Finally getting somewhere

[Die Hard]

I love you guys! I'm finally getting tangible results with women, picking one up last week at the club, picking one up at the club last night, almost done setting up a date with a girl I met online...

I love how I'm behaving, I'm actually ****y and funny and confident. They want me more than the other way around, I am in charge! Just a little example: Last night at the club, I was being mysterious and totally slick, I presented myself as an enigma to her. At one point she let go of me (she was constantly putting her arms around me and pressing herself against me while we were talking/dancing/whatever) and started looking at my face very seriously, she looked like she was sort of afraid or something. So I said "What?" and she told me "I don't know what to think of you, I can't get a read on you. I think you might not be good for me..." So I just told her "Okay, go away then. Bye!" I waved at her, turned around and looked the other way. She immediately grabbed my arm, pushed herself against me and told me "No, I wanna stay with you!" and I don't think she has removed herself one inch from me for the remainder of the night...

I just love how I did that. I could never do such a thing before! I'd be afraid that I fukked up and had "lost" her. I'd tell her "No, I'm sorry. Come back, I like you! I'm a really nice guy and a really trustworthy guy. I'm just playing around! Now come back please, okay?"

There's a lot going on with me, I feel like I'm entering a new phase in my transformation (soon, I'll grow antennas on my forehead, wings on my back and slowly turn into a fly ).

If it wasn't for you guys, I'd be the same chump I was one year ago! Thanks for showing me the light with all your stories, comments, advices etc.

 

[squirrels]

Hmm...I forget which girl told me recently she "couldn't get a read on me". They're used to reading certain behaviors in guys...the fact that you're bucking that trend indicates you're doing SOMETHING right.

Welcome to the party.

 

[Die Hard]

Glad to be a part of it

Let's just hope this high I'm riding will last, right?

 

[Die Hard]

Well, first of all, I need to be honest about my "technique"... I'm still kind of a wussy regarding approaches, meaning that I don't really go for a girl if she didn't give clear IOI's.

In the case of these last two girls, I was pretty sure they WANTED me to pick them up, even before I really started conversation with them or anything. Once I know this, I just feel totally comfortable and start to flow. I just say what I wanna say and do what I wanna do, as if I'm talking to one of my best friends. They look at me, eye contact, smile, they act all feminine, it's like their whole body language says "I want you!" So then I feel like taking a shot at the goal while there is no goalie defending it, I can't miss. Of course, I wish I was able to have the same confidence if the girl didn't show clear IOI's...but that'll come in time. I'm just taking my transformation one step at a time.

So on the one hand, I feel like I'm being a wuss, only able to be confident when it's obvious she wants me. On the other hand, in the past I would be nervous even if she gave clear IOI's. So I did change, I did improve myself and I'm happy about that.

As far as making out, I sort of apply the same 'wussy tactic' of waiting for her to 'invite' me. I don't dare to initiate it before I have certainty that she wants it. I honestly admit that I am afraid to get rejected, so I just don't do anything unless I know that it'll work. At the same time, I guess this 'wussy' tactic works in my favor. I do things step by step:

- Start talking to her, make lots of eye contact during conversation and smile a lot.

That's how you should begin, right? But I don't do this coz that's how it should be done. I just do it because she didn't give me a sign to do MORE than that. I don't wanna make a bad move, so I proceed cautiously and test her step by step. If she responds positive to one step, I'll go to the next step. Again, not because there's some manual that says this is the right way to do things, but simply because my *fear of making a bad move and perhaps get rejected* tells me to.

So if the conversation/eye contact/smiling is reciprocated by the girl, I go for the next step: physical contact. The loud music in the club comes in handy...sometimes I pretend I didn't hear what she said, so I'll grab her by the waist and pull her closer "What did you say?" Of course, not too enthusiastic, just touching her lightly. Just applying basic kino rules, I guess. I'll continue to do kino and see if she reciprocates.

