"How I Made Sure No Woman Ever Friend-Zoned Me Again"

She calls you when her car breaks down. When she needs help moving. When some guy she's actually dating treats her badly.

You're the listener. The reliable one. The guy who would treat her so much better, if she'd just open her eyes.

She won't. You trained her to see you as the low-effort option — the friend who requires zero risk and zero investment. Every favor dug the hole deeper.

The "22 Rules" break the pattern. You'll stop auditioning for a role she already cast and become the man she chases instead. It starts with Rule 1.

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finally got a number

spang

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i finally approached this girl from my chemistry class today. we had talked in class for a few minutes once but it had been a while. it went into a conversation about class stuff. then i steered the conversation into social activities. i used some advice i got here the other day to engage her a little better. i smiled, made eye contact. we talked about parties, clubbing, bars, good places to eat etc. she was nice and i made her laugh a few times. we talked for a good ten minutes...but here was the key part....

me:so do you ever go to starbucks?
girl:yeah sometimes. i usually study in the library.
me:well lets hang out sometime and get some coffee
girl:sure sounds good
me:whats your phone number
girl:uh well i do have a bf by the way
me: oh...
girl:yeah
me:well we can still hang out right...whats your number
girl:yeah its xxx-xxx-xxxx
me:cool

then we got to the parking deck and parted ways. she said bye spang have a good fall break.
i did choke a little bit when she told me she had a bf...i paused like oh crap what do i say, but i persisted. another thing that bothered me was her body language screamed im nervous as hell. she kept stroking her hair and talking nervously. either she likes me or i creeped her out and she hates me. probably the latter. she didnt run away or avoid me though.
i feel like i fvcked that up as usual. but hey at least i got a number out of it.
 

"Nervous Around Beautiful Women? There's a Rule for That"

I could talk to any woman I wasn't attracted to. Charming, funny, relaxed. Then a gorgeous woman looked my way and I'd become a sweating, babbling mess.

The fix took me years to find and ten minutes to learn. Nervousness and excitement are the same physical state — pounding heart, adrenaline, flushed face. Your brain just picks the label. And you can pick a better one.

Rule 16 shows you how. You feel the nerves, relabel them as excitement, and let that energy pour out as enthusiasm. Women notice the guy radiating it. They always do.

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ARrocket

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You should try to get her to go out with you and your friends sometime...even though she may be off the table, she could have some attractive friends
 

spang

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she did mention that her bf is in another state, her home state. i almost said well he aint here...but i didnt want to seem like a dovche.
i cant help but wonder was the playing with the hair thing an IOI or we she just uncomfortable? she did not cross her arms or have closed body language. who knows...a small victory but i didnt win much.
 

Renegade357

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Yeah, I been down this path too many times. Unless she's nuts or you're just going for a imoral lay it's a waste of time. If they have a b/f don't bother.

Get the number then just smile and say "Oh, well he's a very lucky guy." Then don't call her. Nice work getting the number though man that's great practice.
 

For_F

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I have gotten many girls numbers who said they have boyfriends. You must build great rapport in the first meeting and some how get to see them again asap and build on your first meeting. In my experience, when you play the game too vaguely or with toomuch empty space between points of contact she will either feel guilty and cut you off, meet another guy who puts more pressure and aggression in his approach to get her or she may find you boring.

Basic DJ rules still apply but some aspects of the game you must put on an exclamation mark to be successful.

Also, I found that if you're connected to a girl through social circles and he isn't connected then your chances increases. You have an outlet to break through while also making her feel as if she isn't being too bad of a girlfriend at the outset.

I used to think girlfriends and wives were off limits in my afc days but now if a woman is willing to svck you off behind her partners back then you're doing him a favor.
 

"She Laughed All Night. Then She Ghosted You. Here's Why."

Dinner ran three hours. She laughed at everything. You walked her to her car thinking this one's locked in.

Then: nothing. Two texts. No reply. What happened?

You did what most men do on a great date. You filled every silence, answered every question, and left her with nothing to wonder about. No mystery. Nothing to sit with when she got home.

Rule 3 of the "22 Rules" changes the ending: tell her a little, hold back the rest, and let her imagination do the chasing. The ghosting stops too.

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VladPatton

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Can work both ways. Could be true, could be BS. Try a hangout and see what develops. Props on being cool about it and continuing when she dropped the bf bomb.
 

thevilittletroll

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first of all phone numbers are not worth the paper they are written on, and more times then not, the boyfriend is just an excuse to get you to leave them alone. i'm not gonna sugar coat it and tell you that you did a good job. im here to help you fix your problems so it doesnt happen in the future.

after reading your post you dont sound very confident that her number will be solid. i'm here to tell you she felt the exact same way. i'd be real supprised if she ever hangs out with you alone in a date type situation. she'll be nice and polite and maybe even answer your text messages. she knows she has to see you on campus so she doesnt want to piss you off by being a b-itch. she wants to feel safe.

