C&F isn't working for me :/

[CharlieCW]

Hi there guys, how ya doing?I just got the ****y Comedy book from David, and it's a great lecture with a lot of tips. I inmediatly started using the tips and even some of the "copy-paste phrases" to start, but guess what? So far it's been a complete mess.

I've read many posts saying guys get wonders with C&F, but in my case that thevery C&F is making my dating life worse. I act confident and don't care much what girls say, but when I start busting their balls they usually get scared or don't know how to respond. Even one called me an "abuser", and other said that I was a "jerk" when I said "Oooh, someone call the guards, Princess isn't happy" when she started whining about her personal problems.

I think it's because the girls I'm interested are not used to boys aproaching them, and I'm guessing most of them were bullied in middle school. I like usually the nerdy and timid type (aka intelectuals), the ones that are rarely or never approeached and often are invisible (except fo me). For some reason, they respond better to a "nice guy" (obviously not a wuss, but no C&F either). To put into perspective, about 80% of the girls I've approached told me it's the first time a guy ever approaches them.

I don't know why I like this girls, I'm not interested in your so called "hot chicks". To get you the idea, consider for example Penny and Amy from The Big Bang Theory. I'm sure all of you will say "omg Penny is the hottest one". However, I consider Amy as one of the most attractive characters in TV (perhaps 9/10).

I hope you can give me so tips, on how should I act in this case.

 

[apprenticedj]

You need to find something that is congruent with you as a person. C&F is my bread and butter but it's always come naturally to me. For an introverted guy it can be a nightmare and if you're forcing yourself to do it, it's going to sound....well....forced. What is your natural coversation style?

EDIT: C&F is a tough one for nerdy, quiet girls. I would try to just have a genuine, fun interaction. Too much ball busting is taken the wrong way by some women. On the flipside some women eat that stuff up.

 

[Mike32ct]

You need to find something that is congruent with you as a person. For an introverted guy it can be a nightmare and if you're forcing yourself to do it, it's going to sound....well....forced.

EDIT: C&F is a tough one for nerdy, quiet girls. I would try to just have a genuine, fun interaction. Too much ball busting is taken the wrong way by some women. On the flipside some women eat that stuff up.

^This.

Introverts often fail horribly at c&f. I had to drop it a long time ago for that exact reason. When an otherwise quiet/nerdy guy TRIES to bust balls, the women can become quite offended. I won't go into details but I got booted from the club once because a chick flipped out after my poor c&f attempt. The sad thing is it's mostly introverted guys who buy DD stuff. For extroverts, it's probably decent stuff.

But all is not lost. You could try being PLAYFUL once you get the conversation going. You are sort of ball busting but not attacking HER, just other stuff.

I even used this at work once... (Don't try this at home lol.)

A chick was holding a coffee and was about the enter the office.

HB8.5: Can you hold the door for me?

Mike: Do I have to hold your coffee for you too? <smile>

HB: LOL

My point is that I wasn't busting on her directly. Plus I smiled to make it clear that I was being playful. Not the straight face recommended by DD.

A nice guy introvert is probably better as the playful adorable guy than trying to be the badazz ball buster. It's very hard to pull off the later if it's completely the opposite of your personality. But the former can still utilize the intelligent guy's wit.

 

[Trump]

Bro I thought you were good case but after you said Amy is hotter than Penny, I don't know man, that's rough. :crazy:

****y and funny means be focused, crack in a joke here and there, don't take yourself too seriously but don't go around laughing it up either. It doesn't mean be condescending or insulting, it means be confident in what you want.

I don't like the books that say "be a challenge" "make her want you" "you are the prize" "she has to prove herself to you." All this crap confuses people and makes them act outside of what they normally would. When I younger I followed these books to a T and they actually cost me relationships and sex with good looking young girls.

You watch some James Bond or other manly movies, crushes all these pick up books out the window. Do whats natural but get to their emotion.

 

[Don-Kong]

There's such a thing as trying too hard. I've failed many times at this.
My natural state is p1ss taker so I find it difficult to have serious conversations. But it can be seen as too much of a joker and it gets annoying, so balance is key.

