"The Coffee Shop Girl You Never Spoke To"

You've replayed it a hundred times. She stood three feet away, scrolling her phone. You had an opening. You composed the perfect line — after she was gone.

For all you know, she's married now. To some guy who said something. Anything.

Openers are cheap. Almost any sentence works when it's delivered within three seconds. The expensive part is the standing there, drafting and deleting, while the window quietly closes.

The "22 Rules" stripped out my hesitation. What to open with, how to keep it alive, and the one habit that costs guys more women than anything else: waiting for perfect.

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How would a DJ deal with this?

logicallefty

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OP, if you want to step into the world of being your own man, one of the first things you are going to have to do is quit giving a sh|t what others think. As several others have said here already, *postpone the wedding*. Take another year or so to get to know this woman a little better... If you do nothing else... If she really loves you, wants you, etc. , she will wait.. If not, there is your answer....
 

"I'm Not Looking for Anything Serious Right Now"

When a woman says it, guys hear a confession. A heads-up. A scheduling conflict.

Here's the translation: I don't feel anything. Right now. With you.

Watch what happens when a man triggers actual attraction. The busy career, the recent breakup, the "not in a place to date" — all of it evaporates instantly. The same woman who was guarding her freedom is suddenly free every night.

The "22 Rules" explain why. When the right switches flip, her timeline rearranges itself around you.

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Reykhel

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Zinc has some great advice in this thread. I too have fvcked a lot of taken women, to the point I wondered too who took that pic and why.

I have helped do some sneaky things to hide that I was fvking these girls, Some of them included red herring photos like this to take the subject away from cheating. I am not saying she did that here, but the photo just makes no sense to me in the whole context.

I also completely agree with logicallefty. I would strongly advise to postponing this wedding.

Another thought, how old are you and this woman?
Exactly. It seems odd that the photo would be sent to him....

Sometimes admitting a seemingly minor infraction is covering up a a dead body in murky
waters.
 

Bible_Belt

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White knight alert......stop posting your passive aggressive crap you little white knight *****. Too bad this isn't real life so no one can ***** slap ur little punk ass.
Where do you live and what do you weigh? I know every mma promoter in the Midwest. I'd even let you pick the rules...doesn't matter to me...mma, K1, Muay Thai, boxing...hell, submission grappling might be best for you, considering you can't dodge a drunk woman's punch. Picking fights and losing them seems to come naturally to you.
 

BeExcellent

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I'd text "I'm disappointed in your choices. I need some time alone with myself to just reflect. I'll reach out within a week or so, when I feel more clear. Please respect my request for space and do not contact me in the meanwhile."

Then, do just that. Take time away from her and reflect. Reflect on her choices and her response to her own choices. Reflect on, "Is this really the behavior I want in a wife? The mother of my kids?

If I could impart only one thing here, it would be, do not marry someone expecting them to be any different, in any way, than they are right now. Who she is right now, is what you marry. There is not some improved version that comes later. (Usually the opposite, in fact.)
See above. Read. Re-read. Cannot over emphasize this enough. You think postponing the wedding is tough? Try getting divorced with kids when you understand finally that this is indeed what you got yourself into...when you are worried about how her bad choices are going to affect your minor innocent kids. You think it will be expensive now? Much worse later after you are legally bound. Right now its just money and other people's opinions (which as @logicallefty said you cannot give a shlt about that.)

Edit: P.S. Spending time with her girlfriends should equate to lunches, shopping (minimal/window), getting nails done or doing each others, shared hobbies, hanging out at home together, chit chatting, not public drunkeness and whatever behavior goes with that, until she's passed out drunk on someone's floor.
That is what girlfriends do together. See above. They don't go troll for guys in clubs and get shltfaced.

Do not be one of these men who gets 15 years into an unhappy marriage and knows that it was a mistake BEFORE it happened. I'm shocked at how many men like that I run into. It's awful.
 

Reykhel

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Women communicate covertly.

Telling her how you feel is a waste of time. It's overt communication.

I'd read The Rational Male if I were you.

I'd echo the same as what others have said: do not marry her just to appease family. Stupidity.
Loz man, with respect, the Rational Male is not "The book of every answer"...

There comes a point when the white elephant in the room needs to be addressed.
 

"She Laughed All Night. Then She Ghosted You. Here's Why."

Dinner ran three hours. She laughed at everything. You walked her to her car thinking this one's locked in.

Then: nothing. Two texts. No reply. What happened?

You did what most men do on a great date. You filled every silence, answered every question, and left her with nothing to wonder about. No mystery. Nothing to sit with when she got home.

Rule 3 of the "22 Rules" changes the ending: tell her a little, hold back the rest, and let her imagination do the chasing. The ghosting stops too.

