Been LJBF'ed by her and yet she keeps flirting

[B9]

look lads, when the LJBF thing came up I knew right away that it was pointless to pursue. I have no problem with that, which is why I don't see any reason to 'walk away'. It is not really a case of pursuing her for me.

The simple fact is that she is rather hot and I probably would like to bang her if the possibility is there, but nothing more than that. I couldn't quite read the situation and wanted some feedback on it.

I have gone down the friendship route myself with a oneitis before I discovered this site and it does suck. I am not stupid enough to do it again.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

DJDAMAGE: I'm here to help,..

B9: You don't need to find out if you want to fvck this girl or not because it's not going to happen. You've already established yourself as her surrogate, there's nothing left for her to learn about you and she didn't have to get intimate with you to find out what you're about. In addition to this, you already know enough about her methods for achieving noncontingent reinforcement (attention and security for her apparently) and that she'll happily take whatever you will give her and not feel obligated to be intimate with you to get it. And even if the clouds parted, the Angels sang and she miraculously saw you for the 'perfect boyfriend' you already are, how genuine do you think her passion would be? You've sold the farm my friend, time to move on.

Don't beat yourself up over 1 girl, you just missed an opportunity is all. With 90% of the women you will become intimate with, the process of attraction is an immediate, phyisical, spontaneous chemistry.

Keep this in mind - Any woman that makes you wait for her intimacy (i.e. sex) or implies with her actions that she is making you wait for it, the sex is NEVER worth the wait. You cannot plan passion; passion happens or it doesn't and no amount of negotiation or convincing will make it happen.

 

[B9]

Originally posted by Rollo Tomassi
DJDAMAGE: I'm here to help,..

B9: You don't need to find out if you want to fvck this girl or not because it's not going to happen. You've already established yourself as her surrogate, there's nothing left for her to learn about you and she didn't have to get intimate with you to find out what you're about. In addition to this, you already know enough about her methods for achieving noncontingent reinforcement (attention and security for her apparently) and that she'll happily take whatever you will give her and not feel obligated to be intimate with you to get it. And even if the clouds parted, the Angels sang and she miraculously saw you for the 'perfect boyfriend' you already are, how genuine do you think her passion would be? You've sold the farm my friend, time to move on.

heh,
no biggie. just wondered whether the fact her flirting actually increased when I was LJBFed might indicate the possibility for sex might be there.

as desdinova said, " Hell, don't worry about it unless she makes the first move" so regardless of whether there is or not, doesn't make much of a difference really.

Don't beat yourself up over 1 girl, you just missed an opportunity is all. With 90% of the women you will become intimate with, the process of attraction is an immediate, phyisical, spontaneous chemistry.

as an aside, that attraction was actually there as within 5 minutes of us meeting we were kissing, but having 2 other women to choose from that night, I didn't follow up on it.

Keep this in mind - Any woman that makes you wait for her intimacy (i.e. sex) or implies with her actions that she is making you wait for it, the sex is NEVER worth the wait. You cannot plan passion; passion happens or it doesn't and no amount of negotiation or convincing will make it happen.

good words, rollo.

rgds
B9

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

Bear in mind, LJBF still equals rejection. Only, LJBF puts the responsibility of that rejection on the guy who initiated the intimacy (or the 'approach' if you like that term better). By defering to the LJBF response the guy has 2 options; he can either accept her terms of rejection and engage in pseudo-friendship as an obligation for his not wanting to appear 'shallow', or he can simply refuse any notion of future friendship and put the rejection responsibility back on her where it belongs in the first place - with her. Unsuprisingly, I'd reccommend the latter and there are very tactful ways of doing this that leaves you in a position of power and you walk away with your self-respect..

When a woman falls back on LJBF it serves 3 purposes for her. First, she is absolved of any liability for feeling bad about the rejection, if this even comes in to her thinking (she "tried to be nice to you"). Secondly she avoids coming across as a b!tch, both to herself and to her peers ("I tried to be nice to him"). Lastly, it puts the burden of the rejection on the man who initiated the approach by putting him into the difficult position of choosing whether to comply, and allow her to be aquitted of the rejection's implications, or to - unlikely - turn her offer of 'friendship' down and become himself a 'Jerk' for not allowing her the escape that LJBF implies.

