of places like arms & back without getting in trouble. Start doing it all of the time. Like you are talking with a girl and you want to make a point about something, like she says she's been to Wyoming and you've been there too....touch her arm while you're talking:

YOU: "oh yeah? I was in (touch arm) Wyoming 3 years ago (release the touch).
or, lets say you're talking to someone and a girl says "hi"

YOU: "I'll be right with you (fast arm tap)" and go back to talking with your conversation. Tap her arm again as you start talking to her.

They won't really notice unless they have some sort of weird thing going on with them where they don't like physical contact at all. Just make sure you release before it comes to her attention. Do this with all girls you find interesting EXCEPT this won't work as well with women you already know, and here's why:

If you're a guy who's seen communicating in this way (subconscious) consistently, it never gets picked up by people's conscious thinking, it's just how you communicate. I mean, really, how many times have you thought, "wow, that guy has touched that girls arm like 4 times in one minute?". Not even the girls notice anything wrong...in fact, they just automatically assume you're familiar and good with women.

Ok, it may seem I went off the topic, but I'm not, it'll just take a while to get where you're going.

Once you've done this for a while and consistently do this with most women you interact with, you won't have nervousness and you can focus on subtle reactions women give off even if it's that they don't react. And we're halfway there with the next step in your practice:

Vary the parts of a woman's arm you're touching/tapping like first time wrist, second time upper part of forearm (front or back depending on if you're standing next to her or in front), 3rd time middle of forearm (Frt or Back), then the middle of upper arm, then .... you do see what I mean right? You're basically moving one step forward, 1/2 step back and walking up her arm.

SHE WILL NOT KNOW THAT'S YOUR INTENT.

So, you do this while observing her face (keep eyes on face at all times while you're doing this). If she backs away at any time, go ahead and stop unless she moves back in.

Getting sort of next to her side by side makes this a bit easier and MUCH BETTER than doing it facing her....anywhoo, let's get you practiced with more extreme so you'll be ready for the last part: When you're doing this (at first with girls you know), when you touch her shoulder suddenly get distracted by either her hair or earring and say "interesting earring/hair" (if you know her well, say "i never noticed how interesting your hair is") and either touch her hair or earring for a couple of seconds, let go, and go back right where you stopped whatever it was you were saying.

The above will get rid of a HUGE amount of your anxiety. I'm always touching (mostly just lower arm taps) women who seem even slightly interesting no matter if they're young or old or ugly or fat, always keep that touching "muscle" tuned up. I guarantee that when you've become a guy who touches lightly fast, you won't even notice it much less them.

I know, blah blah blah but here's how you can tell what kind of situation the woman you're in is dealing with without anyone but you and her knowing what's up:

Now that you're used to having "walked" your way up a woman's arm to her neck, just touching a woman's wrist or forearm is nothing at all, it's a part of Who You Are: A Guy Who's Comfortable With Female Contact.

So, when you spot that more Mature Girl (i love em!) and you're with friends, you can chat with her and start doing your automatic wrist/arm touches, make sure you're next to her facing almost the same way (a little towards each other), while you're talking to her with your good eye contact, and after you've done hand taps and she's totally comfortable with it, make a similar tap with a couple of fingers of your hand on the small of her back, smile a quick "i'm up to no good/Brad Pitt 'knowing' smile", and release after a few seconds.

If it's ON, IT'S ON. And, only the two of you know it. You'll know the interested look because you've practiced, practiced, practiced on girls you already know and they're a lot tougher because they've made some sort of emotional decision about you and that's more difficult to overcome than a woman you don't know.

If she pulls away a little bit, it's usually that something in the situation is not right for her and that's the tip off usually that there's a boyfriend or husband around. If she suddenly looks around AT THE OTHERS it's totally cool. You won't get busted in any way by her for touching her back as long as it was very brief AND she was totally cool/unaware of the arm touching thing. It's not much of an escalation BUT IT IS ONE. She'll either get butterflies or she'll pull away/close up a bit. Either way, you KNOW and SHE KNOWS.

There are endless ways you can do this. It's not a formula, but since you want to get out of your comfort zone your unconscious mind needs a clear map of what to do and then once it does that, your comfort zone is MUCH more large and you'll just wing it in dozens, if not hundreds of variations of this sort of thing. Women are easy to communicate with, it's just that words matter little, body language is good but it broadcasts to everyone, yet touch is VERY hard to read when the people a) see you doing things like arm touches all of the time, and b) when they can't see your touches at all like in the small of the woman's back.

A key thing to this is to NOT rehearse it in your mind. Start out with the arm touches and walk up to the elbow at first with girls you know. So, you're making your goal 4 touches to get there. That's it. No one will harm you. Girls you DO know will react more strongly because you're doing something different and their unconscious will send a "what's with that?" signal that's not a big deal. Just ignore it. It's just a quick touch and if they're friendly with you, then why would it be a big deal right?