But it's all about mood matching. Be on her wavelength, or, take her to yours. This creates what legendary Señor Fingers called the shared reality. Deep rapport. It's your moment, both hers and yours. If you're constantly teasing her and she's getting defensive, you can do something with that also. "Oh I'm only kidding" with a grin and then say, "ok let's hug it out!" And initiate kino.

 

[The_411]

Hi there guys, how ya doing?I just got the ****y Comedy book from David, and it's a great lecture with a lot of tips. I inmediatly started using the tips and even some of the "copy-paste phrases" to start, but guess what? So far it's been a complete mess.

I've read many posts saying guys get wonders with C&F, but in my case that thevery C&F is making my dating life worse. I act confident and don't care much what girls say, but when I start busting their balls they usually get scared or don't know how to respond. Even one called me an "abuser", and other said that I was a "jerk" when I said "Oooh, someone call the guards, Princess isn't happy" when she started whining about her personal problems.

I think it's because the girls I'm interested are not used to boys aproaching them, and I'm guessing most of them were bullied in middle school. I like usually the nerdy and timid type (aka intelectuals), the ones that are rarely or never approeached and often are invisible (except fo me). For some reason, they respond better to a "nice guy" (obviously not a wuss, but no C&F either). To put into perspective, about 80% of the girls I've approached told me it's the first time a guy ever approaches them.

I don't know why I like this girls, I'm not interested in your so called "hot chicks". To get you the idea, consider for example Penny and Amy from The Big Bang Theory. I'm sure all of you will say "omg Penny is the hottest one". However, I consider Amy as one of the most attractive characters in TV (perhaps 9/10).

I hope you can give me so tips, on how should I act in this case.

Read Robert Greene's art of seduction and you'll get a better understand that C&F (aka being a Rake, is ita rake? Christ, I need to read the book again) doesn't always work.

C&F works best with girls who are used to guys pedestalizing them or worshiping them. A girl who gets lots of attention for her looks.

For your more intellectual girls you need to tune your C&F and intellectualize it. The intelligent girls still respond but you need to more charming than ****y.

 

[VladPatton]

The thing is with all these techniques, is that you have to apply them as needed to fit you personality and the girl you're dealing with. Calibrate yourself, then calibrate how you use it.

You can learn boxing all day, but if you get into an MMA fight and you have no idea on how to kick with your legs as well you'll be pulverized. Therefore, you can't say that kicking doesn't work for you.

It's all about using these tactics as tools, quickly, on the fly. And you're right, a lot of girls do freak out when a guy approaches them. It's all Faceybook, texts, and Instagramming. Fück that. Girls will be surprised by a manly approach. You adjust accordingly and use what you need to get a good outcome. If she's an aṣṣhole, you bonce. If she's having fun, you keep going. Simple. There is no one-tactic-fits-all magic bullet, regardless of what the PUA community is trying to push.

 

[Peaks&Valleys]

^This.

Introverts often fail horribly at c&f. I had to drop it a long time ago for that exact reason. When an otherwise quiet/nerdy guy TRIES to bust balls, the women can become quite offended. I won't go into details but I got booted from the club once because a chick flipped out after my poor c&f attempt. The sad thing is it's mostly introverted guys who buy DD stuff. For extroverts, it's probably decent stuff.

But all is not lost. You could try being PLAYFUL once you get the conversation going. You are sort of ball busting but not attacking HER, just other stuff.

I even used this at work once... (Don't try this at home lol.)

A chick was holding a coffee and was about the enter the office.

HB8.5: Can you hold the door for me?

Mike: Do I have to hold your coffee for you too? <smile>

HB: LOL

My point is that I wasn't busting on her directly. Plus I smiled to make it clear that I was being playful. Not the straight face recommended by DD.

A nice guy introvert is probably better as the playful adorable guy than trying to be the badazz ball buster. It's very hard to pull off the later if it's completely the opposite of your personality. But the former can still utilize the intelligent guy's wit.

I had an HB9 flip out on me through texts once while I was using C&F. I had talked to her on the phone a few times, been on a date with her, which I had severely under performed on, but was still in the running somehow. She seemed cool, but for whatever reason, she didn't realize that I was joking, which I thought was obvious. Some of the better looking ones can be insecure about certain things, and may take "jokes" the wrong way.

