The Danger Of Girls With Many Male Friends?

[Serenity]

There is no such thing as a keeper man.

If this is your belief then I don't see why you'd even bother with a relationship, I wouldn't.

ALL woman are suseptable to cheating, monkey branching, given the right conditions & circumstances.

Half truth. Keep in mind that several conditions and circumstances are within your control and are your responsibility. If you're an inadequate man it shouldn't come as a surprise if she leaves. I would correct this to "NO woman will remain faithful through ALL conditions and circumstances", they also have boundaries.

Literally TONS of men have been with chicks who they felt where a KEEPER & got screwed over by her monkey branching

Literally TONS of men have poor judgement. I have no doubt a lot of men think they found a keeper and wholeheartedly believe so, but many didn't do their due diligence of challenging their beliefs adequately to make sure it's true.

Good woman are divorcing good men at unprecedented rates in the West

One or both of them weren't good, otherwise there wouldn't be a divorce. While they may believe so about themselves, at least one of them made at least one bad decision at some point leading up to that result. It's a lot more complex than you're making it out to be, what you're presenting is just a small sliver of a lot of different reasons people go for divorce. It's more often tied to poor choices in the past than temptations in the future.

The temptation to "slip onto Tyrone's d!ck" is symptom, the causes of said symptom would kill the relationship either way. Typically the problems that causes cheating have very often built up over a long time without being properly resolved. It typically doesn't just happen out of the blue.

We can never stop a woman from cheating, all we can do as men is, to minimize the risk of it happening by setting firm boundaries.

Boundaries are not enough. You can set all the boundaries in the world, but if you don't proactively maintain a good relationship and bond then she is going to leave your ass whether that's through cheating, branch swinging or simply just leaving because being alone is better than being with you.

Too strict boundaries will work against your interests as well as it can hurt the bond, she'll feel too restricted and ultimately unhappy being with you. Thus INCREASING the chance she'll cheat, swing or leave. You gotta be mindful of what boundaries you put up. Restricting others social contact is generally regarded as a red flag for a controlling/jealous type person, is a sign of mistrust and disliked by most people.

 

[NealIRC]

BeExcellent, has derailed the entire topic discussion just talking about her own damn self,
showboating around and telling the world how spectacular she is and how well adjusted
and healthy the world surrounding her is. And how everyone is so messed up except her
and her perfect social circle of perfection.

It was entertaining though. Like reading the National Enquirer.

But she's right. You're all bummed insecure about women having guy friends.

 

[soulforge]

If this is your belief then I don't see why you'd even bother with a relationship, I wouldn't.


Half truth. Keep in mind that several conditions and circumstances are within your control and are your responsibility. If you're an inadequate man it shouldn't come as a surprise if she leaves. I would correct this to "NO woman will remain faithful through ALL conditions and circumstances", they also have boundaries.


Literally TONS of men have poor judgement. I have no doubt a lot of men think they found a keeper and wholeheartedly believe so, but many didn't do their due diligence of challenging their beliefs adequately to make sure it's true.


One or both of them weren't good, otherwise there wouldn't be a divorce. While they may believe so about themselves, at least one of them made at least one bad decision at some point leading up to that result. It's a lot more complex than you're making it out to be, what you're presenting is just a small sliver of a lot of different reasons people go for divorce. It's more often tied to poor choices in the past than temptations in the future.

The temptation to "slip onto Tyrone's d!ck" is symptom, the causes of said symptom would kill the relationship either way. Typically the problems that causes cheating have very often built up over a long time without being properly resolved. It typically doesn't just happen out of the blue.


Boundaries are not enough. You can set all the boundaries in the world, but if you don't proactively maintain a good relationship and bond then she is going to leave your ass whether that's through cheating, branch swinging or simply just leaving because being alone is better than being with you.

Too strict boundaries will work against your interests as well as it can hurt the bond, she'll feel too restricted and ultimately unhappy being with you. Thus INCREASING the chance she'll cheat, swing or leave. You gotta be mindful of what boundaries you put up. Restricting others social contact is generally regarded as a red flag for a controlling/jealous type person, is a sign of mistrust and disliked by most people.

I agree having way too many boundaries is going to be couter productive.

But the no male friends boundaries is something most men would apply & I believe it's a reasonable boundary.

 

[Serenity]

But the no male friends boundaries is something most men would apply & I believe it's a reasonable boundary.

I think it's a boundary that flags your own insecurity and/or lack of trust which is ultimately unnecessary if the woman in question is worth anything.

I don't have much more to add here, I've said what I have to say about it. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on it.

