I saw Fight Club recently and was wondering why so many people look up to Tyler Durden. If someone would do a personality analysis of Jack the main-character/ narrator and Tyler Durden it would be helpful to see what makes him alpha and so special. I also wanted to make this thread to discuss the movie so post your thoughts!
"I just moved here from Florida."
That sentence contains at least five follow-up questions she WANTS you to ask. Where in Florida? What brought you here? How long have you been in the area? What do you miss? How does it compare to here?
She handed them to you on a silver platter. And you said, "Oh cool. I come here every week. I love this band. Ummm... pretty crowded tonight."
She smiled politely. Nodded. And never texted you back.
I was that guy for years. Talking too much. Listening too little. Panicking about my next sentence while she was literally feeding me the answers.
Then I found 22 rules that fixed the whole thing. Rule number one: shut up and listen. She'll tell you exactly what to say.
Fight Club (Jack and Tyler Durden)
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"So, What Do You Do for Fun?"
She asks it casually, mid-sip. And you feel the floor open up, because the honest answer is work, gym, and a couple shows you're half-watching.
Women rarely say this out loud, but a man with a life is attractive before he says a word. The guy who spent Saturday deep-sea fishing and came back with photos and a story — he walks in already interesting.
The "22 Rules" pushed me to build a life worth talking about. Turns out the fastest way to be interesting to women is to be interested in your own life first.
WORKEROUTER
Master Don Juan
Durden is FREE.
He is and does what most are AFRAID to do. This is what makes him alpha, unlike Jack who is a repressed spirit.
He is and does what most are AFRAID to do. This is what makes him alpha, unlike Jack who is a repressed spirit.
I dont know if I would call that free. More a loose nut! The dude is basically a bum with violence issues! But it was a great movie, definately a different perspective on things and Tyler was a cool character. Though I have it from good sources Pitt hit the juices for 6 weeks before filming, so his ripped up body is not "real" so to speak.
"Why Women Dump the Guys Who Try the Hardest"
You paid for dinner. You drove. You said "whatever you want is fine" every single time. All the effort, no expectations.
And she left anyway — probably for a guy who makes her pick up the pizza.
Painful. Also predictable. Her mind quietly concludes that anything requiring zero effort from her is worth exactly zero. You became a free sample, and free samples get taken for granted.
The 22 Rules flip the dynamic. Small shifts that get her investing effort, money, and time in you — until SHE'S the one afraid of losing YOU.
As I wrote elsewhere...
Remember kids, Fight Club is FICTION. Tyler Durden is jobless, homeless, has no prospects. He would not resemble Brad Pitt in any way, because Brad Pitt is everything Tyler Durden is not and his image, physique, coolness, lifestyle and so on are the result of self-improvement.
In reality, Tyler Durden would look like one of the stars of Bum Fights
Remember kids, Fight Club is FICTION. Tyler Durden is jobless, homeless, has no prospects. He would not resemble Brad Pitt in any way, because Brad Pitt is everything Tyler Durden is not and his image, physique, coolness, lifestyle and so on are the result of self-improvement.
In reality, Tyler Durden would look like one of the stars of Bum Fights
Lol, Bum Fights is exactly what came to mind when I read the post also.Jariel said:
But Pitts image, physique are a result of genetics and roids (at least in fightclub they were). I have seen many times when he does not look ripped at all sitting by the pool, not to mention, pasty white.
Vulpine
Master Don Juan
Well, for a bum, Tyler Durden sure was self-reliant.
Dude found a house to squat in, and ran a business in it. So let's see... if he had a home and a job, what part of that equates to "bum"? When was the last time you saw a bum in a department store selling things? Bum on a plane?
Tyler was an "Alpha" who not only established a business, but organized and led a radical social movement. Looks had nothing to do with it.
There are too many good themes in that movie for the feeble-minded to grasp.
The fighting is merely a symbolic celebration of testosterone, not "advocating self destruction".
Meanwhile "Jack" is wrapped up in the womanized world of shopping for material possesions, having a job he hates to buy those things, and image. Jack is "plugged" in, as emphasized by his condo in contrast to Tyler Durden's shack.
Dude found a house to squat in, and ran a business in it. So let's see... if he had a home and a job, what part of that equates to "bum"? When was the last time you saw a bum in a department store selling things? Bum on a plane?
Tyler was an "Alpha" who not only established a business, but organized and led a radical social movement. Looks had nothing to do with it.
There are too many good themes in that movie for the feeble-minded to grasp.
The fighting is merely a symbolic celebration of testosterone, not "advocating self destruction".
