Fish oils slow down muscle degregation.

[stronglifts]

****, i've been taking 1g a day, was wondering why i wasn't seeing any benifits, do you recommend buying a bottle and just gulping it down every day to get the 30g? Is the know dosage limits where as it becomes too much? what are the health benifits you have noticed of long term use?

So many questions, but every time i search on the net i just get some crap product being sold that come in pill form and can't find the proper info.

Ta

Main benefits of fish oil:
-decreases inflammation (example: tendinitis)
-lower bodyfat

Search the net for benefits of omega 3, DHA/EPA. There's more to it. But from the perspective of somebody who lifts weights, these are the main benefits.

-Mehdi.

 

[Kwello]

Don't they also help lubricate your joints?

 

[spesmilitis]

I don't like some of Poliquin's training advice (it pertains more to athletes than guys trying to get significantly bigger) but his nutrition advice is generally spot on. He's not the only guy selling fish oil and BCAAs (his favourites) so I can't see how that's an issue.

I do not find his supplement recommendations ridiculous at all.

What about 50 BCAA pills during a workout?

 

[Warboss Alex]

What about 50 BCAA pills during a workout?

I think the number was 40, but in any case. Yes, I think that's a perfect recommendation. I wouldn't agree with the pills as they'd break the bank. I'd use 40-50g of BCAA powder in gatorade/powerade (with some other stuff too) for optimal results and wouldn't EVER consider going under 20g (and that would be a BARE minimum).

He's right on the money that to get noticeable (and I mean noticeable) benefits from BCAAs you have to megadose them (just like the fish oil). Just like you have to megadose protein (2g per lb) to get significant muscle gains.

I don't buy all this 5g BCAAs pre and post workout thing.. that won't do a thing for you and is a waste of money. The only time I'd take in such a low amount of BCAAs would be pre-cardio (and that's only because I have endomorphic tendencies).

So no, I don't find it ridiculous at all. I find it spot on.

 

[spesmilitis]

My protein powder is 50% BCAA's, can I just use that?

 

[Warboss Alex]

... Your protein powder is 50% BCAAs? So in a scoop you get 10g protein from whey and 10g BCAAs?

 

[Kev07]

how many pills of fish oil is safe to take at a time (1000mg tablets)

 

[Warboss Alex]

I wouldn't go over 30 pills at a time.. anything lower is fine.

 

[spesmilitis]

... Your protein powder is 50% BCAAs? So in a scoop you get 10g protein from whey and 10g BCAAs?

Uhhh, I guess. Here's what it says on the label http://www.powersupplements.com/cytowhey.htm
"50.3% Branched-Chain Aminos! BCCA to EAA ratio"

30 pills per day? Or like, in an hour?

 

[Warboss Alex]

Uhhh, I guess. Here's what it says on the label http://www.powersupplements.com/cytowhey.htm
"50.3% Branched-Chain Aminos! BCCA to EAA ratio"

30 pills per day? Or like, in an hour?

Spes, read the label. It says it has half as many BCAAs as EAAs. Which becomes ~24% when you consider the total protein count in 100g of protein (including all AAs). So in each scoop you're getting 18g of protein, of which ~24% is BCAAs. If you look at the amino acid profile of another whey, you'll find it's about ~20% BCAAs. So your cytowhey is a bit richer in BCAAs than most but not to a noticeable extent (to get the benefits of high BCAAs). It's just another marketing thing to make it appear than it is. So in answer to your question, no, you could not use this whey to get your BCAAs - you'd need more than 10 scoops of whey per workout.

And I mean 30 pills in a sitting.

 

[Road Demon]

Charles Poliquin recommends 45g fish oil a day.

Yes that's a lot of pills. Try fish oil in liquid form (with lemon taste):
-PFO pure fish oil
-Carlson Fish oil

I take 30-45g of the PFO pure fish oil (2-3 tablespoons). It tastes like lemonade.

The theory behind these "huge amount" of fish oil, is that cavemen used to eat everything: brains, inside of bones,... All this is full of omega 3.

-Mehdi.

Umm... 30 grams is far too much for fish oil! Flax oil (plant source Omega 3, whcih is Different than Fish Omega 3) 30 grams is not a big deal. Upper limit is maybe 4-6 grams a day of fish oil sourced EPA and DHA combined, but that is under medical supervision! Fish oil Omega 3 is potent pharmacological agent.

Most OTC fish oil pills are between 30-50% omega-3 EPA and DHA. Look at labels closely as the serving size might be 2 pills. Look for a minimium of molecular distillation and 3rd party PCB and Heavy metal tested.