Like Mike alluded to here. After that little texting "mishap", until I would build sufficient rapport with a woman, I started using smileys on my texts. I know a lot of guys here are against 's when texting women. However I feel they come in handy when busting balls. Texts can be misinterpreted, especially by a woman who could or could not be in some type of "mood". A simple smiley at the end of the text, after you gave her a well deserved tease, can sometimes make all the difference.

C&F is really somewhat of an art form. It does work though, and most women will eat it up. However, it needs to be used correctly, or it will backfire. I took a bad piece of advice from DD when he stated that if a woman is not responding to C&F to just keep pouring it on. I can't recall if that's what he had meant, but that's what I had gotten from it. My advice is to the opposite. Wait for the right times, don't force it. Some women will deliver fast balls to you down the middle of the plate, that you can continuously knock out of the park. It's there personality, others though, are more reserved, and if you try to turn a non C&F moment into a C&F moment, you will come across as a try hard, and she'll read right through you.

As in anything, play it cool, don't force it, let it flow. If you're not sure, and it's not going to seem natural, then hold on to it. Sometimes less is more anyways.

 

[VikingKing]

You have to really be into it, and sincerely playful, for c/f to work. Women are like little girls.

If you really want to get better, practice on women in your life you would never want to fvck. Watch how they react take a mental note, and now you have a base to work from.

I'm kind of introverted. But when I have to interact with people, with the women I always do that, regardless. Unless they appear really shy, then i dont say much.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Calling a girl a princess when she gets mad is going to come off as mean, unless the two of you are in the middle of a lengthy mutual session of insults interspersed with laughter and gut punches. Maybe she does have a princess complex, but telling her that does not get you anywhere.

Try to rip on a girl for silly, small, shallow things. David D has a good line: 'that's a big purse. do you have a gun in there?' It's easy to tease a girl about her purse or her shoes, because those things can easily be changed. That's what lets it be funny. Calling a tall girl an amazon, or ripping on some other permanent physical trait is not going to come off as funny. It does not matter if you are right; it's still not funny.

When C&F fails, it should be you getting a genuine laugh for yourself about something that is genuinely funny, and she just doesn't get the joke and walks off thinking you are weird. It should not fail with the girl getting insulted. If it is, you're doing it wrong.

 

[Mike32ct]

Agree completely. Especially about the fast balls.

I had an HB9 flip out on me through texts once while I was using C&F. I had talked to her on the phone a few times, been on a date with her, which I had severely under performed on, but was still in the running somehow. She seemed cool, but for whatever reason, she didn't realize that I was joking, which I thought was obvious. Some of the better looking ones can be insecure about certain things, and may take "jokes" the wrong way.

Like Mike alluded to here. After that little texting "mishap", until I would build sufficient rapport with a woman, I started using smileys on my texts. I know a lot of guys here are against 's when texting women. However I feel they come in handy when busting balls. Texts can be misinterpreted, especially by a woman who could or could not be in some type of "mood". A simple smiley at the end of the text, after you gave her a well deserved tease, can sometimes make all the difference.

C&F is really somewhat of an art form. It does work though, and most women will eat it up. However, it needs to be used correctly, or it will backfire. I took a bad piece of advice from DD when he stated that if a woman is not responding to C&F to just keep pouring it on. I can't recall if that's what he had meant, but that's what I had gotten from it. My advice is to the opposite. Wait for the right times, don't force it. Some women will deliver fast balls to you down the middle of the plate, that you can continuously knock out of the park. It's there personality, others though, are more reserved, and if you try to turn a non C&F moment into a C&F moment, you will come across as a try hard, and she'll read right through you.

As in anything, play it cool, don't force it, let it flow. If you're not sure, and it's not going to seem natural, then hold on to it. Sometimes less is more anyways.

 

[Mike32ct]

Oh yeah and do NOT use c&f as an opener unless you REALLY know what you are doing. An inexperienced guy trying to bust on a random cold approach girl that he hasn't talked to yet is a recipe for disaster lol. Been there; done that; and won't do it again lol.

At least talk normal and feel out what her personality is like first.

 

[Maximus Rex]

Rex's Two Cents

C & F works for me, because I'm a naturally sarcastic guy, so when I do it works. However, you have to take certain things into account,

1) Timing

2) Tonality

Are you being ****y and funny at opportune times and what is the inflection of your voice when you're making a ****y and funny statement. My advice is record yourself hollerin' at a chick, then upload the audio for feedback.

