Ended my dating with a girl for being a beta male

[sph21]

I just wanna share my experience with you and to easy my pain. So, here goes:

Today I ended my 3.5 months relationship with a girl. Lately I just realized that I'm still a beta when I let all my insecurities controled me. When I'm well aware of those, it's already too late. They made her attractions went downhill as fast as lightning.

Today when she told me that she want to breakup, first I'm dissapointed. But I understand that there's nothing that I can do to make her change her mind because I went beta on her. It's hard to take it as if there's nothing between us. But it's over now.

It happened in her house. When she's positive that she don't want to continue our relationships any more, I asked her for the last time to hold her hand. When she agreed, I told her: thank you for all the things we shared together and I'm sorry for being "beta". She shed her tears when I did that. When I'm done holding her hand, I said: "I'll leave now. You don't have to see me go". And that's what she did. She stayed there in her living room covering her face with her hands.

There's no turning back now. But I just want to know your opinion about what I did to her today. Did I do it like a chump or a man?

I thought I could get rid of my beta attitudes towards women but when I'm feeling too comfortable with the relationship, I forgot all the things I've learnt so far. So I'm still not learning anything.

I don't want to linger to this failure.

What are some places to meet quality women? I hate b!tches.

 

[Wolfgang D]

Don't feel too bad about it. It sucks to lose a relationship that could have worked, I know. Still, it is a pain we all go through. We will always make mistakes. Even after we are experienced and have had great success, we still make mistakes! The "game" is simply too complicated, goes on for too long and involves too many feelings for us not to make mistakes here and there.

But you learn from your mistakes. And as long as you don't crash and burn completely, the mistakes are not too bad.

Now, you ask whether you handled it well. I would say, don't ask to hold her hand. If you want to take her hand in that situation, just do it. (Not grab it fast, of course. Do it slowly but firmly.) Where I live, holding hands when you are talking would be considered strange, but I imagine it is different in Indonesia.

When you left, you shouldn't have said either "I am leaving now" or "you don't have to see me go". That still sounded a bit AFC. (or "beta" if you will.) You should have simply said that okay, you understand, and there is no use in talking about it further. Don't make it dramatic or sound like a martyr in any way. No drama. You are like a rock. You are like an oak tree, planted firmly in the ground. Lesser beings cannot move you. They jump around like rabbits in the meadow while you stand firm.


It feels bad now, but you will feel better soon. Just go about your routines. Don't skip out on doing necessary things because you are depressed, that will only make things worse. Keep your life like a tight ship, and you will soon feel better. And see other women, that will give you plenty of perspective on things and help you cure your "one-itis", your focus on just one woman. You ask for advice on where to meet women, but that is a subject for a longer thread.

 

[Jariel]

In time, you will see this as a good thing. You will look back at your break up as a big turning point in your life.

Here's what you need to do...

Look at the mistakes you made in your relationship and write them down for future reference. Any times you backed down, when you were too nice and accommodating, when you were too available, not enough of a challenge...and so on. You already know you were behaving "beta" so this is a great start. Self awareness will take you a long way!

Now you have to think about what changes you want to make. Hit the gym, socialise more with friends, improve your finances or career and focus on the man you want to be.

If you need motivation, try to think of meeting your ex girlfriend 6 months or more from now. You want her to see a new and improved man. You want her to see that you're not the same wimp she left behind, but you're stronger, more confident and calm.

In the meantime, you have to break all contact with her. If you can show her that you don't need her and you can walk away, you already gain a lot of her respect. This alone can change a woman's opinion of you for the better.

But I have to give you an important word of warning...when you're trying to fix your beta qualities, don't go to the opposite extreme. Most of us do that...we act like a$sholes, play mind games and it blows up in our face. Just aim to be a better, more confident version of you.

 

[HalfPUAHalfAFC]

One of the hardest lessons to unlearn is the belief that women like us for "who we are." That is, we tend to believe women like us for our personality traits, our "real" person.

They rarely look that far into us when getting to know us. It takes quite a while for anyone to really get to know anyone else.

What women are attracted to is what we do. How we hold ourselves, our behaviors, our ability to converse with them (tease, cajole, flirt), how we react (or don't react) to situations and so on.

You probably got too comfortable with this women, revealed too much of yourself, trusted her to act in a reasonable/honorable way (at least from a man's point of view), etc. You turned her off by trying to impress her with your personality.

Yeah, it sucks.

