Do literally all women do this at the end of an LTR or just the ones I've dated?

[oldmanofthesea]

Something I have noticed with all women I've had LTRs with:

Each woman has their own wants and needs in a relationship. As with anyone, those wants and needs are their OWN, and they vary from person to person. We all have different wants and needs. But what I have found is that when it comes to women, if things aren't working out because they don't feel you are meeting their own individual wants and needs, and it leads to a break-up or a serious relationship crisis, they all position themselves on this high perch and give you this unsolicited "advice" that if you don't change and do the things THEY want, you'll never be successful in relationships because "all women want those things." And they say it with such conviction. "All women expect their boyfriends to do ________ and if you don't do that, you will never be successful in relationships."

 

[HyenaPrince]

It's convenient to use the alleged entire gender to enforce an argument. Doesn't have to be limited to this specific approach. Other women might use different "incentives" to manipulate you emotionally and keep you around. But it's extremely easy to look through this childish bullsh*t.

 

[oldmanofthesea]

But it's extremely easy to look through this childish bullsh*t.

After my wife and I divorced four years ago, and I was blue-pilled, it wasn't easy to see it as childish BS. It was a very effective weapon on me.... and not because she was trying to manipulate me to keep me around (since she was the one who left me), but because she was doing it to justify her own wants/needs to herself and paint ME as the one with the issue.

But now that I am wiser, yes it is easier. Though I think as you get older, and you see what and who is out there in the dating pool, it can sometimes give you pause and wonder for a moment if what she is saying might be true, at least partially. But with experience also comes confidence in one's self, and the ability to objectively identify bad behaviors in women and to know they aren't acceptable. Fortunately, I'm past the state of caring whether I do or don't stay single the rest of my life, which is the best defense for the kinds of statements I mentioned in my original post. I'm happy, live a great life, and if I end up in an LTR great, if I don't, that's fine too.

 

[dude99]

Something I have noticed with all women I've had LTRs with:

Each woman has their own wants and needs in a relationship. As with anyone, those wants and needs are their OWN, and they vary from person to person. We all have different wants and needs. But what I have found is that when it comes to women, if things aren't working out because they don't feel you are meeting their own individual wants and needs, and it leads to a break-up or a serious relationship crisis, they all position themselves on this high perch and give you this unsolicited "advice" that if you don't change and do the things THEY want, you'll never be successful in relationships because "all women want those things." And they say it with such conviction. "All women expect their boyfriends to do ________ and if you don't do that, you will never be successful in relationships."

It is extremely rare that a girl will ever take responsibility for the failure of a relationship. Even if they are 100% responsible for everything wrong in the relationship is is extremely rare that you will find a woman that will ever admit it.

If they get bored. It is your fault
If they cheat it was because it was your fault
If they dump you it was your fault
If you dump them, it is certainly your fault because she refuses to accept the blame

Imagine grown up and always being told youre a princess/beautiful/perfect/etc.
Imagine life always hearing "girls first. Boys last.: imagine disney, the laws, society, tv shows pumping the female imperative into you and you realize this completely slanted and biased mentality totally favors you.

Example, how many women abuse shelters are there in the USA alone? I dont know the exact number but Tens of thousands. How many abused men shelters are their in the entire USA?

ONE.

Imagine growing up and your father always giving you what you want/ never saying no, spoiling you rotten. Imagine by the time you are 13 or 14 and you realize you can manipulate boys your own age and a bit older and get your way with them and use them. Imagine now these teen boys never saying the magic word " NO" because they are worried you wont like them. Imagine by the time you are 18 hundreds of boys have all wanted to date you and thrown their blue pill self all at you validating you dozens if not hundreds of times a week.

This flood of attention and spoiling creates piss poor quality women because it teaches them no matter how a-holish they behave, boys/men/society/laws/parents will all spoil me and i have to take zero responsibility for myself. Aka i can always blame.

What you're asking is if women all act this way, yes most of them do. They have been programmed to blame and justify their actions and for far too long society has let them do it.

It isnt just the ones you dated. It is most women

 

[Who Dares Win]

It is extremely rare that a girl will ever take responsibility for the failure of a relationship. Even if they are 100% responsible for everything wrong in the relationship is is extremely rare that you will find a woman that will ever admit it.

If they get bored. It is your fault
If they cheat it was because it was your fault
If they dump you it was your fault
If you dump them, it is certainly your fault because she refuses to accept the blame

Imagine grown up and always being told youre a princess/beautiful/perfect/etc.
Imagine life always hearing "girls first. Boys last.: imagine disney, the laws, society, tv shows pumping the female imperative into you and you realize this completely slanted and biased mentality totally favors you.