Another way to look at it is like this: Women make a LOT of emotional unconscious decisions about you and the more behaviors you show up front the more behaviors that they'll assume you'll do with them. It's not a big deal and the guys won't notice either as long as there's a conversation going on and you haven't been staring at some hiney or something similar.

Do your touching with women as much as possible to stretch your comfort zone and you'll gain the ability to make moves like to the back touch without a care and only you and her will know (she'll half-know, she'll be unsure because of fear of rejection) that things are escalating and if there's a problem your 100x better perception of the multitude of ways a woman reacts to touch will let you know and all you have to do is move back a foot and stop touching.

Again, you do not need to rehearse this in your mind, you need to do it as much as possible with as many women as possible. If your anxiety is way too high, take a smaller step. Just make a goal to touch 10 wrists in one evening. Do that for a week. Then, make it a goal to touch 10 wrists and 10 tops of forearms on the same girls...etc etc etc..

Do this and you'll be ninja-like with your ability to scoop women out of places without anyone knowing what's up. It's not about hiding it...it's more about being suave about getting a woman in a situation so she can get laid with HER being talked about as a slut or whatever. Remember that your anxiety isn't even 1% of what a woman's is in the situation you're in.....guys who are banging milfs are seen as heros, milfs who are banging younger guys are seen as sluts.

 

[dutchmaster]

That post is great^. Really helped me haha. Plan on trying some of that out tomorrow.. I usually don't touch(kino) women until the date.

also it may not work for you since you said you struggle with inner game but when I was working on overcoming AA in crowds I would just think (man look at all these chumps probably thinking the same thing I am. how can i come up to his gorgeous girl?? guess i'll show them how it's done) and bam.. just come up with a hi and a smile and the rest is history

 

[YouKnowI'mRight]

That post is great^. Really helped me haha. Plan on trying some of that out tomorrow.. I usually don't touch(kino) women until the date.

That's all-too-often the issue.

Do it all of the time. Remember, it's an unconscious skill you're building so KEEP EYE CONTACT. If you look at your hand doing it, they'll look too and that's creepy to girls.

Picture it like this: If you were kissing a girl and wanted to start touching her funbags for the first time, which would be successful and which would be totally weird and creepy but they're the SAME THING except what your eyes are focused on:

a) stop, look at her funbags, look up at her, look down and touch them, look up and make sure it's ok

or

b) just make smooth move with your hand on one of them, pull away, go back in for it again, and start working towards another goal all smooth-like all the while staring into her eyes.

Same thing except where you lead her attention with her eyes.

also it may not work for you since you said you struggle with inner game

This does fix inner game. You are consciously teaching your unconscious mind that women are totally cool with being touched as long as you fractionate and back off if she gets anxiety. Your unconscious needs a bunch of reference experiences before it'll believe you and be cool with it. That's why whatever it is you want to do with the Girl Of Your Dreams you should be practicing it on a lower level with virtually all women....not just waiting for that Girl Of Your Dreams occasions because your unconscious will panic AND TRY TO PROTECT YOU BY JACKING YOUR ANXIETY LEVEL HIGH ENOUGH THAT YOU'LL BACK OUT.

 

[Deicide]

Here's a way:

What you really NEED to do is to get very comfortable with touching women and you can touch them in lots of places like arms & back without getting in trouble. Start doing it all of the time. Like you are talking with a girl and you want to make a point about something, like she says she's been to Wyoming and you've been there too....touch her arm while you're talking:

YOU: "oh yeah? I was in (touch arm) Wyoming 3 years ago (release the touch).
or, lets say you're talking to someone and a girl says "hi"

YOU: "I'll be right with you (fast arm tap)" and go back to talking with your conversation. Tap her arm again as you start talking to her.

They won't really notice unless they have some sort of weird thing going on with them where they don't like physical contact at all. Just make sure you release before it comes to her attention. Do this with all girls you find interesting EXCEPT this won't work as well with women you already know, and here's why:

If you're a guy who's seen communicating in this way (subconscious) consistently, it never gets picked up by people's conscious thinking, it's just how you communicate. I mean, really, how many times have you thought, "wow, that guy has touched that girls arm like 4 times in one minute?". Not even the girls notice anything wrong...in fact, they just automatically assume you're familiar and good with women.

Ok, it may seem I went off the topic, but I'm not, it'll just take a while to get where you're going.

Once you've done this for a while and consistently do this with most women you interact with, you won't have nervousness and you can focus on subtle reactions women give off even if it's that they don't react. And we're halfway there with the next step in your practice:

Vary the parts of a woman's arm you're touching/tapping like first time wrist, second time upper part of forearm (front or back depending on if you're standing next to her or in front), 3rd time middle of forearm (Frt or Back), then the middle of upper arm, then .... you do see what I mean right? You're basically moving one step forward, 1/2 step back and walking up her arm.