 

[JoeMarron]

and other said that I was a "jerk" when I said "Oooh, someone call the guards, Princess isn't happy" when she started whining about her personal problems.

Dude..that was a horrible thing to say. You want to tease women not insult them. Judging by this I'm assuming you've fvcked up on other things which is way C&F isn't working for you. Women love to be teased and that's basically what C&F is. I'd just focus on being social for now. Eventually you'll get a sense of when and how to tease. Much of game is just having solid social skills. Some men try to skip the social skills part though and go straight to game.

 

[Huffman]

Yeah. C&F is really great, but don't do it all the time. And, as stated above, don't open with it.

People open with really strange, crazy or even really funny lines. But even if the girl laughs, in her head she immediately thinks "WARNING THIS GUY IS A PLAYER AND ILL BE CAREFUL". Especially if she's not super outgoing as well.

I really like to walk up and say "Hi *smile*". Or, what really works well for me, "do you mind if I sit here / join you / etc?" while looking in the eye and smiling. You know, it's kinda polite, you say it as if it were just a formality, and of course she would accept. It's crazy how well this is going for me. Also works on groups. I guess it makes you come off as very real, genuine, and also a little direct. After a couple of minutes of you showing this "realness", you can go ahead and bust her a couple of times. Mix it up. Then come back to being serious.

And I want to talk about the introvert point: I'm an introvert, but I've always been good at comedy. How? It's a stage personality. Once the comedy starts, introverts SWITCH into their other self, basically becoming actors. Such people can deliver crazy jokes and biting sarcasm for hours, but have a hard time doing serious, interesting Conversation. Don't be that guy. Cracking 1000 jokes does NOT make you social. You'll be a pretender.

Ever tried gaming a girl who couldn't speak your language well? She won't get your witty jokes. Then you will notice: you actually have no idea on how to hold a conversation without C&F.

 

[3agle 3yes]

Even one called me an "abuser", and other said that I was a "jerk" when I said "Oooh, someone call the guards, Princess isn't happy" when she started whining about her personal problems.

The poster "JoeMarron" called it right.

Terrible, terrible example of being c&f.

IMO the BEST times to be c&f is when you're referring to her interactions with you.

C&f should only be used to to tease her...the example above isn't teasing.

C&f is questioning why she is always nervous around you, c&f is reminding her you're NOT her boyfriend just because you're going on a "date", c&f is warning her you don't f*ck on first "dates" when she suggests going to her place. Etc, etc.

I hope you get it, of course if the girl is really hot you can ramp it up more...but these will work on most women.

 

[bigneil]

C+F only works if they are approaching you. You can't approach them and use it or it comes off as blatantly making fun of them (ask me how I know). They need to like you first, then you can use C+F.

 

[Peaks&Valleys]

They need to like you first, then you can use C+F.

It definitely helps, as does some type of rapport. Just as long as they know deep down that you're really not that ****y/arrogant.

My plates get blasted with C&F. They'll smile, shake their head, tell me they hate me, all while they're trying to take off my pants.

 

[3agle 3yes]

C+F only works if they are approaching you. You can't approach them and use it or it comes off as blatantly making fun of them (ask me how I know). They need to like you first, then you can use C+F.

I'm not so sure though.

I once "opened" a girl in a club by going over to her and saying "Do you mind if I talk to you for a while? There is this girl that's try to chat me up and she won 't accept the fact that I ain't interested..."

Or there was another time at college when I approached a girl who was writing something on a notebook. After being nosy and teasing her about what she was writing, I yanked it off her and started reading it out loud.

Yes, those examples are a bit ballsy, but they worked (for me at least).

Interestingly those examples above conflict with what I posted earlier...I guess you can be c&f about other things too?

 

[bigneil]

It definitely helps, as does some type of rapport. Just as long as they know deep down that you're really not that ****y/arrogant.

My plates get blasted with C&F. They'll smile, shake their head, tell me they hate me, all while they're trying to take off my pants.

A pretty girl walked up to me and said hello and I looked her up and down and I said "I'm sorry, but does that purse go with those shoes?" She laughed and we started talking.

The next night, feeling bolder, I walked up to a hot girl and tried that same line again and she almost cried.