Example, how many women abuse shelters are their in the USA alone? I dont know the exact number but Tens of thousands. How many abused men shelters are their in the entire USA?

ONE.

Imagine growing up and your father always giving you what you want/ never saying no, spoiling you rotten. Imagine by the time you are 13 or 14 and you realize you can manipulate boys your own age and a bit older and get your way with them and use them. Imagine now these teen boys never saying the magic word " NO" because they are worried you wont like them. Imagine by the time you are 18 hundreds of boys have all wanted to date you and thrown their blue pill self all at you validating you dozens if not hundreds of times a week.

This flood of attention and spoiling creates piss poor quality women because it teaches them no matter how a-holish they behave, boys/men/society/laws/parents will all spoil me and i have to take zero responsibility for myself. Aka i can always blame.

What you're asking is if women all act this way, yes most of them do. They have been programmed to blame and justify their actions and for far too long society has let them do it.

It isnt just the ones you dated. It is most women

Which is why the start to hate men the same moment that their looks no longer grants them special treatment.

They think the privileges and special treatment were the norm cause they were special and now for no reason it is all taken away from them...the amount of man hating meme shared on facebook all comes from 28+ women.

 

[oldmanofthesea]

Yeah I agree with both of you on your points. I have noticed I don't get the blame as much with women in their 20's. The 30-something women are the most jaded, insecure, jealous, and controlling.

 

[lostintime]

Entitlement syndrome. Women will walk away from a high value man because they're being taught to do so.

 

[oldmanofthesea]

This is why Romance is a stupid self delusion for many men. It feeds into female entitlement. Just see them as flawed humans and everything becomes easier.

Seeing them as flawed human beings has helped me greatly. It has helped me just let-go of certain things women do, to remain calm through their childish outbursts, and also to know where to draw the line to feel confident about leaving a woman when she has crossed that line. The only nagging thing I experience is in the self-reflection I perform after a relationship ends, as to whether or not there is something in my actions or expectations that is preventing me from having a successful LTR. Is it me? Is it them? Is it simply the wrong combination? Are LTRs all doomed to failure? Obviously I am confident enough about my boundaries and my desires to be the one to end the relationships but I do still pause and think about it after, and when women throw the, "you'll never be successful in future relationships unless you _______", it comes at that time of self-reflection. But of course, that is their intent - to create maximum damage while self-rationalizing their own wants which may often be way out of line or just simply not compatible with you.

 

[oldmanofthesea]

Look at how she talks about her last bf. That will tell you how she will talk about you. If she seems compromising and chalk up the breakup to lack of chemistry or connection, or perhaps They were just growing apart, then that’s a good sign.

In the case of the girl I just ended things with, she actually spoke highly of her last BF. She claimed they got along perfectly (unlike us - due to her having constant gripes about me), and that she chose to end it because they just didn't have a "deep connection". Now, for one, that's just what she claims, and for another, we all here know that "deep connection" means something else..... maybe she was conscious of the reason (like she met another hotter guy) and maybe she wasn't. She had two other LTRs before him and she did not speak highly of them though.

As for your points about vetting and validation - these are things I've learned a lot in the past two or so years. I've definitely evolved past that stage of seeing the relationship as the prize and end-goal, and I absolutely qualify women..... which I feel has brought the biggest change in success in the dance of seduction. I think in the case of this particular girl though, I failed in the vetting part because I broke things off with her several times but she would immediately beg me back (as in, during the dumping conversation) and I allowed it. I should have held firm instead of letting it continue - knowing people can't change.

And as for your points about not seeing romance as an end-goal or criteria for success, I'm definitely on the same page there. I love my life, I have tons of friends, hobbies, and interests, and a big reason I ended things with this girl is I'm way happier being single than being with someone who is constantly nagging me and bringing me down. There is no fear about not finding someone else because I legitimately don't care if I do or not. My life is fun with or without a women.

 

[bat soup]

Something I have noticed with all women I've had LTRs with:

Each woman has their own wants and needs in a relationship. As with anyone, those wants and needs are their OWN, and they vary from person to person. We all have different wants and needs. But what I have found is that when it comes to women, if things aren't working out because they don't feel you are meeting their own individual wants and needs, and it leads to a break-up or a serious relationship crisis, they all position themselves on this high perch and give you this unsolicited "advice" that if you don't change and do the things THEY want, you'll never be successful in relationships because "all women want those things." And they say it with such conviction. "All women expect their boyfriends to do ________ and if you don't do that, you will never be successful in relationships."