At the time it seems a pretty simple solution to what amounts to a confrontation, but if you pick it apart a bit the complexities show LJBF to be a very useful and practiced tool for women. Half the reason so many guys become AFCs is due to this self-imposed expectation of an actual friendship (as if one could truly exist) when all an LJBF amounted to for her was a convenient 'out' of a confrontation. The guy deserves a real rejection, but far too many women are cowards in this regard. Not surprisingly many men assume her LJBF rejection is a "not now, but maybe later" equation and waste countless (and potentially productive) months, and many times, years in pursuit of an unattainable female who didn't posess the courage to give the guy a proper rejection and send him off to greener pastures.

 

[DharmaBear]

Wow. This is one of the best threads I've read. What guy hasn't experienced the ill-fated 'LJBF' shutdown at some point in their lives? We all have, and by breaking it down you guys have really helped me put things in perspective with a few LJBF's in my life right now. Especially your last analysis, Rollo. Dead on. Thanks for the great thread.

I agree that woman are insecure, emotional tampons looking for Brad Pitt. When "average" guys like us come along, we get LJBF'd. Ridiculous. I say the best option is the ignore option. If you've already offered up AFC-esque attention, immediately pull out and see what happens. Ignore her. NEXT her. Whatever you want to call it. Odds are, she'll come crying for your adoration.

This thread should be put in the DJ Bible under Rejection.

 

[seasonedplayer]

I have been in a similar situation and I got burnt. This girl used to lead me on and didn't have the guts to reject me because she liked the attention I gave her. I basical;ly took the AFC root for the first time in my life because I really liked her. THen she decided to toss me away when she got sick of my attention.

 

[Tantric]

keep in mind...just because you were LJBF'd, it doesn't mean she will NEVER have sex with you...

You both have already established an "attraction" so i don't believe it will NEVER go anywhere. But, being a "nice guy" or giving her everything she wants as far as attention goes DEFINITLY won't get you there.

When i say "walk away", i don't mean break contact and end the "friendship". Back away for a while don't give her as much attention, and focus on OTHER GIRLS! Whether you fvck her or not doesn't matter...use her as social proof and see if she has any "hot" friends. Just REALLY keep your distance. At school i'd still talk to her, but let HER approach you and let HER start the convos. Remain aloof for now...back off...let her miss you.

When she gets a BF though...THAT is when i'd walk away completely as she'll use BOTH of you to fill her ego.

 

[Blue Phoenix]

Originally posted by Tantric
When i say "walk away", i don't mean break contact and end the "friendship". Back away for a while don't give her as much attention, and focus on OTHER GIRLS! Whether you fvck her or not doesn't matter...use her as social proof and see if she has any "hot" friends. Just REALLY keep your distance. At school i'd still talk to her, but let HER approach you and let HER start the convos. Remain aloof for now...back off...let her miss you.

When she gets a BF though...THAT is when i'd walk away completely as she'll use BOTH of you to fill her ego.

Well, that's the problem Tantric. MOST of the times they DO have a BF, that's why I stop wasting my time with them right away!

It'll be no surprise if the girl B9 is talking has one!

 

[B9]

Originally posted by Tantric
keep in mind...just because you were LJBF'd, it doesn't mean she will NEVER have sex with you...

You both have already established an "attraction" so i don't believe it will NEVER go anywhere. But, being a "nice guy" or giving her everything she wants as far as attention goes DEFINITLY won't get you there.

It seems I am not communicating this very clearly, but I am NOT giving her overly much attention. I probably was for about a week or so (which I reckon gave rise to the 'you're my best friend' comments which I found a bit spooky), but all I've been doing since is responding to what she initiates, and by no means in a 'eager to please' way.

When i say "walk away", i don't mean break contact and end the "friendship". Back away for a while don't give her as much attention, and focus on OTHER GIRLS! Whether you fvck her or not doesn't matter...use her as social proof and see if she has any "hot" friends. Just REALLY keep your distance. At school i'd still talk to her, but let HER approach you and let HER start the convos. Remain aloof for now...back off...let her miss you.

