Am I on the way out?

[Scarlatti]

Hi,

I(32) have been dating her (23) for several months and we have been in a serious relationship since around 3 months ago. Because her parents a very traditional (Chinese) and she is living at home, she can't stay over night or travel with me. But we can meet once or twice a week. When we were still dating I did not care about that but because having a real relationship with her requires her parents' permisson, I agreed on meeting them.

Then things have developed very fast. Her parents somewhat started to accept me, and everytime I meet them they ask me questions about marriage, my finances and so on. They have invited me for dinner several times and I have invited them, too.

My girlfriend has been very happy the last weeks because I am the first person her parents accept. She called me mostly everyday, just to say that she loves me. Two weeks ago she even said that she wants to marry me, last weekend she said that our children would look great. But the following week she did not call anymore, well, only once on Friday. I called her on two days and sent her a message on the third day. Somehow she reacted more cool although she would still say nice things and that she loves me.

On Friday she told me that she has talked a lot with her colleagues about some serious issues concerning marriage. She said she was thinking about what her colleagues said and about my positions on those topics.

Although we then discussed those issues seriously, I am thinking that this was not the real problem. I guess she losing interest because I am too easy to get. I have probably let things happen to fast by agreeing on meeting her parents and playing according to her parents' rules. Actually, I have always said that it is far too early to talk about marriage or something, I met her parents and played to their rules in order to receive some more relationship freedom in return.

Yesterday, we had a date at her parents home, but went to a motel later. In the evening we met her friends and had dinner. She was still kissing, hugging and holding my hands a lot. But I somehow had the feeling that it was more automatic than passionate (maybe a bias).

Any suggestions?

 

[Warrior74]

Everyone else's opinion on this relationship seems more important than yours. And you seem to let it. Of course she's losing attraction.

What her parents think, what her coworkers think, what she thinks. What about what you think? And what issues was she discussing with her coworkers, and why was she discussing your personal business with strangers? That's a gross violation in my book right there. Yah, the bloom is off the rose. Rustle her jimmies a bit and stop being so damn compliant.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Now would be the time that Mom and Dad would pull out every trick they had to set her up with a nice Chinese boy. They are probably calling everyone they know who has a Chinese son and asking them to bring the boy over so they can interview him. I doubt they would ask her, either. I'd guess that's why she has cooled off. They are pressuring her to consider other options.

If you want to marry her, that's up to you. At some point, Dad has to transfer ownership of her from him to you. My biggest fear is that you'd marry her, and then he'd still try to tell you what to do. She is going to eventually have to choose between you and him. And she might never be strong enough to do it.

 

[Scarlatti]

Warrior:
Yeah, that's true. But is there any way to rescue this thing now? I mean, it is difficult to step back now. Of course, I won't call her the next days, I already said that I have had some pressure the last days and I wanna take some days off to think and so on.. but that's probably not enough. Should I reject meetings for some time with some excuse?

Bible Belt: It's her mom in this case. And I told my gf that I am not going to accept her mom's interference into a possible later marriage. But hey, that is far too early to talk about

 

[Warrior74]

I'm gonna be honest and say I don't know. Maybe some other guys here can give you insight. All I know is that sort of behavior makes my blood boil. But I also have a very very short boiling point when it comes to women these days. Personally I would probably start spinning some plates. Spend some time with other women if you have options. You do have options right?

I've never dealt with traditional chinese women or parents, so I don't know how that usually goes. Do they usually marry the person their parents pick out for them?

As for meddling mother in laws, I think every culture has that problem, amiright? lol.

 

[Scarlatti]

No real options. I could date some girls but I am not interested in them, so that psychological trick won't work.

You know what I am thinking now? Why should I want to rescue this thing now? I have already given up too many of my positions. The relationship has been in a state recently that makes me unhappy. I have invited her to overstep my boundaries all the time, I have told her my requirements but scrapped most of them.

Well, I guess I have to make clear now that I am about to leave if things can't be repaired. I am doing this for me, this time.

