Bootcamp 2: Judgement Day

[allan976]

This may sound crazy, but I made it through seven weeks of bootcamp earlier this yera, ramped up my momentum big time, landed a cool summer job that required I wake up at 5:30AM every morning, and yup, you guessed it, I lost all my momentum. Here goes round two of bootcamp. Wish me luck...

End of week 1:

I've been desperately trying to make eye contact with people here in Los Angeles for about two weeks. They won't look at me. Very odd. If they do make eye contact with me, they look away immediately. This leaves me in a situation where I'm often saying 'hi' to someone who's not even looking me in the eye, and has already passed me by. Even if they do smile and say 'hi' at the same time as I do, they often look down immediately instead of holding eye contact.
I'm trying to make eye contact every where I go: the gym, the grocery store, shopping malls, schools, work, etc. No dice. People in Los Angeles are loathe to look me in the eye.

Lesson learned 1: However, maintaining eye contact and saying hello's is important in the sense that it makes you so very aware of your surroundings, namely, of other people surrounding you. So many people these days seem to be walking around like zombies: they are completely intent on finishing their chore, their task, or seem 'tranced out' on whatever commodities are offered and displayed in the windows of mall stores. I want to notice other people, even if I feel slightly 'freakish' staring at people.

Lesson learned 2: you get a very good impression of how people are feeling when you stare at them, waiting to say 'hi' to them. You'll notice how some are relaxed, some are oblivious to other people, others seem eager to talk, and so on. Maintaining eye contact is important to developing rapport, since you get a sense of where a person is at emotionally by checking them out first. Very key.

That's it for this week!

 

[avrilishot]

good job man keep it up.

 

[allan976]

I LIKE BOOTCAMP

Three convo's down in week 2, seven to go.

Convo 1: there's a pickup game with some pro ballers and D1 college players at a gym I frequent. I ask a guy to my right if there are any players I should recognize.
"man, there's x, and y and z. Dude, don't you recognize 'em?'

I'm looking real hard: '....oh yea, I recognize x.

'he looks different from on tv, huh?'

We chit chat for about five minutes or so. He tells me about what he's studying at college, and what sports he's into.

Lesson learned: It takes time for someone to warm up to you, since you are a stranger. It takes time, but eventually the conversation becomes fun and 'natural' for both of you. You just have to give the other person a chance to get over that initial awkwardness of talking to a stranger. The conversation starts off very slowly, as there are long pauses between our exchanges, then the pauses get shorter and shorter until we are finally having a regular conversation. Another girl who's a gym employee, a girl who's never talked to me before, jumps in the middle of the conversation with a big smile and starts asking me and the guy I'm talking to some questions. It turns out the guy I was talking to was a gym employee, and therefore since I was talking to a gym employee, the female gym employee considered me to be part of the 'in' group. Here's the power of 'social proof' as well call it.

---

Convo 2: I talk to a girl while we're both stretching at the gym. She's about 20 or so, a HB6.5. She has a cute face, is tall and slightly soft in the middle. I don't follow the three second rule, but instead take a minute or two after I start stretching next to her, to start talking to her. It's true, the longer you wait, the more nervous you get. Bad idea to wait. Anyway, I start out with a question:

'I thought the gym closed at midnight?' (an employee just announced over the PA that the gym would close at 10:30 instead).

She gives me a big smile. Her eyes are smiling as well as her lips, so I know it's a genuine smile.
'Yea, it normally closes at midnight, but they're having a special event for some kids here.'
We talk, but only for about two or three minutes, as the gym was just about to close (I started talking to her five minutes before closing). She tells me that she's working at a summer youth camp, that the gym holds events during the summer just to make more money, blah blah blah.

Lesson learned: don't wait to begin a conversation. You might not get a chance to talk to her at all. Or, your conversation might be too short for you to build any kind of rapport.

---

Convo 3: I visit some friends who work at a store today. There's a new employee there. He's the security guard. I'm usually cool with all the security guards who've worked there. I introduce myself to him, and since I hang out at the store for nearly an hour, we have a chance to talk a good while. His fellow employees berate him, tease him about his weight, and so on. I try to console him by telling him that they tease everyone like that (which is the truth). He's only been working there two weeks, so he's not quite used to it yet. We get into a discussion of martial arts, and he invites me to his 'dojo.' I tell him I'm definitely interested and will try to stop by to get in a workout.

Lesson learned: I'm damm rusy at conversations. I feel like my old skills are returning, especially now that I'm 'warming up' and don't have the pressure of closing to add to the anxiety. I still need to get in seven more convo's. Even if I don't quite make it to 10 total this week, I'll move on to the convo's with dateable chicks.

Conclusion: practice, practice, practice makes perfect. Fieldwork is absolutely essential. Good luck everyone; I'm finding that you learn valuable life skills by going through bootcamp--these lessons about outgoingness, assertiveness, a positive attitude, overcoming fears and phobias are general skills which are important in all human endevears. This is truly about improving yourself, not about being desperate for chicks.