She'll start kino'ing me as well and then things will soon automatically go towards kissing/making out. I don't really do it consciously, it just happens. I mean, at the beginning of the conversation, you stand next to/opposite each other, you respect each others personal space. When you say something to her, you'll move your head closer to hers and move it backward when you finished your sentence. Then she'll move her head closer towards yours and respond to what you said. This goes back and forth. But by the time the steps of eye contact/smiling and kino'ing have been completed, your heads will be close to each other permanently, no more moving back and forth. Same goes for your bodies...at first I grab her by the waist coz I couldn't hear what she said (supposedly haha) and let go again and move a little backwards again. Later on, I just leave my hand on her waist and keep standing close to her. At this point, she's been kino'ing me too (grabbing my arm, mostly) and leaves her hand on my arm as well. So there you are, heads close to each other, bodies close to each other, arms/hands on each other, you're basically almost cuddling.

Of course, you're making conversation all the time, the conversation is simply the camouflage for the whole physical process I just described.

At this point, you look her in the eye. This is kinda ironic: your head was next to hers for the last while of the conversation (remember, you both stopped moving it backwards after finishing a sentence, you just keep your mouth beside her ear and she does too. By the way, another thing that'll happen is your cheeks will touch. Touch and disconnect the first few times, but eventually just keep them connected) This means you can't look each other in the eye for all that time your heads are next to each other. Then when you move your head backwards and look her in the eye, you both become aware of this. It's like you realize "damn we were so close to each other all the time but at the same time we didn't see each other". I dunno how to express this, but it just sends a certain realization through the both of you, makes you aware of the fact that you've broken all physical barriers between each other. So mostly, when you look each other in the eye at this point, you'll have some sort of mutual realization and give each other a confirming smile.

From here on, there's not really any step left. Kissing/making out is the natural next thing to do. You could start off by slowly and gently rocking your bodies left and right on the music, arms around each other, looking each other deep in the eyes, then go for the kiss. Or put your heads next to each other while doing this and kiss her in the neck first before going for the full kiss. Or you could just kiss her right away. Doesn't really matter what you do at this point or in which order, you can grab her ass, stroke her legs, do whatever you want (although some girls do need the kiss first before they allow you to touch her ass and legs).

Wow, I didn't mean to digress and write such a long and detailed post, haha. Anyway, I guess the most important thing is just feeling confident and NATURAL. I never planned to do the things I described above, it just happened. On the other hand, I did read similar descriptions of the steps on this and other sites many, many times. I really believe this information has become a part of my subconscious. When I talk to a girl and just suddenly out of the blue get this idea to try and grab her waiste, faking that I couldn't hear what she said...this is my own idea, it came to me out of nowhere, it's just a sudden impulse I get. But I do believe I would not have had this impulse if I had never read all those countless threads on kino. You know what I mean?

Getting back at what I said earlier: My fear of being rejected makes me act natural and sort of works to my advantage. If wouldn't dare to ask a girl to come home with me if I hadn't made out with her first. I'd be too afraid that she'll say 'no' and I get rejected. While this is kinda 'cowardly', it works for me at the same time, because a girl would not be eager to go home with me if we hadn't made out first, right? If I had no fear of being rejected, I'd just straight away tell a girl "Wanna fukk?" and probably get slapped in the face. So my fear prevents me from skipping certain steps and girls like it when you take things step by step. That's the game of seduction, you can't just say "wanna fukk?" You need to seduce her, push the right buttons, and my fear makes me do that. I guess you do need knowledge of those steps and how to push the right buttons, you do need to know what you're doing, so it's a good thing to read about that. But ultimately, you shouldn't do something (like grabbing her waist or putting your head next to hers) because you read that somewhere, you should do it because it feels right at that moment.

So if you ask me: "Is it really just balls and go for it?" I'd say it's actually the opposite, hahaha! I hope I'm making sense, lol.

