Nice Guy Finished First... (reverse field report)

[iqqi]

Believe it or not, I really think Iqqi posted it here to give some guys Hope.

I believe it was a well meaning post on her part.

She usually talks about men relating that they're not succeeding because they think they don't have the "looks", and then blame women for being too picky.
When she is trying to make a point , that from her view, it's more about having "game" and something that's confident and relatively "attractive", not necessarily Brad Pitt look a like.

The take home message to everybody is that you must convey sexuality at all times. Don't be a de sexed eunuch.

yes, interceptor, this was my goal.

 

[Interceptor]

(edit: Holy sh*t! The post replies are flying in Can't keep up!) lol!

Anyway, I'll add another take home message: Not EVERYTHING is ALWAYS in Black and White.


BUT........
the general Rule is "Don't be "Nice" in order to impress or to DE Sexualize and DE Threaten your SELF".

Be nice in a masculine and genuine manner.
Would you do it for a friend?
great, then do it. Don;t offer any explanation or anythign. Just calmly, confidently do it, whatever IT is.

If not, then don't do it. Because if you DO, you will demonstrate your total lack of Integrity and your desperation to get some tang by behaving like a Door Mat.

Why doyou think a womna will test you by asking you "for a favor", early on?
Just what do you think she is trying to do?

She's trying to prove to herself you're a chump, and she shoudln't waste time on you.

 

[wjh]

Believe it or not, I really think Iqqi posted it here to give some guys Hope.

I believe it was a well meaning post on her part.

She usually talks about men relating that they're not succeeding because they think they don't have the "looks", and then blame women for being too picky.
When she is trying to make a point , that from her view, it's more about having "game" and something that's confident and relatively "attractive", not necessarily Brad Pitt look a like.

The take home message to everybody is that you must convey sexuality at all times. Don't be a de sexed eunuch.

Nothing new here. Been covered ad nauseum. Just look at the "do looks matter" threads.

I just wish there were no women posting on here because if I wanted a woman's opinion I could just open my mouth and before I said a word one would come in here in my office telling me that I should just be myself and that one day "the one" will come in and she'll be the most amazing person ever and our souls will be intertwined in the cosmos with a whisper. Or some crap like that.

 

[Interceptor]

I'll also add that maintaining your Masculinity and your inner sexuality evident at all times is not up for compromise, discussion, or argument.

At no time should ANY guy give up his masculinity even if a woman is so insecure with your "aura" that she 'acts" turned off. Even if she "tests" you. You don't apologize or give "explanations" or anything.
Don't do it.

Don't apologize for being a Man. Don't apologize for your desires.
And don't apologize for being sexual and showing that you're attracted.

If a woman is turned off by your sexuality (assuming you're not coming across as a pervert and flashing her!) then she is too insecure with herself and her own sexuality to be of any good to you.

 

[Interceptor]

Nothing new here. Been covered ad nauseum. Just look at the "do looks matter" threads

Actually, it's not that it's new or not, it's just Iqqi's first hand account with the subject. That's all. Her personal experience as a female.
You DO know that those post are posted by and replied to by exclusively ALL guys, right?
OK, then, you see part of Iqqi's motivation to post her account.

 

[iqqi]

You summed it up pretty well, but I am concerned with what you said here:

Why do you think a woman will test you by asking you "for a favor", early on?
Just what do you think she is trying to do?

She's trying to prove to herself you're a chump, and she shoudln't waste time on you.

Not every "favor" being asked is a test. And once you start treating things like a test, or a game, then you are playing, most likely yourself.

If you recall how I mentioned the girl he used to date coming up to him and demanding a drink, at first I was shocked and tried to tell him that he shouldn't let her do that to him.

His response was to laugh, mention that she is usually the one buying drinks, and finally to say there is the reason he no longer sees her.

Think about it. That whole scenario was pretty DJ.

He came across as a nice, generous guy, who knew how to draw the line. The chic WAS really upset, even though he gave her money to get a drink. She spent the rest of the night at the bar fuming.

See, he didn't fail when he did that. What he did was basically say through his actions, first of all I am a bigger person than this. Besides, the funny part is I probably owe you, so then he basically threw a $20 at her. THEN, he in a sense warned me, the current chick, about what he didn't go for. Brilliant, really. And all natural.