Thanks Warrior

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Scar,
look Mate Chinese are different....Even those born overseas...I have been involved quite deeply in the Chinese community for six years,the more you know them the less you understand them,but perhaps the more you respect and admire them....The apparent lack of emotion should not be confused with any lack of commitment...Chinese pride themselves on not showing emotion...Now having introduced you to her parents she is committed to you,any retraction at this stage would involve tremendous loss of face...Two things really drive them....Family,and keeping face...your choice

 

[Scarlatti]

Thanks for all the replies.

Ok, there are now several different hypotheses:

1) She is testing me (maybe it was not her who came up with that idea)
2) She is insecure because suddenly a lot of pressure is on her from her parents'/colleagues' side. She does not know whom she should listen to.
3) She really suddenly lost interest because I was to "nice"
4) Maybe she is dating someone else (I don't have any signs for that but could be)

Some evidence points to 1) and 2). Actually, her different behavior coincides with my open statement to her parents that we are a couple. Before that, her parents thought we are "just friends". Even on the same evening we had a talk on the phone later in which she was quite cool. And the next day she did not call me anymore for several days.

But maybe it is also 3). There were some signs of uncertainty before last week. But normally that was only temporarily.

4) I don't have any evidence for that.

As long as I don't know which one is true, I am only waiting. But I hate waiting, I am impatient. But I can also not contact her without knowing what the problem really is.

Despite that, I will have to bring up the "compliance" topic. Even if that uncertainty issue is solved, I won't simply continue with being a nice guy.

 

[GQ Scott]

What were your reactions to her wanting to get married and have kids?

It seems like she/her family is anxious to get her married, and if you didn't seem very enthused about the idea that could be whats turning her off.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Scars,
"1) She is testing me (maybe it was not her who came up with that idea)" Highly unlikely,they are not like that

"2) She is insecure because suddenly a lot of pressure is on her from her parents'/colleagues' side. She does not know whom she should listen to." She knows who to listen to,her Parents,Believe me.

"3) She really suddenly lost interest because I was to "nice"....My thoughts are that unconsciously you said something that offended,her or her parents...As I said they are different.

"4) Maybe she is dating someone else (I don't have any signs for that but could be)" Extremely unlikely....

So just relax,Scars if you want to keep up the good fight she is yours.

 

[Desdinova]

I'll tell you something right now... Her parents, her colleagues, her friends, and anybody else in her life will not have ANY effect on her feelings toward you if she genuinely is attracted to you.

The two biggest things that push women's attraction buttons are fun and confidence. Instead of going to all these fvcking dinners to get interviewed, poked and prodded, take her out and do something fun with her. Show her that no matter what other people say about you, you're a genuinely fun and attractive guy.

Letting everyone else make your relationship complicated and boring is only going to ruin things between the both of you. You NEED to keep the relationship interesting and fun or she's going to back off and let things go stale between the two of you. After that, she will agree with what everyone's telling her and find another guy.

 

[Zarky]

Gotta admit I have no knowledge of that type of relationship. It's not very western, and most guys here are familiar with western-style relationships. You may have to consult people who are familiar with traditional chinese relps.

 

[Scarlatti]

Yeah, I am really trapped in between two ideas: Should I stick to the emotional approach (as Desdinova suggested) or to the Chinese approach (as Scaramouche suggested).

I have some experience with previous Chinese girls and what I have learned from that is that in the end they will simply control their emotions as soon as they notice that romantic feelings cannot match the reality of their family's requirements. One girl was really into me but her parents were against our relationship so she simply said goodbye to me. Blood is thicker than water.

One Western friend married to a Taiwanese woman yesterday gave me the hint that I made the mistake of telling her parents that I am her boyfriend. I should have said something like: "I would like to be her girlfriend if you agree on that".

So it could be what Scaramouche said: I probably said something that offended her.

Yeah, I should relax and stop thinking that much. Thanks for the comments.

 

[Scarlatti]

Actually, now I remember another Chinese girlfriend some years ago who was similar: very passionate and emotional but after some months she became really cool as if she was either losing interest or pretending on purpose. I did my best to keep the relationship interesting but it all didn't work. When I thought it is all too late and I already had lost interest myself, I broke up with her. Guess what, she was terribly crying and saying that she had never loved a guy like she loved me. And even though she was a proud women, she kept trying to get me back (it was too late though).