 

[member162951]

But the no male friends boundaries is something most men would apply & I believe it's a reasonable boundary.

I think it's a bit heavy-handed @soulforge
and in her mind, would (or might) reflect insecurity.

If her having no male friends/orbiters is important to you, find a girl who doesn't (not all women do despite what you think). There are some single women who find orbiters a huge PITA, they're all over her, asking her out, making sexual overtures or otherwise acting thirsty.

OR if she does, would distance herself from them on her own when she starts exclusively dating you, without you having to force her hand to do so. Those are the women you want imo. Not the ones who have to be told. That could very well come back and bite you in the ass eventually.

 

[soulforge]

I think it's a bit heavy-handed @soulforge
and in her mind, would (or might) reflect insecurity.

If her having no male friends/orbiters is important to you, find a girl who doesn't (not all women do despite what you think).

OR if she does, would distance herself from them on her own when she starts exclusively dating you, without you having to force her hand to do so.

Those are the women you want imo. Not the ones who have to be told. That could very well come back and bite you in the ass.

I agree with you. I have changed my mind on this recently.

If a girl is naturally inclined to have many dudes around her, it's best to let her be, and not get involved with her or try to change her.

It's better to find someone who doesn't bring this as an issue to your doorstep in the first place.

Remember there is a difference between a girl having one or two dude freinds & the girl who has a whole rosta of dude freinds and associates.

 

[CountSuavula]

Some of you guys are something else.

Most women need to be told how to behave and they adapt to whatever you say or they just break it off if it disagrees with them. In committed relationships they need to be told what you find acceptable and the two of you have those discussions.

A lot of you must be 20 years old or less. Eventually you have long term girlfriends and you have wives and you see enough of your own relationships to know what is expected.

Women practically always have more flexibility in following a man. They follow his clothes, his interests, his food, his entire lifestyle melds into her like butter. The second she ditches the guy, she suddenly takes on new traits of another guy.

You guys keep sticking up for the Peter Pan lifestyle and the wonderful world of Disney. When you shack up with a women or in a committed relationship, she knows the Peter Pan guy friends need to go bye bye.

It‘s often dictated by the man and woman by conversations. There’s not many relationship conversations that a woman cannot handle. It is up to the man to open up the floor about this whole Peter Pan lifestyle and tell her it won’t fly.

Heck maybe the two of you are just both young and dumb Peter Pans who want to learn the hard way. But the magical world of Disney is not going to refund your money after that hoe decides to go back to the annoying guys who are her “best friends“.

That includes the silly gay dudes she says are “just my friends”. Listen, the truth is most of her single pals were for that temporary stage of single life. Once she has a man they all know it means a change of pace and a change in lifestyles and people.

Then there is the immaturity factor. If she is some bipolar, off her meds, dad committed suicide when she was 13, and she just got out of rehab 6 months ago, she’s not going to be Allowed to hang out with her ex best guy friend who happens to deal coke too. It is just common sense relationship building,

Most women might gripe about having some man who says No, you can’t hang out with that dude anymore, but the truth is women like having a relationship building exercise like that to display you have some backbone.

It’s not like she will be stuck in no friend land forever because she can call all the losers and the abusers once you two break up, every loser and user guy she ever had clinging to her will be back hanging out together again once you are out of the picture.

man you guys have this “It means that you are controlling and insecure“ BS all wrong. It’s not like that. It’s called relationship building and moving on from her singledom friends. It is making a new life together and selecting which relationships are not useful.

 

[member162951]

Some of you guys are something else.

Most women need to be told how to behave and they adapt to whatever you say or they just break it off if it disagrees with them. In committed relationships they need to be told what you find acceptable and the two of you have those discussions.

A lot of you must be 20 years old or less. Eventually you have long term girlfriends and you have wives and you see enough of your own relationships to know what is expected.

Women practically always have more flexibility in following a man. They follow his clothes, his interests, his food, his entire lifestyle melds into her like butter. The second she ditches the guy, she suddenly takes on new traits of another guy.

You guys keep sticking up for the Peter Pan lifestyle and the wonderful world of Disney. When you shack up with a women or in a committed relationship, she knows the Peter Pan guy friends need to go bye bye.

It‘s often dictated by the man and woman by conversations. There’s not many relationship conversations that a woman cannot handle. It is up to the man to open up the floor about this whole Peter Pan lifestyle and tell her it won’t fly.

Heck maybe the two of you are just both young and dumb Peter Pans who want to learn the hard way. But the magical world of Disney is not going to refund your money after that hoe decides to go back to the annoying guys who are her “best friends“.