SHE WILL NOT KNOW THAT'S YOUR INTENT.

So, you do this while observing her face (keep eyes on face at all times while you're doing this). If she backs away at any time, go ahead and stop unless she moves back in.

Getting sort of next to her side by side makes this a bit easier and MUCH BETTER than doing it facing her....anywhoo, let's get you practiced with more extreme so you'll be ready for the last part: When you're doing this (at first with girls you know), when you touch her shoulder suddenly get distracted by either her hair or earring and say "interesting earring/hair" (if you know her well, say "i never noticed how interesting your hair is") and either touch her hair or earring for a couple of seconds, let go, and go back right where you stopped whatever it was you were saying.

The above will get rid of a HUGE amount of your anxiety. I'm always touching (mostly just lower arm taps) women who seem even slightly interesting no matter if they're young or old or ugly or fat, always keep that touching "muscle" tuned up. I guarantee that when you've become a guy who touches lightly fast, you won't even notice it much less them.

I know, blah blah blah but here's how you can tell what kind of situation the woman you're in is dealing with without anyone but you and her knowing what's up:

Now that you're used to having "walked" your way up a woman's arm to her neck, just touching a woman's wrist or forearm is nothing at all, it's a part of Who You Are: A Guy Who's Comfortable With Female Contact.

So, when you spot that more Mature Girl (i love em!) and you're with friends, you can chat with her and start doing your automatic wrist/arm touches, make sure you're next to her facing almost the same way (a little towards each other), while you're talking to her with your good eye contact, and after you've done hand taps and she's totally comfortable with it, make a similar tap with a couple of fingers of your hand on the small of her back, smile a quick "i'm up to no good/Brad Pitt 'knowing' smile", and release after a few seconds.

If it's ON, IT'S ON. And, only the two of you know it. You'll know the interested look because you've practiced, practiced, practiced on girls you already know and they're a lot tougher because they've made some sort of emotional decision about you and that's more difficult to overcome than a woman you don't know.

If she pulls away a little bit, it's usually that something in the situation is not right for her and that's the tip off usually that there's a boyfriend or husband around. If she suddenly looks around AT THE OTHERS it's totally cool. You won't get busted in any way by her for touching her back as long as it was very brief AND she was totally cool/unaware of the arm touching thing. It's not much of an escalation BUT IT IS ONE. She'll either get butterflies or she'll pull away/close up a bit. Either way, you KNOW and SHE KNOWS.

There are endless ways you can do this. It's not a formula, but since you want to get out of your comfort zone your unconscious mind needs a clear map of what to do and then once it does that, your comfort zone is MUCH more large and you'll just wing it in dozens, if not hundreds of variations of this sort of thing. Women are easy to communicate with, it's just that words matter little, body language is good but it broadcasts to everyone, yet touch is VERY hard to read when the people a) see you doing things like arm touches all of the time, and b) when they can't see your touches at all like in the small of the woman's back.

A key thing to this is to NOT rehearse it in your mind. Start out with the arm touches and walk up to the elbow at first with girls you know. So, you're making your goal 4 touches to get there. That's it. No one will harm you. Girls you DO know will react more strongly because you're doing something different and their unconscious will send a "what's with that?" signal that's not a big deal. Just ignore it. It's just a quick touch and if they're friendly with you, then why would it be a big deal right?

Another way to look at it is like this: Women make a LOT of emotional unconscious decisions about you and the more behaviors you show up front the more behaviors that they'll assume you'll do with them. It's not a big deal and the guys won't notice either as long as there's a conversation going on and you haven't been staring at some hiney or something similar.

Do your touching with women as much as possible to stretch your comfort zone and you'll gain the ability to make moves like to the back touch without a care and only you and her will know (she'll half-know, she'll be unsure because of fear of rejection) that things are escalating and if there's a problem your 100x better perception of the multitude of ways a woman reacts to touch will let you know and all you have to do is move back a foot and stop touching.

Again, you do not need to rehearse this in your mind, you need to do it as much as possible with as many women as possible. If your anxiety is way too high, take a smaller step. Just make a goal to touch 10 wrists in one evening. Do that for a week. Then, make it a goal to touch 10 wrists and 10 tops of forearms on the same girls...etc etc etc..

Do this and you'll be ninja-like with your ability to scoop women out of places without anyone knowing what's up. It's not about hiding it...it's more about being suave about getting a woman in a situation so she can get laid with HER being talked about as a slut or whatever. Remember that your anxiety isn't even 1% of what a woman's is in the situation you're in.....guys who are banging milfs are seen as heros, milfs who are banging younger guys are seen as sluts.

Cool, thanks for the in-depth advice. I'm going out tomorrow to buy a Christmas gift for a party this week, so I should be able to find at least one attractive girl to try it on. Maybe more. For the cold approach, I will try the wrist touch. I'm very unexperienced with kino except in 1-on-1 escalation situations in private.