When she gets a BF though...THAT is when i'd walk away completely as she'll use BOTH of you to fill her ego.

agree with all that, Tantric.

 

[B9]

Originally posted by DharmaBear
I agree that woman are insecure, emotional tampons looking for Brad Pitt. When "average" guys like us come along, we get LJBF'd.

average? wtf, what kind of attitude is that for any DJ?

I am NOT talking about going after her out of any romantic interest or anything of the sort. If you read my post, I had within the second day decided that it probably wouldn't be a good idea anyway. When the LJBF came I dids not consider that a problem because I wasn't gonna go after her anyway.

I asked what i did because I wanted to know whether the conflicting signals might mean that there is a possibility for sex somewhere down the line.

I have a feeling some of you are reading the situation as something more than it is.

 

[DJDamage]

quote: B9
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I asked what i did because I wanted to know whether the conflicting signals might mean that there is a possibility for sex somewhere down the line.
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The possibilites are very very low. When a woman already puts you in the "friend" zone it usually means that she has lost most of her attraction to you and sees you more like a brother.

The fact of the matter is that if you have not bang her during the relationship, you are not going to bang her after the relationship, she isn't going to try something new with less attraction to you then before. That is why some men are successful in banging the ex because she tend to miss that if the sex was good, however you never did.

Your better off concentrating your efforts on other hot chicks to bang, because banking on low probablity like that will probably get you nowhere.

 

[Blue Phoenix]

Originally posted by Rollo Tomassi

Keep this in mind - Any woman that makes you wait for her intimacy (i.e. sex) or implies with her actions that she is making you wait for it, the sex is NEVER worth the wait. You cannot plan passion; passion happens or it doesn't and no amount of negotiation or convincing will make it happen.

Man, you've a very good understanding of the dating "rules". Why don't you post something with the knowledge you have?

This thread is a big lesson for all aspiring Djs here!

 

[DJDamage]

quote: Rollo Tomassi
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You're a boyfriend surrogate. She (like every woman) thrives on your exclusive attention, but lacks the interest to correspond with her intimacy. She gets all the benefits of a boyfriend with none of the responsibilities of reciprocating anything for the security you provide by playing the role of boyfriend. This is an analagous situation to a guy having a fvck buddy; he gets his primary desire fulfilled (sex) without reciprocating the security and/or attention she desires.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is one of the best paragraphs I ever read regarding women that are using men. The media always try to portray men as jerks who use women for sex with the promise of a relationship but then bails out after he gets what he wants.

When it comes to women the rules have changed because most women do not sleep with a guy for their own benefits like men do. The way women become the jerks or for better word the "attention wh@res", is by using the guy for attention with the promise of SEX while he supplys the relationship. But he never gets the sex like the woman who don't get the security and attention of a loving relationship.

You will never hear Operah talking about sh1t like this because for some reasons sex is viewed as something dirty and shameful while relationships viewed of something that is higher up that only "intelligent" people do.

Women place relationships higher up slightly above sex, but men places higher value on the sex then the relationship. Its not about being morally right or feeling shamful about it, its what nature intended it to be in order to reprocreate our species.

That is why if a woman feminist ever called you a pig for thinking like this, you should tell her not to act as if her sh1t don't stink.

 

[Skweints]

I believe a lot of this stuff is true, however, I think everybody should realize that women do this on a subconcious level. It's not like they wake up one morning and decide "Oh, I'm gonna use men to make myself feel better." It's a subconcious response, just like eating food cures your hunger.

I've met quite a few intelligent women who I fell into this trap with, providing that "psuedo-relationship" in the hopes that I would EVENTUALLY get sex. And it's nobody's fault but my own.

I don't know, but a lot of these posts make women seem like they make a concious decision to be the bad guy and out to "use" us and "milk" us for all we're worth. You guys have to wake up and realize that it's your OWN fault for that, not her's.

Honestly, would you give up a **** buddy? No way... she'd DEFINITELY have to be the one to break that one off.

Just as if her friends would tell her that she's with an ******* because he's getting what he wants (sex) without giving what she wants (security and romance). We all know that women never think anything is their fault, so instead of admitting that they actually are with an ******* and breaking up with him, she'll find that "LJBF's" guy to get what she's missing from her "sexual relationship."