That includes the silly gay dudes she says are “just my friends”. Listen, the truth is most of her single pals were for that temporary stage of single life. Once she has a man they all know it means a change of pace and a change in lifestyles and people.

Then there is the immaturity factor. If she is some bipolar, off her meds, dad committed suicide when she was 13, and she just got out of rehab 6 months ago, she’s not going to be Allowed to hang out with her ex best guy friend who happens to deal coke too. It is just common sense relationship building,

Most women might gripe about having some man who says No, you can’t hang out with that dude anymore, but the truth is women like having a relationship building exercise like that to display you have some backbone.

It’s not like she will be stuck in no friend land forever because she can call all the losers and the abusers once you two break up, every loser and user guy she ever had clinging to her will be back hanging out together again once you are out of the picture.

man you guys have this “It means that you are controlling and insecure“ BS all wrong. It’s not like that. It’s called relationship building and moving on from her singledom friends. It is making a new life together and selecting which relationships are not useful.

LOL, who are you? You just joined four days ago and sure have a lot to say don't ya. I bet you're a lot of fun at parties too.

In any event, I agree with you about a few things.

>>In committed relationships they need to be told what you find acceptable and the two of you have those discussions.

>>When you shack up with a women or in a committed relationship, she knows the Peter Pan guy friends need to go bye bye.

>>Women practically always have more flexibility in following a man. They follow his clothes, his interests, his food, his entire lifestyle melds into her like butter.

>>Most women might gripe about having some man who says No, you can’t hang out with that dude anymore, but the truth is women like having a relationship building exercise like that to display you have some backbone.

>>It’s called relationship building and moving on from her singledom friends. It is making a new life together and selecting which relationships are not useful.

I agree with all of this! Especially about relationship building and discussing together what you find acceptable - your boundaries. And making a new life together and selecting which relationships are not useful.

100% spot on.

And ideally she will be open and agreeable to it without, like I said, you having to force her hand to comply.

 

[BeExcellent]

LOL, who are you? You just joined four days ago and sure have a lot to say don't ya. I bet you're a lot of fun at parties too.

In any event, I agree with you about a few things.

>>In committed relationships they need to be told what you find acceptable and the two of you have those discussions.

>>When you shack up with a women or in a committed relationship, she knows the Peter Pan guy friends need to go bye bye.

>>Women practically always have more flexibility in following a man. They follow his clothes, his interests, his food, his entire lifestyle melds into her like butter.

>>Most women might gripe about having some man who says No, you can’t hang out with that dude anymore, but the truth is women like having a relationship building exercise like that to display you have some backbone.

>>It’s called relationship building and moving on from her singledom friends. It is making a new life together and selecting which relationships are not useful.

I agree with all of this! Especially about relationship building and discussing together what you find acceptable - your boundaries. And making a new life together and selecting which relationships are not useful.

100% spot on.

And ideally she will be open and agreeable to it without, like I said, you having to force her hand to comply.

I agree 100% with @Serenity in this thread and on this topic. Personally I find orbiters annoying and I don’t tolerate them. My friends are my friends. Mutual respect, total transparency. I also agree that once you are part of a couple you distance yourself from the single lifestyle, irrespective of what gender the single person happens to be.

The problem with being overly heavy handed on this extends beyond social interactions. I answer to my CEO and sometimes I have business functions out of state that have a social element (dinners/lunches etc.). I attend those with my CEO. Hubby isn’t invited. You can’t dictate that your woman cannot have male colleagues, male clients, male bosses, etc.

It comes down to character. Either she has it or she doesn’t.

 

[NealIRC]

Somewhat off-topic here but I recall starting a thread were people bullied me on that they were slut-shamers, and they slut-shame their daughters. And in this thread, insecure men on women having guy friends. I wonder if the 2 traits are correlated. Ah well. Bullies will be bullies.

 

[LTG71]

We don't make female friends because they don't serve us with Jack chit.

Next time you're car breaks down, go ahead and call your female friend... jokes

Because women’s version of “friendship” is face to face. They rarely do activities together side by side like men do. I don’t care to call up a female friend and listen to her ramble on about non-sense over Sunday brunch. I rather go do something with male friends to get away from our partners for a while.

My buddy’s kid asked him once if he had female friends and his wife emphatically responded “NO!” without him getting a chance to speak. My wife also gets instantly triggered when I say another female’s name until she meets her and sees she’s not attractive, lol. They know this dynamic too.

