A Pitfall of Online Dating

[Sargeholic]

Recently, I have come up with a theory.

Online dating, while very easy to get phone numbers and phone calls and even first dates, is very difficult to progress to future dates and sex. The party line around here and ASF is that this is because of the "dating frame", but I disagree. The problem is competition and the numbers game.

I have gotten about a half dozen online lays in the past year, but it is super flaky. Most of my first dates do not lead to second dates, even if I do very well on them. I have had dates where I know I performed well, and it didn't matter. On the other hand, I have f-closed every single girl I have gotten to meet up with me from a cold approach. Sure, it can be tougher to get these girls on the phone, get them to meet up, but once they do, its pretty much game over. I don't even need my A game, a couple of these have been really half hearted "come watch a movie over here" first dates. The reason for this is:

When women are doing the online dating thing, they have WAY more options than those who are not. The chances are that a girl who is not actively looking really has very few concrete options, even if she is very attractive. She may have given out a number or two, or have an orbiter or two at the office or something, but not the lineup of 20 guys that the average online girl has. This is even more true if she is not a "party girl" or is over the age of 25. Sure, she could go down to the bar and pick up a guy at the snap of her fingers, but for the average girl who is not using a Match.com type service, she really doesn't date a whole lot. Its actually rare for the average person to go on a date more often than once or twice a month, outside of serial online daters.

A 6 online has more "concrete" options on the go than a 9 offline.

When you meet up with that girl from Match (which is pretty damn easy to do) she knows in the back of her mind, even if she isn't that hot, that she has four more dates lined up this week. When you call her for that second date and beyond, you are trying to wedge yourself into this lineup. A 6 in this frame can be way pickier than an 8 or a 9 in "real life". Hell, I am a guy, and I know in the back of my mind that I have 10 dates lined up after her, and my schedule is booked solid for the next week. It smokes out neediness, but it also is not healthy in the budding stages of a relationship.

Think of it this way...what is an easier job to get? An entry level job with one opening, but 100 resumes and 20 interviewees, or a senior managerial job where you and maybe one other person are applying? You probably have better odds at picking up the senior position, even if your qualifications fall a bit short.

Online dating has been great for me in many ways, and yes, I have made it work at times. However, I have come to the conclusion that it creates an artificial environment of serial daters which makes both women and men overly picky, and ultimately stunts the development of normal relationships. Street and club PU are much harder and more frustrating in the short run, but they are much higher percentage in the long run and the absence of one-and-done dates is a lot easier and less time consuming.

 

[thederekeffect1]

Call me old fashioned, but I never really got into the whole online dating thing. Exchanging e-mails, instant messaging screenames, etc. I just don't get into it. In fact, I tell women that I don't have a computer. If they see it later on then I just simply tell them that I'm not big on using it.

 

[Eccentric]

This isn't a direct repsonse, just a general view.

I see it like this:

If you're out with your buddies, and you see some attractive girls, you're thinking "lets go talk to them." Ok, you make your move. She may not be perfect, but you made your move and things are working for now. Do you want to start nit-picking little things? Hell no. Keep it up, and you can get laid. Even if you leave with a phone #, you did great in the most basic sense. Attraction was made face to face.

Online is a different story. Seduction through AIM/email? Sure she may be flirting, using smiley and kissing faces every other line, but what's her body language say? You have no idea. She uses "muah" as a kiss. Who's not to say she doesn't do that with everyone? Is she overly friendly, or is your game working? Again, no idea. For all you know she's making plans on the phone with some guy, while she's typing away, and you're getting your hopes up.

Now what about looks? You don't have that 3 second window, or encouragement of the moment to make a move like you were in public. So you sit there and pick out little details that you wouldn't give 2 ****s about at a bar. You'd be lame if you banged a 6 from the internet, but it would be ok if it was from a cold approach. You only want an 8 or 9. This is the internet, so you have your pick. So you browse and browse for only the best. If and when you meet it maybe awkward, or you may have the best sex ever. 50/50, because the only contact you had is through text, and maybe a phone call or 2. Is her picture old, how much has she changed (if any)?

Online sites may give you a few results here and there, but you cant accurately base your success with women because you had a "ONS" with a MySpacer or whatever. I won't lie, I've had some hook ups. Nothing I'm really proud about though. Datings best analogy would be baseball. I think online dating is played on paper, dating "in person" is played on the field.