 

[h2o]

bump

seems like you're doing okay with the convos already. yeah, 3 second rule is def. big.

good luck

 

[allan976]

Convo #4, Friday 3 PM (first convo of bootcamp 2 with a girl I'd date):

I'm at a bookstore cafe, doing some reading on computers. I have to wait for a table, since they're all taken. I scan my environment. HB7/8 blonde, thin, about 20 on her cell phone waiting on a table. I check her out, then look down and read my mag. I look back up, see her checking me out. She looks away as I look at her.

I finally get a table after waiting five minutes. The girl at the table immediately next to me looks at me and stares as I put my backpack down. I get a drink. When I get back to my table, she stares again. This time, I hold her gaze and smile. She smiles and looks down. OK, she gives me two looks and looks down rather than off to the side; classic IOI. I know I have to talk to her. Since I'm so damm rusty, I wait about five minutes or so.

I open with:

me: 'damm, it's getting awfully noisy in here.'
her: yea, i know.

I then do my best to fluff with her for the minimum of two minutes, or longer. We fluff for about five minutes or so. She's really very good at maintaining the conversation, bringing up a new topic whenever there's a lull in the conversation or asking me a question when I've run out of topics, rather than forcing me to ask all the questions. We find out that we both teach:

her: 'oooh, you teach? I want to teach too.'

She's good; she's trying to create rapport by finding/highlighting commonalities, she keeps the convo flowing, and does not break eye contact.

I want to number close, but this is only my fourth convo in bootcamp, so I'm not quite ready; that is, I'm not expecting things to go this smoothly and easily and do not mentally prepare myself for it.

Conclusion: this was my first convo with a 'dateable' HB. She's about a 7, maybe a generous 7.5, about twenty years old, persian chick (no accent). Nice rack, cute face, nice rear end. If I were further along in BC, and had more practice, I would have definitely attempted the number close or venue change. Sorry, I'm rusty.

Bad news is, I see three HB's today (Saturday), but don't attempt convo's with any of them.

The first is a MILF hottie. She's in her mid thirties, blonde, about 5'8", model thin, nice smile. I check her out, trying to maintain eye contact. She sees me and stares right back. I'm not used to girls staring at me longer than I stare at them, so I break eye contact. Typical blonde: very high energy, flirtatious, but I can't bring myself to start a convo with her.

Second, a really beautiful HB9 brunette. She has flawless brown skin, aqualine features framed by glasses. The guy in front of her in line is falling over himself helping her put her groceries on the conveyor belt. She doesn't even notice or acknowledge him!

Three: a young short brunette at the bookstore. She's 20 at most, raven curly black hair, 5' 3" at most.

---

Convo #5, Sat. 3 PM: I chat with a neighbor in my compex. He's pretty cool. We just chit chat about some problems in the neighborhood. No big deal.

Lesson learned: the three second rule is key. So what if she's unreceptive (and who's to say she will be?). I wish I would follow this rule. Damm! I need to focus more on this bootcamp.

Lesson learned: I hate to say this, because ASF/Bristollair recommends that you not turn down any social invitations until you can become more selective, but in the past few weeks, I've been hanging out with wings who are unfortunately quite socially inept, and I'm afraid I've picked up some really bad habits on how to vibe from them. The irony is that without them, I would have to go to weekend/evening venues alone, which I'm really loathe to do. We'll see how this plays itself out in the future. Sigh.

 

[Ricky]

Many people in my town avoid eye contact to. Amazing how many people are staring at the ground? Maybe they are hoping to find money. The cheap bastards!

 

[allan976]

Week 2, Day 7 (Saturday)

Took me about 2.5 hours to finish up week 2 Saturday night.
---

Venue #1:

10:30 PM Venue One: south american bar/restaurant

--I found a listing for a brazilian bar/restaurant in LA, and thought it might be interesting based on the description. It's supposed to include lots of single young ladies from brazil as well as parties of families. I head out with a couple of wings. It's not looking good once I actually see the place. The two hostesses are good looking, but the bar is crowded with males--classic sausage fest. My wings and I take a table instead. At the adjacent table is a MILF. OK, I'm exaggerating--she's in her early 30's. But she's tall, blonde, thin and has a really cute face. Shave off five years and she's a goddess. She's staring dead at me, but again I freak out at the eye contact as I did earlier in the day, and break eye contact first. What's up with these blonde MILF hotties staring at me? My wings and I are surveying the scene and there are really no single girls to be found anywhere on site. There's a dance floor about the size of a postage stamp, and three girls at the bar, all accompanied by males and none of them is especially good looking. We order sodas, then bail.
---

Venue #2:

11:30 PM: my wings and I check out a club near the beach. I'm trying to keep Gunwitch's latest post on maintaining an 'up' party vibe at all times when clubbing in mind. I also keep in mind to be on watch for a possible fight.