Meanwhile "Jack" is wrapped up in the womanized world of shopping for material possesions, having a job he hates to buy those things, and image. Jack is "plugged" in, as emphasized by his condo in contrast to Tyler Durden's shack.
diplomatic_lies
Master Don Juan
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Man, Bum Fights was the funniest stuff I've ever seen. Better than any Hollywood movie!
"She Wants a Man, Not a Boy"
You asked her if she wanted to grab coffee. Then you asked if the time worked. Then you asked if the place was okay. Then you asked if she'd prefer tea.
Four questions. Four chances for her to say no. Four signals that you're terrified of making a decision.
Plan it. Pick the place. Pick the time. Tell her where to meet you. She'll either show up or she won't.
Either way, you look like a man instead of a scared little boy.
Re:
Self Destruction vs. Self-Improvement
"You can't help yourselves because your SELF sucks." ~ Billy Bob Thornton as "Dr. P"
He speaks truth here, because most people try to improve from the vantage point their at, without knowing where they are at from a place of pain. Many times we try to IMPROVE from a bad place. Better would be to IMPROVE from a good place. In the movie, Jack, who is now the awakened Tyler Durden @ the end, CAN improve from a better place. He DESTRUCTED his FALSE beliefs about life. That's where HEALTHY SELF DESTRUCTION can help an individual.
Far too often, the fears and pains are nurtured, when in reality the person only needs to see they are false concepts of a damaged mind. That can be healed...
It isn't the PHYSICAL place where you are that determines who you are or is indicative of your life, but who YOU are. In this case, trying to SLAP anything on a false person, or a person with false beliefs that are leading him astray, will on yield failure, and a reversion BACK to his/her formerself.
If there's anything to take from this movie, it was that Tyler GUIDED "Jack" (though they were the same character AND name), through his greatest fears. If everybody had a Tyler/Jack combo, then many people would do the things they desire in life. However, "Jacks" Ego was to frail from the womanized society he lived chock full of programming that he didn't know he was his own worst enemy. He constantly tried to bandaid his INTERNAL pain with EXTERNAL appendages, such as owning many possessions that he felt would eventually COMPLETE and DEFINE him, asking the doctor to prescribe meds, and attending help groups for near-death people. He was able to wallow in the misery of life and feel like ALL life was "this way," rather than face the glaring pain that he, and he alone was the source of his pain. Maybe he couldn't immediately change his job, but he certainly CAN control his second-to-second mood. And that was what Tyler introduced him to, amongst other things.
Tyler wasn't alpha. The concept of Alpha applies to banging within an animal/mammal tribe. That's quite a narrow concept for such a wide-open book. And having read Chuck's other books, I don't think his entire intention was to motivate guys into being alpha. If you read Choke, or Diary, or any of his other stuff, you see he portrays pretty screwed up people with such clarity that you might think he's screwed up, too.
Guys, you're BIGGEST problem is TRYING TO BE TYLER. Even the book should demonstrate that. "Jack" was trying to BE someone else, something else. You can't TRY to be ALPHA. You can't INTEND anything to get an outcome without sacrificing something else. All you're doing with that stuff is trying to Don a mask to hideaway from the biggest pain of all....
Being yourself, TRULY, and doing what you want to do.
Would you want a woman who likes or loves you for anything else? (Maybe you don't care if she just wants to fvck you, but that's not "success").
Would you want friends who know you as someone different? Would you want to know a friend who dons a mask only to be your friend?
"Jack" dodged his soul, almost afraid of his inherent nature as a man, and as a person. He was meak at work. Never spoke with women. He tried to be all the ideals everyone ELSE wanted him to be, yet he never found TRUE happiness. All because...he never did what HE WANTED. He never controlled HIS emotions. Every direction in life was someone ELSE's choice. His job. His possessions. Perhaps even his family life.
If anything, Guys need to BLOW up the preconceived notions they have about themselves, tap into the wellspring of power in themselves, and start fresh. Most guys hurt the most with women BECAUSE their urge to fvck is one of the strongest we have. We can do without a large TV, but for men acquiring resources is easy. It could happen today, or years, but we'll get it. However the sex drive is strongest, almost uncontrolled, and men are bombarded by images all day long. No wonder the thing they desire most to fix is also one of the strongest biological urges we possess. Guys go to THAT SPOT, figuring it MIGHT fix everything else. And in a way it does, because it reveals the compensating and unbalanced weakness and unhappiness elsewhere in one's life.
Banging a breed of hotter chick DOES not require new skills, it requires new eyes with which to see the world, and a new you. One who is true inside and out.