I'd rather be with the hottie who doesn't live vicariously through online dating. Sure it maybe rough times, and a place to turn, but it's not a long term solution. The REAL issue isn't about getting laid, it's about DEVELOPING the confidence and mental mind to become comfortable around women and become a man. Whether or not you want you sex is up to your personal efforts. Sites like this are here to help overcome fears, not hide from them while we chase the same outcome. Sure if you send out dozens of friend requests, write C&F blogs, run bulletin sets and leave quirky comments, you can get laid. Hell you could get laid 100 times.

What happens when you don't have a SN or a monitor to hide behind? Can you honestly say to yourself that you'd approach a group of HB 8&9's, pick out the best and work your charm? Would you have her and her friends eating out of your palm? Or would you be a dud because you don't have the safety net like an AIM convo to think your response through?

Closing statement:

If you can pick up that 9, then why the hell are you wasting time meeting girls online in the first place? If you want to be able to pick up that 9, well the game is played in the field, not over the internet. Unless you favor bandaids over stitches.

 

[Soprano]

online dating = dating simulator

 

[Wyldfire]

The first post is pretty true about online dating. Both the men and women tend to try to juggle too many people at once and it makes it virtually impossible to get to know any of them very well.

I did the online dating thing here and there but I didn't try to juggle a whole slew of guys at once. In fact...I would only agree to meet the ones I was very interested in getting to know better...and I would not agree to meet anyone else until after I had met the first guy. The funniest part of that is when another guy would ask me to meet them I said that I wanted to meet the first guy I accepted a date with before I scheduled anything else...and they would get all mad at me over it. I have never been someone to date more than one person at a time. As it is I never accept a date offer unless I think I might want to keep seeing them. I found that people do a lot of lying and embellishing about themselves online. A lot of women do that too from what I hear.

What the first poster described reminds me of this one guy I went out with one time. We exchanged a couple of emails and I gave him my cell phone number. He called me and I was charging the phone and missed the call. I called him right back once I saw he had called and he mistook me for some woman he was waiting to meet right then. When he realized it was me he tried to hide the fact that he was supposed to meet up with another woman and lied to me. That rubbed me the wrong way. This was the first time we had spoken on the phone and there would be no reason for him to try to hide that he was meeting up with someone else. We hadn't even had a date yet. I gave him the benefit of the doubt and figured he just didn't want to screw up his chances and decided to give him a chance to redeem himself. So, I told him that if he got back from what he was doing before it was too late to give me a call and I would meet him at a karaoke bar I sometimes used to go to. He called back a little over a half hour later and said "My friend called and he couldn't make it, so I'm heading back now...wanna meet in an hour?" So...the woman he was supposed to meet was a no show. We met and hit it off well, had good chemistry and I was thinking that I'd like to get to know him a little better...but I wasn't sure if I wanted to get involved with him yet because of that lie earlier. I had to get to know him better to figure out if the lying was a pattern. So, after a couple of hours talking he said he promised his friends he would stop in at another bar nearby, so he said he needed to run over for a few minutes and he'd be back shortly. My gut instinct said...he probably told some other woman he'd try to meet her there too...let's see if he comes back. I waited 45 minutes and then left. He met me in the parking lot just as I walked out. He apologized for taking so long and asked me if we could go back to my place. I declined and said I don't bring dates home around my children. He didn't try to invite me to his place, either. A red flag shot up at that point...the guy probably had either a wife or a girlfriend at home. He asked me if I would like to go to lunch the next day and said I was the only woman he'd met from online dating who actually really looked like the picture they showed him and he really wanted to see me again and get to know me better. He asked me to call him at 11am the next morning to set a time and place to go for lunch. So...I call him as I said I would and lo and behold...he AGAIN mistook me for some other woman he was supposed to be meeting right then who did not show up. I told him no, I'm not her...and told him who I was. He tried to lie again and this time we were supposed to have a lunch date and he was off getting stood up yet again. That was enough of him for me. I hung up on him mid lie and refused to even speak to him after that. He kept calling and leaving messages apologizing and saying how much he had liked me and how badly he felt. Oh well...he was so wrapped up in trying to meet as many online women as quickly as he could that he majorly turned off the only one who looked like the photo and showed up, and called him back. He was attractive and had a lot going for him...but all the lying and juggling and lack of follow through took my interest from high to negative numbers in less than 12 hours.