Men often make a similar mistake as women when they project their own mindset to the opposite sex. Yes, we like a woman's looks first but her personality has to be up to snuff or we really don't like them. *****y, naggy, high-maintenance women are to be dropped, no matter how hot they are. Still, it is a good personality that will keep us guys around.

Not so much with women, at first. We shouldn't project our mental schema on to them. Women stick around if we do things that they value, and a lot of that is simply being more dominant and higher value than them. When we try to show them we are "a good person" we lower ourselves to their level and this turns them off.

This is way PUAs recommend retaining a level of mystery with women.

Better luck next time dude!

 

[sph21]

Don't feel too bad about it. It sucks to lose a relationship that could have worked, I know. Still, it is a pain we all go through. We will always make mistakes. Even after we are experienced and have had great success, we still make mistakes! The "game" is simply too complicated, goes on for too long and involves too many feelings for us not to make mistakes here and there.

Good point. I'm feeling much better now.

But you learn from your mistakes. And as long as you don't crash and burn completely, the mistakes are not too bad.

what do you mean by crash and burn completely?

Now, you ask whether you handled it well. I would say, don't ask to hold her hand. If you want to take her hand in that situation, just do it. (Not grab it fast, of course. Do it slowly but firmly.) Where I live, holding hands when you are talking would be considered strange, but I imagine it is different in Indonesia.

Point noted. Asking for permission is bad. In my country, it's not a normal thing for a man to hold hands to a woman. That's why I asked for her permission.

When you left, you shouldn't have said either "I am leaving now" or "you don't have to see me go". That still sounded a bit AFC. (or "beta" if you will.) You should have simply said that okay, you understand, and there is no use in talking about it further. Don't make it dramatic or sound like a martyr in any way. No drama.

You're right. Too much drama. I'm putting her too much pressure.

What is the difference between AFC and beta. I'm still confused.

You are like a rock. You are like an oak tree, planted firmly in the ground. Lesser beings cannot move you. They jump around like rabbits in the meadow while you stand firm.

I never thought about that. It's an interesting insight. I like it. I need work on on that attitude.

It feels bad now, but you will feel better soon. Just go about your routines. Don't skip out on doing necessary things because you are depressed, that will only make things worse. Keep your life like a tight ship, and you will soon feel better. And see other women, that will give you plenty of perspective on things and help you cure your "one-itis", your focus on just one woman. You ask for advice on where to meet women, but that is a subject for a longer thread.

You're right. Having victim-mentality is depressing. Thanks for your great insights.

 

[iamnobody]

One of the hardest lessons to unlearn is the belief that women like us for "who we are." That is, we tend to believe women like us for our personality traits, our "real" person.

They rarely look that far into us when getting to know us. It takes quite a while for anyone to really get to know anyone else.

What women are attracted to is what we do. How we hold ourselves, our behaviors, our ability to converse with them (tease, cajole, flirt), how we react (or don't react) to situations and so on.

^ this.
Focus on improving yourself long term. Chicks are always available everywhere around you.
And read this
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=160056

 

[sph21]

In time, you will see this as a good thing. You will look back at your break up as a big turning point in your life.

Here's what you need to do...

Look at the mistakes you made in your relationship and write them down for future reference. Any times you backed down, when you were too nice and accommodating, when you were too available, not enough of a challenge...and so on. You already know you were behaving "beta" so this is a great start. Self awareness will take you a long way!

Taking notes are great idea. You spotted what I did wrong this whole time. I knew I had to be a challenge, but I let my needy feelings take over.

Now you have to think about what changes you want to make. Hit the gym, socialise more with friends, improve your finances or career and focus on the man you want to be.

My main issue is my finance. Will fix it in few months thogh.

If you need motivation, try to think of meeting your ex girlfriend 6 months or more from now. You want her to see a new and improved man. You want her to see that you're not the same wimp she left behind, but you're stronger, more confident and calm.

Why do you consider this type of meeting as a motivation?

In the meantime, you have to break all contact with her. If you can show her that you don't need her and you can walk away, you already gain a lot of her respect. This alone can change a woman's opinion of you for the better.

To not meeting her in 6 months or more is not easy since we live close by. But I'm planning to break all communications to her. Why do I need her respect or opinion? Wouldn't it be useless since we broke up already?

But I have to give you an important word of warning...when you're trying to fix your beta qualities, don't go to the opposite extreme. Most of us do that...we act like a$sholes, play mind games and it blows up in our face. Just aim to be a better, more confident version of you.

I don't like a$$holes and am not planning to be one. I have to becareful not to fall for the trap. Good points.

 

[sph21]

One of the hardest lessons to unlearn is the belief that women like us for "who we are." That is, we tend to believe women like us for our personality traits, our "real" person.