Remember their evolutionary driver is to collect resources. So if she has a stable of “buddies”, she is using each one for a resource they are providing. And if she needs to continue to do this while in an LTR, either the dude really sucks or she has major daddy issues.

 

[LTG71]

BeExcellent, has derailed the entire topic discussion just talking about her own damn self,
showboating around and telling the world how spectacular she is and how well adjusted
and healthy the world surrounding her is. And how everyone is so messed up except her
and her perfect social circle of perfection.

It was entertaining though. Like reading the National Enquirer.

Solipsism 101. This is another reason why they make lousy friends, most have zero knowledge of the male experience nor any empathy. I‘ve had similar discussions with another females like BeExcellent. Their version of the world is the only version and my life experiences are invalid. “Believe all women” lol, even the one’s that murder their husbands with their side dude.

Back to the topic. Sure women can have male “friends” but if she has very few female friends and a ton of male friends, then she has daddy issues and you’ll have to deal with them. This type of chic will also hide it very well as she doesn’t want to give up her supply from multiple men.

 

[Money & Muscle]

Rian Stone has a good method of how to discuss these topics with women.

Man: "Women are solipsistic and mate opportunistically, meaning they are blind to the fact they are all h*oes".
Woman: "wElL iM nOt LiKe ThAt ThOuGh."
Man: "You're right. YOU aren't like that, you're different. But other women are like that."
Woman: "Oh yeah, absolutely. All those other women are total sl*ts."

... Because solipsism and lack of accountability.
"I'm not like other girls." ~ all women age 18-25 agree.

 

[member162951]

The problem with being overly heavy handed on this extends beyond social interactions...

Not sure why you quoted my post @BeExcellent
and not @CountSuavula since he was the originator of what I responded to, but I happen to agree with you about being heavy-handed. I posted that, perhaps you missed it?

I think it's a bit heavy-handed @soulforge
and in her mind, would (or might) reflect insecurity.

What I DO believe in is discussing together what your boundaries are and building a relationship together. Hopefully, you're both on the same page and can begin doing just that.

Versus one person dictating what the "rules" are, in an aggressive domineering way (which is different from being dominant) as some others suggested.

I also don't believe in something you posted you do, or would do if your boyfriend proposed the idea of your distancing your male friends/orbiters which was:

F*ck off. These people were my friends when shjt went down & Ive known them for years. Who the hell are you to try to dictate my friendships. I just met you.

WTF! And that sort of response isn't heavy-handed? Lord.

It's about deciding together and if you're not on the same page, wish each other well and move the hell on.

 

[soulforge]

Solipsism 101. This is another reason why they make lousy friends, most have zero knowledge of the male experience nor any empathy. I‘ve had similar discussions with another females like BeExcellent. Their version of the world is the only version and my life experiences are invalid. “Believe all women” lol, even the one’s that murder their husbands with their side dude.

Back to the topic. Sure women can have male “friends” but if she has very few female friends and a ton of male friends, then she has daddy issues and you’ll have to deal with them. This type of chic will also hide it very well as she doesn’t want to give up her supply from multiple men.

This was the point of my original thread/topic.

If the girl has many male freinds, more than actual chicks, then it's daddy issues & dealing with a girl with daddy issues is a mind fuk on its own.

 

[Glassguy]

It comes down to character. Either she has it or she doesn’t.

I agree. Ratchet hoes will cheat regardless of how many men are in their orbit, are "friends with", etc.

A woman is either loyal or she isnt. And for some women, they might be totally loyal for a while and then go off the rails.

It's about deciding together and if you're not on the same page, wish each other well and move the hell on.

This is true also. If your values dont line up, move on. Its better to waste a couple of months than to waste years knowing that your values dont line up and the relationship is a ticking time bomb.

 

[BeExcellent]

My point @JoyDivision1990 about the “Fvck off” quote is this. I have friends who have been steadfast as friends for many years. They have been there and been sounding boards when shjt has hit the fan in my life. Two of my longest tenured friends are men. One I’ve known since age 16, one since age 22 (as previously described). Both these people are trusted and in my inner circle. One is an investor in my business and we reciprocally list each other as trustees on our respective trusts. I trust that man with my kids & my money & he holds me in the same esteem. These men were there when the chips were down in my life, and I’ve also been a great friend to them when they’ve gone through things. They both live in different states so I don’t see them frequently but they have proven to be steadfast friends.

Any man that thinks he’s going to waltz into my life in my 50s and tell me to jettison friends like that from my life can pound sand. Seriously. I’m loyal and I appreciate the loyalty shown me by these friends.