Men and women who use the dating sites often do the same thing...they try to cram so many new people into their dating line up that they never really get to know anyone at all. If you're going to use online dating...ask the person if they try to meet a lot of people at once or if they get to know the people they meet one at a time. If it's one at a time, those are the ones you'll have better luck with. If you can weed out the serial daters there can be some good people you can meet.

 

[Sargeholic]

Its odd too, because I have had girls online during first dates in the last few months who have:

• Openly told me how much fun they were having.
  
• Openly told me how pleasantly surprised they were with me.
  
• Openly told me I was good looking.
  
• Bought me dinner.
  
• Talked extensively about future dates and plans with me.
  
• Spent almost two hours talking to me in the street in the cold at her car at the end of the date--not leaving.
  
• Made out with me (several).
  
• Had sex with me (a couple).

All of these girls I never saw again. Sure, I called, but they all of a sudden became extremely "busy". Most of my friends, female and male, typically go on 1-3 dates (not from online), keep seeing one of the girls (guys), and he or she becomes his girlfriend/boyfriend. This is how it was for me before I got involved in online too. My offline experiences have been this way as well--if i get a date (admittedly much harder offline) its there for keeps as long as I don't act like a total freak.

I get freakish IOIs on first dates (or so you would think) but then nothing. Its not normal. Every one of my friends, some several years older than me, say I have been on more dates the past 9 months than in their entire lives, and I have not gotten even close to a girlfriend yet. Its bizarre, and when comparing it to offline outcomes, I have to think its something intrinsically wrong with the online dating process.

 

[Broham]

I completely agree with you. Something is wrong here, and its completely bass-ackwards. The last girl I met off of myspace, I f-ed on the first date. She kept telling me how much she loved it and that she was on cloud nine. We went on a second date, f-ed AGAIN, same thing and then a few days later she didnt return my calls. This is what she just e-mailed me:

"When you first start dating someone, you're supposed to try to impress each other. A gentleman would treat his date to dinner, drinks or whatever. I didn't expect anything more than that. I was giving you a second chance when I went out with you again. "The benefit of the doubt." I should have trusted my gut on this one."

She was giving me a "second chance"? I will NEVER understand women, ever.

 

[mrRuckus]

If you can pick up that 9, then why the hell are you wasting time meeting girls online in the first place? If you want to be able to pick up that 9, well the game is played in the field, not over the internet. Unless you favor bandaids over stitches.

Because not everyone lives in a place where attractive women are walking around all day. The women are at home watching tv and playing on the computer.

The only place i personally ever see them is at the bar and how many stories about how mommy met daddy start with "well, we were at the bar and..." Fine get laid at the bar but have anything meaningful? Meh.

 

[mrRuckus]

"When you first start dating someone, you're supposed to try to impress each other. A gentleman would treat his date to dinner, drinks or whatever. I didn't expect anything more than that. I was giving you a second chance when I went out with you again. "The benefit of the doubt." I should have trusted my gut on this one."

She was giving me a "second chance"? I will NEVER understand women, ever.

Good riddance. Who wants a princess? Who wants to have to impress someone?

Id much rather a girl just act herself to begin with instead of me wasting away months to find out she really doesnt want so much sex and dresses like sh1t usually.

 

[Wyldfire]

Good riddance. Who wants a princess? Who wants to have to impress someone?

Id much rather a girl just act herself to begin with instead of me wasting away months to find out she really doesnt want so much sex and dresses like sh1t usually.

Go read the thread he started about her calling him cheap. She had sex with him on both dates and he made her pay for her own dinner on the second date. Stupid girl had sex with him again after that. Then he must have left some beer at her house or something and emailed her that he wanted it back. She's right...he is cheap and no one should really blame her for not wanting to see him again. Christ, if she's going to have sex with a guy that quick he should at least treat her to a goddamned meal. If she wants to have sex with random guys she meets online she may as well opt for a guy who will at least pay for her dinner.

 

[Sargeholic]

There already was another thread created for this topic, as she said. Please don't hijack mine in yet another SoSuave vs. the Devil's Advocate urinating contest. Lets stay on topic with people's experiences with the fickleness of online dating.