A few are higher, like Solvay Omacor (Requires a Prescription @ 85% to treat high serum Triglycerides)

Carlson Super Omega fish oil is a very high quality supplement, both in liquid and pill form. It is AOAC tested and made in an FDA regulated facility. A 1 gram Carlson fish oil pill provides 300mg of EPA and 200mg of DHA so it is a 50% concentrate. You can try starting at 1000mg of EPA and DHA combined per day. The Amercian Heart Association recommend 1000mg of EPA and DHA combined for cardiovascular disease patients.

Consult with medical professional before talking higher dosages. The actual therapeutic dosage for specific diseases is between 1.5 to 4 grams of EPAand DHA combined under the supervision of an MD.

fyi: I take 1500-2000 mg of EPA and DHA combined. Usually Carlson, but I have taken others.

RD

 

[Warboss Alex]

Road Demon.. you've told us what's recommended. Recommended by whom? MDs? The same people who say we should be eating 80g of protein a day?

There is NOTHING wrong (and everything good) about a high fish oil dose. (conversely there is an argument against a high flax oil dose - which you say isn't a big deal - but as I'm skeptical of it myself I won't bring it up)

Also, the 30-45g dose of fish oil is primarily to redress the omega3 : omega6 balance. If this balance is 20:1-50:1 in favour of omega6, how is 5g a day of fish oil going to redress this? It won't, simply! Once you've run the high dose fish oil for a while (say a month or two) you can lower the dose BUT you'd be better off with keeping it high for the health benefits.

And in a high fat enviroment (anabolic diet for example) it is prudent to get in a high fish oil dose to balance the fats you're taking in. That is the context in which the 30-45g of fish oil is recommended. And remember as strength athletes our needs are greater than that of the sedentary public (for whom the guidelines were laid down).

 

[Kwello]

Yeah once you start to distance yourself physically from the average Joe, you can basically toss any doctor recommended dose sizes out the window.

Like WBA says (I've basically just accepted that he's always right at this point) they recommend 80g protein a day. Right. When I drop down to even like 150g a day, I notice my training gets less effective.

 

[spesmilitis]

well, 20:1-30:1 is the average fast food eatin' American? A huge source poly unsats are fried and fast foods which use vegetable oils for cooking. Vegetable oils are the biggest sourse of polyunsats in the American diet. The ratio is probably much lower for clean eaters. Also, average Americans don't get any major sources of omerga-3's (no walnuts, grass fed meat/eggs, fish, ect). Getting on the supplements would seem to double or triple ones omega-3 intake (just random guessestimates, not based on anything)

High fish oil dosages has a blood thinning affect. When im up to 10g/day fish oil, I notice increased bruising in my BJJ classes.

 

[stronglifts]

don't compare yourself to average population. The fact that you exercise & have a diet, makes you different from the average population.

different games, different rules.

-Mehdi.

 

[typical]

30 pills your kidding right ?? Man I'll stick to the liquid form then LOL

 

[spesmilitis]

exactly how much does omega-3's and omega-6's does the average and healthy American get a day? Since we know the ratio, i'm sure we can get the exact amount some how.

 

[Throttle]

i don't know where WBA gets his numbers. here's advice from an NIH study team:

http://newsletter.vitalchoice.com/e_article000675955.cfm

they're recommending 3.5 grams of omega-3 a day, which corresponds to appx. 3 capsules or one generous serving of salmon per day, OR cut back on your omega-6s. but obviously if you eat corn-fed beef & eggs like an old school bodybuilder you'll need to up that.

 

[simon]

Say I get 20g of omega-6 from a days eating: lamb, turkey thigh and eggs. Say I want my omega-6 : omega-3 ratio as low as possible, 3:1 as a minimum, that means I have to take 6g+ of omega-3, which equates to a minimum of 25g of fish oil. That's why the fish oil is so high.

Throttle, in that link they're recommending 3.5 g of omega-3, not 3.5g of fish oil. 3.5g omega-3 is equivalent to a bit less than 15g of fish oil a day. To get that much you'd need to eat 36oz of sockeye salmon a day.

"The American Heart Association (AHA) recommends that everyone eat two servings of oily fish twice a week. A six-ounce serving of sockeye would provide about four grams of omega-3s per week, or 571 mg per day."

 

[stronglifts]

i don't know where WBA gets his numbers. here's advice from an NIH study team:

http://newsletter.vitalchoice.com/e_article000675955.cfm

they're recommending 3.5 grams of omega-3 a day, which corresponds to appx. 3 capsules or one generous serving of salmon per day, OR cut back on your omega-6s. but obviously if you eat corn-fed beef & eggs like an old school bodybuilder you'll need to up that.

I support WBA's advice: 30-45 grams fish oil a day. Cut the carbs, eat more fats, up the proteins: less inflammation, leaner, more muscle, better endocrine effects.

-Mehdi;