 

[Desdinova]

It really sounds like the problem isn't with the woman, but with her family and friends. When it comes to spending time with her, you need to keep the attraction up. You also need to make sure that you're not spending all your time with her in the company of other people. You cannot develop a relationship with someone when you've got spectators.

When it comes to interacting with her parents, tone down your behavior with her and subscribe to the chinese way the best you can.

Sometimes you have to be a chameleon and blend in with the situation at hand. My gf's not religious, but her parents are EXTREMELY religious. I don't buy into it, but I will bow my head in prayer before a meal, tell them that I do believe in God (but shrug off attending their church), and I won't kiss my gf in front of them.

There are many cases where you need to be respectful toward the family and even go along with their traditions. If you have no problem with doing this, then you should be fine. Just remember that you're not in the relationship with them; you're in the relationship with your gf. You NEED to put your priority on maintaining that relationship first.

 

[mikey2012]

Dude if she likes you enuf she will find a way to be with you even if you are Wesley Snipes twin.

 

[Scarlatti]

Well, I am now pretty much sure that she behaved that cold because of the influence of her co-workers and parents. They all told her something like "If he really loves you why doesn't he.." and a lot of nonsense. I got very angry because I think those people are not qualified to judge me. And because I was in a bad mood anyway I also told her that I expect some action on her side after I have put so much effort into family relations.

I don't know if starting a fight was the right idea but now she somehow seems to be nervous that I could leave. And I am really thinking about doing so because I won't accept a threesome or foursome after marriage (we plus her parents). I am quite pissed off everytime I think of family issues. I don't wanna see her parents now.

I know I can't act against the family in Chinese culture and that's not what I want. But the problem here are also the control issues of her parents and that's also a psychological not only a cultural problem. It's really extreme in this case (I had other Chinese gfs before).

Anyway, that's just an update.

 

[Bible_Belt]

I am quite pissed off everytime I think of family issues. I don't wanna see her parents now.

That is completely understandable. I would feel the same way. I think anybody would.

However, if you want to keep the girl, I think you have to go charm her mom. Take a week or two and pretend like it is her mom that you are trying to fvck. Talk to her, spend time with her, and don't go away when she is rude to you. Hang out at their house. Be there for dinner. Hell, help them cook dinner. That's what they want to see out of you, and that's what you have to do to win their favor, which is what you have to do to keep the girl. But it's up to you to decide if it's all worth the effort.

 

[Naughty Ninja]

I would get the hell out of dodge. I couldn't give a damn if the chick was full blown American, Westernized, Foreign etc. You can't be expected to please everyone to please her.

You're dating a chick who's worried more about what her parents,friends, co-workers and everyone else thinks about a relationship that's supposed to consist of two people.

You marry this chick and you are marrying her family. What happens anytime something goes wrong or you don't make enough money at some point? It's "your" fault will be the answer.

This should serve as a wakeup call to posters who think (not that you did) going overseas to find some 'submissive' Asian or foreign chick is going to cure their problems. They have their own cultures and way of doing things. If you feel comfortable being the "If he loves you why doesn't he whipping boy" in a 'relationship' let alone marriage. Good luck with that.

 

[Scarlatti]

That's what they want to see out of you, and that's what you have to do to win their favor, which is what you have to do to keep the girl. But it's up to you to decide if it's all worth the effort.

Yeah, I have done all that and it works. I am not concerned about the now but about later. I am sure her parents will simply continue controlling their daughter no matter how old she is. And if I don't wanna comply with what her parents want then she will be very unhappy.

This should serve as a wakeup call to posters who think (not that you did) going overseas to find some 'submissive' Asian or foreign chick is going to cure their problems. They have their own cultures and way of doing things. If you feel comfortable being the "If he loves you why doesn't he whipping boy" in a 'relationship' let alone marriage. Good luck with that.

Well, there is some truth in your words. I had Japanese girlfriends, Chinese and Taiwanese girlfriends. And I can say: There is no free lunch. You get something, you have to give something if you are serious.