A New Paradigm On The Nice Guy

[SinJester]

Almost all of us used to be 'nice guys', right?

And because of that, the fact that we were too 'nice' we didn't get any girls. Right?

I think that's bullsh!t. Most of us were not truly nice to begin with.

There's a huge difference between the nice guy (AFC) and a nice guy (the good guy).

I now think that nice guys and PUAs are fundamentally the same. At the core there is very little difference.

Let me explain.

'Nice guys' were never nice to begin with. They don't give gifts and compliments to girls because out of the bottom of their heart they just want them to feel good. They do it because they think it will make the girl like them. It is what they think the girl actually wants. Rather than being themselves they try to put up this image, and pretend to be what they think the girls want (a nice guy). It is really rather manipulative. Hell don't get me started on bribing girls with gifts and compliments, trying to buy her.

Honestly think how manipulative it is to try and be friends with a girl first in order to get into her pants. That's horrible! Sure even if you thought it was 'love' in reality it was probably just lust.

The only reason 'nice guys' seem so nice, and not manipulative, is because it doesn't work! If it did we would all be calling them players!

How does this compare to the PUA?

He uses lines and routines because he thinks that's what women really want. Instead of compliments he gives out ****y/funny lines. Instead of gifts he gives negs. Rather than being themselves they try to put up this image, and pretend to be what they think the girls want (a pua or player). It's really rather manipulative. They just craft themselves around what they think girls want and try to be that guy.

The only difference between them and the nice guy is that it might actually work!

Can you see how they are fundamentally the same now? Both the PUA and the nice guy are not being themselves. They are both trying to be what they think girls want. They are both trying to get the girl to like them rather than actually thinking about her. Although the results may differ the intent is the same.

Now I'm not saying that this is always the case. Maybe you were a genuinely nice guy and cared a lot about what the girl was going through. Maybe you liked her as much for her personality as her looks. I believe that we are always trying to do the right thing, no matter how that comes across.

The DJ on the other hand has the possibility of being something else. Now personally for a long time when I first found this site I was more like the PUA I described. I never used routines or anything like that, but all of the knowledge I found on here was only using it as a means to try and attract girls. I was just trying to craft an act that would do that. So I'm assuming a lot of people do this too. However after awhile I realized that there was more too it, and I think I am now on the path to being a real DJ.

In my definition 'real' DJ is not someone who puts on an act. He doesn't try to be something he is not. What he aims at is decided by his own values, not by what he thinks women want. He may aim to change but he aims at actually becoming that, not just faking it. He realizes that not being true to yourself slowly drains your self-esteem. He does good things for people, but not because he is trying to win them over. Ironically this makes him far more attractive than the PUA or the 'nice guy'. This is the true definition of the DJ, and if you look you will find it in all the classic posts, however I think it can be misinterpreted by people who don't have those beliefs yet.

I think that women act somewhat as mirrors. They can make us realize that we aren't living up to our full potential. I once heard:

"We've all heard that behind every great man is a great woman. I think that that is always the woman that he didn't marry"

By failing with women it allows us to see if we are failing in the rest of our lives and enables us to get our act in to gear. We can actually transform rather than putting up an act. We can change our lives rather than just pretending to. We can find real confidence rather than faking it with our body language.

When I first started reading the DJ Bible I thought I couldn't be nice to girls or they wouldn't like me. Now I realize when I'm coming place of authenticity I can do that, and is actually what most women want. It's not trying to get anything, it isn't fake, it's being myself. On the other hand I wont be nice when it is compromising my values. I won't take her side in the argument if i disagree with it. Instead of putting an act, I want to let people see the real me. If they don't like that it's ok, they aren't people I want in my life right now.

The problem I now have with 'be your best self' is that it made me think I had to go on a journey years long to improve myself before any girl would like me. That's bull****. Aim for that, but don't wait. The journey is your whole life. Just by striving to be your best self, you become your best self.

 

[magickarl]

I've had this attitude for a long time now.

It's been a misconception for too long that DJ and PUA are synonyms.

PUA = Acting like the type of guy a woman wants to be with.

HE IS AN ADVOCATE OF ****Y/FUNNY

- He generally has a few friends, and a lot of acquaintances. People
have mixed things to say about him. At heart he doesn't have confidence
so much as swagger. He likes to make randy jokes and show off a lot.
He tries really hard to be an Eagle (a DJ), but has the wrong ideas and comes off as a Peacock (PUA), and doesn't want to go back to being a Chicken (AFC)

DJ = Being the type of guy a woman wants to be with. Not because he cares
if the ladies love him or not, but because he wants to be the best man that he can be.