 

[Interceptor]

Iq, I know that.
What I referred to WAS when certain "favors" are asked that should raise a red flag for the guy, as it should be looked upon suspiciously. These usually come after a certain dynamic of the interaction. Usually when the guy failed to come off as manly and secure.
It's not about being paranoid, it's about being aware and not being taken advantage of.

So , yes, I understand.
But a guy HAS to learn how to tell if a woman is being "sincere". Or if she really IS testing him.
"Are you a man? Or are you a naive little boy whom I can dominate at will?"


And no. I wan't specifically referring to your post.

 

[aliasguy]

Well, alias, as usual you read a little too much into things, with an idea already in your head. I don't think anyone has a problem with getting it. That has actually been accused of me. I think the problem is that men here just want to hang on to their hang ups.

And, yes, I have said this over and over. But since you have asked, even though it comes across as condescending, I will just answer you here, instead of telling you to go read the thread.

My point of this thread is to counter the repetitive bs threads where guys think they aren't getting laid due to the fact they aren't models. And that there seems to be some huge fear of being mistaken for a doormat, so all basic civilty goes out the window.

Women ARE attracted to men for more than their looks. Looks are nothing but icing on the cake. AND women ARE interested in good men, with good traits.

Iqqi-----

The whole POINT of my post was to REMOVE any ideas already in my head which might make me misunderstand your point in this thread. And get from you a CLEAR message. An ad hominem attack wasn't even necessary. I was TRYING to understand, to "get" you. And now I do.

I'm not a model. I still get girls. The two concepts aren't related. I also agree being civil is best.
I agree there's more to attraction than looks. And I believe that women want "good" men.
I don't think many would argue with these simple points.
Why are you so adamant about all this?

What is all the disagreement about? Do we have to see things EXACTLY your way? Does our failure to se your interaction with the "ugly" guy in the exact same way that you do make us stupid men with "hangups"?

I'm not arguing with you, I was just trying to understand your POINT. Thanks for laying it out clearly this time.

I refuse to counterattack. We have no argument, here. But you seem to want to argue.

 

[iqqi]

Iq, I know that.
What I referred to WAS when certain "favors" are asked that should raise a red flag for the guy, as it should be looked upon suspiciously. These usually come after a certain dynamic of the interaction. Usually when the guy failed to come off as manly and secure.
It's not about being paranoid, it's about being aware and not being taken advantage of.

So , yes, I understand.
But a guy HAS to learn how to tell if a woman is being "sincere". Or if she really IS testing him.
"Are you a man? Or are you a naive little boy whom I can dominate at will?"


And no. I wan't specifically referring to your post.

Yes, you are right about all of that. It is important to have standards, one of which is to avoid women who are manipulative users.

 

[wjh]

Not every "favor" being asked is a test. And once you start treating things like a test, or a game, then you are playing, most likely yourself.

No, not every favor is a test.

But you must not have read his post clearly, because your story is not comparable.

His point was specifically about a girl asking you for a "favor" early on. Huge difference. It's obvious you've known this guy for a LONG time.

Not every woman is worth a "favor" - newsflash: Being a DJ is about becoming the prize.

Is there an arbitrary measure for determining whether a woman is worth a "favor"? NO. But can we CLEARLY say it is GENERALLY not early on? YES.

Sure, you can help a girl out. You can NOT expect anything in return. But if you're completely taken advantage of don't be shocked.

Sorry but I have better things to do than to help a girl out that I just met with something. Thank feminism. I do.

 

[iqqi]

I'm not a model. I still get girls. The two concepts aren't related. I also agree being civil is best.
I agree there's more to attraction than looks. And I believe that women want "good" men.
I don't think many would argue with these simple points.

Lol, me either!!! But if you actually read the thread and the replies, you will see that is what has been going on.

I was just offering up an example of this situation in real life.

Because not all men on here understand what you do, obviously. That is why there is so much debate right now, with so many guys that are, YES, HUNG UP, on their looks. That is great Alias, that you don't have that problem.

If you don't disagree with the thread, but you also don't seem to be supporting my points that you agree with, then what is YOUR point, may I ask?

 

[Interceptor]

Like I said, if it's genuine and sincere, in that, you would do it for a friend you know. Then, yeah, of course. Don't be a d*ck.
And if it's a woman in genuine need, then yeah, it's the right thing to do.

But be careful with women who ask for favors to see how many hoops you'd jump for her.Or because she just "felt" like being more manipulative that day.