In line, there's an asian and middle eastern girl. They're 6's or 7's. Fairly cute, but not strikingly so, dressed up in the usual flashy party clothing. I chat up the middle eastern girl. She's got glitter eye makeup and a shiny blouse. She's short, even in her heels. I go into a routine about how long the damm line and wait is, and are they going to stick around. The ME girl maintains good eye contact and smiles as we chat for a minute or two. I'm not really into her or the conversation that much, and sort of let it wane.

I want to check out the crowd, so I get out of line while my wings hold my spot and walk up to the front, checking out the girls who smoke out in front, and the rest of the girls in line. Some fairly good looking but not gorgeous girls. I return to my wings and we chit chat. I make a point of it to stay in a 'party' vibe: joking, talking loud, smiling.
---

Convo #6. Immediately inside, I let my wings lose me, as I let them walk into the club, while I stay back in the bar area. There's a dude sitting near the door. "Are you security?" I ask him, joking around with him. He says he's not, he's just sitting near the door since it's a good spot to check out all of the girls entering and exiting the club. I ask him if there's one girl he likes in particular. He points to an Asian chick in a leopard print top at the bar just five feet ahead. We chit chat for about five minutes.
---

Convo #7: The leopard print's girlfriend begins staring at me, with a confused look on her face. I point at myself looking at her, to indicate 'are you staring at me?' She says as we stand five feet apart:

her: 'you look familiar!'
me: I give her a confused look as I've never seen her before in my life.
her: 'do I know you?'
me: I'm thinking, did you borrow my shark basic playboy cd? I walk over there, thinking this has to be the cheesiest pickup line ever thrown my way, or perhaps she's just damm confused.
her: you look just like someone I know.
me: who's that?
her: a dj I worked for a while back...

she says I look just like some club promoter or dj who works at clubs, I don't remember the exact details. I tell her I'm a teacher not a dj! I try to kino the girl but she pulls back when I try it. We do talk for more than five minutes. I find out she's a dj on a local radio station, she does club shows for entertainment clientele, blah blah blah. Hate to say this, but she's got kickin' breath. She's about a '7', maybe. She's of average height, asian, very thin, party clothes, average to above average face, early twenties. I exit since the kino's not working, her breath kicks, and I finished my 'assignment' with her.
---

Convo #8: I check out the dance floor. There's an elevated seating section next to the DJ's booth which is on a riser. I survey the scene for two or three minutes. A tall black girl, early to mid twenties gets right up in my grill. She's got some serious curves! Booty and chest are poppin' right out of her party clothes. She does have a thin waist however. I'll give her a '6' plus.

her: do you wanna dance? Big smile, direct eye contact.
me: sure. I'm already dancin! You gotta cut me some slack though cuz I'm asian!
her: looking confused: 'well I'm black, it doesn't matter...'

I kino the girl a little bit. Putting my hand around her waist and copping a feel of her butt: firm and very large. Wow! I'm impressed. Still not really turned on by her though.

we start dancing for a while and she's shaking it pretty good for a minute or two. I dance, but I'm not looking her in the eye, but instead continue surveying the club. She takes this mean that I am not interested, and she skampers off. I feel kinda bad; I'm not that interested in her, but don't want to offend her or insult her.
---

Convo #9: I see an Asian cutie behind the bar, near the back of the club. One of my wings is conversing with her asian girlfriend. This Asian girl is average height or shorter, has babyfat chipmunk cheeks, big eyes and is dressed up in a tourquoise top. Again, I'd give her a 6 or 7 out of 10. I ask her if she's having a good time then I fluff with her for three or four minutes. She goes to school in the area, studies nursing, volunteers at an old folks home. It turns out she's a typical girl at the club: a very nice college girl, no bytch shield, more shy than bytchy, fairly cute and a very down to earth to personality. My wing leaves after three or four minutes. My girl goes to talk to her girlfriend who has just been left alone.

her: 'hey, your friend's leaving!'
me: 'he's not my friend, I was just lyin' to you!'
her: her jaw drops and she looks shocked. So much for ****y and funny. The girls in this club are so damm nice and gullible.

I wait around for a minute or two, get bored then ditch the girl I was talking to:

me: 'hey it was nice talking to you, I'll see you later.
her: she stares at me as I leave, she looks offended or mad that I've left. Odd. I think the situation is, she thinks I'm some kind of heartless player, that I'll lie to her, and that I'll ditch her in a heartbeat. Not necessarily true, but perhaps that's her perception. Lesson learned: never tell a girl you are lying, even if it's just to joke around. Be doubly sure to avoid this with a 'nice girl.'
---

Convo #10:

I meet up with my wings again. I tell them I'm having a good time and ask them if they are also. They're chatting nervously about how many sets they've opened up and about which girls they want to talk to next.

me: which girl do you see that you wanna talk to?
wing 1: after a pause, he points to a girl sitting at a booth.
me: 'c'mon. I motion him over and walk right up to the girl's friend. Actually, the girl wing 1 points out is the asian girl who said she knew me. Right now, the dj girl looks catatonic, which is why I choose the dj girl's girlfriend. This is the Asian girl in the leopard print top the black guy I talked to first was eyeballing.

me: hey, how you doing tonight?
her: fine.
me: you having a good time?
We fluff for about five minutes. She tells me she goes to a local college. I tell her a few jokes about my college being able to kick her school's ass in just about every sport:
her: 'that's true!' she says laughing.