 

[squirrels]

Of course, you're making conversation all the time, the conversation is simply the camouflage for the whole physical process I just described.

Understanding this one tidbit by itself puts you ahead of 50% of the Don Juans on this forum.

So if you ask me: "Is it really just balls and go for it?" I'd say it's actually the opposite, hahaha! I hope I'm making sense, lol.

It's "balls", but it's also knowing when to let 'em hang and when to pull 'em back a little.

You can wield a lot of power in a seduction if you learn to wield it subtly.

 

[Die Hard]

Thanks, Squirrels It's the subtleties that really make your game, I guess... But I'm only just beginning to grasp all that, still have a long road to go!

I feel the need to write my thoughts down, as a way of putting things in perspective for myself. I tend to digress a lot, which makes for a boring read but this is more like a note to myself, rather than a message to you guys. I hope y'all won't be annoyed and of course I welcome any comments very much!

I was just remembering how I went to the club with a fellow Sosuave.com member a while ago. I was having approach anxiety while he approached lots of girls. It kinda gave me the feeling that I'm pathetic at pick up... I truly respect the balls that he had that night! At one point, we met two girls on the street and went to some bar with them. Once we were inside, they kinda ignored us and eventually started talking to other guys. Our mistake, I guess...we should've probably been more aggressive. Well, at least I know I should have, I can't really speak for him. Anyway, later on, he decided to give it another shot with his target. She had acted quite interested in him up until the moment we entered the bar and they started ignoring us, so he wasn't willing to give up on her yet. Only problem was she was standing there, talking to the same dude all night long. So we stood at a distance and watched the chick talking to that dude, while contemplating what he should do. We stood there for a very long time and concluded that his only option was to go in there, interrupt the conversation and try to pick her up. But he was hesitating... I thought to myself: "He won't do it, especially since he's been contemplating it for over 5 minutes now. If he was going to do it, he would've done it already, it's not going to happen anymore." But eventually he did! Just walked up there, interrupted the conversation and did his best to pick her up. Well, it didn't work and we went on to other girls but he earned my eternal respect! I would never ever have the balls to do that! He approached many more girls after that and I was just being a wussy with approach anxiety.

Later on, I told myself I have to become like him. "I want what he has", is what I thought. But there was also some other perspective in my mind, which I'll try to explain now.

I often feel like I wouldn't be 'high value' if I approached girls left and right. Playing the numbers game appears like a dishonorable thing to me. Going from one girl to another, just going for the next one in line when the current one rejects me, and so on... It would make me feel like I'm kinda desperate, like I'm thinking: "I'm gonna open each and every girl I see tonight, until I succeed!" I'd feel like I had lost my self respect if I were to do this. I've always been the exact opposite from that, which is also a bad thing, like: "I'm not gonna open a girl, she will have to come to me." That attitude never got me anywhere, lol. But still...that was the starting point for me when I decided to become a DJ and leave my AFC days behind, it's my foundation so to speak.

I mean, If I imagine a strong, masculine, confident guy, some Clint Eastwood character...he wouldn't go from girl to girl, opening girls left and right, would he? He would stand there at the bar, just being cool. He wouldn't scan the place with his eyes, hoping to find a girl he could pick up. He would just scan the place in general, with no direct purpose... And at some point, some girl would just catch his eye. Not because he was purposely looking for a girl, but he just noticed her and felt attracted. So then he approaches her, picks her up and that's that (and he already knows he's gonna succeed, haha). He's the strong and silent type, he doesn't NEED a girl, so he sure as hell doesn't open one after another, like a beggar. (don't get me wrong, I don't think people who do this act like beggars and as long as they feel good about themselves, who am I to criticise them. It's just that I, personally, would feel like that, but I'm just a stubborn Klingon who has way too much sense of honour, lol. Godspeed to those who open girls left and right without some stupid honour-feeling being in their way!)