 

[Wyldfire]

There already was another thread created for this topic, as she said. Please don't hijack mine in yet another SoSuave vs. the Devil's Advocate urinating contest. Lets stay on topic with people's experiences with the fickleness of online dating.

Agreed...I mentioned it because he sorta misrepresented how things played out as if she had no reason to stop seeing him when she actually came right out and told him he was cheap.

 

[Wyldfire]

Espi...I posted on the thread I referred to...I'll respond to whatever you want to say about that topic over there. It's right in this section.

And back on topic...

My online dating history consists of a kinda cute guy who dressed like a hick, chain smoked and never washed out his coffee cup. He was too eager, smoked too much and the coffee cup things was just plain gross. The next guy I dated was actually a decent guy except he had some anxiety over me having kids. I stopped seeing him for that reason. The next guy was the most pathetic lump of lactating puss-man I ever met...and he had hair sprouting out of his collar...this guy went to his ex's house and freaking cooked dinner for her and the guy she cheated on him with...GAH! The next one didn't have a picture and I told myself after lactating hairy collar boy that I wasn't going to meet anyone without a picture again...but like a dumbass I did. This guy lied about his appearance. He wasn't fat or anything...but he had a unibrow and one googly eye that had a mind of it's own. I couldn't even look at the guy it was so bad. He had to use the bathroom and I hightailed it out of there like greased lightning. Then I went out with that guy who kept thinking I was some chick that was standing him up one time. The last one was the lawyer who was boring as hell and came across as kinda feminine. Those were over a period of about 4 years. I haven't met anyone from a dating site in about two years now.

 

[Eccentric]

Because not everyone lives in a place where attractive women are walking around all day. The women are at home watching tv and playing on the computer.

The only place i personally ever see them is at the bar and how many stories about how mommy met daddy start with "well, we were at the bar and..." Fine get laid at the bar but have anything meaningful? Meh.

You don't have to meet people in a bar for it to be meaningful. Beautiful women are everywhere. Why limit yourself to online dating, just because a possible result is 1 click away? I see pretty girls everywhere. Drug stores, Dunkin Donuts, restaurants, the gym, if you're in college - try the library, lounges, dorm parties. Downtown, shopping centers, clubs, bars, beaches, cafes, bookstores, hell even Bed & Bath when I was buying pillows. If you feel that no pretty girls are in your city, why track some down online when you can take a drive to the next city and start to hang out there?

Meaningful relationships don't happen overnight. Commitment and trust are key. The other stuff is just gravy. I don't go somewhere with the mindset to find a LTR. I go with the mindset to have a great time. If I meet a girl, great, my night got better. Now I could have sex the first night, but does that mean we cant click a month or so down the road? No girl upon first contact will invite you with open arms to be her BF. You see each other for a while first, if things are going good, then you decide to "date." But going out getting laid, then calling her for next week doesn't mean you're dating. You may have A date, but you'd be stupid to think that after 1 or 2 weeks she's yours. You set yourself up to fall that way, and she can drop you like a ton of bricks. Lets say 4 or 5 weeks down the line you're out with her 3 or 4 nights a week. Then you can look at it in a different light.

 

[TxCowboy]

I used to be cool with online dating...Fuk, I even made a thread on it called "Effective Tactics to use on Friendster and Myspace"..

But I've gotten a lot more advanced since then...and I'll tell you right now..Dude, it's just a lot easier to approach REAL women.

There's a lot of sea donkeys on the Internet.

This is the definition of a sea donkey.

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=sea+donkey

Man, there's just a lot of weird problems that happen with online dating. First of all, have any of you SEEN the True or Match online ads? god damn! them women on them ads don't look look like the women on the actual site. They should be shot for making fake ads like that. They be ugly azz bytches. You feel me?

I think online dating is only aight...if you're shy and DON'T KNOW how to approach women. For those of you who LIKE online dating....HEY, I used to think just like YOU!. I even made a post DEFENDING online dating...Now I regret that shyt..cuz I KNOW what's the real deal. Just grab some ballz and ask the breezy...Don't be playing guessing games on the online dating steelo.

Hopefully, in the future the ONLINE dating will evolve into a better and easier place to pick up chicks - we're not they're yet! .... In the mean time ... you gotta get some ballz like "KillaPetehog" said and just talk to girls and dont be afraid of them ...