And for those who want to continue quoting or following this movie and Durden's principles, do yourself a favor and read the book.
A-Unit
Self Destruction vs. Self-Improvement
"You can't help yourselves because your SELF sucks." ~ Billy Bob Thornton as "Dr. P"
He speaks truth here, because most people try to improve from the vantage point their at, without knowing where they are at from a place of pain. Many times we try to IMPROVE from a bad place. Better would be to IMPROVE from a good place. In the movie, Jack, who is now the awakened Tyler Durden @ the end, CAN improve from a better place. He DESTRUCTED his FALSE beliefs about life. That's where HEALTHY SELF DESTRUCTION can help an individual.
Far too often, the fears and pains are nurtured, when in reality the person only needs to see they are false concepts of a damaged mind. That can be healed...
It isn't the PHYSICAL place where you are that determines who you are or is indicative of your life, but who YOU are. In this case, trying to SLAP anything on a false person, or a person with false beliefs that are leading him astray, will on yield failure, and a reversion BACK to his/her formerself.
If there's anything to take from this movie, it was that Tyler GUIDED "Jack" (though they were the same character AND name), through his greatest fears. If everybody had a Tyler/Jack combo, then many people would do the things they desire in life. However, "Jacks" Ego was to frail from the womanized society he lived chock full of programming that he didn't know he was his own worst enemy. He constantly tried to bandaid his INTERNAL pain with EXTERNAL appendages, such as owning many possessions that he felt would eventually COMPLETE and DEFINE him, asking the doctor to prescribe meds, and attending help groups for near-death people. He was able to wallow in the misery of life and feel like ALL life was "this way," rather than face the glaring pain that he, and he alone was the source of his pain. Maybe he couldn't immediately change his job, but he certainly CAN control his second-to-second mood. And that was what Tyler introduced him to, amongst other things.
Tyler wasn't alpha. The concept of Alpha applies to banging within an animal/mammal tribe. That's quite a narrow concept for such a wide-open book. And having read Chuck's other books, I don't think his entire intention was to motivate guys into being alpha. If you read Choke, or Diary, or any of his other stuff, you see he portrays pretty screwed up people with such clarity that you might think he's screwed up, too.
Guys, you're BIGGEST problem is TRYING TO BE TYLER. Even the book should demonstrate that. "Jack" was trying to BE someone else, something else. You can't TRY to be ALPHA. You can't INTEND anything to get an outcome without sacrificing something else. All you're doing with that stuff is trying to Don a mask to hideaway from the biggest pain of all....
Being yourself, TRULY, and doing what you want to do.
Would you want a woman who likes or loves you for anything else? (Maybe you don't care if she just wants to fvck you, but that's not "success").
Would you want friends who know you as someone different? Would you want to know a friend who dons a mask only to be your friend?
"Jack" dodged his soul, almost afraid of his inherent nature as a man, and as a person. He was meak at work. Never spoke with women. He tried to be all the ideals everyone ELSE wanted him to be, yet he never found TRUE happiness. All because...he never did what HE WANTED. He never controlled HIS emotions. Every direction in life was someone ELSE's choice. His job. His possessions. Perhaps even his family life.
If anything, Guys need to BLOW up the preconceived notions they have about themselves, tap into the wellspring of power in themselves, and start fresh. Most guys hurt the most with women BECAUSE their urge to fvck is one of the strongest we have. We can do without a large TV, but for men acquiring resources is easy. It could happen today, or years, but we'll get it. However the sex drive is strongest, almost uncontrolled, and men are bombarded by images all day long. No wonder the thing they desire most to fix is also one of the strongest biological urges we possess. Guys go to THAT SPOT, figuring it MIGHT fix everything else. And in a way it does, because it reveals the compensating and unbalanced weakness and unhappiness elsewhere in one's life.
Banging a breed of hotter chick DOES not require new skills, it requires new eyes with which to see the world, and a new you. One who is true inside and out.
And for those who want to continue quoting or following this movie and Durden's principles, do yourself a favor and read the book.
A-Unit
diablo
Master Don Juan
Welcome to the forum. However, and no offense, but please do a search in the future before bringing up things that may have possibly been brought up before. If you want to discuss "Fight Club", please visit several of these threads:CCKazi007 said:
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=53356
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=57408
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=97906
In addition, I've done a limited search for you. Feel free to elaborate and expand on my terms, as you'll find a wealth of knowledge currently available to you.
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/search.php?searchid=230330
If you find anything new to add to any of the 'fight club' discussions and think that it belongs in this thread instead of any of the pre-existing threads, please PM me and I'll review said material. Until then, thread closed. Thanks much.
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