Anyway, he doesn't NEED a girl, but he does WANT one when he happens to notice one that attracts him. It's a totally different starting point to go from... One might ask: Does he not have the balls to actively look for girls? Isn't he just tricking himself into believing that he doesn't need a girl? Is this strong and silent image not just something he projects onto himself so he doesn't have to deal with his desires, which make him "weak"? I dunno, I guess this is all true in a sense... I've always been this strong and silent type, not as much as the stereotype you see in movies, but it's what my personality is like overall. I've been too much of it in the past and I'm moving away from that now. But it is my starting point, it is where I come from and I do stay closer to it than others, I guess. I will not open every pretty girl I see until I succeed, that makes me feel weak. Some other guy might not have problems with this and he might score a girl following this tactic, while I leave the club alone. I don't care, good for him. However, I will allow myself to try a few girls. This doesn't make me feel desperate, but at the same time, it's a big improvement from the rigid attitude I had in my AFC days (when I didn't approach at all, having convinced myself they had to come to me, but really just being a wussy).

At the moment, this works better for me, because it is more congruent with my personality. I often attract women by acting distant, like I am kinda unapproachable. It intrigues them... Like the silent cowboy standing alone at the bar, his hat tilted forward so his face is kinda closed off, while the rest of the saloon is being loud and outgoing. In the past, I would be like that even after a girl showed interest, I couldn't break out of that attitude. I'd stay distant and introverted...and therefor was always flirting, but never closing. I moved away from that rigid personality, but it remains my at my core. In practice, this means I get the advantage of attracting women because I still radiate that strong/silent type image, but at the same time I'm not confined by it and can act outside of it's boundaries. I am the strong and silent type, but I'm also the pleasant, sociable and chatty guy. Better said, I'm none of those...I just have a repertoire of different behaviour, which I can apply according to the moment, while still being 'myself' all the time.

Of course, it's not as perfect as I make it sound now. Sometimes I'm totally out of sync and way too conscious of my own behaviour, I'll be insecure and totally not 'in the zone'. But overall, what I said above is true, especially these last two weekends of going to the club. And I notice it applies to my personality and behaviour in daily life as well, although it seems harder there.

Anyway, what I'm contending here is that it's a good thing to find your own way in the game (I know I'm not saying anything original here, but this is more of a note to myself than a message to you guys). If you line up 10 great DJ's and let them run their game on women, I don't think they will all behave the same way. You are not your game, you are you. Your game comes on top of your personality and is intertwined with it. If you really want to have succesful game, it should be based off your personality and be in accordance with it, I think.

Haha, my post is becoming too long. I'll continue in the next one...

 

[Die Hard]

When I think back of that night when I went out with a fellow Sosuave member, I remember we were going to get some fresh air at one point but he started talking to a chick while we made our way to the exit. So I waited for him a few metres further, standing in the middle of the crowd. As I stood there, I assumed my cool, confident attitude (actually, I just WAS cool and confident, lol) and looked around, not waiting for him but rather just enjoying myself. Then some hot girl looked at me very briefly, then looked the other way and said something to her girlfriend. I could tell she was talking about me coz she slightly turned her back towards me. She did it very lightly, almost unnoticeable, but still... (lol, I love how easy it is to read them if you just pay attention!). So I turned my body towards them, looked at them confidently for a second, kinda acknowledging that I knew they were talking about me, and then looked the other way again, putting a little smirk on my face. One minute later we were "coincidentally" standing next to each other and I looked her in the eye... I don't know how to explain this, but I made all of my body language signal that I wasn't enthusiastic about her, except for my eyes. Hard to explain what I mean... It's like when you put your hands in your pockets and assume a careless position, conveying that you don't care about anything happening around you. But with my eyes I expressed a clear, genuine lust and sexuality.