Again, no bytch shield, no attitude, and very shy but friendly as is the typical pattern in this club.

I motion wing #1 over. Hey, D! Hey D! Come over here, man!
Wing 1: waddup dude??

he comes over. I introduce D to the leopard print girl and the dj girl. The dj girl raises her hand reluctantly as if she can barely move and I introduce him to leopard girl, who's name I've already forgotten. So i just introduce him to her instead.

A third Asian girl tries to interrupt my conversation with leopard girl by insisting on sitting between her and me. I tell her to sit by me, away from her girlfriend. "But that's my friend!" I tell her she can sit on my lap instead with a smile. Her jaw drops and she's speechless. I offer a seat next to her friend, but not between us. I pull leopard girl aside and she makes room for her friend. After a couple more minutes of fluff, the girl who just sat gets huffy: "let's go. I wanna go." DJ girl, leopard girl, and huffy girl all have to move in a pack and within fifteen seconds they are all gone. We say our goodbyes and part ways.
---

TBC

 

[allan976]

Convo #11: A japanese guy and gal in their early twenties are walking to the exit.

him: 'do you mind if we sit here (at a bench near the club exit).'
me: I charge twenty dollars. I smile to let them know I'm kidding.

The guy and gal smile nervously.

I'm kind of stumped and amused as to why they'd ask me if they could sit at an unoccupied booth in a public club, so I ask them:

Jguy: 'uh, well, you were sitting her before, so....'
me: 'hey, it's cool, it's a public club, man, I don't own this club' I continue to razz them. They can see I'm clearly joking now and the Jguy loosens up. So I exchange the favor:

me: can I sit here?!
Jguy: well, sure, but we are about to have a conversation. It's going to be really personal and intense.
me: I'm thinking whatever. 'Well, hey, I'll just be sittin'.
I notice the Japanese girl is staring at me as I talk to the guy. I wonder if they're a couple.
me: 'so are you guys from Japan?' They are. 'I noticed there are lots of Japanese at this club tonight.'

The guy tells me that the dj tonight is a friend of theirs. As I talk with the guy, I notice the Jgirl is still staring at me. I gradually include her in the convo, and eventually phase out the guy. However, the guy keeps wanting to talk to me so I continue to acknowledge him, mistake or not.

The three of us talk for about fifteen minutes or so. So much for their intense, personal conversation.
---


Lesson learned 1: not all clubs are the same. Clubs on sunset get PUA's who parachute in squadron by squadron and attack the girls with lines and routines. The girls want to have a good time but get fed up with the silliness and put up bytch shields. The club I went to last night was filled with shy college girls. These girls are LTR material, rather than being jaded wanna be actresses. Bottom line? College girls are cool!

Lesson learned 2: stay up, up, up. Smile, joke, talk loud and stay positive. Let your inhibitions go. Forget about all of your preconceptions about how things will go. Be open to girls of various races and ages. Don't be afraid to talk to strangers. In general, just stop thinking and have a good time. The more self conscious you are, the more nervous you will be. The more outgoing and uninhibited and confident, the better off you will be. Act like you own the place, and a lot of people will believe you.

Lesson learned 3: wearing club gear to a club or a weekend evening out is a must. I used to go in a t shirt, khakis and worn black shoes. Tonight I go out in a form fitting club shirt, with nice polished black shoes. I also ditch the glasses. Girls initiate eye contact, convo's and ask me to dance. I must be doing something right.

Lesson learned 4: find some wings you like, but ditch them the second you enter the club. don't cling to them like lint on an old suit. Talk to new people, act like you own the place, and be more up, positive and uninhibited than the girls you target. Talk to everybody and smile and make eye contact with everyone: the security, the hostesses, the bartenders, the guys, the girls, everybody. Next time you go, you'll be welcome.

Did I mention I had a really fun night out? Don't stay home on a weekend night. It's not natural. It's natural to prowl on weekend nights and let your inhibitions down. So just do it.

Onto week 3......

 

[madgame]

Three convo's down in week 2, seven to go.

Convo 1: there's a pickup game with some pro ballers and D1 college players at a gym I frequent. I ask a guy to my right if there are any players I should recognize.
"man, there's x, and y and z. Dude, don't you recognize 'em?'

I'm looking real hard: '....oh yea, I recognize x.

'he looks different from on tv, huh?'

We chit chat for about five minutes or so. He tells me about what he's studying at college, and what sports he's into.

Who were those pro players? Just wondering..cause I'm into basketball too (I suppose u were talking about basketball lol).

Oh and another thing, I was wondering: Do you think people in L.A. (in general) are less friendly than in S.D. area or is that nothing but a stereotype some ppl make up because they run into some of these chunks who think the world revolves around them cause they live in hollywood or something?

 

[bbestar]

Glad to see a fellow asian here in these forums...

I can't really prowl on the weekends cause of my parents...