THE DJ IS AN ADVOCATE OF CONFIDENT/FUNNY

The DJ is in pursuit of inner happiness and realized that it doesn't come
from women. Ladies are just icing on the cake. Whats more is that he sees
people as people and not just vaginas and penises. When he does a good or a nice thing, it's not because he is trying to impress anybody or get something out of them. It's because he is a genuinely happy person, enough so that he wishes others could be as happy as he is. He is the kind of man that leaves a tip on the table UNDER the check, and does it discreetly. He tries not to curse in public, and doesn't talk behind peoples backs. In fact, he tries not to run his mouth in front of people either. That is because the DJ has class.

People generally have nothing bad to say about the DJ, just good things and fond memories of how much of a funny, charming, respectable man he is. Men want to be him, women want to be with him, and regardless of gender people want to be around him because he makes them feel good about themselves.

 

[jacob]

tru dat. giving and not expecting anything in return makes you super attractive and unforgettable. My ex did that to me I miss her like hell. Also I wish I did more for her if not for the techniques were they suggest that you don't spend or splurge on a woman, if I could do it all over again I'd give her my all without expectations just like she did to me.

 

[daygameguy]

All PUAs are DJs after an year of practice.

PUAs become ultimately better DJs than the others as they are more in control, and more aware of what they are doing.

 

[magickarl]

^

Sorry, I've got to disagree

I suppose it all depends on how you define PUA and DJ, but to me...


A PUA is a watered down version of a DJ.

STEVE STIFLER FROM AMERICAN PIE WAS A PUA.
JAMES BOND WAS A DJ

get my drift?

So...

Thats kind of like saying that anyone who takes Karate class for a year is good at fighting.

Actually, thats nothing like it. This is closer:

If you mimic for a year, you are the thing you are imitating.

Actually, its exactly like saying:

Anyone who can act ****y, have a basic understanding of body-language, gets over the fear of rejection, and learns basic concepts of interacting with a female will be well on the path to self actualization in one year.


You can't put a timeline on becoming a DJ. There are plenty of people on this forum who have been trying these PU tactics for years, and are still unsuccessful with women, and some that are still yet to have sex with a woman.

Whats more is that some of these PUA's who do bag women are still unhappy with life, lack confidence in themselves, and get so caught up in the details of exactly what to say or do that it takes all of the FUN out of being with women in the first place.

Maybe I'm way off base here, but to me a PUA translates to anybody who can imitate what a woman wants closely enough that she takes the bait.

PUA :: DJ
as
Crystal Palace :: Grey Goose

I will concede that a PUA is more successful with the ladies than your average guy any day of the week. But a true DJ is not only successful with the ladies, but successful in life. He is happy with who he is, and where he is going, and could be happy for the rest of his life if all of the women on the planet disappeared overnight.

 

[Wynston]

That is so true man... Yet when I was an AFC (nice guy) I used to do things 1. cos I thought they wanted me to do and 2. I used to enjoy seeing their faces and hoped other guys had never thought of that, so a bit of both really...

An AFC will say all the wrong things to try to win a girl
A PUA will say all the right things to try to win a girl
A DJ will say "Look how glorious I am" and girls will try to win him..

So AFC and PUA are more or less the same its just words that make him different. A DJ is a way of life not words, an epiphany, a transformation of beliefs and ethic... An awakening of a man from a boy!!

 

[SXS]

In the end I think the key is REAL indifference. Thats what I Ithink you should do. The guys I know who becomes bitter towards women are the ones who try to please them or invest on them, and them when things dont come their way, they become angry.
I used to like Ddeangelo a lot, but now I think he is dead wrong on his phylosophy. He honestly thinks that hot women like mature men, or what some like to call "real men", and that women have some kind of extra sense who tells them instantly who are the good ones and who are not. In the end, he just teaches you how to "please" a woman in a non tradicional way.
I now just think that women cannot be taken seriously(most men can't either), and this is because I have seen everything in this world. So being indifferent is the best thing you can do. There are always other girls, so investing your time or anything else, or trying to win their aproval is the worst thing you can do in your life.
I do whatever I want, whenever I want. I pick whatever comes my way, and don't think about it. I have already a lot to worry about in life...