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Red_Hat

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Some asked about the photo. Her friend called last night just after they changed clubs to tell me all was good and she was a lil drunk. I then told her to call or text me when they got home. It's her friend who took the pic of my fiancé on the floor passed out with the text 'we're home safe and T**** is totally passed out... She'll call you when she wakes up..."

She's 31 and I'm 35.
 

zinc4

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Where do you live and what do you weigh? I know every mma promoter in the Midwest. I'd even let you pick the rules...doesn't matter to me...mma, K1, Muay Thai, boxing...hell, submission grappling might be best for you, considering you can't dodge a drunk woman's punch. Picking fights and losing them seems to come naturally to you.
Provoking others on the net and being a little passive aggressive ***** seems to come naturally to you.

No wonder.....you are the typical wanna be cage fighter unleashing your insecurities onto others.

Only a complete moron would travel or take the time out to go meet a stranger over the net to fight.

You need to stop ruining threads on here with your little passive aggressive wanna be cage fighter white knight behavior. Doubt you subtly provoke others in real life like you do on this board.
 
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zinc4

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OP....my brother, who wouldn't listen to anyone by the way, is currently paying child support for two kids with a woman who cheated on him multiple times after getting drunk at clubs with the girls before sayi g her feelings changed and is now out to take everything he's ever had and ruin his life.

His situation started out much like your's with an underlying g alcoholism problem and inability to control her urges to go clubbing g once every few months.

You can't force a round object into a square hole.
 

Bible_Belt

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Only a complete moron would travel or take the time out to go meet a stranger over the net to fight.
Oh, it's not a fight. It's a friendly competition, completely legal and sanctioned by the respective state. Didn't you say you're in Atlanta? I know people in Kentucky. That's not too far from me. Believe it or not, the promoter I know there actually really likes grudge matches. He does them all the time; they're crowd-pleasers.

Anyway, think about it....consider it an open invitation.
 

zinc4

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Oh, it's not a fight. It's a friendly competition, completely legal and sanctioned by the respective state. Didn't you say you're in Atlanta? I know people in Kentucky. That's not too far from me. Believe it or not, the promoter I know there actually really likes grudge matches. He does them all the time; they're crowd-pleasers.

Anyway, think about it....consider it an open invitation.

Yes, i currently live in Atlanta. And I could care less about a grudge match.

The only way I'd consider something like this if there was enough money involved for me to make it worth my time.

You presume to know what my abilities are and arent based on me being wasted and letting a girl's punch land.

Name the amount of money involved to make it even worth considering in the first place.
 
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"I just moved here from Florida."

That sentence contains at least five follow-up questions she WANTS you to ask. Where in Florida? What brought you here? How long have you been in the area? What do you miss? How does it compare to here?

She handed them to you on a silver platter. And you said, "Oh cool. I come here every week. I love this band. Ummm... pretty crowded tonight."

She smiled politely. Nodded. And never texted you back.

I was that guy for years. Talking too much. Listening too little. Panicking about my next sentence while she was literally feeding me the answers.

Then I found 22 rules that fixed the whole thing. Rule number one: shut up and listen. She'll tell you exactly what to say.

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logicallefty

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@zinc4 @Bible_Belt please take your fight discussion to PM or Anything Else. Thank you.
 

salinechow

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Can't believe people are advising OP to play games like it's just some girl he's casually banging.

That will just treat the symptoms.

The root problem will remain.

Like I said, you can take the girl out of the bar but not the bar out of the girl.

It's a saying they use for bar prostitutes in southeast Asia and chumps that marry them.

The same rule however, applies here.

Trust me OP, you can't magicallg change this girl into a high quality woman.

If u try to do so, your life will be miserable for a while.

I was merely trying to offer advice, from, as I sometimes try to do, a different angle.
There is no way this guy is equipped, nor should he, at the advice of us, reconsider his engagement based on this thread.
Although, the advice given here, is incredibly sound, im sure there are a million other reasons to break up with her and/or love her.
Yes, I believe he should reevaluate his position and consideration of his marriage to her, based on this infraction, yet, I just do not think it would happen. Im just being real. Sh!t, people around here dont listen to us when we tell them to ask a girl out at the gym they have been eyeball stalking for 4 months. We expect this OP to break up and cancel a wedding? Come on.

He came here for advice about a situation...So that's what I did, I tried to give him advice on THIS situation.

Yeah. Yeah. Woman play games, men do not...Right, I got it. But, when you have only one weapon in your arsenal, sometimes you bring cannons to archy matches, and catch an arrow to the heart while you light a fuse.