They rarely look that far into us when getting to know us. It takes quite a while for anyone to really get to know anyone else.

What women are attracted to is what we do. How we hold ourselves, our behaviors, our ability to converse with them (tease, cajole, flirt), how we react (or don't react) to situations and so on.

I'm having a hard time understanding your writing since English is not my native language.

Thanks for pointing out a trap in the way women are thinking. I've been working on my personality. I thought it's the first thing they want from a man. So, are you saying that they attracted to us because we understand the game and how to play it? Personality comes later?

You probably got too comfortable with this women, revealed too much of yourself, trusted her to act in a reasonable/honorable way (at least from a man's point of view), etc. You turned her off by trying to impress her with your personality.

Yeah, it sucks.

This is true. I tried to impress her with my personality. Why is it a turn off for women to try to impress them with personality? Are you saying, "don't try to impress her ever?"

Men often make a similar mistake as women when they project their own mindset to the opposite sex. Yes, we like a woman's looks first but her personality has to be up to snuff or we really don't like them. *****y, naggy, high-maintenance women are to be dropped, no matter how hot they are. Still, it is a good personality that will keep us guys around.

I totally agree with your points.

Not so much with women, at first. We shouldn't project our mental schema on to them. Women stick around if we do things that they value, and a lot of that is simply being more dominant and higher value than them. When we try to show them we are "a good person" we lower ourselves to their level and this turns them off.

Could you explain about this "projecting our mental schema on to them"?

This is way PUAs recommend retaining a level of mystery with women.

Better luck next time dude!

Thanks dude!

 

[sph21]

i personally would NEVER admit to a girl that i went "beta" on her even if its true. or that i know anything about seduction for that matter.

You're right. It only shows weakness.

 

[sph21]

^ this.
Focus on improving yourself long term. Chicks are always available everywhere around you.
And read this
http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=160056

Yes, those are great points. I'll do that. Thanks.

 

[sph21]

You guys are awesome. I'm learning so much from your insights.

 

[HalfPUAHalfAFC]

I'm having a hard time understanding your writing since English is not my native language.

Thanks for pointing out a trap in the way women are thinking. I've been working on my personality. I thought it's the first thing they want from a man. So, are you saying that they attracted to us because we understand the game and how to play it? Personality comes later?



This is true. I tried to impress her with my personality. Why is it a turn off for women to try to impress them with personality? Are you saying, "don't try to impress her ever?"



I totally agree with your points.



Could you explain about this "projecting our mental schema on to them"?



Thanks dude!

Sure, I'll expand a bit...

Men and women do not think alike when it comes to what they find attractive in the opposite sex.

Men prioritize looks (youth/beauty/fitness) first. If her personality is also great, then we can really end up liking a woman a lot.

Women, though they do like good-looking fit men, do not prioritize the same things as men. They may find us good looking but that's neither sufficient or necessary. Women go for a man because of the way he makes her FEEL.

And what makes a woman FEEL attraction for a man? His behavior first and foremost.

He walks tall.
He's confident in who he his.
He doesn't take nonsense from women. He can't be pushed around.
He doesn't bend over backwards to make her happy.
He teases her playfully and makes her feel like a little girl.
He's sexually confidence and experienced.
He doesn't pressure her to be with him to raise his own status.
He has skills, goals, plans, pursuits, hobbies, interests, etc.

And so on.

Now, if he has all this she will be interested. If you add in good looking, she'll definitely be interested.

And only after the guy has attracted her through these things will other parts of his "real" self be relevant to her.

If you go out of your way to show a woman that you are smart, caring, insightful, compassionate, or whatever, that (1) comes off as try too hard and (2) these things are not what creates ATTRACTION. The might create a level of trust, comfort, rapport with a woman, but they do not get her lustful for you.

Many guys will think, "Okay, I like looks and a good personality in a woman. I can't change my looks fundamentally (though I can get in shape and dress well) but I can show a woman what a great personality I have and then she'll like me." She might "like" you as a person, but she doesn't see herself getting with you sexually.

So, we make a mistake of projecting what works on us onto women and think it will work on them.

It doesn't.

This is the root of many guys problems with women.

Women do it too. Here in the United States, women think "I'm a strong, confident woman with an education, good job and career... why can't I find a man????" And men are thinking, "Your job, education, strength, and confidence do nothing for me. I can't have sex with those." It is not that these hurt women in getting men's attraction, it is that they DO NOTHING FOR US sexually. They do not hit out attraction switches.