I remember one girl told me that I'd always be alone. But I think she was just angry at the time, so I didn't take her seriously. For me each long-term relationship ended differently but I was always the one that left and I don't remember getting any of the advice that you describe.

 

[HyenaPrince]

After my wife and I divorced four years ago, and I was blue-pilled, it wasn't easy to see it as childish BS. It was a very effective weapon on me.... and not because she was trying to manipulate me to keep me around (since she was the one who left me), but because she was doing it to justify her own wants/needs to herself and paint ME as the one with the issue.

But now that I am wiser, yes it is easier. Though I think as you get older, and you see what and who is out there in the dating pool, it can sometimes give you pause and wonder for a moment if what she is saying might be true, at least partially. But with experience also comes confidence in one's self, and the ability to objectively identify bad behaviors in women and to know they aren't acceptable. Fortunately, I'm past the state of caring whether I do or don't stay single the rest of my life, which is the best defense for the kinds of statements I mentioned in my original post. I'm happy, live a great life, and if I end up in an LTR great, if I don't, that's fine too.

The problem is that sometimes you see and understand it, but won't act upon it. You're betting on the relationship and hope for a change. It's just being blind on purpose.

 

[oldmanofthesea]

They wouldn't dare lol, they know me too well. If you recall Krueg's post, I'm the type of guy that would have immediately brought up the fact that she had brought up meeting with her ex within a few seconds of her trying to pick a fight with me. They will criticize me though.

When I have short-term things with women in their early to mid-thirties though they will say things like that, actually some of the initial dates are lecturing and I just lose attraction pretty quickly.

Interesting.... I have never been lectured on an initial date. Out of curiosity, what was the topic of conversation that lead to a lecture?

 

[backseatjuan]

Never had this happen.

 

[Black Widow Void]

I can't say that I've experienced this in a relationship, but several times, I've heard similar attitudes with a few women that I've dated.

My "go to" rebuttal is to tell them "if I ever experience a lull in my bachelorhood, I'll ask you for advice. Because things were good before you and I'm sure will good be after you, I doubt I'll need your suggestions, but thanks"

One actually said that because I've never married, she didn't see me as the "commitment type."
I responded (paraphrasing my memory) ... "this is interesting; coming from someone that is divorced. This tells me that either you broke your wedding vows of till death do us part or you made a poor relationship choices by marrying someone that did. I don't think you are qualified to speak about commitments."
As you can imagine, the above went over reaaaaly well. haha

 

[metalwater]

never had it happen just like that.

your describing manipulation 101. she tells; everyone agrees with me and you're a loser if you don't agree with me also because everyone else does. This is a common fallacy in logic; we call it to appeal to bandwagon or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum.

of course, women use very fallacy ever invented.

 

[RangerMIke]

This has never happened to me. Mostly because I never try to do relationships and never put any effort keeping a woman around. When she's ready to go... I just let her go. I never give them any indication that I need an explanation when she loses interest. I really don't care why she's lost interest because it has nothing to do with me. I haven't changed. I'm the same person I was 30 years ago.... So when sh1t goes sideways, it's really not me.

I'm not saying this is what happened with the OP, but I do know a lot of dudes that put on an act when they first start a relationship... I have friends that change their personalities and behavior depending on what woman they are dating, but you can not keep up the act. Now here is the truth... the woman knows you are putting on an act to impress her... but what she convinces herself of is that if you are willing to TRY and make her happy, you will keep it up.

Be the best version of yourself you can be... but be yourself. If you have issues that keeps you from getting women, then work on that... independent of any particular chick, and become what you want to be... not for chicks, but because being the best person you can is the best way to live during the short time you are on the planet.

For me... well I do not try to hide who and what I am... this is better for me, and better for women I date. They can learn right away if things are going to work. The result is women come: women leave... and when they leave, it's really no harm no fowl... I haven't had a woman get mad at me after a break-up since my divorce 12 years ago. I continue to have cordial relations with them, and sometimes they come back for rounds 2, 3 and 4. The two women I'm dating now I've known for 5 years... they drift off, get in relationships, those end.... and they come back.

 

[Dash Riprock]

The problem is that sometimes you see and understand it, but won't act upon it. You're betting on the relationship and hope for a change. It's just being blind on purpose.

I'll add that in a LTR or marriage, as time goes on, its very easy to get "comfortable." Meaning as a couple, you stop doing the things that attracted you to each other in the first place; fun dates, crazy sex, road trips, whatever. This is amplified if you live together and have common "couple" friends.