But this was a very helpful field report...you are very direct and lessons learned are very informative..

*2 thumbs up*

 

[madgame]

Glad to see a fellow asian here in these forums...

He's/You're asian? (just wondering, because I read it nowhere)

 

[allan976]

Week 3, Day 1 (Monday)

I got in a couple of convo's with dateable girls today.

Convo #1:

At 1 PM, I visit a natural foods store. I see a very cute brunette (22 yrs old?) showing lots of cleavage, offering samples of stew. I chat with her for about 5 minutes or so. I find out she's from Albuquerque New Mexico and she's been in town for six months or so. She tells me there's more jobs out here in LA and its too quiet there (her hometown).

A dorky co worker of hers comes by and hovers near her booth. He offers me some lemon along with my meat sample.

her: "It's not lemon, it's lime!" she reprimands her co worker.
me: 'she doesn't like you very much,' I tell him and the girl laughs out loud in his face.

Fellas: if a girl ever teases you and reprimands you like a little boy, tease her right back and put her back in line straight away.

She offers us both a tortilla with the meat. Again, the dorky co worker offers me a slice of "lemon," as he calls it.

me: 'Dude, it's a lime, not a lemon. It's green, look.'
her: 'We already told you that!'

Afterwards, while we chat, she is always looking down and not looking me in the eye. She could be shy, could just be busy. Later, another of her co workers kisses her ass: 'good job, Melinda!' These guys are swarming over her like flies.
---

Convo #2


At 1:30 PM, I go to another natural foods store. I see a very cute blonde, early twenties, already in a checkout line (damm, I wish I was here five minutes earlier I think). Then, I see ANOTHER blonde, who's even prettier. She's about 5'9", blonde, nice tan, and toned legs (but not too muscular). She looks nice in her white shorts. She's wandering around, grabbing this and that. She doesn't really stop for any extended period of time, so I don't talk to her. I see her again in the check out aisle, but am still nervous about talking to her ('what if she's not nice?', I think to myself). Then I decide it's my assignment to get my ten conversations in this week. She also makes direct eye contact with me, looking at me over her shoulder when I am five feet behind her, so that encourages me also.

I get in line behind her.
me: 'is that soymilk any good?'
her: 'yea, it's really good.' she smiles very broadly and makes direct eye contact.
I am a bit nervous, but try to slow down and not talk so fast, so I don't appear as nervous. She's about 30, rather than 25 but she looks fantastic. She says she's a massage therapist and seems excited when I tell her I teach. We talk about some natural foods restaurants, things like that. She is very, very, very friendly and down to earth. This conversation goes much, much better than I had expected. We are friendly and develop a rapport right away.

I mess around by grabbing her food items to see if she'll get irritated. We talk for about five minutes or so. The only kino I get in is a handshake though lol. Our conversation is interrupted when she has to check out. She says it was nice talking to you/goodbye before she leaves.

Lesson learned: IOI's are good, but again, you certainly don't need it.

Lesson learned: I've repeated this a million times, but you MUST approach. Better to be rejected than to wonder "what if." This is not just rhetoric guys, this is real.

Lesson learned: you may be pleasantly surprised. The reason I wasn't as 'up' for this convo with the blonde was that I feared rejection. This led to me putting off a slightly distant vibe to the girl, who was obviously ready to vibe with with me in a friendly way.

Lesson learned: blondes are generally more outgoing in my opinion. The brunette I spoke to earlier was much more reserved than the blonde I spoke to later today.

 

[allan976]

madgame: I can't really compare LA and SD since I've never been to SD. I can say that the LA county/metropolitan region is extremely diverse. Sure, many of the pretty girls are involved in or want to be involved in the entertainment industry. But, there are also tens or hundreds of thousands of college girls, international girls, girls who want nothing to do with the entertainment but are still gorgeous, etc. Can't generalize to all 10 million of us I think. Are you based in SD?

Also, see convo #8 from week 2; I mentioned I was Asian to mess with the Black girl who danced with me.

 

[madgame]

@allan:

What does "cut some slack" mean?
I'm not based in SD, I'm from germany, but I wanna go to southern cali for some time (and I guess I'm gonna do so in maybe a year or so, as I have the opportunity to go to Australia before and will have to save up some money again). But I've read stuff on some travel forum with a few ppl saying ppl in L.A. were (generally) superficial and they only made 1 or 2 friends there in there stay of a year....but then again I know generalizing is bull****..but maybe there was this attitude among a lot of people in L.A. or something..but I guess it's bull**** and when I'm going I guess I'm gonna go to LA and to SD.

Oh and..speaking of that tall black girl: and international girls: Is L.A. really that (culturally) diverse? Are there lots of black girls, too? Because I've been told before, S.D. was more diverse than L.A. because in L.A. all the different races/ethnic groups were still sorta segregated....but then again I only got this piece of information from like somebody who heard that elsewhere and so on, so I guess it's bull****, too...

oh and keep the good BC work up!