I think you all, and I concur, gave good advice to postpone at least the nuptials....However, if not....At least I gave him some advice that he can use otherwise. Something substantial to select from. Pretty easy to say to someone to throw away his fiancee while you have your hand down your pants playing withyourself in your lacrosse shorts and then move on to the next post that you can just say. "F^ck, lay, next, gym,work, rinse, repeat. Sometimes life is more than that though. Sometimes we need a scalpel instead of a shotgun.

Again, I think you all have some truth in what you offer as your take on the situation. Again, I realize passive/aggressive games are a more feminine realm and usually stupid an ineffective. Yet, sometimes, beating a woman at their own game is exactly how to win back the frame and gain compliance so that you can lead the relationship well going forward. Sometimes, the alpha tactics can backfire and have a girl dig in with her sh!tests and misbehavior. She gets attention from it, even if its negative.

In THIS (HIS) situation, like I said, given the REAL choices he will GIVE HIMSELF( in my perception) my offer of advice is of value.

Or, just hit her in the face with a pie next time and make her wear a sandwich board that says she did bad things.
 

Trump

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Thanks guys. I appreciate the response. Taking the wedding off the table isn't going to work unfortunately without causing so much pain to family and friends. Venue booked, invitation sent out and all are informed.
I'm open to see things in perspective from all angles.
OK bro, when you say: "I am marrying my fiance in a few months and need advice on how to deal with her drinking problem, but whatever you advice you give me, I am going to marry her anyway."

You are asking us to give you advice, but telling us only give you the advice you want to hear. It's a little suspicious.
 

Slash Dolo

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Your ignorance is limitless and appalling.

"Her drinking issue is her issue; until it starts to affect YOU negatively, it shouldn't be a big deal. Don't overthink."

He's supposed to marry the girl. That will mean signing a contract with her. Possibly a mortgage. Possible kids. Living under the same roof. I think her habits and her vices are clearly potentially his issue too.

This is clearly a red flag. If you think that we as men should not pay attention to red flags with the women in our lives....with the women who we could potentially marry as in this case, I implore you to write a thread explaining exactly why we should ignore red flags when our sexual strategy is LTR game/girlfriend game. I'm all ears.

A few people are missing the point here. Some are saying hey it's no problem, she only goes out every few months and gets drunk and others possibly implying (understandably) that she's an alcoholic because of the way alcohol effects her negatively...

Personally, I'm not a fan of the label alcoholic. Some will say, you're alcoholic by the amount you drink and some will say you're alcoholic by the affect it has on you i.e. if it changes your personality. And some will say you're alcoholic if you're dependent on the stuff....

.....whatever..........labels can do more harm than good.

What I do know is that if you consume alcohol and you end up on the floor every time.......doing embarrassing things..............you have a choice.....you can continue in that fashion and think "well I'm not doing anyone any harm".....kind of like someone who jumps from a window and on his way down thinks to himself "so far, so good".......or you can take responsibility for the fact that consuming said liquid renders you on your back and decide that it's not the life for a responsible adult......

.....choice.

Either way, I know which one I would be concerned about. And I know which one I would trust more for taking responsibility for their life.

I completely get the OP's concerns and the reason he wrote this thread is because he has a gut feeling that something is not quite right.
Ignorance? Ignorance is strangers on an online forum trying to talk OP out of not marrying his fiance because she went out with friends and got drunk and didn't text him back for a few hours. Holy sh*t. You sound like controlling, over-emotional p*ssies with trust issues. The butthurt is astounding.

Marriage is not my (and others on here) cup of tea but give the guy advice that's realistic. We are supposed to empower each other here, not be misogynistic tw*ts. I'm listening to 'Out of Touch' by Hall & Oates right now; too fitting for this thread in particular.

My advice to OP? LogicalLefty's post (EDIT: and Cola's, for a little more detail on the matter) is all that needs to be said about the issue to OP.
 
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"She's Out of Your League"

You've said it a hundred times. Maybe a thousand. And every time you say it, you train your brain to freeze the next time she walks into the room.

Leagues are a myth invented by guys who are scared of women.

She's a person. She has bad breath in the morning. She picks songs she can't sing in the shower. She overthinks her own texts.

Walk over. Say something. The league dissolves the second you open your mouth.

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zinc4

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I was merely trying to offer advice, from, as I sometimes try to do, a different angle.
There is no way this guy is equipped, nor should he, at the advice of us, reconsider his engagement based on this thread.
Although, the advice given here, is incredibly sound, im sure there are a million other reasons to break up with her and/or love her.
Yes, I believe he should reevaluate his position and consideration of his marriage to her, based on this infraction, yet, I just do not think it would happen. Im just being real. Sh!t, people around here dont listen to us when we tell them to ask a girl out at the gym they have been eyeball stalking for 4 months. We expect this OP to break up and cancel a wedding? Come on.