I was in a 9 year LTR a few years back. I should have ended it after year 6 due to apathy more than anything else. I *finally* pulled the plug on the relationship after I sensed she was cheating (she was)...and I just didn't care. Bad sign.

I'm exponentially happier being single.

 

[oldmanofthesea]

what she was actually complaining about by the way was that I didn't orbit her at parties where she clearly had several other orbiters present if not outright ex-boyfriends. I basically just let her attention whor and talked to other women which made her insanely jealous and she criticized me for that since I was "her date"(I wasn't, nor did she act like it. We hadn't even made out at that point.)

I have seen this before myself.... the entitlement is next-level. "I can do X but you can't do the same thing, and if I'm doing it, it's ok because it's different." You handled it 100% perfectly by talking with other women instead of following her around like a jealous simp and trying to flex on the guys she was using to try to make you jealous.

So the next time an exit happens by a girl in your life. When she says im leaving, or i need a break. Say "ok" and not a word more. Guys who tolerate shytty behavior is a topic of another thread. IMO

In the case of this girl, she said it when I broke up with her. But my ex wife also did it to me - though in that situation it was her breaking up with me. Situations aside, I do agree that the best response to a girl breaking up with you is to smile confidently, say "I understand", and immediately walk away and never look back.

Be the best version of yourself you can be... but be yourself. If you have issues that keeps you from getting women, then work on that... independent of any particular chick, and become what you want to be... not for chicks, but because being the best person you can is the best way to live during the short time you are on the planet.

Yeah, I fully agree. In the last few years since my divorce I have come so far and achieved so much abundance that, for the first time in my life, I now have a hair-trigger when it comes to dropping a girl.... honestly I have lately been wondering if I'm too eager to walk because it's practically my default reaction to any issues. I set boundaries, she crosses them, I dump. She annoys me with emotional outbursts and temper tantrums, I communicate kindly and if that fails, I distance myself or dump. In the case of this girl, I dropped her multiple times over an 8 month period and she kept begging me back on the spot each time. Her making the "you'll never be successful" speech was in response to my dropping her this most recent time. My biggest fault with this girl was lying to myself and believing her when she said she would work on things and that she could change, and staying together with her when she begged me back. The same set of core issues on her side were resulting in the same conflicts repeating on a roughly 14-day cycle. Jealousy, insecurity, neediness, and being toward the extreme end of the spectrum of women who are over-run by their emotions.

 

[RangerMIke]

Yeah, I fully agree. In the last few years since my divorce I have come so far and achieved so much abundance that, for the first time in my life, I now have a hair-trigger when it comes to dropping a girl.... honestly I have lately been wondering if I'm too eager to walk because it's practically my default reaction to any issues. I set boundaries, she crosses them, I dump. She annoys me with emotional outbursts and temper tantrums, I communicate kindly and if that fails, I distance myself or dump. In the case of this girl, I dropped her multiple times over an 8 month period and she kept begging me back on the spot each time. Her making the "you'll never be successful" speech was in response to my dropping her this most recent time. My biggest fault with this girl was lying to myself and believing her when she said she would work on things and that she could change, and staying together with her when she begged me back. The same set of core issues on her side were resulting in the same conflicts repeating on a roughly 14-day cycle. Jealousy, insecurity, neediness, and being toward the extreme end of the spectrum of women who are over-run by their emotions.

Over the years I've gotten really good at sniffing out 'bad news'. It does take some experience, but really anyone can do this. It's a 3-step process.

(1) You have to go into dating first that you want to have fun. The minute dating is no longer any fun you stop.

(2) Shut your mouth, don't try to sell yourself, and listen to what the chick is saying. PAY ATTENTION, and don't worry about how you are going to respond. You let chicks talk and think about what she is saying... ask questions about what she is saying, and you will LEARN A LOT on a date.

(3) Adopt an attitude that it is HER job to sell herself to you... this is hard for younger guys to do because they have been raised in a Disney Princess culture where they believe they have to win a chick over. You do this, and you weed out women who really are not interested or attracted to you... and you are just being used for attention. Because if she doesn't really like you, she won't make much of an effort.

Most of my dates never get past the 1st or 2nd. If she isn't any fun.... says crazy @ss sh1t.... or isn't putting effort int he date, I move onto the next one. Bad news does not get better with time.

 

[Murk]

I failed in the vetting part because I broke things off with her several times but she would immediately beg me back (as in, during the dumping conversation) and I allowed it. I should have held firm instead of letting it continue - knowing people can't change.

Same! I let my gf back in the early stages when I was very nonchalant, still banging multiple women and didn't really want her... but of course that all drew her to me more and she treats me like a king. I got sucked into a relationship I never wanted.