 

[allan976]

Week 3, Day 3 (Wednesday):

7-9 PM gym. There are two girls that I wanted to talk to but didn't talk to. One girl was on an exercise bike. Brunette, 5'6", very cute face and nice body. I debate with myself whether I should talk to her. I chicken out. Some guy in his forties hops on the bike next to her, plugs in his earphones and tunes her out. The other guy on her opposite side stares at her, but doesn't attempt a conversation.

A second girl is 5'9" blonde with muscular very tan legs that go on forever. I'm guessing she's a volleyball player. She looks 19. I can't bring myself to talk to her either.

Convo #3:
I'm about to leave so I get my gymbag and begin dumping my stuff in the bag at a couch. There's a cutie who looks up startled when I drop the bag near her. She's in her mid twenties, average height, very cute face, brunette wearing a baseball hat and gym gear. I get in a good three/four minute convo with her. Her body language is ok: she makes direct eye contact and smiles the entire time. However, she gives me very short one word, short phrase answers.

Lesson learned: better to be rejected than to wonder 'what if.'

Lesson learned: speak loudly and confidently. I was speaking in a very tentative and quiet voice in convo #3. At one point she asked: 'what did you say? I can't hear you....' I'm surprised the convo went as well as it did given how lame my body language and tone was.

I'm getting stressed out by a few things in my life right now, so I'm using that as an excuse, but the majority of convo's this week are going pretty well, despite their paucity.

Does this qualify as a shameless bump? lol.

 

[allan976]

Week 3, Day 5 (Friday):

I go out bar hopping in the socal "valley". It's hotter, smoggier, the girls aren't quite as hot as on LA main entertainment strip (sunset), but there are still pretty girls, if not galore, and just about everyone is quite a bit friendlier.

Venue 1: 11 PM:

My wing and I go to the "turquoise room". The entire, single room is indeed turquoise, from seats to walls to carpet. I scan the room and it looks to be a near sausage fest: I'd estimate it's 70% male. I'm not impressed. I move around the room and scan the place, looking for attractive females. They are few and far between. I open up a conversation with a couple of college students. It's better than not talking with anyone at all, but I don't count the two conversations I have with the two college girls, since I normally wouldn't date them. They have cute faces, but have very large bodies. When I open up a conversation, the wing becomes a problem immediately. Instead of occupying another girl in the set, he simply barges into my conversation. It will be a problem throughout the night. My wing and I bail after 30 minutes or so.

---

Venue 2: 11:45 PM (pool hall):

My wing recommends a second place; he said it was dead on a weekday evening, but thinks it might be better on a weekend evening. I scan the room, and again it's about a 70/30 m/f split. I check out the entire large rectangular room. After a second tour, I notice two HB7 blondes at the bar. There's an unoccupied seat next to the two girls and I take it. I wonder about how to open them. My wing steps in.

W: "want me to open them?"
me: no, give me a couple of minutes.
W: "you better have opened them when I come back" he says. The nerve of this guy. I like my wing, but good grief....

I am truly stumped. I am waiting for the right moment. Hey, I'm inexperienced. Finally, the girl on the far side orders a rolling rock. I bust on her for ordering a rolling rock saying they taste really bad. I get her laughing and smiling a bit. I engage the blonde on the far side in conversation, occasionally bringing the girl immediately to my side in. The conversation is going better with the blonde/far side. The blonde/near side still has her back to me. At this point, things can go either way: I can either heat up, or get gently rejected, it's too early to tell after only three or four minutes. Here comes the wing:

W: "so what's the big discussion all about?"

All three of us freeze dead in our tracks. The blonde/far side looks over at blonde/near side and myself, gauging our reactions. The set is blown. The wing keeps asking questions, and the girls become increasingly hostile, now insulting both of us at this point. I attempt a defensive maneuver by busting on them right back, but it's painful watching this set die slowly right in front of my eyes. After a couple of minutes attempting resuscitation I leave.

I tell the wing later: don't enter the set until I wave you in, or call you in. I tell him he didn't pick a girl, either (he's supposed to target the girl I'm not talking to). His opener, and his tone of delivery are artificial and contrived and don't match the energy level of our conversation. He's not reading the reaction of the girls either (hostile and defensive). Just a terrible piece of work on his part. Two sets, my wing barges in twice destroying both conversations. It might as well be a ****block it's so bad!

We leave the venue. As we leave, two HB's, a blonde and brunette walk past us. We watch to see where they're going. They're going to the pool hall we just left. We go back to the pool hall! The girls are showing ID. I'm waiting for the girls to find a seat and see if they are waiting for dates or a larger party. My wing walks right up and puts his arms around both. He's out after two minutes. Major mistake. I ask him what happened. He says that they "didn't take me seriously." I wonder what insult these two girls hurled at him this time. I don't ask.