Interestingly my father’s best friend was a woman he knew from college, he met her husband in the 1950s at university the night her husband took her on their first date. She & her husband have now been married over 60 years. She (and her husband) were steadfast friends with my dad (and my mom) all their lives. So not only did I grow up with a strong father figure, I had a father whose closest friend was a woman he met in his college/law school years who he never dated, but who was a lifelong friend even though they were both married to other people. My father had several close platonic female friends who were never involved with him romantically. I know them personally and they are great people.

So this was a normal thing to me, both growing up, in my family, and in my own life.

So I see friends differently with regard to gender (gender is immaterial) and I realize that is an unusual perspective compared to many here. My husband knows all these people, and my husband has also met my late father’s best friend and her husband. They are like second parents to me.

To me there is an enormous distinction between real friends and orbiters. I don’t keep orbiters and I think orbiters are a bad idea. Orbiters are opportunistic and they aren’t friends.

To me this is pretty clear distinction and it’s easy to discern. This is why I’m fine with my husband being friends with an ex girlfriend, she’s not an orbiter and I totally trust that friendship. She’s been a solid friend to me and to us as well. Their interaction failed for various reasons before me and independent of me. No way I’d ask my husband to kick her to the curb as a friend.

 

[member162951]

My point @JoyDivision1990 about the “Fvck off” quote is this. I have friends who have been steadfast as friends for many years. They have been there and been sounding boards when shjt has hit the fan in my life. Two of my longest tenured friends are men. One I’ve known since age 16, one since age 22 (as previously described). Both these people are trusted and in my inner circle. One is an investor in my business and we reciprocally list each other as trustees on our respective trusts. I trust that man with my kids & my money & he holds me in the same esteem. These men were there when the chips were down in my life, and I’ve also been a great friend to them when they’ve gone through things. They both live in different states so I don’t see them frequently but they have proven to be steadfast friends.

Any man that thinks he’s going to waltz into my life in my 50s and tell me to jettison friends like that from my life can pound sand. Seriously. I’m loyal and I appreciate the loyalty shown me by these friends.

Interestingly my father’s best friend was a woman he knew from college, he met her husband in the 1950s at university the night her husband took her on their first date. She & her husband have now been married over 60 years. She (and her husband) were steadfast friends with my dad (and my mom) all their lives. So not only did I grow up with a strong father figure, I had a father whose closest friend was a woman he met in his college/law school years who he never dated, but who was a lifelong friend even though they were both married to other people. My father had several close platonic female friends who were never involved with him romantically. I know them personally and they are great people.

So this was a normal thing to me, both growing up, in my family, and in my own life.

So I see friends differently with regard to gender (gender is immaterial) and I realize that is an unusual perspective compared to many here. My husband knows all these people, and my husband has also met my late father’s best friend and her husband. They are like second parents to me.

To me there is an enormous distinction between real friends and orbiters. I don’t keep orbiters and I think orbiters are a bad idea. Orbiters are opportunistic and they aren’t friends.

To me this is pretty clear distinction and it’s easy to discern. This is why I’m fine with my husband being friends with an ex girlfriend, she’s not an orbiter and I totally trust that friendship. She’s been a solid friend to me and to us as well. Their interaction failed for various reasons before me and independent of me. No way I’d ask my husband to kick her to the curb as a friend.

I understand all that @Be, that's not what I object to.

It was your delivery - "F*ck off, who the hell are you to tell me who my friends are?"

There's a much more gracious and less aggressive way of sending that same message Be.

I think it's sad with all your intelligence and social grace you claim to possess, you fail to grasp that.

All you needed to say was "that doesn't work for me so I'm moving on. Wish you the best."

 

[Manure Spherian]

I wonder if the 2 traits are correlated.

I wonder what man wants a ***** of a daughter.

I suppose one can educate his daughter on the matter, which is what I’ll do when mine is older.

Do you have a recourse if education doesn’t work?

 

[pipeman84]

However can you ever really trust a girl, who is naturally more inclined to be friendly with men?

She's the type of girl who always had more guy freinds than chicks, and is too comfortable talking to & being around dudes?

No, IMO. She's either a hoe, which has been mentioned by several posters already or she's a masculine woman (surprisingly no one touched on this possibility so far) and I think @BeExcellent falls in this category.
Having 1-2 guy friends you went to kindergarten, primary school with and you keep in touch into adulthood, that I understand. Once a girl is over the age of 15 or so, I don't get this guy friend thing ... from that age onwards normal male-female relationships beside romantic would be as class mates, work colleagues ... but male friends? That's highly suspect.