I mean, if you put it in a perspective that women want romance and security the same way men want sex, it's really not too difficult to understand. Or maybe that just works for me.

BTW, off topic, but does anybody feel the same way about the "bad word" filter thingie and how useless it really is on this forum?

 

[huge_guy_pimpin]

Originally posted by Skweints
I believe a lot of this stuff is true, however, I think everybody should realize that women do this on a subconcious level. It's not like they wake up one morning and decide "Oh, I'm gonna use men to make myself feel better." It's a subconcious response, just like eating food cures your hunger.

that is the stupidest thing i ever heard,
eating food releases many chemicals in your body and its not just a mindset, as it would be with a woman subconsciously flirting.

 

[Blue Phoenix]

Originally posted by huge_guy_pimpin
that is the stupidest thing i ever heard,
eating food releases many chemicals in your body and its not just a mindset, as it would be with a woman subconsciously flirting.

I'm sorry, but flirting DOES liberate something in her, otherwise she'd not do it. It liberates her from her "feeling of abandonment".

Originally posted by Skweints
I believe a lot of this stuff is true, however, I think everybody should realize that women do this on a subconcious level. It's not like they wake up one morning and decide "Oh, I'm gonna use men to make myself feel better." It's a subconcious response, just like eating food cures your hunger.

I don't know, but a lot of these posts make women seem like they make a concious decision to be the bad guy and out to "use" us and "milk" us for all we're worth.

As strange as it may seem I've agree with you. Aws are not aware of what they're doing, neither why! It's not that they want to hurt others, but they're so self-centered, need so desperately to fulfill their needs that they simply don't care if they hurt you or not. A vampire is a perfect analogy for their case. To use guys like vamps but instead of blood, attention!

In the end, they pay a high price for that.

Originally posted by Skweints
You guys have to wake up and realize that it's your OWN fault for that, not her's.

See:

The guy is ignorant and naive.
The girl is insecure and manipulative.

Who's to blame? The guy or the girl?

 

[Don Juanabbe]

I had a similar situation to this when I was about 19. It went on for months and months. Fairly often, I would sleep with her. Maybe not for four months, but then, every now and then, we'd hook up, and I'd bone her.

Fast forward 14 years later - she's been living very happily with her lesbian lover for several years.

I suppose every now and then, even the Lesbians need some c*ck.

 

[Don Juanabbe]

Originally posted by Skweints
believe a lot of this stuff is true, however, I think everybody should realize that women do this on a subconcious level. It's not like they wake up one morning and decide "Oh, I'm gonna use men to make myself feel better."

If you believe that then you're in a lot of trouble man.

 

[B9]

Originally posted by Don Juanabbe
I had a similar situation to this when I was about 19. It went on for months and months. Fairly often, I would sleep with her. Maybe not for four months, but then, every now and then, we'd hook up, and I'd bone her.

Fast forward 14 years later - she's been living very happily with her lesbian lover for several years.

I suppose every now and then, even the Lesbians need some c*ck.

 

[DJDamage]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Skweints
believe a lot of this stuff is true, however, I think everybody should realize that women do this on a subconcious level. It's not like they wake up one morning and decide "Oh, I'm gonna use men to make myself feel better."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

That is an excuse for bad behaviour. Some women and especially the attension wh0ores often act like a naive child in a relationship where she is always the victim when things go bad but never take any responsibility for their actions.

I agree what alot of the times, its the guy fault with the AFC mindset that he puts himself out there by giving her attention and security in hope of getting sex. If he knew the rules of attractions he would know that being a friend with a chick will most likely lead him nowhere and he is just an emotional tampon to her.

However, that does not excuse the woman herself. Women know that you are sticking around because you like her and she is giving you postive feedbacks that there might be a chance with the two of you. That positive feedback is translating through the act of Flirting. Nature intended flirting behaviour to emmulate interest to develop sexual chemistry in order for sex to occur in a later stage.

However if a woman is flirting with you, she already know deep down if she is going to sleep with you or not and if that's the case she is giving you FAKE FLIRTING signals and as a result a man gets confused from the friendship.

Its much more harder to prove a woman taking advantage of man as oppose to a man taking advantage of a woman.