---

Venue #3: 1 AM

We drive to venue #3. I try to tell him in the car about his fyckups as a wing. I'm a little upset, but want to give him some feedback in between sets about the problems with his approaches, to rescue both of us in the future. He understands the importance of being a good wing and agrees not to enter a set until I signal or call him in. He doesn't have the intuition or observational skills yet to figure who to occupy, or when or how to enter a set opened by a wing so I have to play it safe. I give him some advice on when and how to make physical contact. Again, he insists that since he feels touching right away is ok, the girls must be ok with it. He clearly does not get it, by his own admission. I tell him the field is the ultimate arbiter, not his personal or theoretical opinion. Just a very frustrating wing to deal with at times. However, the improvement while glacial, is there to some small degree.

As we drive to a third venue, he asks me how he did during the last set. I tell him he blew up the set. I tell him it's a learning experience which will make us better in the future (hopefully), and he agrees to my rules. I am relieved for the moment.

We enter a bar after not being able to find our original destination. I order some water at the bar. A blonde five feet away looks over her shoulder and checks me out:

HB7: "water, that's a nice choice!" (sign 1: situational opener; ****y and funny?)

I can't tell if she's being sarcastic or not, so I don't reply. Plus, I've just entered the joint, so I want to check out the action before being pulled into a set.

I take a casual stroll around the bar. Again, a 70/30 split m/f. I observe for five minutes or so. I don't see or feel any openings. I then see another guy in a suit also observing the bar. I talk to him for five minutes. As I'm talking, I see HB7 stare at me again (sign 2: staring). Two IOI's and I'm in. I walk over to the bar and order some more water, so HB7 can hear me. HB7 also orders a water at this point (sign 3: mirroring).

HB7: hey, that is an excellent choice...
Me: are you busting on me?
HB: no, not at all! I totally respect that" she says leaning in, and becomining serious in tone now to demonstrate her sincerity.

I laugh at her, reassured and amused by her very obvious game. She's "sarging" me, and I qualify her by waiting for more and signs of interest ("stacking evidence"). We get each other's names and shake hands. She won't release my hand and continues holding it (sign 4: kino1)

We fluff for the rest of the night. She's with her restaurant boss (male) and a coworker (HB8). She says she's an actor. At one point, she hits me (sign 5: kino2). I push her back (gently) until she laughs out loud and bows her head. At another point, she asks me what I do for work, and she squeals:

HB: 'oooh, that is great! (sign 6: tries to create rapport by demonstrating false enthusiasm about my personality).

HBactor then drops the bomb and tells me she's married. I take a look at her ring. It looks chintzy as hell, but later produces a photo of her and her husband. I call my wing in at this point!

HBactress then introduces me to her friend. HB's friend is also a HB blonde, and has a strikingly pretty face. I take a closer look and she's a dead ringer for Britney Spears. I fluff HBBritney.

Me: you look like Britney Spears
HBB: she bows her head and thinks for a second (she has to think through her response--weak game/nice girl). "I do get that."
Me: "you've got a big nose just like Britney."

HBactor busts up laughing: "he said you have a big nose! Ha ha ha! You can't tell her she has a big nose!"

HBB: britney tries to look sad and offended, bowing her head and frowning but is also busting up laughing. She covers her nose self consciously.

The single guy I was talking to earlier rushes in and AMOG's me! I try to AMOG back, but half heartedly so. Good work on his part. Oddly, my interest level in HBBritney skyrockets after I face competition, but was weak to moderate prior to his entrance/****block.

Lesson learned: HBBritney has a lovely face, but she's completely covered up. She's wearing a black cap, full length leather jacket, jeans, and "covers herself" with her arms and closes her legs. She does give me two IOI's by looking at me twice over her shoulder while I talk with HBactor. The lesson is, as soon as the other guy AMOG's me, my interest in HBB skyrockets (the power of social proof). Before, my interest level was low to moderate, then takes off after seeing her opened. Interesting.

Lesson learned: HBB Britney is single and very reserved. HBactor is married and gives me buying signals like it's her job. Attention hor? Possible lay? My interpretation was that HBactor is flirting with me to reel me in for HBBritney. My wing claims HBactor wanted me for herself, but offered me up to HBB only after feeling guilty about the hubbie. He still insists HBactor wanted me to fyck her, even after listening to my theory. Who knows. I had two blondes, a HB7actor and HB8Britney look-a-like giving me buying signals/IOI's but I had to try to focus on one, so I lost out.

Lesson learned: my energy has picked way up now that work starts at 11 AM and not 8 AM anymore. I feel much, much better. I feel great actually. I get plenty of sleep. I only start to fizzle out at 1:30 or 1:45 AM, which for me woulda been a damm miracle two months ago.

TBC....

 

[allan976]

Field Report Conclusion:

I got in convo's 5,6,7 and 8 with dateable girls. I count the last the two pairs of girls, but not the first pair of girls, who did not have attractive bodies.