He came here for advice about a situation...So that's what I did, I tried to give him advice on THIS situation.

Yeah. Yeah. Woman play games, men do not...Right, I got it. But, when you have only one weapon in your arsenal, sometimes you bring cannons to archy matches, and catch an arrow to the heart while you light a fuse.

I think you all, and I concur, gave good advice to postpone at least the nuptials....However, if not....At least I gave him some advice that he can use otherwise. Something substantial to select from. Pretty easy to say to someone to throw away his fiancee while you have your hand down your pants playing withyourself in your lacrosse shorts and then move on to the next post that you can just say. "F^ck, lay, next, gym,work, rinse, repeat. Sometimes life is more than that though. Sometimes we need a scalpel instead of a shotgun.

Again, I think you all have some truth in what you offer as your take on the situation. Again, I realize passive/aggressive games are a more feminine realm and usually stupid an ineffective. Yet, sometimes, beating a woman at their own game is exactly how to win back the frame and gain compliance so that you can lead the relationship well going forward. Sometimes, the alpha tactics can backfire and have a girl dig in with her sh!tests and misbehavior. She gets attention from it, even if its negative.

In THIS (HIS) situation, like I said, given the REAL choices he will GIVE HIMSELF( in my perception) my offer of advice is of value.

Or, just hit her in the face with a pie next time and make her wear a sandwich board that says she did bad things.

You are most likely correct in that he won't take the hard route and look for a better woman for the future. But that is the only advice that would actually help him. Not trying to trash what you said, just stating the truth.

And it is actually easy for me to say because I've been married once engaged two other times before backing out due to similar scenarios/red flags. No disrespect intended to you, just telling OP what experience has taught me.
 

zinc4

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Ignorance? Ignorance is strangers on an online forum trying to talk OP out of not marrying his fiance because she went out with friends and got drunk and didn't text him back for a few hours. Holy sh*t. You sound like controlling, over-emotional p*ssies with trust issues. The butthurt is astounding.

Marriage is not my (and others on here) cup of tea but give the guy advice that's realistic. We are supposed to empower each other here, not be misogynistic tw*ts.

My advice to OP? LogicalLefty's post is all that needs to be said and he's the only one that's really made sense. Disregard just about everything else in the thread.

It's not about butthurt feelings, being a control freak nor anything like that.

It's simply about what will happen to OP in the future and the fact that he is limiting himself. If you gave never been married before then you really have zero clue how these things will come back to haunt you.

Why would any sane person marry a girl who still enjoys getting wasted at clubs when there are PLENTY of girls who shudder at the thought of getting drunk or going to a club with her gfs?

It defies any kind of rational logic.
 

Slash Dolo

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It's not about butthurt feelings, being a control freak nor anything like that.

It's simply about what will happen to OP in the future and the fact that he is limiting himself. If you gave never been married before then you really have zero clue how these things will come back to haunt you.

Why would any sane person marry a girl who still enjoys getting wasted at clubs when there are PLENTY of girls who shudder at the thought of getting drunk or going to a club with her gfs?

It defies any kind of rational logic.
I can argue that Marriage defies all rational logic.

The fact is we can not predict the future because there is an exception to every rule. A girl that shudders at the thought of hanging with her friends and having a drink sounds like a boring, clingy b*tch to me, but to each his own.
 

zinc4

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I can argue that Marriage defies all rational logic.

The fact is we can not predict the future because there is an exception to every rule. A girl that shudders at the thought of hanging with her friends and having a drink sounds like a boring, clingy b*tch to me, but to each his own.
I still enjoy banging and dating girls who like drinking and going clubbing as well...because I still do those things myself and it does create a sense of space/freedom in the short term honey moon stages of things plus common activity if drinking.

However, marriage is essentially a business contract and a wise man would treat it as so.

Also, they are all going to get boring sooner or later regardless of what they do for fun....at that point, you'll be glad you chose a grounded faithful woman over a girl who ironically you are even more bored with at that point (not as much substance) and who still enjoys getting wasted at clubs with her gfs.
 

"She Made Her Decision Before You Finished Your Sentence"

Three seconds. That's how long it took. Your shoes. Your posture. The way you held your drink. Whether you looked at the floor or looked at her.

She already filed you away. Interesting. Boring. Safe. Bold. Before you even opened your mouth.

Everything you say after that is just her confirming what she already decided.

So stop rehearsing lines. Fix the first three seconds. Stand tall. Look up. Smile like you mean it. Walk like you belong wherever you're standing.

The words come later. The impression comes first.

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