But they do hit women's. So women think what makes them attracted to a man is what will make a man attracted to a woman. It doesn't work that way.

So us men think, "A woman has to be visually appealing but she also needs a good personality... So, if I like a woman I'll reveal my awesome personality to her." And then they wonder where they went wrong.

 

[sph21]

Women go for a man because of the way he makes her FEEL.

And what makes a woman FEEL attraction for a man? His behavior first and foremost.

He walks tall.
He's confident in who he his.
He doesn't take nonsense from women. He can't be pushed around.
He doesn't bend over backwards to make her happy.
He teases her playfully and makes her feel like a little girl.
He's sexually confidence and experienced.
He doesn't pressure her to be with him to raise his own status.
He has skills, goals, plans, pursuits, hobbies, interests, etc.

And so on.

Now, if he has all this she will be interested. If you add in good looking, she'll definitely be interested.

And only after the guy has attracted her through these things will other parts of his "real" self be relevant to her.

That's what I did before dating her. When I started dating with her, I thought I had to change because it's a different condition. I thought she would love me more if I show her my true personality. So, I guess I had changed from being a challenge to her to become an easy target. What should us men do when we're entering relationship with a woman? Is it maintaining what made her attracted to us?

If you go out of your way to show a woman that you are smart, caring, insightful, compassionate, or whatever, that (1) comes off as try too hard and (2) these things are not what creates ATTRACTION. They might create a level of trust, comfort, rapport with a woman, but they do not get her lustful for you.

Are you saying never try to impress her with what you've got and let her find those quality from you by being a challenge to her?

What make her lustful? Is it the former qualities you mentioned?

 

[JoeMarron]

What should us men do when we're entering relationship with a woman? Is it maintaining what made her attracted to us?

Follow this and you're good

http://heartiste.wordpress.com/the-sixteen-commandments-of-poon/

 

[sph21]

Follow this and you're good

http://heartiste.wordpress.com/the-sixteen-commandments-of-poon/

Thanks man. I think my main problem is that I tried so hard to suppress my own insticts as a man. Which turns me to a nice guy type.

 

[PlayHer Man]

You REALLY said this? --> "Sorry for being beta" :crackup: :crackup:

You realize that's like a girl saying: "Sorry for being fat".

My usual advice:

1. Never care more about the relationship than the woman.

2. Never fear losing ANY woman (You did this part right. You walked away when you realized you lost the game )

Your post inspired a 3rd rule:

3. When you lose the game.. WALK AWAY. Sticking around is self-destructive. Being with a woman with low interest is a toxic drain on your soul and emotions. Always dump women with low interest like there's no tomorrow and don't like back for even a nanosecond.

My biggest trump card with women has always been my willingness to walk away at the drop of a hat from ANY relationship. I've shocked many women by disappearing like a f*cking magician with no real warning. Its something I'm very proud of. My time is valuable and I'm not going to waste it on lukewarm b!tches.

 

[Serenity]

To answer your question, you did it like a man. Except from the part where you degraded yourself by apologizing for being beta.

Alpha and beta is so contrasted. If you're alpha you will attract, but you will struggle to keep a good and comfortable LTR. If you're beta you won't attract as much, but you will have the qualities to maintain a good relationship. If you are alpha with the capacity to be beta under certain circumstances you will be far more successful in a relationship.

 

[LiveFreeX]

What are some places to meet quality women? I hate b!tches.

Thailand, Japan, China, Mexico, Brazil, Peru.

 

[Jair213]

Thailand, Japan, China, Mexico, Brazil, Peru.

And Jupiter. Them alien bishes got 3 tits.. yum .. hahahhahaah

 

[sph21]

You REALLY said this? --> "Sorry for being beta" :crackup: :crackup:

You realize that's like a girl saying: "Sorry for being fat".

My usual advice:

1. Never care more about the relationship than the woman.

2. Never fear losing ANY woman (You did this part right. You walked away when you realized you lost the game )

Your post inspired a 3rd rule:

3. When you lose the game.. WALK AWAY. Sticking around is self-destructive. Being with a woman with low interest is a toxic drain on your soul and emotions. Always dump women with low interest like there's no tomorrow and don't like back for even a nanosecond.

My biggest trump card with women has always been my willingness to walk away at the drop of a hat from ANY relationship. I've shocked many women by disappearing like a f*cking magician with no real warning. Its something I'm very proud of. My time is valuable and I'm not going to waste it on lukewarm b!tches.

Yes I said that. I just realised that it's silly.

I broke the first rule and when I realised it, it's way too late so I walk away.