Next moment, she just moved towards me and immediately dancing with me, her body against mine, stroking my face and running her fingers through my hair in a very sensual way!!! I had acted totally minimalistic but the effect was extremely powerful, haha. I didn't even approach her, I mean, I just stood there and gave her a glance. Then she came towards me, grabbed me and started dancing with me. This tells me that my strong/silent type attitude works. I'm convinced she was attracted to me because I radiated an "I am not looking for a women" attitude and displayed lots of confidence, when I stopped and waited for my wingman (to a lesser degree, this is also what I did with the girls I picked up this week and last week). I admit that I don't have the balls to do what my wingman did that night, approaching all those girls...but when it comes to pure results, he didn't achieve more than I did. I guess this is just my style, based off and in accord with my personality. However, that's not to say I will be confined by my current style. Lesson nine from the Book of Pook says: "Be not contained by formula!"

 

[squirrels]

Here's the thing...no, Clint would not go up and talk to a bunch of girls, but Clint had better things to do than chase tail...like shoot people.

One thing it took me a very hard time to get my head around was the idea that if I CAME to a bar with a girl, it didn't necessarily mean I had to LEAVE the bar with the same girl. Unless it's an "extract/venue change", where you're taking her somewhere away from her friends to make out or something, then don't be afraid to disconnect from the girl you came with and explore some other tail.

I can think of at least 2 occasions where I've taken girls out to bar/nightclub type places...girls who were attractive enough that I started getting IOIs from other girls. I declined to respond, instead "waiting" for the girl I had originally came with...in both cases, I found that she had gone off on her own to "party" and any attempt to draw her back just made me look like a total chump. I learned two things from this:

1) Don't take sand to the beach
2) You don't HAVE to leave with the same girl you came with

This is especially true when you hook in with girls off the streets and chat them up, then follow them to a club. If they wanna be around you, they will be. Otherwise, just use them to guide you to where the "rest of the p*ssy is".

Once you're there, just drift around, look for eye contact/incidental kino, when you get it, just "run game". Otherwise just drink and have a good time.

I never liked the word "approach"...it turns talking to girls into a distinct high-importance "event". A Don Juan does not make an "event" out of talking to girls. He just talks to them.

As I stood there, I assumed my cool, confident attitude (actually, I just WAS cool and confident, lol) and looked around, not waiting for him but rather just enjoying myself. Then some hot girl looked at me very briefly, then looked the other way and said something to her girlfriend. I could tell she was talking about me coz she slightly turned her back towards me. She did it very lightly, almost unnoticeable, but still... (lol, I love how easy it is to read them if you just pay attention!).

http://www.valdostamuseum.org/hamsmith/MatrixCode.gif

Here's the scary thing...the more comfortable you get with talking to/sexing women, the more you start interpreting EVERYTHING as an "IOI". And 9 times out of 10, you're right.

Tell me this...whenever you meet a new woman, don't you IMMEDIATELY evaluate her in your mind, regardless of her age/appearance/professional relationship/social relationship, as to whether you'd f**k her? Even if you NEVER would because she's your friend's wife, your boss, etc, you still make that evaluation, right? Either saying in your head, "yes I'd f**k that" or "no I probably wouldn't f**k that"?

You think it's only guys who do that sh*t??

 

[Die Hard]

Here's the thing...no, Clint would not go up and talk to a bunch of girls, but Clint had better things to do than chase tail...like shoot people.

You just made me realize how badass he truly was



I definitely know what you mean! I do it with every woman, no exceptions. My female boss is not my boss, she's a woman. A female store assistant is not a store assistent, she is a woman. And women I can only see from one perspective... Interaction with women is ALWAYS sexual to me, even if I was talking to my female lawyer who's minutes away from convincing the jury not to put me on death row...

And even if a woman doesn't attract me, I will try to flirt with her and see if I can get her to signal some IOI's to me. I love it when they resist my flirting and don't want to have any part of it. They pretend they don't realize what you're doing and ignore it, hoping that you'll stop... It's so much fun if you can get her to respond after all! She doesn't want to signal them but her subconcious takes over and sends them after all, against her will!