Bench press- incline or flat? (and deadlift question)

[slave_to_the_audio]

Hey all, been reading through warboss alex's guide practically everysingle day (keeps me motivated and on the right track). My question is, whats the main difference between doing incline presses or plain, flat bench presses (aside from the upper chest muscles on incline)? I think i heard wba mention somewhere incline is the way to go, just not sure why.

Also, I just got through my back group today (following that routine in the growing guide, got me into lifting real heavy) and on my deadlifts, it seemed to tire me out but i couldn't really feel where most fo the exercise was coming from. I thought it was meant to be mostly felt in your lower back but... Could be my form, ill keep at anyway

 

[Skilla_Staz]

Incline: Targets front delts/ upper pectorals
Flat: Targets lower pectorals


The problem with overdeveloping the lower pectorals is you get that "droopy" look to them. By beefing up your upper pecs, you get a more solid, rounded look to them. It's much more "manly" looking as well.

Deadlifts: I generally feel my deads most in my butt. Maybe around halfway up my back as well.

 

[slave_to_the_audio]

wow, fast reply Thanks for the advice, ill definitley make sure to stick with incline then.

 

[Skilla_Staz]

Ha late at night, you'll probably catch me on, especially this forum. I think I'm getting a skinny man's version of bigorexia


I do my flat bench (heavy sets) first, and then go right into incline DB presses after that.

 

[spesmilitis]

I feel deadlifts in mostly in my lower back.

 

[dj ben2]

Incline: Targets front delts/ upper pectorals
Flat: Targets lower pectorals
l.

whats the purpose in decline bench then

 

[spesmilitis]

whats the purpose in decline bench then

Even more lower pec emphasis

 

[md3sign]

Once you build a solid strength/size foundation and start going HEAVY on deads for reps (i.e. over 315lbs), your back will get pretty sore. It's a compound movement and depending on your form you'll feel it differently from other people. I know on my heaviest sets my legs extend much sooner than on my lighter sets and my back ends up doing more work, simply because I don't have the leg strength to lift that weight beyond a few inches.

 

[Warboss Alex]

Once you build a solid strength/size foundation and start going HEAVY on deads for reps (i.e. over 315lbs).

315 is heavy?

 

[md3sign]

315 for reps is heavy for a 1st year skinny kid trainee

 

[manuva]

whats the purpose in decline bench then

There's no real purpose to decline bench, its the most overrated chest exercise in my opinion. It also places the head below the heart, which is a pretty dangerous situation to be in whilst under exertion.

 

[md3sign]

Well, everything's relative. 315 for Ronnie Coleman, for example, is a joke. Too light for even warmup sets. To the average guy that frequents the gym to tone up, or gain some decent strength...315 is a very healthy amount of weight.

I doubt even 1% of the male population can just up and lift 315 out of the blue. By that token in 7 months of going to the gym I've only seen 1 person ever deadlift higher than that. I see maybe 2-3 people a week doing some sort of SLDL/RDL variation with 135. And this is at a uni gym that's always packed.

 

[Warboss Alex]

I doubt even 1% of the male population can just up and lift 315 out of the blue. By that token in 7 months of going to the gym I've only seen 1 person ever deadlift higher than that. I see maybe 2-3 people a week doing some sort of SLDL/RDL variation with 135. And this is at a uni gym that's always packed.

it depends who you measure yourself against and where you train. it's all relative.

you won't find any big lifts in a uni gym, students are more interested in their wifebeaters, hair gel, mobile phones, and bb.com volume routines than actually lifting heavy. you'd have to pay me to lift in a uni gym, and even if it was free I'd want my money back. 315 in there would be something.

by the same penchant, where I train 315 is a warmup weight for myself and others (natural or roided).

 

[Warboss Alex]

There's no real purpose to decline bench, its the most overrated chest exercise in my opinion. It also places the head below the heart, which is a pretty dangerous situation to be in whilst under exertion.

again we agree.

incline presses will always be the superior chest builder because they allow for the best stretch (faschial expansion).

 

[A-Unit]

Re:

Where you feel the exercise is a barometer of whether you're doing it right and lifting with the proper muscles. Good job on the 315. The deadlift is my baby, and you should feel the deadlift up the back, from the lower piece to the upper piece. If you examine how it's done, you can see what muscles are involved.

Keeping a tight back, with an opposite grip (under hand and over hand), bar close to your shins, back tight, and straight or arched upward, you drive with the legs up first. At some point, your back will come into play, and keeping tight, trying to squeeze the bar to death you pull straight. Don't arch backwards for more effect, just straight up, hold it 1 second, and then slow down with the legs, and then back. Keep the tension throughout the back and arms. Tension creates force, and added strength. The legs play the role up and down. If it was only a back exercise and no legs, it would be similar to the SLDL. However, it's not, and a SLDL at 315 would be huge.

And, yes, 315 IS good. Especially in year 1. 400, impressive. 500 even better. Etc. So don't knock a guy who can do that. Appreciate the fact he's in the top 5% of all people because that strength. And keeping that up, with good progression, you can hit your genetic peak with devotion.


A-Unit

 

[md3sign]

it depends who you measure yourself against and where you train. it's all relative.

you won't find any big lifts in a uni gym, students are more interested in their wifebeaters, hair gel, mobile phones, and bb.com volume routines than actually lifting heavy. you'd have to pay me to lift in a uni gym, and even if it was free I'd want my money back. 315 in there would be something.

by the same penchant, where I train 315 is a warmup weight for myself and others (natural or roided).

I measuring up against the male population of the United States in the age range of 18-35, if you want to get specific about it, lifters or not. Yes I realize 315 is a pink dumbell in the iron game, but honestly how many people on the street do you think lift seriously?

Why is the decline bench useless? I honestly haven't researched it much. I know I did a fair amount of it (along with incline and flat) back in the day before I knew what I was doing. I agree that most people don't have a use for it as I've yet to see someone with a HUGE upper chest and tiny lower, but is that the only reason?

PS. it seems weighted chest dips provide enough lower-pec development, at least in my experience.

A-Unit - thanks.

 

[slave_to_the_audio]

A-unit: sweet advice for the deadlifts man. I got another question tho, im really just gettin into the heavy lifting (i weigh about 70kg/~150lbs, fairly skinny and im starting on low reps with a bit over 50kg). Im finding my back has a really tough time keeping straight when trying to lift this. Should I focus on keeping my back straight or on getting the bar up higher (at the cost of my back curving a bit)?

Also, i was checking out the deadlift strength standards (http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/DeadliftStandards.html) and noticed that the amount lifted from un-trained to novice jumps a hell of alot. Is it normal to be able to increase the weight that much in a fairly short period of time?

 

[Warboss Alex]

A-unit: sweet advice for the deadlifts man. I got another question tho, im really just gettin into the heavy lifting (i weigh about 70kg/~150lbs, fairly skinny and im starting on low reps with a bit over 50kg). Im finding my back has a really tough time keeping straight when trying to lift this. Should I focus on keeping my back straight or on getting the bar up higher (at the cost of my back curving a bit)?

BACK ALWAYS STRAIGHT

Also, i was checking out the deadlift strength standards (http://www.exrx.net/Testing/WeightLifting/DeadliftStandards.html) and noticed that the amount lifted from un-trained to novice jumps a hell of alot. Is it normal to be able to increase the weight that much in a fairly short period of time?

EVERYONE IS DIFFERENT, CHARTS MEAN SQUAT

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