My wing is an asset and a hindrance. He's pointed out some decent places in the valley and can negotiate that part of town since he's a native. On the other hand, he enters sets so badly and busts them so quickly, he might as well be a ****block after we get to those venues. I have to set rules, which are quite restrictive, in order to protect sets both for myself and for him. However, I do follow my own rule with his sets; that is, I don't move into his sets until he signals me in. He still doesn't quite get the point of winging, which is to help each other succeed. Right now, all he understands is that he should talk to girls, but all of the subtleties and nuances of reading a room, reading a person's energy level, gauging their personality, observing the situation, etc. etc., all seem to be lost on him. He admits he is really bad, but his refusal to listen is also very frustrating. As a beginner myself, I have to be patient and take the good with the bad as my selection of wings is relatively limited. Also, I'm sympathetic to his plight, so I do want to help him.

Overall, it's a win win situation and I consider my wing and I to be friends at this point. It's a clumsy, awkward relationship but the positives are beginning to outweigh the negatives. Plus, with my energy level up, I just let slip ups do just that: sliiide. They roll off my back like water. No worries.

Peace,

Allan

 

[allan976]

CONFUSING NIGHT OUT AT A CLUB

Week 3, Day 6 (Saturday):

I complete my week 3 assignment with two conversations last night. I have several questions below, for those who are in a generous mood.

Convo 9:

4 PM: gym: I see a coed cutie on an exercise bike. There's only one bike available, right next to the girl. I take it.

me: "hey, mind if we switch bikes? My tv monitor isn't working" I joke with her.
her: "uuuuuu"
me: "I'm just kidding"
her: "well, if you don't mind watching dirty dancing."

I hesitate and she starts laughing.

me: "I think I'll have to pass."

We both start to laugh.

me: "I like some chick flicks but I don't know about that one."

We fluff for five minutes about movies, school, family. She's not that great at conversation so I can't gauge her interest level. Every sentence starts off with: "yeah, um......" She says she's in her third year of college but she looks alot younger.


Convo 10: dance club:

I don't head out of the house until about 11:30 PM tonight. Everything is just off tonight. I'm getting irritated as I'm going out with three wings and none of them have any idea of where they want to go. Apparently, they're wandering around near the beach, and flit from one place to another.

We all decide on one dance club. They say it's pretty small but for some reason want to go back. I am slightly tired myself, and these guys are very, very quiet and low key. I try to bring them up, but they seem really too low energy for a dance club. We wait in line twenty minutes and they barely talk. Weird.

Once inside, I am quickly overwhelmed. The place is pretty small, and the very small dance floor is packed. I get immediate IOI from a HB7 Asian girl as I walk up to a bar. She looks over her shoulder once, then twice. She's with an Asian guy.

I ask her what she's drinking. She has to repeat what she's drinking like six times since it's too loud and I can't hear, even with my ear directly to her mouth. I think she gets frustrated and leaves the conversation and goes off with the Asian guy. I meander about. There are several girls who stare right at me, but I'm just not feeling it. I am quite frankly intimidated by the very high energy level and feel discombobulated.

About a half hour later, I walk back near the door. I see three blondes between the bar and exit. I talk to the prettiest one, who is also closest to me. I have a good conversation with her, for about four or five minutes. I run a coversation routine by asking her a bunch of questions. Her body language is pretty good: she makes direct eye contact and turns her body towards me. I remember to remain neutral by turning my head but not my body to her. At one point, I mention that I am having a hard time adjusting to the high energy level. I say I need some crack or other drug to get me up. She busts up laughing. Then she scolds me saying that I need to expect this and bring myself up. She says she needs to talk to her friends.

Lesson learned: energy level matters. After a long night out barhopping Friday night, I follow up with a late night out Saturday. It does prove to be difficult.

Lesson learned: I should expect to be very up and energetic; that way, if the place is mellow, I can adjust accordingly; if the place is hopping, I'm already there in terms of energy level.

Lesson learned: the higher the energy level, the more direct I need to be. The standard conversation is less useful, and kino is more important. I need to be flexible.

Lesson learned: I had several girls stare right at me, but I didn't jump in.

---

Questions:

1. This board seems good at providing info about daytime approaches. What readings in particular are useful for very high energy nighttime approaches?

2. If a girl is staring and she is part of a party of mixed guys, girls what's the appropriate way to approach in a club?

3. Where do you guys shop to get some club gear? I just have a couple of Kenneth Cole shirts and dress in jeans and black dress shoes. Tips appreciated.

 

[allan976]

ANWERS TO QUESTIONS

"I've read stuff on some travel forum with a few ppl saying ppl in L.A. were (generally) superficial and they only made 1 or 2 friends there in there stay of a year...."

---this is a tough question since the LA County metropolitan region is so huge and diverse. Sure, the center of the entertainment industry is in Los Angeles, and lots of people flock here for that reason, but you can find your own niche, regardless of what you do because of the region's size. It will be easy to find entertainment industry types, especially wanna-be's but there are lots of people doing everything.

---

"Oh and..speaking of that tall black girl: and international girls: Is L.A. really that (culturally) diverse?"

---Los Angeles is extremely diverse. The entertainment types really stand out and try to attract attention to themselves, but yes racially it is very diverse.

I say check it out for yourself.

 

[RBB]

I've got tonnes to learn from you. What's your status? RAFC? You seem to have all the knowledge down. gj!