#1 work on your confidence and your body language.
#2 from what you wrote based on your conversation it's boring fluff talk interview style questions that build no attraction or emotional connection. this what most guys do wrong. it tells her you are not interesting, boring, not confident, no fun. its the same boring bs as whats your name, where you from, what do you do for fun. work on your attraction material, pick some conversational topics that are off the wall but are fun & interesting that requires more than just a yes no type answer. i like to get ideas from indirect opinion openers.
#3 be more aggressive with your flirting and your kino. make sure she knows you find her attractive and that you are hitting on her. otherwise you will find yourself in the friend zone. if you dont express to her that you are interested in her in a sexual way, she will label you as a friendly non confident guy that does not have enough alpha to make a move on her. AKA Friend Zone!
 

spang

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now whats bugging me is why she gave me her number if she had absolutely no interest in me. she could have refused or maybe she just did it out of social obligation. maybe it means nothing and its just an ego boost for her. either way i dont really plan on texting her anytime soon.
 

oxford comma

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thevilittletroll said:
first of all phone numbers are not worth the paper they are written on, and more times then not, the boyfriend is just an excuse to get you to leave them alone. i'm not gonna sugar coat it and tell you that you did a good job. im here to help you fix your problems so it doesnt happen in the future.

after reading your post you dont sound very confident that her number will be solid. i'm here to tell you she felt the exact same way. i'd be real supprised if she ever hangs out with you alone in a date type situation. she'll be nice and polite and maybe even answer your text messages. she knows she has to see you on campus so she doesnt want to piss you off by being a b-itch. she wants to feel safe.

#1 work on your confidence and your body language.
#2 from what you wrote based on your conversation it's boring fluff talk interview style questions that build no attraction or emotional connection. this what most guys do wrong. it tells her you are not interesting, boring, not confident, no fun. its the same boring bs as whats your name, where you from, what do you do for fun. work on your attraction material, pick some conversational topics that are off the wall but are fun & interesting that requires more than just a yes no type answer. i like to get ideas from indirect opinion openers.
#3 be more aggressive with your flirting and your kino. make sure she knows you find her attractive and that you are hitting on her. otherwise you will find yourself in the friend zone. if you dont express to her that you are interested in her in a sexual way, she will label you as a friendly non confident guy that does not have enough alpha to make a move on her. AKA Friend Zone!
great post! op, i have the same problem as you. i used to think working up the courage to talk to a girl for five minutes then get the number= getting laid! I cant give you much advice cuz im at the same stage as you but what i have been working on is being more aggressive and escalating faster. basically, i want to be WAY too aggressive and then find the balance instead of just *****footing around showing her im attracted and having her think im just some chump. basically, amp up the intensity of your convos.
 

sylvester the cat

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spang said:
now whats bugging me is why she gave me her number if she had absolutely no interest in me. she could have refused or maybe she just did it out of social obligation. maybe it means nothing and its just an ego boost for her. either way i dont really plan on texting her anytime soon.
to get rid of you because she had no interest in you?

giving a phone number is the easiest (and softest) way to get rid of a guy short of saying 'i have a bfriend'.

or, she was interested and wants you to call her.

there is only one way to find out and that is to find out...
 

"I'm Not Looking for Anything Serious Right Now"

When a woman says it, guys hear a confession. A heads-up. A scheduling conflict.

Here's the translation: I don't feel anything. Right now. With you.

Watch what happens when a man triggers actual attraction. The busy career, the recent breakup, the "not in a place to date" — all of it evaporates instantly. The same woman who was guarding her freedom is suddenly free every night.

The "22 Rules" explain why. When the right switches flip, her timeline rearranges itself around you.

Read more...

oxford comma

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troll, what kind of stuff do you do to get a solid number? what do you talk about? i must admit, i go into interview mode and even as im doing it i know its wrong and boring haha. i need to memorize some interesting questions to ask.
 

Trump

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spang said:
me:so do you ever go to starbucks?
girl:yeah sometimes. i usually study in the library.
me:well lets hang out sometime and get some coffee
girl:sure sounds good
me:whats your phone number
girl:uh well i do have a bf by the way
me: oh...
girl:yeah
me:well we can still hang out right...whats your number
girl:yeah its xxx-xxx-xxxx
me:cool

she kept stroking her hair and talking nervously. either she likes me or i creeped her out and she hates me. probably the latter. she didnt run away or avoid me though.
i feel like i fvcked that up as usual. but hey at least i got a number out of it.
Bro we have to work on your confidence. You act like they are doing you a favour by giving you their number. What are you going to do when it comes to have sex with a girl?

You should listen to what a girl says and RESPOND, not completely ignore it and focus on the number.

"I usually study in the library"
"What do you study"

"I have a boyfriend"
"What does he do?"

By the sounds of it she could have said "Well I do have a turtle" and you would have still replied "Well thats ok, we can still hang out."
 

thevilittletroll

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oxford comma said:
troll, what kind of stuff do you do to get a solid number? what do you talk about? i must admit, i go into interview mode and even as im doing it i know its wrong and boring haha. i need to memorize some interesting questions to ask.
guys i want to help change your entire mentality. your goal is not to get the phone number. your goal should be to GET THE DATE. the phone number should be just one step in the process, its not the goal. i'm not gonna bore you with giving you a bunch of material. first you have to attract her. you can find plenty of attraction material her on this site. before you ask for her number talk about some event that you are going to and build it up. invite her and get the number. i like to use some party my friend is having, or a concert. you dont have to go to the event its just a reason to get the number.

keep in mind once you get good attraction, you dont need techniques, just ask for the number.
 

oxford comma

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thevilittletroll said:
guys i want to help change your entire mentality. your goal is not to get the phone number. your goal should be to GET THE DATE. the phone number should be just one step in the process, its not the goal. i'm not gonna bore you with giving you a bunch of material. first you have to attract her. you can find plenty of attraction material her on this site. before you ask for her number talk about some event that you are going to and build it up. invite her and get the number. i like to use some party my friend is having, or a concert. you dont have to go to the event its just a reason to get the number.

keep in mind once you get good attraction, you dont need techniques, just ask for the number.
for some reason i never thought of actually inviting her to something as im talking to her. haha. it seems pretty obvious now, maybe its because i dont have much of a social life to begin with and never know of anything fun going on. great advice!
 
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