Aslo, be careful of the resentful hate filled "independant" "strong" women who actually don't like you to do anything for them(holding doors open , lifting heavy objects for them), lest they feel you think they are "helpless' and NEED a man. God forbuid you put them in a place where they have to return your favor with SEX! OMG! Say it ain't so!!
God forbid you do a favor for that kind of woman!
I just saw evidence of that today at the airport!
"NO! That's ok! I don't need help!" she snarled at this poor guy.

LOL!

Anyway, don't let that type of behavior get to you. Never, never, EVER hold on to that resentment.
Never, never, never..........

 

[aliasguy]

Lol, me either!!! But if you actually read the thread and the replies, you will see that is what has been going on.

I was just offering up an example of this situation in real life.

Because not all men on here understand what you do, obviously. That is why there is so much debate right now, with so many guys that are, YES, HUNG UP, on their looks. That is great Alias, that you don't have that problem.

If you don't disagree with the thread, but you also don't seem to be supporting my points that you agree with, then what is YOUR point, may I ask?

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My point was that I wanted to know what you wanted us to get out of your tale. I now know. Thanks. Message received

And I wondered why you get so p*ssed when others disagree. (Not that I'm innocent of that sin, myself.) You really do strike back pretty hard and attack those who disagree with you, using a LOT of insults. But that's ok. We're all learning, here. And knocking heads with other posters can be a good learning experience.

March on, Iqqi..........
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[ThunderMaverick]

212-479-7990. Call me now. I have to tell you something interesting...

This isn't your number, is it? I'm really really tempted to call it.

 

[iqqi]

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My point was that I wanted to know what you wanted us to get out of your tale. I now know. Thanks. Message received

And I wondered why you get so p*ssed when others disagree. (Not that I'm innocent of that sin, myself.) You really do strike back pretty hard and attack those who disagree with you, using a LOT of insults. But that's ok. We're all learning, here. And knocking heads with other posters can be a good learning experience.

March on, Iqqi..........
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Well Alias, I am never mad at someone disagreeing with me. But most of the posts here were not disagreements. They were twisting what happened, to the point where it wasn't what I had originally said at all. AND they also insulted me with the prostitute jabs, and whatnot. That actually p!ssed me off.

And I do know how to strike back pretty hard, but you will notice that I still remained open to actual questions afterwards.

The worst part is that noone seemed to really disagree with the two main points, it seemed to just be a free for all attack of my account.

If someone really thinks that ugly guys only get laid out of pity, then that is indeed a sad viewpoint, that I disagree with.

 

[iqqi]

This isn't your number, is it? I'm really really tempted to call it.

That number wasn't for you, love. It was for Mr. Hilarious-not.

 

[iqqi]

Aslo, be careful of the resentful hate filled "independant" "strong" women who actually don't like you to do anything for them(holding doors open , lifting heavy objects for them), lest they feel you think they are "helpless' and NEED a man. God forbuid you put them in a place where they have to return your favor with SEX! OMG! Say it ain't so!!
God forbid you do a favor for that kind of woman!
I just saw evidence of that today at the airport!
"NO! That's ok! I don't need help!" she snarled at this poor guy.

LOL!

Anyway, don't let that type of behavior get to you. Never, never, EVER hold on to that resentment.
Never, never, never..........

I am so glad you can call this for what it is, Interceptor! You are right on, here. I have witnessed this myself, and boy is it unattractive behavior from a woman.

They assume that all men are trying to get something from them. They don't enjoy being a woman, and they don't value a man.

There are a lot of men like that women on this site.

 

[ThunderMaverick]

Why didn't you just send him a private message?

....because it's not reallyournumberANDIT'SONEOFTHOSEPRANKCALL"YOUGOTREJECTED"NUMBERSANDYOU KNEWAWHOLEBUNCHOFUSWOULDCALLIT!!!!

<-----World's finest detective.

I just want you to know that I WON'T be calling that number. u_u *nods*

 

[iqqi]

....because it's not reallyournumberANDIT'SONEOFTHOSEPRANKCALL"YOUGOTREJECTED"NUMBERSANDYOU KNEWAWHOLEBUNCHOFUSWOULDCALLIT!!!!

<-----World's finest detective.

Lol. See, I understand men.

I admit I like to have fun with them sometimes...

 

[ThunderMaverick]

My feelings would have seriously gotten hurt if I called huh?

You're fu*kin' mean, dude. I guess that's something to be proud of...